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AmiralPotato

Help wanted: guide to BB brawling

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Hi everyone,

While knowing that brawling may not be the most effective playstyle for BBs, I would like to try to gather advice on how to do it.

More precisely, how to actually do it in a reasonably useful way for the team, instead of my current "rush -> die -> repeat'' way :D

 

This would include

- choice of lines/tiers

- choice of captain skills (typically first 10pt, and then full 19)

- choice of ship upgrades

- choice of camo / flags

- tactics

- other ?

 

Please don't hesitate to state the obvious and cover low tiers as well (well, I would call 4- low, 5-7 medium, and 8+ high).

Quite a lot of posts here seem to focus on higher tiers for experienced players, leaving us newbies a bit lost.

 

Thanks !

Potato

 

Summary:

- to be completed

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[-T-O-]
Alpha Tester, Players, In AlfaTesters
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The only good brawler BBs for me (that I have played and still do + have in port) are Tier - VII Scharnhorst, VIII Tirpitz, Bismarck and Amagi (kinda), IX FdG, X GK. In short mostly German BBs.

 

As for the choice for captain skills, upgrades, tactics would suggest to watch Flamu's videos. (just type Flamu and preferable ship; e.g. Flamu Bismarck). You have it all in those.

 

As for the camo - your choice. You can do as I did, buy a perma camo for real money or go for camos for credits/doubloons.

Signals - standard BB signals - November Foxtrot e7542de6-a258-11e5-82d7-ac162d8bc1e4.png (reduces the recharge time of consumables by 5%) India Delta 433a2308-b399-11e5-b275-ac162d8bc1e4.png (it gives you a 20% bonus to HP recovered when using the "Repair Party" consumable) India Yankee 437b7e5c-b399-11e5-b275-ac162d8bc1e4.png (decreases the time of fire extinguishing by 20%) Juliet Yankee Bissotwo 4356b022-b399-11e5-b275-ac162d8bc1e4.png (reduces flooding recovery time by 20%) Mike Yankee Soxisix43631c0e-b399-11e5-b275-ac162d8bc1e4.png (improving accuracy and firing range by 5% of your secondaries). The last one Mike Yankee Soxisix you take only if you went for full sec build.

 

November Echo Setteseven e7606dea-a258-11e5-82d7-ac162d8bc1e4.png - Improves the performance of anti-aircraft guns. Improved by 10%. Good to use on BBs with excellent AA; e.g. USN BBs + some other BBs from other nations.

Sierra Mike 4388bd1a-b399-11e5-b275-ac162d8bc1e4.png - gives you a 5% bonus to the maximum speed of your ship.

 

                                                  

 

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Add Gneisenau to your list.

 

Speed, agility, torpedoes and big guns that come into their own at under 12km. Also a better(?) secondary complement that comes into its own at longer range than Scharn's - I might be wrong but it feels that way to me. In any case I specced secondary from the off and the captain maintained this spec until GK, with much hilarity ensuing.

 

For my money Gneisenau is the best/my favourite TVII BB.

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Also, Mikasa really shines when something comes into secondary range, but that's mostly because they main battery is crap and the ship at T2 is a silly pre-dreadnought. Don't buy it just for that.

 

Choice of lines: German T7+, others can brawl too, but need to be more careful. Amagi mostly just shines at very close ranges due to turtleback and the broadside weight they can fire off if they manage to catch your broadside. Has decent HE though, if you really need to shoot angled targets. Rest, I wouldn't use much for brawling (and wouldn't build amagi as dedicated brawler, because it is a midrange sniper).

 

Captain Skills: PT, EM (replace with AR on Germans), BFT (BoS or SI are very decent alternatives, if you don't want to go fully secondary, but have some survivability), AFT (range is more important than accuracy, as it also affects AA and likely you won't get 14 pts before Bismarck, so on Gneisenau you want the AA). For 19 pts, obviously the next 4 pts are for Manual Secondaries, then you get the coice of whether you want to get a 4 pt skill and a 1 pt skill or a 3 pt skill and EM (or AR, if you weren't German and didn't take it the first time). 4pt picks are typically FP to avoid getting burned down, CE to sneak closer undetected or IFHE, which is especially of use on Gneisenau and GK, where it allows 128 mm secondaries to pen the weak parts of T8+ BBs (I used the space battles to test IFHE on GK, it's ok. Certainly not something I'd bring into competitive, but for the odd fun). 3pts are BFT, BoS or SI, whichever you haven't picked yet. 1 pt skills likely are double plane, ammo switch or PM to keep secondaries alive longer.

