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ogzhnyldrm1907

Is it bad RNG or something I do not know?

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Hello everyone.  I have a problem.

I had a top tier battle for my first time in the NC. When I got spotted, I saw HE shells coming in. So I decided to use my spotter plane to have better idea where that Cleveland is. After I use my spotter plane, the guy get spotted. I shot my first valley in, 5 shells hitted him. All of them were overpens for 6k damage.

Then I hitted another Cleveland. He was 15 km away, showing full broadside. 10k damage, no citadel.

Then, the Cleveland decided to rush me. He was 7 km away, and beached himself into the island. I got only overpens with my front guns.

 

That was the guy who was rushing me:

Spoiler

shot-18_04.14_01_22.40-0787.thumb.jpg.fe6a713c93876036530161833ab7dad1.jpg

 

That was the other Cleveland, who was sitting behind the island from 12km away, I got 5 overpens in my first valley:

Spoiler

shot-18_04.14_01_22.35-0447.thumb.jpg.be2855d66f7f6af0e8c1e5d495e4db10.jpg

 

I mean, I am not a good player, I know that. But I want to get rewarded when my enemies do mistakes (like showing full broadside to the NC while stopping in 12km away, or rushing the NC while showing full broadside) . I am writing here to learn.  Do I need to aim somewhere I do not know?  For example, I can citadel every cruiser without any issues when i have good aim and they are showing their broadsides. But I can not citadel Clevelands in the same way. The distance does not matter, 7 km or 12 km or 15 km. 

 

Where to aim to citadel Clevelands?

 

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How do you rush broadside?

If he sails towards you, he is angled towards you...

 

Clevelands are easy to citadel when broadside, but quite tough when angled.

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The Cleveland is a though nut to crack.

Small citadel which is barely exposed above the waterline. It only stretches from beginning to end of the superstructure, unlike most other ships where the citadel stretches from the first to the last gun turret.

For battleships you actually want cruisers to angle a bit to ensure that your shells fuse and has enough travel time inside the ship not to detonate after exiting the ship on  the other side. That goes double for tough cruisers like the Cleveland.

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between the small citadel and the Cleavland's happy home being 14km away lobing HE from behind an island i've only ever cit one of those with a BB, and that was a friendly that chose to charge up to a red Bayern and start the rubbing paint off it broadside to broadside as passed by at full steam thus acting as spaced armor against the shells i shot at the Bayern10 seconds earlier.....doh!

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We can call it RNG and Cleveland's citadel position. Her armor is bad, but also, your guns are too thick, result is full overpens unless you hit their citadels (unless they are not angled ) .

Here is the armor layout for Cleveland;
 

Spoiler

m20JpZ.jpg


Mid citadel is almost underwater, and gun citadels are too thin. So, that's the point.

İyi şanslar, sakin denizler! :Smile_honoring:

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9 hours ago, ColonelPete said:

How do you rush broadside?

If he sails towards you, he is angled towards you...

 

Clevelands are easy to citadel when broadside, but quite tough when angled.

He peek behind an island. And turned right when he was angled so showed me full broadside before I shoot.

 

That is the problem. You say it is easy to citadel when broadside. But I can not citadel Clevelands. So I am asking how to?

 

 

9 hours ago, Nechrom said:

The Cleveland is a though nut to crack.

Small citadel which is barely exposed above the waterline. It only stretches from beginning to end of the superstructure, unlike most other ships where the citadel stretches from the first to the last gun turret.

For battleships you actually want cruisers to angle a bit to ensure that your shells fuse and has enough travel time inside the ship not to detonate after exiting the ship on  the other side. That goes double for tough cruisers like the Cleveland.

 

So you mean when I see a Cleveland, I can get pen damage when it is angled? 

8 hours ago, _LordLucan said:

between the small citadel and the Cleavland's happy home being 14km away lobing HE from behind an island i've only ever cit one of those with a BB, and that was a friendly that chose to charge up to a red Bayern and start the rubbing paint off it broadside to broadside as passed by at full steam thus acting as spaced armor against the shells i shot at the Bayern10 seconds earlier.....doh!

 

I know Clevelands love long range HE spam. And that is why I used my spotter plane to have better idea. Because since I am playing with NC, I can shoot a cruiser behind an island but I got only 5 overpens so...

 

7 minutes ago, Accelerated said:

We can call it RNG and Cleveland's citadel position. Her armor is bad, but also, your guns are too thick, result is full overpens unless you hit their citadels (unless they are not angled ) .

Here is the armor layout for Cleveland;
 

  Reveal hidden contents

m20JpZ.jpg


Mid citadel is almost underwater, and gun citadels are too thin. So, that's the point.

İyi şanslar, sakin denizler! :Smile_honoring:

If I understand correctly, I can not citadel it because my shells are too thick, and for mid citadel I need to aim way more below right?

 

Teşekkürler hocam, size de bol şanslar   :Smile_honoring:

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8 dakika önce, ogzhnyldrm1907 dedi:

If I understand correctly, I can not citadel it because my shells are too thick, and for mid citadel I need to aim way more below right?

 

Teşekkürler hocam, size de bol şanslar   :Smile_honoring:


You can citadel if you hit to citadel. There is no overpen on citadels. If Cleveland gives you full broadside and you didn't hit her citadel, result is full overpens. Because her plating is too poor. To hit citadel, yea, you have to aim below but it is still about RNG. Even you are aiming to exact point, RNG may shows middle finger. :cap_haloween:

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8 minutes ago, ogzhnyldrm1907 said:

So you mean when I see a Cleveland, I can get pen damage when it is angled? 

