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TigerMoth

Błyskawica Needs Some Love?

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Having had a break from the game when they removed the ability for DD's to invisifire (a good call), today I had my first game in the Błyskawica since those changes.

 

This ship needs some serious love. As WG sold this ship on its ability to shoot at range, undetected - It's main strength with the old mechanics. It now has very little going for it.

 

The gun range is a pain in the butt. Soon as you shoot, it feels like the whole enemy team spots you! :Smile_sad:

 

Add to this, a high detection range, and this ship is no longer the fun boat it was.

 

Can we please have some love for this ship by adjusting at least one of  these?

 

Reduced gun range.

Reduced detectability range.

Increased smoke duration.

Increased torpedo range.

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2 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:
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I think you misread my post. I wasn't asking for game advice.

 

I was suggesting the ship needs some love. I was kind of expecting comments saying, 'no, it is fine' or, 'yes, I agree'.

 

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17 minutes ago, TigerMoth said:

Reduced gun range.

Reduced detectability range.

Increased smoke duration.

Increased torpedo range.

 

-Reduced range - that would be a nerf, not a buff. Blyska lives and dies by its guns.

-Reduced detection - maybe.

-Smoke duration - nope, unless it's a special trait.

-Torp range - 8km is alright at T7 for a gunboat.

 

What the ship would really need is either better torps (faster) or better gun reload, because 6.5 base reload is a joke compared with Leningrad and soon Cossack (The latter has 4x2 turrets with a reload of 5s).

 

13 minutes ago, TigerMoth said:

I think you misread my post. I wasn't asking for game advice.

 

I was suggesting the ship needs some love. I was kind of expecting comments saying, 'no, it is fine' or, 'yes, I agree'.

 

 

A lot of people will just post "git gud" and be all smug, while showing complete ignorance of the fact that Blyska is getting powercreeped. Cossack with more guns and faster reload, Z-39 with 150mm guns. The ships needs a better edge.

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WD40 the turrets and the torpedo propeller shaft to get an extra 3-5 knots out of the torpedoes, and there, Blyska fixed.

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2 hours ago, ColonelPete said:

She outperforms Sims and Leningrad.

 

image.png.9d633a151937bf5aeb359cdead8d17d7.png

http://maplesyrup.sweet.coocan.jp/wows/ranking/index.html

 

For me she still feels fine, one of my best Tier VII DD. And yes, she needs at least 10 point captain to work.

 

I'm only a mediocre player, and my winrate in the Polish Blitz is 53% and average damage is at 36k. In the Sims it's 50% WR and only 28k. Akatsuki was 54% and 41k. Mahan 48% and 28k.

 

So... nah, I also don't think the Blitz needs a buff. Probably just a problem of the OP with the style of play it needs. You can still kite cruisers and use speed and agility to dodge their shots. Alas, only if you know how to do damage at long range.

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Błyskawica should have defensive AA consumable - every time she's mentioned, there's something about her disrupting AA raids on that one city AND her description mentions being best AA DD in the world when commisioned! Meanwhile she can't deal with a single spotter plane. Damn, she should have that def. AA!

 

Maybe in the same slot as smoke (so nobody would use it anyway :Smile-_tongue: ), but she should have one as an option :cap_rambo:

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4 hours ago, TigerMoth said:

Having had a break from the game when they removed the ability for DD's to invisifire (a good call), today I had my first game in the Błyskawica since those changes.

 

This ship needs some serious love. As WG sold this ship on its ability to shoot at range, undetected - It's main strength with the old mechanics. It now has very little going for it.

 

The gun range is a pain in the butt. Soon as you shoot, it feels like the whole enemy team spots you! :Smile_sad:

 

Add to this, a high detection range, and this ship is no longer the fun boat it was.

 

Can we please have some love for this ship by adjusting at least one of  these?

 

Reduced gun range.

Reduced detectability range.

Increased smoke duration.

Increased torpedo range.

 

Used it to get Rank 1 in Season 6 and there is nothing wrong with it, you just cant burn down multiple BBs for free anymore.

It was OP when introduced, only the later massively nerfed Kiev could fight it.

 

Now it is just one of many good T7 dds that has powercreeped it (Gadjah Mada, Leningrad, Cossack soon can all fight it on even terms)

It's strength was always high volley alpha with a correspondingly bad ROF though maybe it could use a slight ROF buff since Leningrad has become the Khaba "light" speedboat on Tier VII.

