Cyclonic iritation

[SeaWolf7]

Hi Guys,

 

This has been bothering me for a while. 99,9% of the time after a cyclone hits the game goes to Crap. 

Example: You've established where enemy ships are you've worked out a strategy and how the situation may progress you've positioned yourself in accordance...in short you have a plan.

We receive the warning that the Cyclone hits and voila.....instant chaos.

I know it levels the playing field for everyone but I just experienced yet another cyclone game where after destroying a DD in Neptune and doing some positive action for my team (as he was sneaking up behind undetected) 3 ships rendered 6-8 klm away 2x BB and 1x CA with no warning, they were also no where near the area they appeared before when cyclone hit so you cant track or have a rough idea where they would have been and what direction they were going etc.   Also the duration of the cyclone was quite long. too long IMO.

So what do cyclones actually lend to our game? Can we do without them...should we keep them and change the way they effect the game? Im all for realistic effects in the game etc but too many times the reason your back in port in this situation is not because you made a error but because the cyclone has made a threat/situation that you would otherwise taken action against impossible to avoid or detect.

 

Its like "surprise!!" but in a really bad way...

 

 

 

Over to you guys....

Many thanks for taking the time to read...

 

Wolf

[Jethro_Grey]

I like them, they enable teams to turn a lost game into victory, at least that's my experience so far.

 

Keep them, don't change them.

[tank276]

Dont know if I have clown phobia, but that f**er creeps me out.

:)

Yes,the cyclone changes everything in game dynamics but for me it happens so rarely, I hardly take notice.

Just 1 more RNG factor I guess

[SeaWolf7]

6 minutes ago, tank276 said:

Dont know if I have clown phobia, but that f**er creeps me out.

:)

 

Just 1 more RNG factor I guess

Lol

 

True....

[Sander93]

More often than not cyclones hit just when CA/BB have established a proper battle line at ~15km range apart and everyone can spend the next five minutes doing nothing but watching fog and water while trying to get within the cyclone visibility range. It's usually incredibly boring and annoying. 

 

I guess cyclones are somewhat a refreshing mechanic, but they should really increase the visibility range. Somewhere around 12-14km would be good.

That would still force ships to close the distance but it wouldn't take as long to get within view range. And it gives BB's less of an edge. 

[PapVogele]

Tbh I hate the way cyclones work, they’re a Huge benefit for capital ships (my thoughts).

 

Cvs can stealth fly their planes around and when they spot you, they can still hit with pinpoint accuracy even though its so windy that noone can really see anything?

 

BBs suddenly become DDs with huge guns and can sneak up on anyone and just blab them.

 

the worst, is radar ships, they get spotted they pop radar and own up whatever DD spotted them...

 

Cyclones are such a huge gamechanger, that does NOTHING good for DDs, only something good for radar cruisers, and does something great for capital ships...

 

IMO it should be changed, CV planes should be under perma panic in cyclone, BBs should get reduced vision and manouverability, DDs reduced manouverability but keep their vision, same with cruisers.

[wilkatis_LV]

42 minutes ago, SeaWolf7 said:

You've established where enemy ships are you've worked out a strategy and how the situation may progress you've positioned yourself in accordance...in short you have a plan.

We receive the warning that the Cyclone hits and voila.....instant chaos.

 

 

[SeaWolf7]

20 minutes ago, PapVogele said:

 

Cyclones are such a huge gamechanger, that does NOTHING good for DDs, only something good for radar cruisers, and does something great for capital ships...

 

IMO it should be changed, CV planes should be under perma panic in cyclone, BBs should get reduced vision and manouverability, DDs reduced manouverability but keep their vision, same with cruisers.

 

 

errm im sorry? why would a cyclone Physically effect manoeuvrability?

 

Everyone gets reduced vision in a cyclone...

 

Radar has roughly the same range give and take depending on what ship, that the cyclone reduces visibility too. So there should be no advantage really....

[SeaWolf7]

9 minutes ago, wilkatis_LV said:

 

 

 

yep I hear you....if we had the foggiest where the hell it was coming from...

 

55 minutes ago, SeaWolf7 said:

The situation is not because you made a error but because the cyclone has made a threat/situation that you would otherwise taken action against impossible to avoid or detect.

 

 

No?

 

 

[PapVogele]

Rough seas = reduced manouverabilty.

 

the advantage that radar cruisers gain is the fact that they’re not spotted until they’re in radar range, whereas under normal circumstances they can be avoided... really not that hard to understand is it?

 

The problem with cyclones is that it nerfs DDs alot, by removing their ability to spot and plan ahead, it buffs BBs by giving them insane camo allowing them to sneak up and lolpen anything with bugged AP rounds, It buffs CVs alot by stealthing up their planes and not affecting them in any way other than that really. Cruisers kinda get screwed, kinda get lucky, depends on the situation and the cruiser.