 

Ship upgrades: I guess modules, and this depends on ship. Secondary survivability, secondary firing range, damecon 1, damecon 2, concealment, main battery reload (secondary reload might sound lulzier for secondary build, but unless you are a total crapshoot, your main battery will always be where it's at) are typically what I'd use, though last one only is available on FdG and GK. On FdG, GK and Amagi, I'd replace damecon 2 with steering gear mod, because rudder shift is so terrible otherwise.

 

Camo: Whatever camo reduces your visibility and increases dispersion when firing at your ship. All special camos have that, so they can all be used. Camos mostly just have added econ bonuses anyway, no secondary benefit.

 

Flags: _DeathWing_ explained it already.

 

Tactics: Depends on ship. No two ships play the same of those recommended. Bismarck/Tirpitz likely are the most well-rounded and capable and can pursue close range the best, while Gneisenau kind of has the issue it is made for close ranges, but cannot stand getting focused and flanked and the larger ships are way easier targets, so they also need to make sure they don't overextent. To the point they might even rather go for tank build.

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On 01/04/2018 at 4:04 AM, Riselotte said:

Also, Mikasa really shines when something comes into secondary range

Key point: "when something comes". You're not getting to anything with that speed. You have to wait until the enemies get to you. :fish_aqua:

 

Anyway, as people say, the Germans work well overall. The low and mid tiers aren't bad either. What's more important is that you learn how to play the respective ships to their strength. For instance, while Bismarck has great secondaries, they're not effective straight forward or backwards. They've got roughly the same angles as your main guns, so keep that in mind. You can try out to see what at angle they go off on (and you are going to notice that). Just make sure you're not showing too much broadside, especially when you know enemy BBs have reloaded. That's the key to surviving. Also learn where to aim. Don't hit the belt unless you've got a relatively flat angle. Better go for the more reliable penetrations in the bow, or aim for the guns to reduce enemy firepower.

 

A secondary build and an AA build are very similar, with only a few differences. Therefore you should pick everything that gives plusses to both of those. For the more specialised stuff, you can choose either, or go for survival with that stuff instead. Still, remember that your main guns are your main guns for a reason. Your secondaries, even when fully secondary specced, will do less damage. But you can still increase that damage decently with a secondary specced ship. It's up to you which path to take (but personally, secondaries are just so much fun).

 

Captain skills are honestly not as important exactly what you pick, as long as you pick something that benefits your style. But to mention some of the skills:

  • Priority Target: Good, solid skill. Gives information about enemies that consider you a threat and potentially incoming torpedoes.
  • Preventive Maintenance: It would be good if it affected secondaries. It doesn't, so it's not worth it.
  • High Alert: Not that useful since you can get by with careful DCP management, but not terrible. Problem is that there are more useful T2 skills.
  • Jack of All Trades: Slightly better than HA, since the overall bonus is better, but still not great.
  • Expert Marksman: Personal preference. Test your ship first. Do you think you need faster turning turrets? Pick it. Can you manage without? Don't. I actually have it on Bismarck, despite already very good turret traverse (for a BB), just because it is noticeable in brawling (but not much elsewhere).
  • Adrenaline Rush: Mandatory. One of the best skills of all. 10% more total firepower at 50% health.
  • Basics of Survivabilty: Not bad, and sort of does the same job as High Alert but better. Since you'll often let single (and sometimes double) fires burn, you'll take 15% less damage from those. Solid choice for surviviability.
  • Survivability Expert: If you want to troll people into thinking you're a potato. Only if.
  • Basic Firing Training: Very good for a brawler. Better secondaries and better AA. German BBs benefit from both.
  • Superintendent: One more heal, one more sonar (for those that have it). Planes you have enough of. Not worth it if you often die before using all consumables. Worth it if you do survive that long.
  • Vigilance: Personal preference. If you don't have sonar, not a bad choice for a brawler. You can leave this one be until you know how much trouble you have with torpedoes.
  • Manual Fire Control for Secondary Armament: The fun skill. If you want to snipe with your secondaries, pick it. Does wonder for secondary DPS.
  • Fire Prevention: Only YOU can prevent ship fires! Solid skill, especially if you're often on fire. One of the best skills for survivability.
  • Advanced Firing Training: BFT version two.
  • Concealment Expert: While a good skill, it's less useful for a brawler (you're constantly detected anyway), and you're going to have a lot of skills you want to spend points on anyway. I wouldn't recommend it, but in return, you need to make sure you have a good exit strategy. Make use of islands to get out of line of fire since you can't rely on stealth. Also use islands to get into brawling range.

