Jump to content
Server Maintenance - January 18, 6:00 CET (5:00 UTC) Read more... ×
Server Maintenance - January 18, 6:00 CET (5:00 UTC) Read more... ×
Sign in to follow this  

37 comments in this topic

Recommended Posts

Players
590 posts

Very early days in the Lyon, but so far it seems to be a lot of fun. Even with the starting 3 point captain.

 

Comes into is own when under 13kms and shooting broadside cruisers or BB's. Also good for chunking DD's under 10 kms, due to flinging 16 shells their way.

 

Also a bit weird being the only Lyon in each battle. I bet that'll change in due course and this'll be a popular ship.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[BOAT]
Players
132 posts
2,147 battles

It will be popular for the all the wrong reasons.

 

16 shells flying at a poor cruiser or destroyer is seriously not fun when you are the victim. You can't dodge all 16 shells and the Lyon really seems to appear like a "Throw enough stuff at the wall, some of it's gonna stick" ship. It seems far too "retard-proof", which is rather unfortunate.

 

All the Lyons I've seen so far have been skirting around the edge of the map throwing their 16-shell broadsides around and generally offering little in the way of support to the rest of the team.

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beta Tester
1,971 posts
2,146 battles
On ‎2018‎-‎02‎-‎17 at 4:18 PM, Drasnighta said:

All the Lyons I've seen so far have been skirting around the edge of the map throwing their 16-shell broadsides around and generally offering little in the way of support to the rest of the team.

 

Well, from what I've heard about her dispersion, that's exactly the wrong way to play the Lyon. Where's the fun in that?

You should get up close and personal, and go all Gallic shotgun on your unhappy foes until they, or you, are sunk, sunk, sunk! Vive la France!!!

:Smile_izmena:

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[IRON7]
Players
153 posts
1,016 battles
On 24/02/2018 at 11:33 AM, Procrastes said:

Well, from what I've heard about her dispersion, that's exactly the wrong way to play the Lyon. Where's the fun in that?

No disrespect, but that's no way to play any ship other than a CV.

Haven't read up on its sigma, but if its anywhere close to that of the Fusou, then you don't want to fire at long range if at all possible.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beta Tester
1,971 posts
2,146 battles
16 hours ago, Nishi_Kinuyo said:

No disrespect, but that's no way to play any ship other than a CV.

 

That's true enough. But the French and the Russian cruisers do have a tinge of long-range kiter about them, have they not? At least if you get too close too early on in those ships, you stand a high risk of a swift trip back to port.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[BYOB]
Players
3,062 posts
11,002 battles

This ship was made to cheese people.

I took the AA range module and combined it with AFT/BFT. I feel dirty.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
154 posts
2,330 battles

Questionable addition in my Opinion, borderline OP... even with it`s shitty HE it does more damage than a DoY or King V

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[BYOB]
Players
3,062 posts
11,002 battles
20 hours ago, RAZ0RLIGHT said:

Questionable addition in my Opinion, borderline OP... even with it`s shitty HE it does more damage than a DoY or King V

It's not borderline, it's flag waving at the centre of the OP parade.

You can't kite against 16 barrels of death.

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[SICK]
Weekend Tester
4,682 posts
9,234 battles

Giving baddies 16 guns with reasonably good HE and good range.

How could anyone have seen people using that to snipe and basically just grief every match with it?

Creepy-Condescending-Wonka.jpg

  • Funny 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[DUXTR]
Alpha Tester
529 posts

Holy shait. I so hate the guns on this ship. It`s either overpens or bounce. I get the occational citadell.

There is absolutely no consitency over the guns. I refuse to spam HE in her yet. But I`m tempted to.

I`ve had so many broadside CA/CLs to me it`s retarded. And my reward is 950 damage.

  • Funny 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
590 posts
On 03/03/2018 at 1:15 PM, siramra said:

Holy shait. I so hate the guns on this ship. It`s either overpens or bounce. I get the occational citadell.

There is absolutely no consitency over the guns. I refuse to spam HE in her yet. But I`m tempted to.

I`ve had so many broadside CA/CLs to me it`s retarded. And my reward is 950 damage.

At longer ranges you're praying to the RNG gods. Sometimes you get no hits or 1 poxy overpen. Sometimes you strike the jackpot and all your lemons line up.

 

At 10 kms or less, this ship is lethal vs broadside cruisers - usually. From time to time you do get trolled by the spirit of de Gaulle.

 

I've been having fun doing 20k damage salvoes vs broadside Bis'ies Tirp'ies, Gnies and Scharn'ies in Operation Herpes.

As Aragathor mentioned the AA is AOK. I haven't specced into it and still shot down 47 bot planes in todays mission. I wasn't even ctrl-clicking them most of the time.

