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Best troll-secondary build for Alsace?

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So if you wanna go a full retard troll-secondary build on youre Alsace whats the best skills and modules? Is for instance 4 points cap.skills Manual secondarys better then IFHE? Anyone has some great experience with trying a build like this. Thing is i sold my Bismarck a while back since i have the Tirpitz which is pretty much the same ship but with torps. And im grinding the French line right now and i just want to have a ship to troll with when youre not that regular Die Hard mode. I recon i will stop at T9 Alsace because i really dislike the gun setup on the Republique.

 

So whats youre recommendations? 

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Pretty sure that a FR BB secondary build works best without IFHE and go for DE instead to maximize your fire starting chance (that's what the french secondaries are really good at with their base fire chance and the RoF).

 

On the Alsace IFHE would help for the 100mm calibers doing direct damage at least to DDs, but outside that only the 152mm would dmage anything in the tier IX spread. Whereas with going for DE, the increased fire chance works against everything.

 

So I'd go for this build (19 points):

Priority Target

Adrenaline Rush

Super Intendant

Manual Secondaries

Advanced Firing Training

Demolition Expert

Expert Marksman

 

For a secondary build that deals direct damage, you'd have to go for the KM BBs (again, 19 points):

Priority Target

Adrenaline Rush

Super Intendant

Manual Secondaries

IFHE

Advanced Firing Training

Preventive Maintenance

 

Both builds forego Concealment Expert. For one, to make the builds work you have to spent the captain points elsewhere and secondly those are pure lolbuilds for that time you just want to go for shits'n'giggles, so I obviously recommend a normal captain build for slightly more serious gameplay.

 

If you want to go full ham, you can skip SI and the additional heal it brings and go for Basic Firing Training to boost the secondary RoF some more.

 

 

I'm actually just waiting for clanwars to end and the ensuing free captain respec (I'm of course assuming there will be one, as I need to respec a couple 19 point captains that I used in clanwars, aswell as spec my ships back to randoms setups) and will spec my current 19 pointer on my KM BBs for the IFHE secondary build. I'm not grinding the line anymore (kinda grew bored of hightier BB gameplay) so I'll just have some fun with it.

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2 minutes ago, Oldschool_Gaming_YT said:

So if you wanna go a full retard troll-secondary build on youre Alsace whats the best skills and modules? Is for instance 4 points cap.skills Manual secondarys better then IFHE? Anyone has some great experience with trying a build like this. Thing is i sold my Bismarck a while back since i have the Tirpitz which is pretty much the same ship but with torps. And im grinding the French line right now and i just want to have a ship to troll with when youre not that regular Die Hard mode. I recon i will stop at T9 Alsace because i really dislike the gun setup on the Republique.

 

So whats youre recommendations? 

This

 

I use it on my Republique and share the cpt with Gascogne, but used same build on Alsace. 

 

Its not competitive, but tons of fun. IFHE helps the 100mm guns pen 19mm armor (DD hulls and BB superstructures) and helps the 152mms pen 25, 27, 30 and 32mm thresholds (Most cruiser and BB hulls).

 

For Alsace I found I didnt really need secondaries because the gunpower was absolutely amazing. On republique the Alpha strike is rather underwhelming, making secondaries make up for lost damage. 

 

I have tested this build on German BBs before, and Tirpitz doesnt really gain anything from IFHE. It only helps the 105mm guns with the 19mm threshold since the 150mm guns already pen 32mm due to 1/4 pen rule (which for good reason doesnt apply to 105mm guns). GK with IFHE secondary build however is a lot of fun and very good.

 

Alternative setup can be:

http://shipcomrade.com/captcalc/0100000000100010000011001000100019

 

But closing, I can say you can mix and match whatever build you want on French BBs, they are so damn flexible they are insanely fun to play with.

 

Standard Concealment/survival build? Go ahead its very good. Play around with full IFHE secondary build? Go ahead, I can promise you can have fun with it.

Hybrid builds like Secondary/AA, Concealment/AA, Survival/AA, Secondary/survival, secondary/concealment etc etc too much fun. Especially Alsace benefits insanely much from MFCAAA which goes well with AFT and Manual Secondaries for a hybrid build. I played around so much with different builds during the grind and I can say that almost any kind of build combination works with these ships.

