Enough is enough.

[anonym_yHbO7kUt9ZH4]

Right, have to make a topic out of it..

 

I'm really getting sick of that horrible MM for tier 8. WG, please fix that horrible 'thing', i'm really tempted to just quit the battle, or just sell all my T8 ships. 90% of the battles i play in T8 ships are T10 battles. and though i don't mind being bottom tier, everyone has to be every now and then, this is way beyond the 'fun and engaging' part of the game. This has been going on for quite some time now, and really, DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT. please.. the difference between T10 and T8 ships is already way to big to be a fair fight in my opinion, certainly in cruisers. I know, 'L2P'.. and stuff like that. I'm not the best player out here, but i'm certainly not the only one facing this horrible stuff. I really like the T8 ships, they are among the most fun ships to play imo, but it's that MM that kills all the fun. I lost count of the times i was the only T8 ship in a battle, the other team did have a person that had the same bad luck, but i'm past believing this is just bad luck.

I'd love to hear if there is something to do about this, and IF WG is actually going to do that...

 

thanks for reading, and have a nice day.

[Sargento_YO]

Surely you don't complain when you enter into a tier 6 battle.

I can imagine this: Being in a tier 6 and entering a tier 8 "[edited]WG, [edited]MM, blah blah"

Same with: tier 5 vs tier 7

Tier 4 vs tier 5

Tier 3 vs tier 4... etc.

[anonym_yHbO7kUt9ZH4]

3 minutes ago, Sargento_YO said:

Surely you don't complain when you enter into a tier 6 battle.

I can imagine this: Being in a tier 6 and entering a tier 8 "[edited]WG, [edited]MM, blah blah"

Same with: tier 5 vs tier 7

Tier 4 vs tier 5

Tier 3 vs tier 4... etc.

With the tier 6 it doesn't happen with the vast majority of the battles, so no, you don't hear me complaining about that indeed.

[principat121]

13 minutes ago, _Caution_BraincellNr2 said:

I'd love to hear if there is something to do about this, and IF WG is actually going to do that...

No.

And why should they?

[RUSSIANBlAS]

Lel Deal with it...

 

It's a farming opportunity as you bag XP fast vs T10 potatoes.

 

Although in seriousness the New Orleans grind was the most painful thing I've done recently in Ships and that includes Ranked. Across the entire grind I probably had under 10 games as top tier but with quite a few where I was an isolated T8 Cruiser.

[iJoby]

1 hour ago, _Caution_BraincellNr2 said:

the difference between T10 and T8 ships is already way to big to be a fair fight in my opinion

Surely you would adjust your strategy & play more cautious if you were T8 in a T10 game, as you would be more aggressive if you were T8 in a T6 game. 

[LazyInsight]

Why are people so against being uptiered at T8? I understand that some ships handle uptiering worse than others, especially lower tier cruisers, but at tier 8 you have acces to concealment / 40% rudder shift module so why all the crying?

 

In my case whenever I play my Takao or Mogami, its really nice to have matchmaking like ~3-4 T10s and rest mix of T9s and T8s. Even in case of bigger numbers of high tiers; like lets say 8 T10 ships, I would prefer that over being downtiered. I just dont know, playing T8 ships in a tier 6 match feels like a chore - not really to my liking. Playing T8 ship in a tier 10 match seems like a vacation in comparison.

[Shirakami_Kon]

2 hours ago, Sargento_YO said:

Surely you don't complain when you enter into a tier 6 battle.

I can imagine this: Being in a tier 6 and entering a tier 8 "[edited]WG, [edited]MM, blah blah"

Same with: tier 5 vs tier 7

Tier 4 vs tier 5

Tier 3 vs tier 4... etc.

 

Tier 8 ships are being drawn so much to tier 10 battles that the T6 situation and how much you face tier 8 is even good in comparison. And to be honest even though the difference it's still there T6 ships in general fare a lot better against tier 8 than tier 8 against T10.

 

Just try to look for rants about T6 being awful last monts and then do the same about T8. That may tell something.

[eliastion]

16 minutes ago, SHDRKN4792 said:

(...)

Just try to look for rants about T6 being awful last monts and then do the same about T8. That may tell something.

This might not be the best argument, seeing how t8 is THE most popular (by the number of games played weekly) tier in the game (certainly played much more than t6, at least). And this naturally makes t8 "hard life" whines louder. And then there's the fact that t8 is an "adult" tier (so you can complain without shame) while t6 is often considered sealclubbing (so complaints are likely to sound like a sealclubber throwing a tantrum that real player come to ruin his fun). Basically, regardless of how bad or how good the situation is, there are just more people who care about t8 AND they aren't stopped by shame of coming off as sealclubbers with demands - it's obvious that their voice is going to resound much louder on the Forums.