You can pretty much pick and choose from what you want. It all depends on what you're good at, what you need help with, and what synergises with your personal playstyle. Players brawl in different ways, and have different problems with it. Pick what suits you; that's the most important part.

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9 hours ago, AnotherDuck said:

Key point: "when something comes". You're not getting to anything with that speed. You have to wait until the enemies get to you. :fish_aqua:

 

Anyway, as people say, the Germans work well overall. The low and mid tiers aren't bad either. What's more important is that you learn how to play the respective ships to their strength. For instance, while Bismarck has great secondaries, they're not effective straight forward or backwards. They've got roughly the same angles as your main guns, so keep that in mind. You can try out to see what at angle they go off on (and you are going to notice that). Just make sure you're not showing too much broadside, especially when you know enemy BBs have reloaded. That's the key to surviving. Also learn where to aim. Don't hit the belt unless you've got a relatively flat angle. Better go for the more reliable penetrations in the bow, or aim for the guns to reduce enemy firepower.

 

A secondary build and an AA build are very similar, with only a few differences. Therefore you should pick everything that gives plusses to both of those. For the more specialised stuff, you can choose either, or go for survival with that stuff instead. Still, remember that your main guns are your main guns for a reason. Your secondaries, even when fully secondary specced, will do less damage. But you can still increase that damage decently with a secondary specced ship. It's up to you which path to take (but personally, secondaries are just so much fun).

 

Captain skills are honestly not as important exactly what you pick, as long as you pick something that benefits your style. But to mention some of the skills:

  • Priority Target: Good, solid skill. Gives information about enemies that consider you a threat and potentially incoming torpedoes.
  • Preventive Maintenance: It would be good if it affected secondaries. It doesn't, so it's not worth it.
  • High Alert: Not that useful since you can get by with careful DCP management, but not terrible. Problem is that there are more useful T2 skills.
  • Jack of All Trades: Slightly better than HA, since the overall bonus is better, but still not great.
  • Expert Marksman: Personal preference. Test your ship first. Do you think you need faster turning turrets? Pick it. Can you manage without? Don't. I actually have it on Bismarck, despite already very good turret traverse (for a BB), just because it is noticeable in brawling (but not much elsewhere).
  • Adrenaline Rush: Mandatory. One of the best skills of all. 10% more total firepower at 50% health.
  • Basics of Survivabilty: Not bad, and sort of does the same job as High Alert but better. Since you'll often let single (and sometimes double) fires burn, you'll take 15% less damage from those. Solid choice for surviviability.
  • Survivability Expert: If you want to troll people into thinking you're a potato. Only if.
  • Basic Firing Training: Very good for a brawler. Better secondaries and better AA. German BBs benefit from both.
  • Superintendent: One more heal, one more sonar (for those that have it). Planes you have enough of. Not worth it if you often die before using all consumables. Worth it if you do survive that long.
  • Vigilance: Personal preference. If you don't have sonar, not a bad choice for a brawler. You can leave this one be until you know how much trouble you have with torpedoes.
  • Manual Fire Control for Secondary Armament: The fun skill. If you want to snipe with your secondaries, pick it. Does wonder for secondary DPS.
  • Fire Prevention: Only YOU can prevent ship fires! Solid skill, especially if you're often on fire. One of the best skills for survivability.
  • Advanced Firing Training: BFT version two.
  • Concealment Expert: While a good skill, it's less useful for a brawler (you're constantly detected anyway), and you're going to have a lot of skills you want to spend points on anyway. I wouldn't recommend it, but in return, you need to make sure you have a good exit strategy. Make use of islands to get out of line of fire since you can't rely on stealth. Also use islands to get into brawling range.

You can pretty much pick and choose from what you want. It all depends on what you're good at, what you need help with, and what synergises with your personal playstyle. Players brawl in different ways, and have different problems with it. Pick what suits you; that's the most important part.