[Profilus]

20 minutes ago, PapVogele said:

The problem with cyclones is that it nerfs DDs alot, by removing their ability to spot and plan ahead

NOPE, maybe just spotting part a bit, but same goes for enemy so both teams get these buffs/nerfs same time same duration.

[SeaWolf7]

31 minutes ago, PapVogele said:

Rough seas = reduced manouverabilty.

 

ahh I see....you said nothing about rough sea's in your post but I get what your saying now...fair point perhaps.

 

31 minutes ago, PapVogele said:

 

 

the advantage that radar cruisers gain is the fact that they’re not spotted until they’re in radar range, whereas under normal circumstances they can be avoided... really not that hard to understand is it?

..is it me or does that make no sense....?

Nothing is spotted until its in range of radar if ships are hidden by smoke or cyclone for example...

cyclone's bring DETECTIBILITY for all ships down to say 9 klm. If the range of radar is 9 klm or less.... what's the advantage again?

 

 

 

[Commander_Cornflakes]

>->Wiki

 

>

Vor 2 Stunden, SeaWolf7 sagte:

instant chaos

 

[pra3y]

2 hours ago, PapVogele said:

Cvs can stealth fly their planes around and when they spot you, they can still hit with pinpoint accuracy even though its so windy that noone can really see anything?

 You do know CV literally cant spot a ship during a cyclone unless they're directly above (give or take 2/3km) a ship. The only benefit a CV get is against another CV player and that's provided the other CV playet doeant pay attention.

[SeaWolf7]

23 hours ago, Commander_Cornflakes said:

>->Wiki

 

>

 

 

On 3/11/2018 at 1:33 PM, SeaWolf7 said:

 

We receive the warning that the Cyclone hits and voila.....instant chaos.

 

sorry poor wording....I meant when it becomes active and your in it...

 

On 3/11/2018 at 1:38 PM, Jethro_Grey said:

I like them, they enable teams to turn a lost game into victory, at least that's my experience so far.

 

Keep them, don't change them.

god dam it.... that's totally the opposite of what I experience, hence the thread ....

[alessandroj1]

4 hours ago, Jethro_Grey said:

I like them, they enable teams to turn a lost game into victory, at least that's my experience so far.

 

Keep them, don't change them.

Happened to me 2 days ago, my team had 5 ship against 8, 1 vs 2 caps when Cyclone hits. After a few minutes I (Yamato) remain with a Montana, both around half HP, against 5 , we head to the central cap and luckily the enemy comes 1 at the time so we kill them ( plus enemy gearing decides to shoot instead of stealth torping). At the end we are 2 vs 1 remaining chapayev, the cyclone is fading away but the enemy has the advantage and there is not time to cap.. guess what the enemy chapa does? Sails in front of me and Montana exiting from behind of an island 7km from me 10 from Monty.. Yes we won a battle that we should have lost and probably would have without the cyclone

[alessandroj1]

3 hours ago, SeaWolf7 said:

ahh I see....you said nothing about rough sea's in your post but I get what your saying now...fair point perhaps.

 

..is it me or does that make no sense....?

Nothing is spotted until its in range of radar if ships are hidden by smoke or cyclone for example...

cyclone's bring DETECTIBILITY for all ships down to say 9 klm. If the range of radar is 9 klm or less.... what's the advantage again?

 

 

 

He is saying that usually you can see where a radar ship is and avoid it, example I am in a yogumo I see 12 km away a des mones I will stay away from her. When cyclone hit you don’t know where the radar ship is moving and so chances are that you meet her suddenly 7.5km away( time to render), then you are screwed, only thing she has to do is pop radar and you’re dead

[Butterdoll]

5 hours ago, SeaWolf7 said:

Hi Guys,

 

This has been bothering me for a while. 99,9% of the time after a cyclone hits the game goes to Crap. 

Example: You've established where enemy ships are you've worked out a strategy and how the situation may progress you've positioned yourself in accordance...in short you have a plan.

We receive the warning that the Cyclone hits and voila.....instant chaos.

I know it levels the playing field for everyone but I just experienced yet another cyclone game where after destroying a DD in Neptune and doing some positive action for my team (as he was sneaking up behind undetected) 3 ships rendered 6-8 klm away 2x BB and 1x CA with no warning, they were also no where near the area they appeared before when cyclone hit so you cant track or have a rough idea where they would have been and what direction they were going etc.   Also the duration of the cyclone was quite long. too long IMO.

So what do cyclones actually lend to our game? Can we do without them...should we keep them and change the way they effect the game? Im all for realistic effects in the game etc but too many times the reason your back in port in this situation is not because you made a error but because the cyclone has made a threat/situation that you would otherwise taken action against impossible to avoid or detect.

