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aviaxis

Clan wars MM

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Hi,

 

I would like to draw attention on a very important factor in Clan Wars, and that is the Match Making system.

 

In the first season my clan was very close to promote in storm league... we reached the play offs twice. First time we met 4 Taifun teams in the play offs for storm (!?!?!?!)... we managed to win 1 game but lost the other 3. We had actually 0 chance to promote... the teams we met were much more experienced than us and they actually gave us the feeling that we stood no chance. Of course, it is demotivating when such thing happens, but we managed to raise our morale and go back again.

 

This time we met 3 taifun teams in the play offs and again we stood no chance to promote in the Storm league.

 

After this happened, the team was practically disbanded... we could barely gather a 7 players team... we played rarely, and even though we reached 98 points and were 1 victory away from the play offs, we actually never got to play again... The team was really demotivated for the rest of the season and never had 7 players to play clan wars again. Players were playing randoms or something else and lost all interest in clan wars.

 

I think this kind of unfair match making should be eliminated from play offs. Is it so hard to limit the level of the teams you meet in play offs / play outs to the league above / below?

You can't ask teams from the bottom leagues to win against hurricane division teams in play offs... it's unfair, demotivating, and no fun... practically for both, the experiences and non experienced teams...

 

Could this be fixed?

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4 minutes ago, aviaxis said:

 

the teams we met were much more experienced than us and they actually gave us the feeling that we stood no chance.

 

 

 

Well that is supposed to happen.

Surely that team that beat you in that particular game, will inevitably feel the same in another clan game, against a stronger than them opponent .

 

 

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Well I think this is normal because you are competing ( struggle ) to go from Storm to 1 league higher and that is Typhoon - what is stupid to me is that lower league can be vs from I league higher leauge, they should play only vs III  of that higher league ( there is III, II and I in every league )  ...

 

It is very good and fair that WG put top above league Hurricane so all top clan can play vs each other so the rest of us have a good chance to get that flag - it is far better than last season... 

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So let's say 2 potato teams fight each other and one wins and is promoted to a higher league but then in higher league there are better teams and that potato team will lose unless there are more potato teams in the higher league to fight against and not instantly lose. But then again what would be that higher league if it would be full of potato teams?  In the end it's lose - lose anyway unless you want to be in the best league but fight only weak teams like your own with skill based MM or smg.

 

Word potato was used in a friendly way.

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8 minutes ago, Geralt_z_Rivii365 said:

So let's say 2 potato teams fight each other and one wins and is promoted to a higher league but then in higher league there are better teams and that potato team will lose unless there are more potato teams in the higher league to fight against and not instantly lose. But then again what would be that higher league if it would be full of potato teams?  In the end it's lose - lose anyway unless you want to be in the best league but fight only weak teams like your own with skill based MM or smg.

 

Word potato was used in a friendly way.

I agree with this a lot. Sure, you will meet the occasional team that will wipe the floor with you, but taking this as a learning experience rather than anything else. Typhoon is where the big guys play and storm itself is challenging. If your team forfeits that easily they are no material for top level competitive. I'm not trying to be rude or talk down to you, but that's what it comes down to. Had large losing streaks as well, but pulling yourself back up is what gets you to the promised land. 

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To be fair, at least in my experience, in Typhoon we were almost always fighting other teams in Typhoon, with a Storm here and there. We got a sub-storm team just once - some bronze guys after a fair bit longer queue than usually. So... I'd guess if you don't get a game in 30s just quit the queue and enter it again, good chance you can avoid meeting clans far out of your level that way

 

But yeah, Geralt_z_Rivii365 has a point, in promos you'd expect to fight stronger clans - to prove that you are worthy to join  them :cap_yes:

 

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The entire reason for promotion games is to play against clans which are close to relegation in the league above you, so that you can prove you are more worthy being there than they are. Not sure what your complaint is. There's a simple truth behind this: your clan wasn't good enough for Typhoon League and that's why you couldn't get there. Everything working as it should here, sorry.

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2 minutes ago, Guillotine said:

This isnt ranked where you can throw enough **** on the wall and you reach top league. 