Also worth considering:

  • Direction Center for Catapult Aircraft: Wouldn't take it normally, but if you got a single point to spare at the end of the build (read, if you have 3 4pt skills), this might be a decent pick. Not for main battery range, but for screening around you.
  • IFHE: Only worth much on Gneisenau and Kurfürst. Allows 128 mm guns to penetrate 32 mm plating on enemy BBs. Allows to get some damage when brawling bow tankers. Also incredible vs any BB that has extensive amounts of 32 mm plating all over, like some of the French and I think Nelson (you know, that notorious bow camper at T7). In that regard it is situational though and you will have to consider how all-out you want to go, but you can farm entire BBs worth of damage with it.
  • Manual AA: Likely the better 4 pt investment on Gneisenau. Might be even better than the Manual secondaries on that ship. Not so much for a secondary build, but because Gneisenau when brawling will already get close, launch torps, deal more damage than your secondaries ever will do in that situation and upping the simply ridiculous AA values of the 11x2 12.8 cm long range AA guns is going to make most CVs reconsider targetting you. Especially when you meet the occasional poor T6 or T5 CV thanks to good T7 MM.
  • AFT: Was already touched upon, but just going to say, trading out BFT is manageable. BFT only is a 10% increase on your secondaries and some AA. If you consider that direct damage from secondaries typically will be not too great (even with IFHE, you'd look at like 40-50k in a good game, so 10% is 4-5k more) and CVs aren't too common, or even if they appear, you should rather focus on not being all alone and an easy kill, I'd rate BFT not too high. Adrenaline Rush also is most often just around 10%, but it also affects the main battery, which is what should always be the main source of damage. AFT however, is quite mandatory for secondaries, because AFT adds 20% range to them and the AA. Which vastly increases the bubble of destruction around you and at least in the upper tiers, this is mandatory for secondary builds, as 11km vs 9 km can make a difference in how comfortably or uncomfortably close you have to get.
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On 3/30/2018 at 2:10 PM, AmiralPotato said:

More precisely, how to actually do it in a reasonably useful way for the team, instead of my current "rush -> die -> repeat'' way :D

Ship's have more speed settings than "sit uselessly in spawn" and "damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead".

After initial moving to position to support team (&draw at least some enemy fire away from cruisers and destroyers) it can be usefull to even momentarily stop bow toward enemy battleships.

Ideally so that some island protects your side from flanking fire, or in such position that other enemies are behind big islands in other part of map.

Pushing to close range is also good idea against only against limited number of enemies close to each others. (to avoid getting into crossfire)

Also if there are enemy destroyers which can stealth torpedo you still alive and their location isn't known that's another big risk.

Also most cruisers carry torps and can ruin your day if you let them do that.

Chosing correct place and time is very important for that brawling.

 

 

Anyway with sitting in the rear not being problem, I would say you need to improve leading.

With standard BB bad accuracy of tier 5 30% accuracy should be achievable, when staying away from long ranges.

And with "density" of incoming fire increasing lot at closer ranges it's important, that you maximize damage potential of your own slow rate of fire.

After all making enemy sink or run away to cover of islands is always good way to decrease amount of incoming fire and increase survivability.

 

This covers most areas of leading well:

https://youtu.be/-tAWN32AnZY

How number of crosshair ticks and shell flight time seconds relate to each other is something you have to learn yourself.

But once you learn that for say 3 second shell flight time when firing at that particular (speed) target shells hit x number of ticks behind aiming point correct lead for 6 second shell flight time is 2x crosshair ticks.

Against heavily angled and incoming targets correct aiming point is lot closer to their bow like you may have noticed.

 

 

After that knowing what kind armor ships you meet have and what you can overmatch is important:

http://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Ship:Gunnery_%26_Armor_Penetration#Armor-Piercing

Especially as Tier 5 ship you can't overmatch bow plating of angled T6 and above BBs...

So instead of hitting bow you have to have aim little higher to hit superstructure, or simply shoot better side showing target.

While keeping bow toward biggest threat to minimize taken damage...

As T6 against T5s you can just do this:

https://youtu.be/HiWroA7310E?t=1m10s

 

 

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[INTRO]
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Thanks for all the answers !

I'll start to see what I can make of it.

 

Currently playing roughly 50/50 cruisers and battleships. For BBs mostly at tier 5, and the french ones from the missions.