 

WG should offer a refund though, since they removed the mechanic they specifically advertised the Blysca on

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4 hours ago, GulvkluderGuld said:

Used it to get Rank 1 in Season 6 and there is nothing wrong with it

AFAIK the 6th season happened before the the stealth fire removal. So you are talking about circumstances that aren't present in the game anymore.

 

4 hours ago, GulvkluderGuld said:

Now it is just one of many good T7 dds that has powercreeped it (Gadjah Mada, Leningrad, Cossack soon can all fight it on even terms)

And this is the argument that supports a buff, because:

-Leningrad is faster, stealthier, and has a better rudder shift. Also the torpedo armament is vastly superior with better speed, damage, and torpedo tube amount.

-Gadjah Mada has faster firing guns with good angles, plus two pentad torpedo launchers that fire almost double the amount of torpos the blyska fires.

-Cossack has more guns that fire at a better rate. It's, for now, stealthier and has hydro.

 

Blyska will struggle to fight against those three on even terms unless it can ambush them and fire the guns first. Under other circumstances it is the weaker ship.

 

4 hours ago, GulvkluderGuld said:

WG should offer a refund though, since they removed the mechanic they specifically advertised the Blysca on

Instead of refunding, WG should balance T7 premiums better. And nerf the Gadjah...

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55 minutes ago, Aragathor said:

And this is the argument that supports a buff, because:

-Leningrad is faster, stealthier, and has a better rudder shift. Also the torpedo armament is vastly superior with better speed, damage, and torpedo tube amount.

-Gadjah Mada has faster firing guns with good angles, plus two pentad torpedo launchers that fire almost double the amount of torpos the blyska fires.

-Cossack has more guns that fire at a better rate. It's, for now, stealthier and has hydro.

 

Blyska will struggle to fight against those three on even terms unless it can ambush them and fire the guns first. Under other circumstances it is the weaker ship.

Problem is that it's a very bad idea to start balancing based on OP ships, it's better for the OP to be brought in line, this isn't possible for Lenin but Gadjah is a silver ship and Cossack isn't released and is still in testing. 

 

While I don't have Blyska myself she doesn't seem like a weak ship, merely weaker than DDs that are the best at T7. Looking at her stats she seems like a slightly weaker version than Lenin (with worse torpedoes and worse speed, mind Lenin is among the fastest in game, but she has a much better turret traverse) which in itself is a strong ship that many will argue is blatantly OP. A better Blyska player will still likely come out on top in a 1v1.

 

Every premium does not need to be and should not be the strongest at their tier (even though they often are), premiums that are ok or average are fine.

 

I wouldn't massively mind WG buffing her (provided it is a slight buff, otherwise I'm against it) but I personally don't consider it necessary, especially considering the current MM means she'll rarely get uptiered. 

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1 hour ago, CleverViking said:

considering the current MM means she'll rarely get uptiered. 

Define "rarely". Because problem is: she does get uptiered quite a bit and, boy, does she suffer when that happens. She gets outspotted by everything, her guns end up against things like Akizuki and Kidd, her torps are just not up to par...

She used to excel in speed and gunpower AND in worst-case scenario she could fall back on her ability to stealth fire - she used to punch up pretty well. Now she's still strong (even if powercreeped quite a bit) as top tier, but her ability to punch above her weight went to hell. She can't even do long-range speed gunboating properly because her shells lose velocity pretty fast and at longer distance the arc and travel time become really bad.

 

Basically, she's a ship that had her strong points either removed or powercreeped while her weak points remained as they were. Sure, she's hardly the weakest of the bunch but she pretty much got relegated to the "worse Lenningrad" status. This causes negative reaction from her fans - perhaps disproportionate (when you take into account the overall pecking order among t7 DDs) but pretty understandable...

 

Which is one of the reasons why I'm only partially joking when I suggest giving her def. AA - it won't necessarily be a huge buff it it goes into smoke consumable slot (or if she gets a special one with little to no damage increase) BUT it would make her unique in t7 AND fit extremely well into her lore - after all, her best known exploit pretty much boils down to shooting her AA guns like crazy to force the air raid to fly higher and drop less accurately. Which is, incidentally, the exact way defensive AA works in WoWs.