It's your best shot.

Seeing as the Cleveland is only armored on it's tiny citadel, almost every hit you get on him will be 16mm plates. This means two things:

  1. There is no angle he can present where you won't penetrate due to the overmatch mechanic.
  2. You need to hit that armor at something like 76-77° for your shells to even arm.

So if you find a Cleveland broadside to you, you need to hit that tiny citadel to do any meaningful damage. Every other hit will just be an overpenetration unless he's at a pretty steep angle to you. The only other way for your shells to arm when hitting the Cleveland is hitting the gun barbettes, but that's not really something you can aim for with a battleship, so it'll just be down to luck if you do, but once again you'll have bigger chance if he's angled.

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7 minutes ago, ogzhnyldrm1907 said:

He peek behind an island. And turned right when he was angled so showed me full broadside before I shoot.

 

That is the problem. You say it is easy to citadel when broadside. But I can not citadel Clevelands. So I am asking how to?

Aim to hit low at midship:

That's far from only time I've citadelled Cleveland.

With very high penetration gun from closer range you would want to aim just at waterline to hit water just before ship arming the fuze.

You can use Training Room to practise that by adding Clevelands as "target ships".

At long range more downward dropping shell trajectory should make it easier to hit citadel of at least stationary Cleveland if dispersion is good.

 

Also angled Cleveland is nice soft target because of that flimsy all or nothing armor scheme tinfoil, which gets easily overmatched giving regular pens.

Unlike some IJN cruisers whose midship can bounce BB APs when angled enough for auto bounce.

 

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Citadels against Clevelands? I managed a couple with my Warspite from nearly maximim range (= plunging shells) and iirc even a one-salvo-and-boom-she's-gone hit.

 

Apart from that, there are many ships that are easier to citadel than a Cleveland...

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22 hours ago, ogzhnyldrm1907 said:

Hello everyone.  I have a problem.

I had a top tier battle for my first time in the NC. When I got spotted, I saw HE shells coming in. So I decided to use my spotter plane to have better idea where that Cleveland is. After I use my spotter plane, the guy get spotted. I shot my first valley in, 5 shells hitted him. All of them were overpens for 6k damage.

Then I hitted another Cleveland. He was 15 km away, showing full broadside. 10k damage, no citadel.

Then, the Cleveland decided to rush me. He was 7 km away, and beached himself into the island. I got only overpens with my front guns.

 

That was the guy who was rushing me:

  Reveal hidden contents

shot-18_04.14_01_22.40-0787.thumb.jpg.fe6a713c93876036530161833ab7dad1.jpg

 

That was the other Cleveland, who was sitting behind the island from 12km away, I got 5 overpens in my first valley:

  Reveal hidden contents

shot-18_04.14_01_22.35-0447.thumb.jpg.be2855d66f7f6af0e8c1e5d495e4db10.jpg

 

I mean, I am not a good player, I know that. But I want to get rewarded when my enemies do mistakes (like showing full broadside to the NC while stopping in 12km away, or rushing the NC while showing full broadside) . I am writing here to learn.  Do I need to aim somewhere I do not know?  For example, I can citadel every cruiser without any issues when i have good aim and they are showing their broadsides. But I can not citadel Clevelands in the same way. The distance does not matter, 7 km or 12 km or 15 km. 

 

Where to aim to citadel Clevelands?

 

water level

 

pray to RNG god

 

 

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On 4/14/2018 at 12:46 AM, ogzhnyldrm1907 said:

Hello everyone.  I have a problem.

I had a top tier battle for my first time in the NC. When I got spotted, I saw HE shells coming in. So I decided to use my spotter plane to have better idea where that Cleveland is. After I use my spotter plane, the guy get spotted. I shot my first valley in, 5 shells hitted him. All of them were overpens for 6k damage.

Then I hitted another Cleveland. He was 15 km away, showing full broadside. 10k damage, no citadel.

Then, the Cleveland decided to rush me. He was 7 km away, and beached himself into the island. I got only overpens with my front guns.

 

That was the guy who was rushing me:

  Reveal hidden contents

shot-18_04.14_01_22.40-0787.thumb.jpg.fe6a713c93876036530161833ab7dad1.jpg

 

That was the other Cleveland, who was sitting behind the island from 12km away, I got 5 overpens in my first valley:

  Reveal hidden contents

shot-18_04.14_01_22.35-0447.thumb.jpg.be2855d66f7f6af0e8c1e5d495e4db10.jpg

 

I mean, I am not a good player, I know that. But I want to get rewarded when my enemies do mistakes (like showing full broadside to the NC while stopping in 12km away, or rushing the NC while showing full broadside) . I am writing here to learn.  Do I need to aim somewhere I do not know?  For example, I can citadel every cruiser without any issues when i have good aim and they are showing their broadsides. But I can not citadel Clevelands in the same way. The distance does not matter, 7 km or 12 km or 15 km. 

 

Where to aim to citadel Clevelands?

 

It could be bad RNG, but im not so sure about it because we all know WG did some AP changes recently so firing offen seems diferent then before 0.7.2 patch.

 

Yesterday in Clan Battles I played Conqueror and on 15 km range was enemy Des Moines who have soft armor. I hit him 3 times with AP and it didnt do nothing to him. Usualy 1 salvo from Conqueror's 12x 420 mm would eat cruisers like him.

 

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