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Nishi_Kinuyo

Ashitaka is back, time to get?

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[IRON7]
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Just noticed that the Ashitaka is back in the store again for €30,60 (local values may vary), and I had missed her the first time around due to sitting too much on the fence about her AP shells.

Now, several months have passed and she's up for sale again, so I'd like to hear some opinions from those who've played her a fair deal.

Would you recommend getting her in general?

" " for co-op/operations?

" " if you love IJN BBs?

Not going to ask for randoms, and even less for ranked I suppose, due to those AP shells she shares with Mutsu. Well, maybe ranked is more suited to it than randoms since you won't see higher tiers.

:fish_cute_2:

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[O-R-P]
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Check server statistics

https://wows-numbers.com/ship/3763287760,Ashitaka/

12000 battles played from december-

So far we know same useless AP ammunition (type88) like in Mutsu. If Mutsu struggling to pen tier 5 BB we can imagine how Ashitaka will perform against Iowa and FDG

Old A hull from Amagi- in its time worst BB hull in a whole game- getting citadelled by everything. (including one -shot killed by t5 Texas)
Add worst AAA from all t7 BB. It will be farmed by T7-T9 cv....

 

Collectors value is also discutable- since it was renamed Takao during construction,  and scraped before completed in 1923. Its final look and parameters are WG guess in some degree.

 

If we not get any information about any kind of buff Im not intressted...

So figure it out...

 

Flamu commentary o Ashitaka before it was released

 

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[BYOB]
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3 hours ago, Nishi_Kinuyo said:

Would you recommend getting her in general?

 

Spoiler

 

 

Seriously, that ship is a massively nerfed Amagi with no AA and bad AP. You don't want to spend money on it.

LWM's review says it's a good ship for coop, but not fun to play. And don't even think of taking her into randoms. If you don't have the Missouri you can shell out big bucks for the Makoto Kobayashi camo version, to earn more silver. But the Kii is better.

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Don't really see much point when I already have the Kii, Mutsu, and the Ishizuchi to train the IJN bb skippers..

 

EDIT: And my Musashi

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[SWEOV]
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Le 20/04/2018 à 20:41, Nishi_Kinuyo a dit :

Would you recommend getting her in general?

No.

Poor artillery, poor secondaries, poor hull, poor AA and not even a spotting aircraft.

Don't waste your money on her.

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[AKI]
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Platooned with someone that got her, he was constantly raging on how bad she is, don't buy her ^^

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Community Contributor, Beta Tester
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I had actually ok games (65% w/l and 65k avg.dmg) in the ship when we tested it before release. But I was lucky with both RNG and teams. 
In general, this ship is nothing else than port decoration. It doesn't do anything well. Dont buy it if your after a decent premium T7. There are much better options out there.

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"A-crap-AKA" Ashitaka as christened by one of our clan members is so utterly terrible its actually beyond belief how it got through testing. 

 

Its the biggest mess of contradictory gameplay styles I have seen.

 

Its a glass cannon, yet it has trouble going through any sort of armor.

 

Its accurate at long range, but has the worst drag value on any BB tier 7 and up and therefore has as bad pen as Lyon on long range.

 

Its fast, but doesnt have the agility or AA protection to do any sort of flanking.

 

The HE is decent/good, but you give up one of the only strengths of the ship if you use it, namely the overmatching 16.1" guns.

 

Armor is laid out in a way that you wanna face your stern at the enemy, but the citadel is elevated in such a way that a 22mm piece of citadel deck is faced stern.

 

And yes, much of its citadel deck is 22mm so it gets citadelled from just about any angle from any ship with guns larger than 15".

 

Secondaries are useless and torpedo protection is bad. Its displacement to health ration is super low, meaning its about just as large and heavy as Amagi, but for some reason gets much less HP. Concealment is worst for its tier. It gets no catapult plane what so ever. No torps like Mutsu or Kii. None of the AA is centered around DP guns so you cant really spec for AA. 

 

Ashitaka is literally worse than Mutsu, and Mutsu isnt even a good BB.

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14 hours ago, Affeks said:

And yes, much of its citadel deck is 22mm so it gets citadelled from just about any angle from any ship with guns larger than 15"

 

There's a 95mm deck that probably doesn't show up on the armour viewer. (25mm weather deck > 89-95mm main deck > 22-48mm citadel deck)

As usual the biggest problem is 25mm everywhere, 15"+ BBs can pump out 20k+ salvos at any angle by ignoring your main belt (always feels like a citadel or two) But this is a problem for most tier 7 BBs, granted the others have stealth (KGV) or are too slow to get into trouble quickly (Colorado, Nagato) so I can imagine Ashitaka is pain in the [edited] to play (would've been better at tier 8 like KGV/DoY)

 

Penetration is the least important value for BB AP tbh, your usually just looking to 'lolpen' plating and hit upper belts etc. Overmatch > ricochet > penetration, nothing beats Ashitakas overmatch ability at tier 7.

 

If you like IJN BBs then go for it. If you want historic BC gameplay then Hood is actually bloody amazing (massively underestimated this gem)

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I think if you just boil it down to stats of your pixel ship you'll reach the conclusion that Ashitaka isn't worth it, but for some of us considering getting her it's about look and feel than pure efficiency.