Favorite ship so far is probably Konig (Kaiser was nice too). Seems to take hits at a rather regular pace, making it easier to use Damage Control / Repair. Just unlocked Bayern.

Then Lyon (So. Many. Guns :D) even though I'm rather terrible with it at the moment. Obviously higher tiers require more practice. Unlocked Richelieu but will wait a bit.

Normandie not bad at all overall, and tier 6 is slightly more manageable. Poor Bretagne I sold rather quickly, did not seem to have anything better than the other tier 5 in port.

Dunkerque holds a special spot for being the gift ship that brought me to Wows, but honestly it feels more like a super-cruiser. And these secondaries seem to fire only backwards...

Good old Kongo was my first tier 5 and seems solid overall, I'll probably play her a bit more now.

A bit disappointed with Iron Duke, since Orion felt quite good. Apparently it's more Orion being a really good ship, so the Duke may get the axe :p

I admit I sold New York because it felt really slow. Things don't seem to improve much later, so I put this line aside for now.

 

First 10 pt of skills are typically:

- Preventive Maintenance, which I thought also affected AA and secondaries -_-.    PT and IFA are a bit wasted on me now, I tend to dodge like a frozen brick.

- Adrenaline Rush. Well, this one sure is always active :p

- BFT

- AFT

Next I'll probably try Manual Secondaries for the tier 7. For lower tiers maybe High Alert + Jack as an alternative to Fire Prevention.

Vigilance is probably a waste for me now. Same with Superintendent.

Thanks for pointing out the technical details on IFHE for secondaries !

 

For upgrades I just tried to switch slot 1 from main to auxiliary. I'll see how it goes.

With AFT+BFT it's sad to lose that many sec/AA, on the other hand most dmg is still done by main guns.

Slot 2 is dmg control, 3 is secondaries (AA for Dunkerque), slot 4 is often steering.

 

In game, well, I'll start with trying not to overextend too much (that will be even more useful for cruisers ^^), and aim better.

 

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when we are talking about brawling against other battleships 

litterally every Battleship expect Yamato is able to do that

 

approaching a ship:

you want to sail at an angle and not go completely bow on. Try to "swig out" whenever your guns are reloaded to shoot a full salvo and immidialtly turn back in.

 

brawling:

You do not want to give the enemy a chance to ram you so try to ot get too close to the enemy. I'd say the closest you should get is 5km since at that range your ship is very accurate and your turrets are still able to keep up with your aim.

when the enemy is facing its bow towards you try to take out his Main guns or aim at the superstructure with AP  you will still be able to inflict massive angles

when you have a better target available (like a broadside cruiser) don't hesitate to shoot at it.

 

the "pass by"

in brawling you very often will get into a situation where you have to pass by a ship at very close range where your guns aren't able to keep up anymore.

what you have to do now is aim your guns ahead of the enemy ship and wait for it to cross your aim point and fire when it does.

now a big mistake I often whitness is that playerd after they passed by the enemy ship turn back in to get in some sort of circle maneuver, however this will expose your weak broadside.

As the enemy often is trying to do the smae thing what you do is just continue to sail on while your guns reload and create some distence between you and the enemy.

you can say you are "kiting away.

you constantly sail away from the enemy ship at an angle to make it harder for the enemy to aim at you. on every reload you wait for the enemy ship to shoot any only now turn back in to shoot your salvo just to turn away again.

 

 

CAPTAIN BUILD

first skills:

1p PT

2p EM or AR

3p SI

4p CE 

Advanced

1p PM (optional)

2p HA or JoAT

3p BoS

4p FP

 

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I'll try to help you, as I play mostly German BBs and each one has a full/hybrid secondary build.

1. SHIPS

As far as ships are concerned, the obvious choice would be Ze Germans. Their armor is very good and gets stronger the closer you are to the enemy due to turtleback.
Their secondaries are best-in-tier almost every time and, plus, you that "Deutschland Uber Alles" effect that scares people (super effective tactic).

Other than that, i only played IJN BBs, and tho I found them quite good in brawling scenarios, I cannot give you any other insight than that above.

Better off asking players that have more experience with other lines.

 

2. BUILD

Simple: maximise via modules and flags your secondary capabilty.
Then go survivability.

Also dont forget speed to swiftly close to the enemy when the opportunity rises.
Camo the best you have, just pick the one you would take to be competitive.