 

 

[Shirakami_Kon]

20 minutes ago, eliastion said:

This might not be the best argument, seeing how t8 is THE most popular (by the number of games played weekly) tier in the game (certainly played much more than t6, at least). And this naturally makes t8 "hard life" whines louder. And then there's the fact that t8 is an "adult" tier (so you can complain without shame) while t6 is often considered sealclubbing (so complaints are likely to sound like a sealclubber throwing a tantrum that real player come to ruin his fun). Basically, regardless of how bad or how good the situation is, there are just more people who care about t8 AND they aren't stopped by shame of coming off as sealclubbers with demands - it's obvious that their voice is going to resound much louder on the Forums.

 

I get what you're trying to say but I don't understand how of all tiers, tier 6 is a "sealclubbing tier". What's the worse that can happen at tier 6? A lot of players may consider tier 6 boring because of it being mid tier or maybe because of the fact that tier 6 ships in general are actually pretty well balanced. Yeah, sometimes I hear some people that argue that Arizona is "OP" for a tier 6 but if that'd be the worse problem of WOWS I'd be crying of joy compared to what happens in other tiers with certain premiums.

 

Tier 6 really had a similar situation to tier 8 now and nowadays it's somehow solved and any complain about it was a valid one at the time and I don't see how any of them should have been disregarded "because of sealclubbing" at tier 6.

 

Returning to topic though, this has now remembered me that if I remember well this situation of T8 being uptiered a lot kinda began shortly after the T6 problem being solved, right? So... (TINFOIL HAT MODE ACTIVATED!) maybe it has something to do about it? Maybe MM was tweaked so T6 face T8 less which led to T8 being uptiered more because of that too? 

[Butterdoll]

1 hour ago, SHDRKN4792 said:

Just try to look for rants about T6 being awful last monts and then do the same about T8. That may tell something

 

Nah, t6 MM is not that bad.

T5 Have it worst

and t8 ships (from what I eared have it the worst, poor bastards).

I don't know why but before t6 fought a lot more Tirpitz/Bismarks than know. Know it's more dynamic, more diverse.

When down tiered and specially in strange map nothing cheer me more than a Bismark or a Tirpitz, everything comes into place.

a person goes from hesitant to fully action stations, I can't explain why.

The hardest thou, it's the dds, they are tougher than nails, tougher than t6 cruisers, they can brawl you, they can use AP on you, as if they were cruisers themselves. You can sink them, but essentially you got to face them as if you were facing a cruiser.

 

@_Caution_BraincellNr2

 

Maybe the best course of action is to maintain yourself in the pack, stay low, with an eye on the big guns, and looking for ships that are already committed with something else.

I've been in t7 battles against t9s where they were too cautious I found it very strange, very campy to my taste but perhaps those particular ones were shell shocked? 

Either way, (I learned this with the Konisberg), that backwards little sparrow did fine as long you didn't have to held a flank or muscle with other ship or be the main focus. When one or more than one of this scenarios happens you are just an spectator of your own demised or defeat.

I don't know about t8, but t6 have ships that can take care of ships 1,2 tiers above.

Be happy if you manage to get your "pound of meat".

 

 

 

   

 

 

[Shirakami_Kon]

13 minutes ago, Butterdoll said:

Nah, t6 MM is not that bad.

T5 Have it worst

 

Agree with that, I like playing tier 6 last months and I don't feel it's much of a problem even when facing tier 8 ships since there's not as much of them as before and T6 ships can still retaliate against a tier 8 unless you do something stupid, obviously.

 

Can't say anything about tier 5. I like playing tier 5 a lot, but that's because the only tier 5 ship I played for a while now is my Giulio Cesare. Now that's actually a little sealclubbing monster that can faceroll even tier 7 ships, so it doesn't even count and why I won't say anything about how tier 5 deals against tier 7 in general.

[Major_Damage225]

Had a game today in T10 where a tirpitz refused to play and said hes gonna exit but kept going on and on in chat how the game sux all game long 

But in a tirpitz you can do pretty well ina T10. 

[xxNihilanxx]

Wow the reading comprehension fail in this thread is laughable. The OP isn't complaining about being uptiered, he specifically states that, he is complaining that T8 is (nearly) always uptiered. It is.

 

Maybe those who play at prime time have a different experience but anyone who plays even remotely outside of prime-time will face T10 in 90-95% of matches. That is almost three times as often as the law of averages suggests it should happen. THAT is the problem. In our clan we even refer to T8 as T10 because we know that in all but the most freakish of occasions that is what tier we will be playing in when we choose a T8 ship.

 

People can speculate as to why it happens all they want, it is irrelevant, the OP is asking WG to change something to prevent this. Maybe consider the addition of battle-tier 11 - ie a setting that creates some matches as T9&10 only.