 

Błyskawica doesn't necessarily need to be significantly stronger - but I would certainly want her to be more special (since her original specialness - guns and speed - got powercreeped so hard).

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USS Sims has def.AA already - just a sidenote.

 

Perhaps WG should put it into the Royal Navy fleet. At least UK Capts should work on it. That would give her an additional sense as a crew trainer.

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4 hours ago, Aragathor said:

AFAIK the 6th season happened before the the stealth fire removal. So you are talking about circumstances that aren't present in the game anymore.

 

And this is the argument that supports a buff, because:

-Leningrad is faster, stealthier, and has a better rudder shift. Also the torpedo armament is vastly superior with better speed, damage, and torpedo tube amount.

-Gadjah Mada has faster firing guns with good angles, plus two pentad torpedo launchers that fire almost double the amount of torpos the blyska fires.

-Cossack has more guns that fire at a better rate. It's, for now, stealthier and has hydro.

 

Blyska will struggle to fight against those three on even terms unless it can ambush them and fire the guns first. Under other circumstances it is the weaker ship.

 

Instead of refunding, WG should balance T7 premiums better. And nerf the Gadjah...

And she still has a higher WR than Leningrad...

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Błyska is stil very comfortable ship to play. Lenin is faster, but his turning circle is even bigger then PL ship, making her even worse cap contester in closed areas.

 

Gadjah/Cossack are slow ships with US arcs , suited for close combat, when Błyska shines in middle/long fights. Those are different ships for different purposes. Both of them when spotted > 8 km have not a chance in open combat with PL/RU DD. Anyway HE DPM of all ships are almost the same, while only the two first ones can use it  effectively on all distances.  Błyska/Lenin/Cossack/Gadja 110K/114K/122K/122K. Anyway the two second ones has turret rotation the same as Błyska - 18 s, so even in close fight chances are comparable for all - four ships.

 

PL torps are rather weak, but this is almost pure gunboat ship with extra torps. Buffs ? Always welcome, but taking invisi fire from Błyska force players to a proper game, more focused on DD role - capping/spotting/fighing enemy DD, which is the first priority of destroyer play. Damage done to BB/cruisers sometimes is good, but focusing purely on it in Błyska, always was a great mistake. In DD play only one thing really matters - WR. Nothing more, nothing less.

 

Those are my solo stats in very close time from invisi fire nerf. Błyska is top 1, while Lenin played like standard RU DD is the last one in WR ... As I said - most the time capping/spotting/killing DD is winning games, not doing DMG to other classes. This is something extra, when the game is already won.

 

I am not the best player, but I am just trying to do my best for a team.

 

5ac0a6e882449_Beztytuu.thumb.png.b51773d2ce1381618c62e6ff6b0f516b.png

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14 hours ago, TigerMoth said:

Can we please have some love for this ship by adjusting at least one of  these?

 

Reduced gun range.

Reduced detectability range.

With four guns firing to rear Blyska is pretty much ideal ship for kiting away and range reduction would hurt that.

 

And with that heavy seven gun broadside, hp pool and speed stealth improvement could easily cause more problems for balancing between tiers.

 

 

4 hours ago, Aragathor said:

And this is the argument that supports a buff, because:

-Leningrad is faster, stealthier, and has a better rudder shift. Also the torpedo armament is vastly superior with better speed, damage, and torpedo tube amount.

-Gadjah Mada has faster firing guns with good angles, plus two pentad torpedo launchers that fire almost double the amount of torpos the blyska fires.

-Cossack has more guns that fire at a better rate. It's, for now, stealthier and has hydro.

 

Blyska will struggle to fight against those three on even terms unless it can ambush them and fire the guns first. Under other circumstances it is the weaker ship.

 

Instead of refunding, WG should balance T7 premiums better. And nerf the Gadjah...

So wouldn't it be better for WG do better job at balancing from the start?

Leningrad has bad turret traverse and even worser firing angles to limit gun firepower use.

But then they added ships like Gadjah, giving ship with heavy firepower and permasmoke ability also very good stealth.

And Cossack looks like another balancing train wreck.

 

Heavy handed buffing just leads to self reinforcing spin of balancing problems.

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14 hours ago, TigerMoth said:

Having had a break from the game when they removed the ability for DD's to invisifire (a good call), today I had my first game in the Błyskawica since those changes.

