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The_Dunk_Squad

British Battleship Armor Piercing not Citadelling?

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Is something different? I'm hitting enemy battleships center mass from about 11-14km broadside on with my Armor Piercing, I'm getting penetrations for like 3-5k damage per shell, but no Citadels? What's happening? I wish this game would show you what happened to your shell...

 

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Ever heard the tragic story of short AP fuse shells versus subsurface citadels and/or turtleback armour?

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1 minute ago, Ubertron_X said:

Ever heard the tragic story of short AP fuse shells versus subsurface citadels and/or turtleback armour?

 

No.

I thought not. It's not a story WarGaming would tell you...

 

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Though it is not impossible for British BB to citadel other BB's it is much harder to pull off, as the British AP shells have shortened fuse timers. While this helps versus cruisers to avoid overpenetrations it causes the shells to explode prematurely when they hit BB's, dealing regular penetration damage instead of causing citadel hits.

 

In addition to that there are a couple of BB who are notoriously hard to citadel, mostly those who have a submerged citadel and/or feature effective turtleback armour (literally the entire Kriegsmarine BB line), which is especially true at close range, as the shallower shell angles work against you.

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you know, it would help if you told us which ship you are actually playing. The game changes a little bit as you go up the tiers...

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56 minutes ago, Tyrendian89 said:

you know, it would help if you told us which ship you are actually playing. The game changes a little bit as you go up the tiers...

 

Iron Duke.

 

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1 hour ago, The_Dunk_Squad said:

Is something different? I'm hitting enemy battleships center mass from about 11-14km broadside on with my Armor Piercing, I'm getting penetrations for like 3-5k damage per shell, but no Citadels? What's happening? I wish this game would show you what happened to your shell...

Short Fuse AP. Shells explode in half the time after penetration.

Normal fuse is... 0.03s I think

RN gets it at 0.015s

 

Against BBs - yeah, much harder to citadel, but also much less likely to overpen

Against CA/Ls and DDs I'd say it's the superior AP type

 

4 minutes ago, The_Dunk_Squad said:

Iron Duke.

Ahh, I found Dukes AP to be usable only below 10km range. The "good" RN AP started from QE and upwards, while I may be a rather rare exception to it starting from the QE I still prefer the AP over HE in most situations.

 

An easy way that I go by for the amo selection on RN BBs is by range - in the furthest third of it your AP is next to useless, that's where you use mostly HE. Anything that's closer than that - use your amo just like on any other BB.

 

Example:

QE has 17.1km range, so up to about 12km I'd play her as any other BB, but at 12 to 17 km I'd use HE much more.

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1 minute ago, The_Dunk_Squad said:

 

Iron Duke.

 

...ah. You just left protected matchmaking. Yeah there are quite a few BBs in your matchmaking range that you will pretty much never citadel due to a combination of your gun  performance (which on the Iron Duck isn't exactly fantastic) and their ship design (hello Gneisenau/Scharnhorst turtleback! to name the most pronounced example). So at this point, that is nothing you are doing wrong - it's just the way it is. And against broadsides, AP is still the better choice - get a couple of those penetrations in one salvo (if RNGsus is in a cooperative mood), and you still hurt your target a lot even without citadels.

 

As you gain more experience over time, you'll learn more about the peculiarities of the ships that you face, and what to expect from them (both when they shoot you and when you shoot them). Keep an open mind, occasionally take the time to do a little bit of research on something that gives you particular trouble (sort of like you did here), and you'll gather more and more of that knowledge and add it to your decisionmaking.

 

Oh also,

1 hour ago, The_Dunk_Squad said:

 I wish this game would show you what happened to your shell...

 

in a rather limited way, it already does. There's a checkbox somewhere in the interface options for "Detailed Ribbons" - that'll at least give you a breakdown between riccochets, non-penetrations, overpens and full pens. While it would sometimes be neat to get a sort of "shell cam", an instant replay of exactly where your shell went and what it did, that isn't in the game (and is also not planned afaik).

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Just now, Tyrendian89 said:

...ah. You just left protected matchmaking. Yeah there are quite a few BBs in your matchmaking range that you will pretty much never citadel due to a combination of your gun  performance (which on the Iron Duck isn't exactly fantastic) and their ship design (hello Gneisenau/Scharnhorst turtleback! to name the most pronounced example). So at this point, that is nothing you are doing wrong - it's just the way it is. And against broadsides, AP is still the better choice - get a couple of those penetrations in one salvo (if RNGsus is in a cooperative mood), and you still hurt your target a lot even without citadels.

 

As you gain more experience over time, you'll learn more about the peculiarities of the ships that you face, and what to expect from them (both when they shoot you and when you shoot them). Keep an open mind, occasionally take the time to do a little bit of research on something that gives you particular trouble (sort of like you did here), and you'll gather more and more of that knowledge and add it to your decisionmaking.

 

Oh also,

in a rather limited way, it already does. There's a checkbox somewhere in the interface options for "Detailed Ribbons" - that'll at least give you a breakdown between riccochets, non-penetrations, overpens and full pens. While it would sometimes be neat to get a sort of "shell cam", an instant replay of exactly where your shell went and what it did, that isn't in the game (and is also not planned afaik).

 

I have detailed ribbons on, and yeah I've been finding the Iron Duck worse than the Orion

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Just now, The_Dunk_Squad said:

 

I have detailed ribbons on, and yeah I've been finding the Iron Duck worse than the Orion

small wonder - it's practically the same ship, but with vastly different matchmaking (you go from one of the best tiers to be at MM wise, to one of the very very worst).

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2 minutes ago, The_Dunk_Squad said:

 

I have detailed ribbons on, and yeah I've been finding the Iron Duck worse than the Orion

 

While the Duke is pretty good, Orion is really, really strong in Tier 4, you've essentially gone from a ship many feel is OP to one that people treat as reasonably OK, but nothing special.

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1 minute ago, BeauNidl3 said:

 

While the Duke is pretty good, Orion is really, really strong in Tier 4, you've essentially gone from a ship many feel is OP to one that people treat as reasonably OK, but nothing special.

 

Yeah I've been liking the Duke, I just dont feel outright invincible like I did with the Orion.

 

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