3. COMMANDER

Same build for every ship, only 1 skill different for -T7 or +T7
- PM

- EM
- AR
- BoS
- BFT

- AFT

- Manual Secondaries (for T7+) or Concealmente/Fire Prevention (for -T7)

4. Brawling is about TIMING.

It doesn't matter if you are the best brawler tactician on the jet-set: screw up your push time = die quickly.
You have to carefully read the situation and exploit enemy mistakes.
Remember that once you are committed to a push it is very very hard to disengage.

Brawling is about PATIENCE.
Even if you have the best brawling ship set up with a 19 pts commander in it, you cannot withstand being focus fired by 2/3 or more ships.
So play second line in the first half of the game.

"But i cannot hit anything with my bismarck guns!"

"Welcome to the Kriegsmarine son."

Brawling is about having BALLS and playing for enjoyment.
Brawling is not the most effective playstyle. And it is the least rewarded.
But we all know that it is the most fun and enjoyable playstyle.
So expect a lot of wrong games, with wrong teammates that prefer to snipe from 20 km than getting their paint scrateched a bit.

Brawling is about ANGLING AND CLOSING IN AS FAST AS POSSIBILE.
Watch out for torps and enemies around the "duel area".
Dont give broadside to the enemy, no matter what ship you are in.

German or RN maybe almost immune to citadels but they do take tons of normal pens.
Use your armor and find the right angle to bounce/mitigate damage and let your secondaries open up on the enmy vessel.

5. STUDY

Watching CC videos on YouTube can help a lot, namely Flamu, Notser and Others, to say a few known names.
They are very good and experienced players and you can learn tons and tons of useful things from them.
Watch, listen, learn, profit.

Hope this helps!


 

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GK is not agile enough to be a real, decent brawler. It's good at bullying things with both secondaries and main turret, but brawling directly a République or a Montana will be very hard.

 

Montana is more dangerous at very close range than a GK : turrets are fast, those 406 are deadly, and the ship is one of the most agile at tier 10. While being smaller than GK. Also Montana is amazing at knocking down turrets (esp on GK...) when aiming for them, which can be a very good tactic when passing by your opponent : use the first front turret to knock the enemy one down, the rear turret to do damage, then keep the turn, and after reloading stuff everything into either the flatter part of the stern (will penetrate easily and allows for massive damage) or the side depending on what your opponent is doing.

 

When approaching the side-to-side pass, stop using the sniper view. get back into the third person view, turn your turret in anticipation and don't aim directly at your foe or they won't be able to keep up. Your goal is to do massive damage when your opponent is perfectly broadside.

 

Best choice right now for brawling would be IMO Gneisenau, Scharnhorst, Tirpitz, Bismarck, FdG, Alsace, République, Montana. Amagi is also great and Kii does have torpedoes on top of the same main armament as Amagi, which can be a nasty surprise, especially since there aren't that many Kii in the game.

 

27 minutes ago, Kaput_Mundi said:

Brawling is about having BALLS and playing for enjoyment.

 

I disagree.

It sure is fun, but used at the right time in the game it is also a fantastic carry. Well timed brawling mean you push hard and eliminate at least a big threat while staying alive. It can save a game. Especially true if that means you'll also cap a point.

 

Oh, I forgot to mention : IMO the best brawler in the game would be Hindenburg. That cruiser got a set of 16 torpedoes with great angles but short range, is tanky as hell at close range and can finish its opponent with a load of nuke-AP on broadside or HE that penetrates almost any bow armor ingame. You DON'T want to mess with a Hindenburg during a Cyclone.

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7 hours ago, ShinGetsu said:

 

I disagree.

It sure is fun, but used at the right time in the game it is also a fantastic carry. Well timed brawling mean you push hard and eliminate at least a big threat while staying alive. It can save a game. Especially true if that means you'll also cap a point.

 

 

Also very true.
A well timed push can turn a game in your favour.
Good advice here.

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Hi there,

 

Still happily potatoing :D

 

As you guys pointed out, the german line is clearly the one that suits me most.

Kaiser and Konig are great for T4-5, slowly getting used to Bayern at T6, Normandie is not too bad as well, a shame she has such poor AA.

Sold Kongo and Fuso, they seem more designed for longer range than I like.