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5 minutes ago, Aotearas said:

Nice thing about the KM IFHE secondary build is that it synergizes extremely well with the Tirpitz and Scharnhorst, so yay.

It doesnt tho

 

Only GK (arguably Gneisenau when uptiered) benefit. 15cm guns already pen 32 (but still cant pen 50 with IFHE) and 105mm still have 1/6 pen rule so only 19mm threshold reached.

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Take a look at this picture (even if its in german). I dont need the manual secondary skill and I do have the Expert Marksman, Basic Firing Skill & advanced firing skill together with Adrenaline rush.

Last but not least the flag to have something with 11km. 

I have all my BBs like that. :cap_cool:

alsace.jpg

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20 minutes ago, Affeks said:

It doesnt tho

 

Only GK (arguably Gneisenau when uptiered) benefit. 15cm guns already pen 32 (but still cant pen 50 with IFHE) and 105mm still have 1/6 pen rule so only 19mm threshold reached.

 

Huh, just checked and you're correct. Apparently only the 128mm and 150mm get the 1/4 HE pen exception (which makes no bloody sense because those calibers need it the least compared to the 88mm/105mm caliber secondaries ... what the hell WG?).

Well, still makes sense for the Scharnhorst (if she gets to be toptier, but at tier VII that's more often than not anyway).

 

 

Aww man, that means I actually have to grind to the GK to make full use of that IFHE secondary build ... guess that ain't happening now.

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Thanks for all the replys. Interesting that it is so many ways to go here! I feel like Manual secondarys and AFT is a must have for full-troll, but do DE really do much difference? I definatly feel the need to go Preventive maintenance instead of Priority target since i dont want my moduls to get damaged after all this spec. Anyone have experience how strong the AA bouble gets with this secondary build? Is it a No-Fly zone or do you still get dropped. Because im guessing i will need to sit still close to islands to be most effective against pushing fleets.

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Preventive Maintenence only effects modules that can be disabled (i.e.: main guns and torpedo launchers). It doesn't help secondaries (or AA mounts).To enhance their survivability you need to use the Auxillary Armaments mod.1.

 

Can't say how strong the AA on the Alsace is from the top of my head (though I know she's plenty strong). Even without buffing the AA she'd be an undesirable target for CVs, but I reckon if you use BFT in addition to AFT, the AA would be pretty nasty (though not as good as AFT and Manual AA).

 

That aside, no BB really manages to maintain a no-fly-zone territory. Even my AA specced US BBs (AFT and Manual AA) can only rely on their DP secondaries in the latter half of a match (due to the HE spam knocking out most mid- and shortrange mounts) and whilst that's still 300+ AA dps at longrange, any CV that really wants you can still drop, he just has to be willing to sacrifice some aircraft in the process.

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The Alsace has a very good AA but you cannot stand still behind a island. You would be a huge target for CV and DDs. You have to use the speed of the french BBs and be like a ghost on the map. :cap_rambo:

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Sorry, but assuming you're going BFT/AFT, I really do not see the value in spending 4 points on IFHE to tweak secondaries a bit when Manual secondaries for the same 4 points is a significant buff to secondary damage. For secondary "trolling" Manual secondaries really does make them decidedly nasty to face.

That's assuming you can spare the 4 points that arguably might be well spent on Fire prevention.

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11 hours ago, Aotearas said:

It doesn't help secondaries (or AA mounts).To enhance their survivability you need to use the Auxillary Armaments mod.1.

 

I thought Aux Armaments mod.1 was generally considered useless since the extra HP for AA mounts is supposedly still not enough to prevent them from being taken out by a single hit. 

Don't know if secondaries share the same problem, though. 

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I was thinking of utilizing the strengths of the Alsace; massive firepower (12 barrels main armament), concealment and its speed. With concealment and speed you can close the distance on the red team and disengage if needed.

So for captain skills (i am using Jean-Jacques Honoré; EM and AR boosts) I am considering this setup;

  • PM; don't want to get those baguettes damaged
  • AR; to enhance the output of both main and secondary armament. When brawling this is really useful.
  • BS; just to get the edge on survivability. French BB's tend to flambé easily
  • BFT; for AA and to get more dps out of the secondaries
  • AFT; because of the range of the secondaries and AA.

