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dreddwales

Surface Radar

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Hello, 

Before I give up on this mostly enjoyable game ....... will the developers ever do anything about Surface Radar working through land masses??

You can hide in smoke quite well. You can hide behind land masses quite well and this makes playing as DD enjoyable but add in Radar and its pointless? You can spend time pushing and find your self spotted through a billion tonnes of rock?

Line of sight works quite well with regards to general detection and again, also in smoke ....... why cant the same principles be added to Radar??

Radar should be for spotting those in smoke or those with a smaller detection radius, where they can spot you but you cant' see them!!

 

Please say this will be addressed ..... or ..... sniff's ...... I'll cut my investment in the game and take my leave :(

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Nope, no fix to this planned.

But honestly, I don't see this as a big problem anyway. He may spot you through the island, but he still can't shoot you through it.

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And it gets better OP: planes will see you through the same amount of rock. AA is also "magically" shooting right through them... Did I mention sonar is of biblical power? That doesn't care for rocks either.

 

Edit 1: now I'm not claiming to be a super unicum with my stats to get that straight. Yours however doesn't make me worry that much to carry out your "threat."

Edit 2: it's working both ways... So why not take advantage from it and get better by the fact? It'll save you and us a lot of whining.

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6 hours ago, Commander_Cornflakes said:

But honestly, I don't see this as a big problem anyway. He may spot you through the island, but he still can't shoot you through it.

But others can. It's stupid, and it should be fixed. Preferably by removing radar entirely. Would make for a better game.

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6 minutes ago, AnotherDuck said:

Preferably by removing radar entirely. Would make for a better game.

 

Nah, I've seen too many one-sided games just because one team had more ships with smoke generators. 

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Unfortunately it can't be fixed because of engine limitations apparently. That really sucks. I completely agree with your point about it though. 

But since wg can't do anything about it, then you need to adapt. 

Check the minimap and keep checking it. 

Make sure you know which ships have radar and their ranges. Check divisions. Always have a quick way out when coughed out. 

That is the only way we can do something about it. 

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Vor 1 Minute, stewie533 sagte:

Unfortunately it can't be fixed because of engine limitations apparently.

mainly because it is working as intended...

Zitat

Radar and Hydroacoustic Search can pass through islands – is this a deliberate design choice or game engine limitations?

Both consumables work as intended and we have no plans to change them. We get where you’re coming from, but changing those mechanics would make the game more difficult to understand for players. 

 

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2 minutes ago, Klopirat said:

mainly because it is working as intended...

 

WGs comment "...but changing those mechanics would make the game more difficult to understand for players..." is weird.  Hardly the first time they have said something that doesn't make a lot of sense.

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8 minutes ago, Culiacan_Mexico said:

WGs comment "...but changing those mechanics would make the game more difficult to understand for players..." is weird.  Hardly the first time they have said something that doesn't make a lot of sense.

I don't think they listen to the players as much as they claim. Most complaints about it is that it doesn't make sense that it goes through islands and that they're caught off guard by something as stupid as that. I mean, if it was called X-Ray or Wallhack, then I could understand, but...

 

40 minutes ago, Marlekin said:

Nah, I've seen too many one-sided games just because one team had more ships with smoke generators. 

And I've seen too many complaints about one-sided games just because one team had more ships with radars.

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Admittedly I am not a software developer and obviously have no idea how the game's engine works at a coding level, but I l still don't understand why radar cannot be made to work on line of sight.  You know, exactly like the spotting mechanics which obviously rely on ...line of sight.  Just because a ship is in smoke or behind an island and not spotted the game engine doesn't forget where it is!

 

As for the comment that it would be too confusing for players - I really don't know what to say to that.  Line of sight is a fantastically simple mechanic to get your head around and yet WG might actually be right in this instance.  There was a guy in general chat the other day complaining that his Pan-Asian torps were bugged because they never hit enemy DDs (and looking at his stats I don't think he was trolling) and can you imagine the whine if they did make radar only work on line of sight and not through islands?  Because you can bet that the first battle after they did it (not that they will) someone will complain that they "got killed by an enemy who came around an island and wasn't detected by radar, even though that corner of that particular island is really low and the ship was taller than the island so my radar should have spotted it earlier." - Because at what point exactly should the radar start working past low lying land?

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4 minutes ago, krazypenguin said:

Because at what point exactly should the radar start working past low lying land?

Like normal spotting works now?

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10 minutes ago, AnotherDuck said:

Like normal spotting works now?

Oh, I totally agree with you, it's just I can still predict a huge amount of whine from the masses!

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But then that awesome DM gameplay wouldnt be so effective... you know, rush to the island near the cap zone, park behind it and ruin all gameplay and make DDs sit back until DM is somehow dealt with... and for them to be dealt with someone has to go in the open to shoot him behind that island. So much fun and makes game so much more active!!! All while they lob shells over the edge of the island... you know, favorite playstyle of "pro" players and those most "skilled".

All while other team complains how their DDs suck because they dont cap the zone...

 

Radar should be removed alltogether, promotes even more passive gameplay and it working through islands just makes it even worse.

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Hey, thanks all for the input! Grateful.

The only way I can see this resolved, especially as the Developers "Computer Says No" ....... is to call it 'Satellite Spotting'!! 