T7 is still quite painful, although I do like the Gneisenau and Lyon a lot. Need more practice. Got once in a point blank duel with another Gneis, that was fun, we both died :D

First few T8 games with Richelieu have been complete disasters. I'll try again later, but I'm not a fan of the 2 front turret only layout (same with Dunkerque). Maybe Bismarck will do better.

Also, captains are a bit green at only 10-12pt.

 

Since I now mostly play in div with a CV, I switched slot 3 from secondaries to AA in most ships.

Overall, putting Aux mod in slot 1 does not seem to cause much problems with main batteries survivability.

Putting all defensive flags (5% consumable reload, 20% heal, flooding and fire reduction) helps.

With steering module (and good AA) you don't eat that many torps either.

Overextending / pushing too early is still one of the main problems, especially with the faster ships.

 

A few questions:

- since I stopped the US, JAP and UK lines rather early, are there any decent brawlers among them at higher tiers ?

- same question about premium ships (Scharnhost seems a good choice)

- games at T8 seems much more punishing than lower tiers. Is it actually possible to get some closer range action without getting insta-focus-slaughtered :D ?

 

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For brawling :

- Amagi and Kii (the premium) are rather good. Amagi got quite good secondaries (not worth investing into, tho), fast turrets, huge firepower, and is rather agile with a turtleback. Kii is the same, but more fragile... and got two sets of 3 torpedoes with amazing forward angles.

- Montana and Iowa aren't that bad for brawling either, but it's not their main playstyle. They're more suited for roaming at mid range.

- French. Alsace, and more importantly, République ! I win brawling contest with GK on a daily basis with République. Insanely fast rof, great secondaries, and fast turrets that hurts like hell at close range, where the meh accuracy doesn't matter as much as the impressive power those 8 guns can pack. It's a squishy ship that hate being HE spammed, but the 431mm coupled with those firethrower secondaries makes it a very dangerous beast.

Still, République isn't an easy ship. It's powerful, but it also takes a lot of damage if you get HE-spammed and aren't angled properly.

 

Anyway, I usually play my BBs with a survivability + concealment build. I hate AA build (that's not my job as a BB and those skills are so broken it's disgusting), and I don't like secondary build either. From the ships I mentioned, only République is worth a full secondary build, but even then I play it as a CE-Survivability ship. (build would be PT-PM-AR-SI-AFT-Manual sec-CE or PT-AR-SI-AFT-Manual sec - BFT - EM)

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Thanks for the suggestions ! The grind through Richelieu will be painful though. But maybe useful.

 

Finally gave in to the cliche and bought the Tirpitz. I am beyond recovery :D

The Potato goddess blessed me with a good team and a victory on my first game :cap_happy:

I even almost survived. Damn AP bombs.

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On 2018-06-18 at 5:07 PM, ShinGetsu said:

French. Alsace, and more importantly, République ! I win brawling contest with GK on a daily basis with République. Insanely fast rof, great secondaries, and fast turrets that hurts like hell at close range, where the meh accuracy doesn't matter as much as the impressive power those 8 guns can pack. It's a squishy ship that hate being HE spammed, but the 431mm coupled with those firethrower secondaries makes it a very dangerous beast.

How is your setup on the French, I'm at T8 targeting T10 and want to start spec my captain already.

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Thanks again for all the advice !

On 4/3/2018 at 12:36 PM, Riselotte said:

Also worth considering:

  • Manual AA: Likely the better 4 pt investment on Gneisenau. Might be even better than the Manual secondaries on that ship. Not so much for a secondary build, but because Gneisenau when brawling will already get close, launch torps, deal more damage than your secondaries ever will do in that situation and upping the simply ridiculous AA values of the 11x2 12.8 cm long range AA guns is going to make most CVs reconsider targetting you. Especially when you meet the occasional poor T6 or T5 CV thanks to good T7 MM.

In particular this hint by @Riselotte was not obvious to me at first. Decided to give it a go since I now play mostly in CV div.

Seems to work quite well with Gneis (even traded the sec range upgrade for the AA one).

Will try it also on Scharn, even if its AA is a bit inferior. In time I'll probably chose a full sec build / captain for Scharn and Tirpitz, and focus more on AA for the silver line.

 

Also currently trading the steering upgrade for dmg 2 in slot 4 for a bit more survivability.

From what you all said, only a few higher tier ships will really need the steering one.

 

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