That's what people want though. Because deep down, nobody wants actual skill based MM, they all just want to feel like being the best without actually being the best. Ranked is the perfect example. The amount of people I've met feeling superior to everyone just because they reached rank 1 is hilarious.

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39 minutes ago, Earl_of_Northesk said:

That's what people want though. Because deep down, nobody wants actual skill based MM, they all just want to feel like being the best without actually being the best. Ranked is the perfect example. The amount of people I've met feeling superior to everyone just because they reached rank 1 is hilarious.

Tbh, when I encounter another guy with a Stalingrad flag I usually trust that guy a lot more than I usually would in randoms. 

 

If you make it far in cw you're actually proving you're a good team player. Because teams have to be really amazing to compensate 1/7 of them being bad. 

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26 minutes ago, dCK_Ad_Hominem said:

Tbh, when I encounter another guy with a Stalingrad flag I usually trust that guy a lot more than I usually would in randoms. 

 

If you make it far in cw you're actually proving you're a good team player. Because teams have to be really amazing to compensate 1/7 of them being bad. 

Because clan wars is the most skill based system we have. That’s not what I was speaking about though, I was referring to Ranked.

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4 hours ago, aviaxis said:

Hi,

 

I would like to draw attention on a very important factor in Clan Wars, and that is the Match Making system.

 

In the first season my clan was very close to promote in storm league... we reached the play offs twice. First time we met 4 Taifun teams in the play offs for storm (!?!?!?!)... we managed to win 1 game but lost the other 3. We had actually 0 chance to promote... the teams we met were much more experienced than us and they actually gave us the feeling that we stood no chance. Of course, it is demotivating when such thing happens, but we managed to raise our morale and go back again.

 

This time we met 3 taifun teams in the play offs and again we stood no chance to promote in the Storm league.

 

After this happened, the team was practically disbanded... we could barely gather a 7 players team... we played rarely, and even though we reached 98 points and were 1 victory away from the play offs, we actually never got to play again... The team was really demotivated for the rest of the season and never had 7 players to play clan wars again. Players were playing randoms or something else and lost all interest in clan wars.

 

I think this kind of unfair match making should be eliminated from play offs. Is it so hard to limit the level of the teams you meet in play offs / play outs to the league above / below?

You can't ask teams from the bottom leagues to win against hurricane division teams in play offs... it's unfair, demotivating, and no fun... practically for both, the experiences and non experienced teams...

 

Could this be fixed?

From what I understood your team was in storm league and playing the 5 games for promotion to enter typhoon...

So its pretty obvious that if you want to enter the typhoon league you need to be able to win at least 3 games against clans in that league to prove your clan rating should be there instead of the storm league... if you fail to do so means your team was simply not good enough...

 

There is no issue with MM whatsoever... this is the whole purpose of having a league system...

 

Now WG already changed this season to help you with your case by adding a new hurricane league which only purpose is the same as the superleague in rankeds. To remove the typhoon league clans from the pool so "weaker" clans can get promoted to it and have a chance to get the stalingrad flag.

So basically if you want to improve your odds just wait for the typhoon clans to move to hurricane leaving room for the storm clans to move to typhoon (and so on...)

 

But again... there is nothing wrong with you facing a higher league clans during promotion battles...

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8 minutes ago, SunSkaRe said:

From what I understood your team was in storm league and playing the 5 games for promotion to enter typhoon...

So its pretty obvious that if you want to enter the typhoon league you need to be able to win at least 3 games against clans in that league to prove your clan rating should be there instead of the storm league... if you fail to do so means your team was simply not good enough...

 

There is no issue with MM whatsoever... this is the whole purpose of having a league system...

 

Now WG already changed this season to help you with your case by adding a new hurricane league which only purpose is the same as the superleague in rankeds. To remove the typhoon league clans from the pool so "weaker" clans can get promoted to it and have a chance to get the stalingrad flag.

So basically if you want to improve your odds just wait for the typhoon clans to move to hurricane leaving room for the storm clans to move to typhoon (and so on...)

 

But again... there is nothing wrong with you facing a higher league clans during promotion battles...

not sure, but from the way I read the OP, they were facing Typhoon teams in their promotions games into Storm league from Gale, not out of it into Typhoon. And, frankly, if that was the case it does stink a bit... doesn't change the "if you cant fight your way through tough times as a team you simply arent top material" point, but I can understand the frustration...