It has put me off the game and I find myself slowly playing less and less. DD's for me are the most fun, failing badly at sneaking up on the big boys and then missing them with my Torp's ...... sigh :/ BUT at the point where I have hunted down an Island camper and I am about to pounce ....... when he Radar's we through the land mass I'm using to hide my fragile rust bucket and his Team splode me in seconds :(

Radar should have the same principles as Line of Sight , it should just make your Line of Sight range far longer and enable the spotting of those hiding out of range / in smoke.

 

How about an option ....... being able to join games where there are no Radar equipped Ships?? A Tick Box list of Options ..... ?? (bag of worms right there :)  ) 

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18 hours ago, AnotherDuck said:

But others can. It's stupid, and it should be fixed. Preferably by removing radar entirely. Would make for a better game.

There is an entire cruiser line that is the only one without torps and all it has is the radar after T8. Take away the radar and there is no reason to use US cruisers... Imagine being the cruiser with worst shooting range in tier, bad armor, no torps, worst reload in tier, and a radar that only reaches 1Km less than your detection. Radar is annoying, but only Russian cruisers get OP versions of it and quickest reload, because reasons... Meanwhile in my Baltimore I have to spend 2 million credits and use an upgrade that I can only get from a Supercontainer just for the privilege of being able to shoot 2 salvos while the premium radar is up. Yes, because that 18 second reload is really threatening to a DD at T9...

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2 hours ago, EgyptOverseer said:

Meanwhile in my Baltimore I have to spend 2 million credits and use an upgrade that I can only get from a Supercontainer just for the privilege of being able to shoot 2 salvos while the premium radar is up. Yes, because that 18 second reload is really threatening to a DD at T9...

Citing those numbers makes me question whether you own a Baltimore at all, let alone know how to play one.

 

I'm also not quite sure what you're arguing. First you say that the entire line would be completely useless without radar, and then you say the radar is practically useless anyway.

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I've lost the count of the number of threads with people asking for radar change or removal. :fish_palm:

That won't change. It's an integral part of the current balance, so deal with it.

Also not mentioning the fact that plenty of people like it, but you will never see on the forum many posts about things people like. 

 

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15 minutes ago, elblancogringo said:

I've lost the count of the number of threads with people asking for radar change or removal. :fish_palm:

That won't change. It's an integral part of the current balance, so deal with it.

I've lost count on how many people mistakenly think that's an actual argument.

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6 minutes ago, AnotherDuck said:

I've lost count on how many people mistakenly think that's an actual argument.

It was not an argument, just an expression of how bored I am when I see someone like you aksing for radar removal.

But you mainly play destroyers, so I'm not surprised.

I play all classes, but mainly CA/CL and BB. I guess you're not surprised neither that I like radar, aren't you?

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5 minutes ago, elblancogringo said:

It was not an argument, just an expression of how bored I am when I see someone like you aksing for radar removal.

If you want to talk about boring, how about the kind of gameplay radar encourages? Max range torpedo sniping and island humping.

 

15 minutes ago, elblancogringo said:

I guess you're not surprised neither that I like radar, aren't you?

Why would I be surprised that you argue for selfish benefits? You assume that of others, so the normal conclusion is that it applies to yourself as well.

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In the current situation, It is a good thing that radar penetrating the islands IMO

Because when you hide behind an island it doesnt matter they see you or not. They mostly cant hit you.

When I get detected behind an island or W/O line of sight.. I just wait for 30 seconds to radar fade away.. and carry on my bussiness.

 

I wouldn't like it better If I go behind and island oblivious that there is radar runnind nearby.

 

But I believe everyones problem is that actually radar ships, especially american ones, sit behind islands for 15 mins.. and lob shells around.

Yeah I know it. People call it is fun.. I cant understand either.

But when you think about it, there are people who likes to watch criket on this world too.

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13 minutes ago, Excavatus said:

In the current situation, It is a good thing that radar penetrating the islands IMO

Because when you hide behind an island it doesnt matter they see you or not. They mostly cant hit you.

When I get detected behind an island or W/O line of sight.. I just wait for 30 seconds to radar fade away.. and carry on my bussiness.

I dont agree. Especially when playing cw. Its a common tactic to layer multiple (3+) radars to close down caps. It happens in randoms to, but not as often. When this is done well it hinders dds from spotting as well as capping. Leading to stale and campy play. Making radars line of sight would benefit gameplay. The great players would adapt so they would still be unicorns.

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23 hours ago, stewie533 said:

Unfortunately it can't be fixed because of engine limitations apparently. That really sucks. I completely agree with your point about it though. 

But since wg can't do anything about it, then you need to adapt. 

 

Not directed at you, but at WG...

This excuse is rubbish. With only a little modification, the radar/sonar functions could use the same code as that which decides whether your ship can see another one. It is just lazy programming and and a couldn't care less attitude of WG.

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3 hours ago, elblancogringo said:

...But you mainly play destroyers, so I'm not surprised...

I mainly play DDs, but...

 

I believe the old Shima torpedoes were bad for game play, I think WG approach to smoke could be altered, I like short range hydo on  cruisers is great, I think there should be more cruiser on each team, etc.

 

Is it possible that someone could try and look at overall game play and not at what just benefits a specific ship type?

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