 

I don't have her, as I said I'm tempted, but here are the points I'm considering:

 

- Mutsu guns really aren't as bad as people seem to think. That's actually one of my favourite BBs in the game at the moment, the guns deliver if you adjust your aim

- T7 MM is amazing at the moment. Easy to say "just crappy Mutsu guns at T7" but 90% of the time you'll be in the same game you would have been in Mutsu... with 25% more guns

- Hood is an amazing ship and yes she provides the "battlecruiser experience"

- BUT Ashitaka is more of a glass cannon and is shown in a really "clean" 1920s design appearance (not that Hood isn't drop-dead gorgeous); as a Washington treaty "cherry tree" in my opinion she's a hugely interesting design historically, even if never built

 

Overall what puts me off Ashitaka a bit is the lack of flavour. Hood is very tanky and versatile, is faster and has interesting fuse and autobounce properties to prop up her shell penetration. I've been trying not to fall into the review consensus that Ashitaka isn't fun because a) I haven't tried and b) I look for different things in playstyle. But the negativity is enough that I'm struggling to get excited enough about her to spend.

 

I was hoping for a more positive response to this thread from like-minded people who own her but the silence even among her dedicated fan base is deafening. :Smile_sad:

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I'd have to agree, it would be fun to see why people like her. After all such people do exist, surely..

 

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1 hour ago, lafeel said:

I'd have to agree, it would be fun to see why people like her. After all such people do exist, surely..

 

Well, if it helps, I like the Type 5 Chi-Ri. :fish_cute_2:

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11 minutes ago, Nishi_Kinuyo said:

Well, if it helps, I like the Type 5 Chi-Ri. :fish_cute_2:

And as previously implied, I like the Duke of York (and the Duca), so who am I to judge :D

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I'm usually the first to argue for playing a certain ship due to looks, history, design or stuff like that, or just a quirky one-sided playstyle, but the gameplay sacrifices (if any) in other areas has to be within reason. I did speak to an Ashitaka owner, someone I know is really keen on classic dreadnought hulls, and even they struggled to recommend it to me from a gameplay point of view. I also like a lot of odd duck, unpopular or widely regarded as "weak" ships like New Orleans, Eugen or Atlanta but they all have their quirks that make them fun. I imagine the draw of this is the firepower. Penetration or not, if she has Amagi accuracy that should really slap anything same tier or lower. Still speculating here though, still unsure if I can justify it.

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Actually ironically had a one in game with me just now.

 

Can't have done too well, as I was above him on the team xp list despite being bottom tier (HSF Graf)

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I like her, though this is more of a personal tick of mine rather than any expression of value. She's not the worst battleship in the game - but she's outperformed by most of her tiermates. She looks nice to my eye and can land quite heavy hits, but she's not very reliable to do so and has a difficult time staying alive herself.

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[GURKA]
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I played just a few games, but in general I like that ship. The primary contra is, that this has nothing special. No torps, no cool consumable, even the plane is missing. I also hear often "It's a stock Amagi", well a stock Amagi is still a T8, so I don't know if you can compare that :D

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[LEGIO]
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I did buy her. And i must say that i really like her. Only played 4 games so far. But i think she ´s a nice and funny ship to play with. Of course she have flaws. But use her superb precision and play smart. Use her as a she is built, as a battlecruiser. 

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Are there some tables, to compare Tier 7 penetration? Especially  Scharnhost, Ashitaka, Normandie or so?

Ashitaka is instable... but as long you can shoot stuff you are still fine. You don't need citadels against battleships. And just like it's intended role, Ashitaka blows cruisers away.

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1 hour ago, josykay said:

Are there some tables, to compare Tier 7 penetration? Especially  Scharnhost, Ashitaka, Normandie or so?

Ashitaka is instable... but as long you can shoot stuff you are still fine. You don't need citadels against battleships. And just like it's intended role, Ashitaka blows cruisers away.

You can compare up to 3 ships using the WoWS fitting tool, to be found here -> http://wowsft.com/

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4 hours ago, Aragathor said:

You can compare up to 3 ships using the WoWS fitting tool, to be found here -> http://wowsft.com/

Ahh thank you very much.  :)

WG should really make  sure, that all values are displayed.

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7 hours ago, josykay said:

Are there some tables, to compare Tier 7 penetration? Especially  Scharnhost, Ashitaka, Normandie or so?

Ashitaka is instable... but as long you can shoot stuff you are still fine. You don't need citadels against battleships. And just like it's intended role, Ashitaka blows cruisers away.

Normandie is tier 6 afaik, Lyon is tier 7.

5 hours ago, Aragathor said:

You can compare up to 3 ships using the WoWS fitting tool, to be found here -> http://wowsft.com/

And according to that site, the Ashitaka actually has slightly better penetration than the Lyon, and vastly better sigma.

Better firing arcs too I think, if you're into that.

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My mistake :) Meant Lyon, not Normandie indeed.

At least her guns... look technically ok. They are not Nagato's or Colorado's hammers, but the numbers of shells, and Overmatch potential  makes up for that. Sure, you will less likely score those citadels against battleships, but neither do Scharnhorst or Lyon. Funnily enough, Ashitaka doesn't even look that bad, aside from the mid to high tier space visibility and AA values... (Though, even that comparing tool doesn't show Ashitakas "unique" armor sheme.)

 

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25 minutes ago, Nishi_Kinuyo said:

Normandie is tier 6 afaik, Lyon is tier 7.

And according to that site, the Ashitaka actually has slightly better penetration than the Lyon, and vastly better sigma.

Better firing arcs too I think, if you're into that.

Interesting..

 

May have to look further into her then.

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7 hours ago, Nishi_Kinuyo said:

And according to that site, the Ashitaka actually has slightly better penetration than the Lyon, and vastly better sigma.

In return Lyon has a better velocity on the guns, more of them, a faster reload, and also a better dispersion value. So compared to each other the Lyon has a similar dispersion at longer ranges and the penetration that is only slightly worse than the Ashitaka. Lyon also has a much better AA suite and a vastly better concealment.

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