  • Funny 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[DUXTR]
Alpha Tester
529 posts
8 hours ago, Lin3 said:

At longer ranges you're praying to the RNG gods. Sometimes you get no hits or 1 poxy overpen. Sometimes you strike the jackpot and all your lemons line up.

 

At 10 kms or less, this ship is lethal vs broadside cruisers - usually. From time to time you do get trolled by the spirit of de Gaulle.

 

I've been having fun doing 20k damage salvoes vs broadside Bis'ies Tirp'ies, Gnies and Scharn'ies in Operation Herpes.

As Aragathor mentioned the AA is AOK. I haven't specced into it and still shot down 47 bot planes in todays mission. I wasn't even ctrl-clicking them most of the time.

I`ve tried every range. The overpens are insane. Even when I try to shot "into" the water.

Thankfully done With her now. Didn`t sell her though....still 16 gun meme ship.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
154 posts
2,330 battles

GG WG, you put in such a [edited] OP ship... thats it for me and WoWS, if you enjoy such imbalance go on.

edti: weird enough, since it isnt a premium ship and we all know how you love overpowered (good selling) premium ships

  • Funny 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beta Tester
1,339 posts
5,176 battles
On 2018-03-05 at 6:51 PM, RAZ0RLIGHT said:

GG WG, you put in such a [edited] OP ship...

It certainly sits on the more OP side of the fence with large amounts of guns and for some reason also great AA even when you don't spec for it.

 

However I found the guns very tempermental, and the low caliber provides problem if a target tries to angle. So far my sucess in the ship has relied on that people just will not stop giving broadside to you, and at tier 7 there are still quite a few newish and inexperienced players to prey upon. Also I'm not overly impressed with the durability. Lower than average HP and with armor that atleast for me catches penetrations from weird angles.

 

But with that being said I would not shed a tear seeing this thing tweaked in some way.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[NWP]
[NWP]
Players
8,107 posts
11,620 battles

16 guns was a silly idea, even with the derp.

 

Look at the Fuso and New Mex. Those were pretty decent at slapping down their targets but this thing is even crazier due to the sheer number of dice rolls you have.

 

They even made it fairly fast too. Only slower than Hood and the German baby Tirpitz (Gnesi).

 

I enjoy it more than the damn Richelieu which is very meh as the guns suck.

  • Funny 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[SOCKS]
Players
783 posts
5,479 battles

I personally loathe this ship for two reasons.

Reason number one is that no cruiser is safe within firing range of one. As the old saying goes "through enough crap to the wall, some will stick". Or put in other words, even a lousy shot lobbing 16 shells in the general direction of a WASD-ing cruiser will get hits. And those hits will hurt A LOT.

Plain and simple ,this ship is a huge OP cruiserclubbing crapwagon. And then we complain we don't see enough cruisers. With horrid for the meta additions like this imaginary ship (it only existed on design...limited to a top speed of 22.5 knots) which just craps on cruisers, who is to be surprised?.



Reason number two is that I swear that 4 out of 5 Lyons I see are played by utter nobrainers whose idea of "teamplay" is to sit as far from the enemy they can while they still can lob those 16 gun broadsides of doom. I've seen my fair share of borderhumping oblivious BBs in WOWS but in this ship the ratio goes off scale between the numbers of Lyons doing what a BB is supposed to do and Lyons playing the almost-BVR game. And is all due to the same reason as number 1. 16 guns, no matter how crap you are at aiming even while sitting at top range, your chances to hit with at least one per volley are astronomically high.


This ship is a mistake and should SERIOUSLY be nerfbatted some way or another. You can't have 16 guns moving at almost 30 knots with that AAA on top of that and think it's going to have any good impact on the game. Slash that speed to historical limits and we can begin having a conversation. In the meantime the ship is a huge mistake and misstep by wargaming. This thing should've never been introduced in the game, period.

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[BYOB]
Players
3,062 posts
11,002 battles
On 3/10/2018 at 1:36 AM, RAMJB said:

I personally loathe this ship for two reasons.

Reason number one is that no cruiser is safe within firing range of one. As the old saying goes "through enough crap to the wall, some will stick". Or put in other words, even a lousy shot lobbing 16 shells in the general direction of a WASD-ing cruiser will get hits. And those hits will hurt A LOT.

Plain and simple ,this ship is a huge OP cruiserclubbing crapwagon. And then we complain we don't see enough cruisers. With horrid for the meta additions like this imaginary ship (it only existed on design...limited to a top speed of 22.5 knots) which just craps on cruisers, who is to be surprised?.