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11 minutes ago, SunSkaRe said:

From what I understood your team was in storm league and playing the 5 games for promotion to enter typhoon...

So its pretty obvious that if you want to enter the typhoon league you need to be able to win at least 3 games against clans in that league to prove your clan rating should be there instead of the storm league... if you fail to do so means your team was simply not good enough...

 

There is no issue with MM whatsoever... this is the whole purpose of having a league system...

 

Now WG already changed this season to help you with your case by adding a new hurricane league which only purpose is the same as the superleague in rankeds. To remove the typhoon league clans from the pool so "weaker" clans can get promoted to it and have a chance to get the stalingrad flag.

So basically if you want to improve your odds just wait for the typhoon clans to move to hurricane leaving room for the storm clans to move to typhoon (and so on...)

 

But again... there is nothing wrong with you facing a higher league clans during promotion battles...

 

we were sqal, trying to promote to storm

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5 minutes ago, Tyrendian89 said:

not sure, but from the way I read the OP, they were facing Typhoon teams in their promotions games into Storm league from Gale, not out of it into Typhoon. And, frankly, if that was the case it does stink a bit... doesn't change the "if you cant fight your way through tough times as a team you simply arent top material" point, but I can understand the frustration...

 

I am talking the B team of OP... of course OP was facing Typhoon... they were top 10 at some point...

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2 minutes ago, aviaxis said:

 

I am talking the B team of OP... of course OP was facing Typhoon... they were top 10 at some point...

...ah. how inconvenient. OP=Original Poster in my case there :Smile_teethhappy:

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11 minutes ago, Tyrendian89 said:

not sure, but from the way I read the OP, they were facing Typhoon teams in their promotions games into Storm league from Gale, not out of it into Typhoon. And, frankly, if that was the case it does stink a bit... doesn't change the "if you cant fight your way through tough times as a team you simply arent top material" point, but I can understand the frustration...

My first impression from reading OP was they were already in storm... but if they were actually trying to get in it then yeah I agree that shouldnt happen...

 

7 minutes ago, aviaxis said:

 

we were sqal, trying to promote to storm

You mean gale (squal is lowest league) but yeah... again you shouldnt have to fight typhoon teams to enter storm (at least doesnt make much sense in this kind of league system other then there were no other teams in queue at the time)

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5 minutes ago, Tyrendian89 said:

...ah. how inconvenient. OP=Original Poster in my case there :Smile_teethhappy:

 

oh... right :)

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29 minutes ago, SunSkaRe said:

My first impression from reading OP was they were already in storm... but if they were actually trying to get in it then yeah I agree that shouldnt happen...

 

You mean gale (squal is lowest league) but yeah... again you shouldnt have to fight typhoon teams to enter storm (at least doesnt make much sense in this kind of league system other then there were no other teams in queue at the time)

I call [edited]. We never faced a team below storm while being in typhoon. It doesn’t work that way.

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7 minutes ago, Earl_of_Northesk said:

I call [edited]. We never faced a team below storm while being in typhoon. It doesn’t work that way.

Actually I've seen it before (though it was always after sitting in queue for some time) and was told of similar "events" by friends in other clans (after having a winning streak)... so I dont think its so far from reality...

Although pretty rare that could even call it worth entering the statistics or even be mentioned as decisive to anything

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7 hours ago, Earl_of_Northesk said:

I call [edited]. We never faced a team below storm while being in typhoon. It doesn’t work that way.

ADRIA did fight some bronze (squall or whatever it's called) team once while being in Typhoon. Those guys just rushed through the middle in the map where B was in A, initially took us by surprise (I mean - who would expect that silly rush? :cap_haloween:) but they got slaughtered quite quickly. No idea how that was seen as fair MM, but it happened after a prolonged queue - I guess when you sit in it for too long MM goes crazy.

 

Have seen screenshots quite a few screenshots of silver (gale?) teams being put up against Typhoons, those seemed to be far less rare (there were multiple topics of that here in Forums)

 

 

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