 

Its like "surprise!!" but in a really bad way...

 

 

 

Over to you guys....

Many thanks for taking the time to read...

 

Wolf

 

I like cyclones.

they provide concealment and can be your ticket out of a bad place.

Also, if you said that cyclone took to long to pass it's possible that you spend some time dd hunting and ended up in the mist of some reds.

Yes cyclones can turn a game or win games.

things that i usually do.

- if you are chancing a ship and cyclone hits, the best thing to do it's disengage and seek some support before you resume the pursuit.

- the ship you are focusing generally will be roughly in the same area, just before the visibility drops to 8 km, check the others reds ships and direction.

 

My last cyclone battle ended up pretty well, me and a bb had a dd thou, we cut through the red's flank like a knife in hot butter.

we sunk a cl, a gneise and if our  other flank had not capped we would had sunk their cv too.

 

But yeah, sometimes you lose.

 

And besides, in the edge of the 8kms of detectability the red ship icon appears in the mini map before both ships are detected and rendered  you have a small window to chose between engage or evade.

 

 

 

 

[SeaWolf7]

56 minutes ago, alessandroj1 said:

He is saying that usually you can see where a radar ship is and avoid it, example I am in a yogumo I see 12 km away a des mones I will stay away from her. When cyclone hit you don’t know where the radar ship is moving and so chances are that you meet her suddenly 7.5km away( time to render), then you are screwed, only thing she has to do is pop radar and you’re dead

why would she pop radar? Your already detected at that range in a cyclone? Are you confusing this with smoke? they are very different in detectability ranges.

I think radar ranges and cyclone detectability ranges are a bit confusing

Have a look here:

Cyclones: http://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Ship:Cyclones

 

Surveillance radar: http://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Ship:Surveillance_Radar_Data

 

hope that helps..

 

Ps.. it appears Russian Cruisers are best off in these cyclone scenario's though

[MMASK]

There's nothing better that taking Kurfurst for a game and getting notified cyclone will start shortly...

[Commander_Cornflakes]

Vor 9 Minuten, SeaWolf7 sagte:

why would she pop radar? Your already detected at that range in a cyclone? Are you confusing this with smoke? they are very different in detectability ranges.

He said he's in Yugumo. With 5.5km detection range, he would still be stealth until radar comes.

 

Though he should just stay with a BB that would make scrap metal of every radar cruiser on 8km ^^

[PapVogele]

10 minutes ago, SeaWolf7 said:

why would she pop radar? Your already detected at that range in a cyclone? Are you confusing this with smoke? they are very different in detectability ranges.

I think radar ranges and cyclone detectability ranges are a bit confusing for some...

Have a look here:

Cyclones: http://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Ship:Cyclones

 

Surveillance radar: http://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Ship:Surveillance_Radar_Data

 

hope that helps..

Really?

 

ok, I’ll try to explain:

 

Des Moines sails around undetected in a cyclone. He suddenly gets spotted by a DD that has 5.8 km concealment, so he gets the notification that he is spotted, yet cant spot anything himself. Being the wise Desmo player he is, he knows there’s a DD around, and seeing as cyclone reduces visibility range to 8km, he also knows that if he pops radar the DD will be within range of the radar.

 

thus, cyclones are a MASSIVE disadvantage to DDs as anything they run into will know they are around, and they can’t spot most ships at ranges they normally can.

 

do you understand now?

[SeaWolf7]

4 minutes ago, Commander_Cornflakes said:

He said he's in Yugumo. With 5.5km detection range, he would still be stealth until radar comes.

 

Though he should just stay with a BB that would make scrap metal of every radar cruiser on 8km ^^

you are right missed that one ..my apologies.

[Naesil]

Cyclone is nice change of pace once in a while, so keep them and keep them relatively rare. 

 

Cyclones seem to favor the losing team so it can make matches interesting, while winning team is scattered aka creating crossfires the losing team is usually blopping somewhere and that becomes huge threat when cyclone kicks in. 

[SeaWolf7]

3 minutes ago, PapVogele said:

Really?

 

ok, I’ll try to explain:

 

Des Moines sails around undetected in a cyclone. He suddenly gets spotted by a DD that has 5.8 km concealment, so he gets the notification that he is spotted, yet cant spot anything himself. Being the wise Desmo player he is, he knows there’s a DD around, and seeing as cyclone reduces visibility range to 8km, he also knows that if he pops radar the DD will be within range of the radar.

 

thus, cyclones are a MASSIVE disadvantage to DDs as anything they run into will know they are around, and they can’t spot most ships at ranges they normally can.

 

do you understand now?

yes I do. That's absolutely correct and my fault I am sometimes ignorant in DD spotting ranges because I don't play them much