Reason number two is that I swear that 4 out of 5 Lyons I see are played by utter nobrainers whose idea of "teamplay" is to sit as far from the enemy they can while they still can lob those 16 gun broadsides of doom. I've seen my fair share of borderhumping oblivious BBs in WOWS but in this ship the ratio goes off scale between the numbers of Lyons doing what a BB is supposed to do and Lyons playing the almost-BVR game. And is all due to the same reason as number 1. 16 guns, no matter how crap you are at aiming even while sitting at top range, your chances to hit with at least one per volley are astronomically high.


This ship is a mistake and should SERIOUSLY be nerfbatted some way or another. You can't have 16 guns moving at almost 30 knots with that AAA on top of that and think it's going to have any good impact on the game. Slash that speed to historical limits and we can begin having a conversation. In the meantime the ship is a huge mistake and misstep by wargaming. This thing should've never been introduced in the game, period.

Amen to that. This ship is almost worse than the Orion. It requires no skill and can delete any cruiser in range just by firing its guns. It's a paper design that has been chosen instead of an existing ship.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[ST-EU]
Supertester
2,835 posts
4,190 battles

Wow... salt is really real on this one. As a cruiser player I can safely say I don't especially fear this compared to any other BB. Huge dispersion, no penetration, nothing to fear as long as you keep an eye on where it as and when it's got guns on you. Plus half the people playing it seem to think 16 guns is an invitation to fire HE, which without RN special shells just makes it a fail choice.

  • Cool 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beta Tester
1,971 posts
2,146 battles

I have so far played the Lyon exclusively in the 'Operation Hermes'. And my impression is that this scenario seems tailored to fit the Lyon's playstyle like a glove - row after row of enemy battleships and cruisers appear at ranges of 12 km or less, and then drive around, mainly broadside on, like ducks on a shooting range. I'm a medocre gunner at best, but even my damage statitistics have gone through the roof on this one. I will have to test her out in some random battles and see what happens!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[FLEET]
Beta Tester
60 posts
5,144 battles

I hate this ship with a passion. The guns are severely underwhelming even compared to New Mex and Fuso's 1.5 sigma derp. 

As already mentioned they either overpen or bounce/shatter when shooting AP. I can't recall another BB where I've gotten SO many 900 - 3000 dam salvos and then having to wait for half a minute for another go. Even on perfectly broadside cruisers.

It has a good speed and the AA is decent. The main problem is the short range where you don't really want to spec AF to extend it 20 %.

I might try a few days just spamming HE to see if it improves, because the AP is not doing it for me. 

  • Funny 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[BYOB]
Players
3,062 posts
11,002 battles
1 hour ago, Arkhannan said:

I hate this ship with a passion. The guns are severely underwhelming even compared to New Mex and Fuso's 1.5 sigma derp. 

As already mentioned they either overpen or bounce/shatter when shooting AP. I can't recall another BB where I've gotten SO many 900 - 3000 dam salvos and then having to wait for half a minute for another go. Even on perfectly broadside cruisers.

It has a good speed and the AA is decent. The main problem is the short range where you don't really want to spec AF to extend it 20 %.

I might try a few days just spamming HE to see if it improves, because the AP is not doing it for me. 

I have a completely different opinion of this ship based on my experience against and in it.

A typical faceroll game in the Lyon driven by me looks like this:

-Omaha gets into position bow on, citadel through the bow with some overpens, 2K HP left.

-Königsberg at max range, all shots miss save one, citadel, Königsberg dead.

-Galissonniere tries to angle and run away, how sweet, double citadel, dev strike.

-Nelson turns around the corner, one salvo, half HP gone.

-Queen Elizabeth shows some side, five pens, 2/3 HP evaporates.

 

Earning High Caliber, Confederate, and Kraken Unleashed is so damn easy in this ship. It's disgusting. I really wanted to like this ship, as I don't have too many silver T7 BBs that I want to keep after the grind (only one in fact, the Gneisenau). But this ship offers no challenge, no excitement, it's like playing Orion at T4 or having @xXx_Blogis_xXx in a Saipan on your team. I'd rather jump into a Pensacola (which I've kept with the perma camo on and the Measure 22 mod) and try my skill against the red team, because I want to have fun and ez Lyon mode just isn't.

  • Cool 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Players
147 posts
6,556 battles

Its not like we dont have any border line OP ships at t7 anyways, the saipan is just dirty, the kaga has the same strike capacity as the t9 jap cv, Belfast is stronk, we got flints, in addition to lenins ( maybe not OP in my opinion but I know others disagree). I personally think that the lyon is fine, just turn bow in have be happy, its got no armour so :P

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[BAD-A]
[BAD-A]
Beta Tester
1,673 posts
15,367 battles

Hey guys just a FYI I too looked at the ship and thought yum 16 guns... then played first game and gave my thoughts on her in this 

 

 

 

Having played an additional 25 games in her my opinions are somewhat changed, will post up an update video at 50 games in her to update my opinions... but the long and short of it is thus.....