That leaves still 2 points for Honoré to distribute. I was thinking on spending that on Expert Marksman.

IFHE and manual secondaries were also taken into consideration, but I found that to depended for random matches.

 

Oh and this of course;

 

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1 hour ago, Sander93 said:

 

I thought Aux Armaments mod.1 was generally considered useless since the extra HP for AA mounts is supposedly still not enough to prevent them from being taken out by a single hit. 

Don't know if secondaries share the same problem, though. 

Don't know the HP values for the AA mounts, but I believe with the auxillary armament mod.1 they become somewhat resilient. Iirc Flamu used it in one of his AA test on a ship (not sure which one though, maybe the Kii) and I do remember he was quite surprised at how little AA he had lost after the first couple divebomber attacks (barely lost any mid- and shortrange mounts).

 

Probably doesn't help much against sustained HE rain throughout the game.

 

But the secondaries are pretty tough to knock out with the mod. Used it on my grind with the Bismarck and barely ever had secondaries lost. Didn't compare it without using the mod though, so take it with a pinch of salt.

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I don't know about you, but for me the best troll build is to max out reload speed.

It's absolutely gold to see someone showing too much broadside, thinking I still need another 10 seconds to reload :cap_haloween:

RIP that Izumo who took a 28k damage.

Without taking a single citpen.

While angled.
18km away.

God the Alsace is a strong ship.

Even without any dedicated secondary spec but taking AFT for the AA range and the secondary flag because you have 800 lying around, the amount of dakka and base range is such that you're damn effective at setting fires and even finishing a few DDs here and there.

 

Either the ship is nerfed within a few patches, or becomes the new gold standard for high tier BBs.

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Unfortunately a loss (on cap points) but the Alsace is really dishing out damage.

shot-18.03.23_11.23.43-0753.jpg

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Damn, the more answers i get the more i start to question if i really should use this ship for trolling since it seems like a really OP ship to do a Carry-build on instead and play more hardcore and serious with. That said i would really like to have a nice troll ships for crap and giggles and this also seems like a great candidate for that.

 

You guys that have grinded passed Alsace to the Republique, is that any good? I was watching a Flambass video where he compared those two and if you just go by that video (and his experience) its seems like T9 is sooo much better then T10? And i really dont like the gun setup on the Republique. Alsace reminds me more of Missouri (which i love) but with crazy OP secondarys (which is a nice gravy.....)

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I’m rather interested in a secondary BB, manly because I’ve already tanky Amagi, Roma and Yamato and AA Missouri, so I d’like to try a new gameplay...

 

Obviously a Bismarck will be the best choice, but damn, that Alsace is so sexy looking and I like the idea of having a couple of Akizuki mounted on the sides and a De Grasse on the central superstructure :cap_rambo:

 

I think I’ll build my Honorè with AR, BFT, AFT, Manual and IFHE just for maximum dakka dakka. Even if sub-optimal, I’ve still 12 380mm firing every 26,4 seconds with the fire-rate upgrade :cap_hmm:

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I still advocate FP as a first level 4 BB skill. Everything else, even CE isn't as important I'd argue. 

 

Even if you go by the DCP for 2 fires only, FP will mean you actually catch fire on more than one location far less.

 

Whilst full secondary builds might be fun, it certainly isn't funny to burn down to HE spam :Smile_sceptic:

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3 ore fa, Negativvv ha scritto:

 

Whilst full secondary builds might be fun, it certainly isn't funny to burn down to HE spam 

 

“If this is to end in fire, then we will all burn together.” 

—> set target for secondaries and activate engine boost, RAMMING SPEED! 

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The Alsace is not a Troll ship - its Napoleons Revenge!

alsa.jpg

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3 ore fa, Ranulf84 ha scritto:

The Alsace is not a Troll ship - its Napoleons Revenge!

alsa.jpg

 

Which build did you use, may I ask?

Standard secondary or IFHE secondary? 

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36 minutes ago, Bics93 said:

 

Which build did you use, may I ask?

Standard secondary or IFHE secondary? 

I just let it like this and its working for me.

alsa.jpg

alsa2.jpg

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