 

This ship needs some serious love. As WG sold this ship on its ability to shoot at range, undetected - It's main strength with the old mechanics. It now has very little going for it.

 

The gun range is a pain in the butt. Soon as you shoot, it feels like the whole enemy team spots you! :Smile_sad:

 

Add to this, a high detection range, and this ship is no longer the fun boat it was.

 

Can we please have some love for this ship by adjusting at least one of  these?

 

Reduced gun range.

Reduced detectability range.

Increased smoke duration.

Increased torpedo range.

It was one od most OP ships in game. Now it is just very strong. Compared to other DDs she is balanced. 

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6 hours ago, Aragathor said:

AFAIK the 6th season happened before the the stealth fire removal. So you are talking about circumstances that aren't present in the game anymore.

I was sure it was before, but it was actually at the end of S6 :Smile_honoring:

 

The reason I dont remember is how little I used it in the higher ranks - that was all about Blysca outspotting most dds once the IJN ones were killed off.

 

My point still stands though. It was OP, now it is merely one of many strong dds and the king of kiting.

Blysca can beat Leningrad if played well as because of the reasons EsaTunaanen wrote. Its a fair fight.

Gadjah actually has horrible turret arcs on the front turrets so it sucks at kiting away. Perma-smoke in DD vs DD does not mean much when it has DW torps, as you can always rush and torp it.

I'd say a slight ROF nerf would bring it in line. Cossack sounds a little stupid, but so far it is just in ST.

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4 hours ago, stinkmorchel said:

 

Perhaps WG should put it into the Royal Navy fleet. At least UK Capts should work on it. That would give her an additional sense as a crew trainer.

 

Something that I think WG should look at for all the orphan ships.

 

Make the CW, maybe PL and perhaps some future European ships compatible with the RN, perhaps the Italians can be paired with the French until they get a full tech tree, maybe some South American ships can go with the USN.

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9 hours ago, Aragathor said:

AFAIK the 6th season happened before the the stealth fire removal. So you are talking about circumstances that aren't present in the game anymore.

 

And this is the argument that supports a buff, because:

-Leningrad is faster, stealthier, and has a better rudder shift. Also the torpedo armament is vastly superior with better speed, damage, and torpedo tube amount.

-Gadjah Mada has faster firing guns with good angles, plus two pentad torpedo launchers that fire almost double the amount of torpos the blyska fires.

-Cossack has more guns that fire at a better rate. It's, for now, stealthier and has hydro.

 

Blyska will struggle to fight against those three on even terms unless it can ambush them and fire the guns first. Under other circumstances it is the weaker ship.

 

Instead of refunding, WG should balance T7 premiums better. And nerf the Gadjah...

Bly never ever was DD hunter or capper.  In its glory days she would lose from USA DDs. It just lacks dps, stealth and agility for that. 

 

She allways was burner of BBs with epic firechance and good balistic and range. (and epic stealthfire window due to small caliber guns)

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1 hour ago, 15JG52Adler said:

Bly never ever was DD hunter or capper.  In its glory days she would lose from USA DDs. It just lacks dps, stealth and agility for that.

I always played her like that and it worked fine. Kiting is the key.

 

1 hour ago, 15JG52Adler said:

She allways was burner of BBs with epic firechance and good balistic and range. (and epic stealthfire window due to small caliber guns)

Yes, she is good at that. But burning BBs and farming damage is not a good way to win a match.

 

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22 hours ago, TigerMoth said:

This ship needs some serious love. As WG sold this ship on its ability to shoot at range, undetected - It's main strength with the old mechanics. It now has very little going for it.

 

Blyskawica is still a very capable destroyer. If you needed stealth fire to perform with her, you played her wrong. There is no T7 DD which could beat her at midrange engagements.

 

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3 hours ago, ColonelPete said:

I always played her like that and it worked fine. Kiting is the key.

 

Yes, she is good at that. But burning BBs and farming damage is not a good way to win a match.

 

Good player wins over bad ones. For sure bly can be played as USA or ijn dd and it can work but it is a gunboat with all advantages and disadvantages of gunboat. 

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Blys is some hybrid between US and Russian DDs: It has US gun characteristics and Russian speed and HP to fight in the open. IMHO she was never supposed to sit in smoke and spam battleships. You cannot outspot most other DDs but you can outbully them.

 

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