 

Long range HE spam is the WRONG way to play this ship, set her up with concealment skill, load AP and you WILL put DS into cruisers of ANY tier, you can one shot Nagato's (assuming they are the moron who accused me of hacking yesterday when he was one shotted from full health by my Lyon... even though I told him after that if you sit still in open water fully broadside to a Lyon at 11km... then what can you expect), you can also put CONSISTENT...HEAVY damage into any BB who shows the slightest of broadsides. Yes the HE is excellent if you are kiting away while holding a flank against superior ships/numbers and with the correct angling and speed changes you receive minimal damage in return. 

But.. and this is a big BUT... the ship is in no way OP it is another vessel similar to the Fiji that REWARDS experienced players in orders of magnitude. So yes OP in the right hands and downright meh when used by someone with less experience.

 

Just my tuppence

 

Cherry

 

 

Lyon at 30.jpg

  • Cool 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
[SOCKS]
Players
783 posts
5,479 battles

I'm sorry, it's OP. Let me give the reasons why:
T7 BB contenders: Colorado, Nagato, Scharnhorst,Gneisenau, KGV, DoY, Nelson.

-Speed: middle of the ground, 27 knots means it leaves Colorado and nagato in the dust, and is almost tied with KGV and DoY most of the time.

-Maneouverability: 11.7 rudder shift. By far best at tier. 700m turning radius. Only Colorado is better, that by 10% and colorado has to chug along in a turn at 18-19 knots while Lyon does at 24-25 (so traverse per second is FAR higher in the Lyon). Literally it's a windmill BB.

-AAA: some of the best stuff at T7, only Gneisenau is objectively better and even then Lyon beats it in range (5.2km AAA base range).

 

-Secondaries: base of 5.2km range (beats the german twins), a total of 24 guns with pretty decent arcs, 9% fire chance and good reload. I've ran Gneisenaus with secondary builds and by now I'm quite sure this one will be better at it.

- Main battery: 16 guns is utterly ridiculous. Dispersion being not great actually work in their favor, the shotgun effect DOES kill WASD-ing cruisers with outrageous reliability. I'm tired of getting citadelled in cruisers while WASD-ing at long ranges against Lyons only to get citadelled anyways by some stray shell. The number of shells in a volley is just too much to reliably avoid. Only downside is the caliber when dealing with overmatches but given how hard it's HE hits bow-on opposition is not a problem. Turret angles don't favor a pure bow-on approach, but with that rudder shift coming out-and-into autobounce angles to unmask the guns at the proper time is a child's play so that's almost a non-factor.

-Concealment: Roughly the same as Scharnhorst's, which means more than good enough to sneak into firing positions where you can pretty much drop the hammer on enemy cruisers at will while all they can do is try to flee in terror while they're blasted to smithereens

 

-Survability: Probably it's weakest trait. Armor is...actually pretty decent. Spaced armor-on-top-of-turtleback arrangement means it's more resilient than what the uninspiring thicknesses might look like at first to incoming broadside fire. Still eats citadels broadside on, but the armor layout is far more resilient than say, a Nagato's. doesn't mean from certain angles isn't weak, but still is more than good enough for a T7.  HP pool is not specially high (even while it's in Scharnhorst's ballpark, it doesn't have Scharnhorst's armor). Add to that that it's not a particularily large ship.


Summing up in most regards Lyon is top class, specially on frepower. Agility, top marks, speed, high marks, firepower best marks by far of the whole tier. Concealment, high marks. Even survability aint' bad. So even at it's weakest trait, Lyon is still GOOD ENOUGH, being best-or-almost the best in everything else.

That's pretty much the summary of an OP ship. That potatoes can't shine on it doesn't mean it's not OP, it means that if potatoes can't shine even on a smoked radarhydro Belfast, they won't in a battleship either.

But the ship is a straight up OP monster that should've never been introduced in it's current form. Far too many strenghts without any real weaknesses (not even the survability). With those strennghts and 16 guns, it means laughable gunplay, specially against a class that's already far too hard to play well (cruisers), and don't deserve to have to deal with this apocaliptic monster in almost every game they play.

And even more when there's no reason why a ship that was designed to be a lumbering dreadnought with a  (theoretical) top speed of 22.5 knots can top off 27 with those rudder shift times and turning radiuses which make absolutely no sense from the historical nor gameplay points of view.

this thing needs a SERIOUS (not moderate, serious) nerf to it's maneouverability/speed and then it'll be OK. At 27 knots, with that maneuverability, AA and guns, it's certainly not OK.

  • Cool 2
  • Bad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×