[Butterdoll]

1 hour ago, SHDRKN4792 said:

 

Agree with that, I like playing tier 6 last months and I don't feel it's much of a problem even when facing tier 8 ships since there's not as much of them as before and a T6 ships can still retaliate against a tier 8 unless you do something stupid, obviously.

 

Can't say anything about tier 5. I like playing tier 5 a lot, but that's because the only tier 5 ship I played for a while now is my Giulio Cesare. Now that's actually a little sealclubbing monster that can faceroll even tier 7 ships, so it doesn't even count and why I won't say anything about how tier 5 deals against tier 7 in general.

 

I did my t5 battles before the new MM.I only fought with my Konisberg recently against t7s.

I didn't find the MM between tiers very unbalanced  but the problem comes for the ships themselves.

T5 it's a transition level regarding technological advances (broadsiding vs guns mount in turrets, etc).

In t6s those changes  are consolidated and improved upon and they are must more capable ships overall, than t5s.

At least this is my take on it.

In fact, I think t6 ships are the best to now (where I am) I have much more confidence in them than on my t7 ships. (with an exception or two).

I am not more up tier  and I could be, because they simply don't convince me. While with one's are my workhorses, the backbone, with the others I feel the need to improve them and their captains, before I can release them in random battles.

I don't know if this makes sense to you.

Plus the t7 and t8 ships that I had sunk already with t6s, some of them sunk in brawling fights, the first one t8 I remember was an Akatsuki, I didn't find him, he found me, he jumped me, at first I thought that it was a Benson, than a cruiser.

After the brawl I was spent, no more combat effective, clearly not a BB but made as many damage as one. Only at the end I saw what I had caught, a dd. 

Maybe my t7 insecurity it's related by the fact that I sunk all the same ships I got in my port and more

But I'm a little baffled when I see Flamu and other  forum users  calling t7 the sweet spot because t6 suffers from unfavourable MM.

" I can't recommend any t6 right now because of the MM"

Well, it's not that unfavourable.

 

GC it's an entire different ball game, it's a juggernaut, I've seen them doing exactly that, he's a wolf in a sheep clothing, handle with extreme caution.   

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Infiriel]

20 minut temu, xxNihilanxx napisał:

Wow the reading comprehension fail in this thread is laughable. The OP isn't complaining about being uptiered, he specifically states that, he is complaining that T8 is (nearly) always uptiered. It is.

This

Have fun playing your T8 cruisers vs Yamatos, i dare you.

 

It`s funny that WG actually had THE SAME PROBLEM in world of tanks, and they solved it by making limits on top tier tanks in a game (T10 in this case). This solution works pretty damn good there so why not apply it to WoWs aswell?

[eliastion]

1 hour ago, SHDRKN4792 said:

 

I get what you're trying to say but I don't understand how of all tiers, tier 6 is a "sealclubbing tier". What's the worse that can happen at tier 6? A lot of players may consider tier 6 boring because of it being mid tier or maybe because of the fact that tier 6 ships in general are actually pretty well balanced. Yeah, sometimes I hear some people that argue that Arizona is "OP" for a tier 6 but if that'd be the worse problem of WOWS I'd be crying of joy compared to what happens in other tiers with certain premiums.

 

Tier 6 really had a similar situation to tier 8 now and nowadays it's somehow solved and any complain about it was a valid one at the time and I don't see how any of them should have been disregarded "because of sealclubbing" at tier 6.

 

Returning to topic though, this has now remembered me that if I remember well this situation of T8 being uptiered a lot kinda began shortly after the T6 problem being solved, right? So... (TINFOIL HAT MODE ACTIVATED!) maybe it has something to do about it? Maybe MM was tweaked so T6 face T8 less which led to T8 being uptiered more because of that too? 

I'm not saying that t6 is some super-sealclubbing tier (unless you're talking CVs, of course - the first tier with manual drops and strafes). Generally speaking, the lower you go, the more sealclubby things get. Tiers 1-2 are REALLY dirty, 3-4 pretty dirty still, 5-6 is borderline sealclubbing, t7 is "casual lower tier" and t8+ is the "proper" tier. Of course, different people have different standards, but the above seems to be the general perception.

 

As for MM problems, WG messed with low tier matchmaking, preventing t3 ships from seeing t5. This led to t5 struggling more (they couldn't get REAL top tier MM so their pool of potential partners/enemies became more top heavy (they could only see t4,5,6,7 ships so the average tier of their battles went up). This, on the other hand, meant that more of their top tier partners were pulled down, depriving t8 of some of their low tier partners - which, in turn, reduced the % of t8 ship games as top tier.

 

It's not as bad as some claim, I might add, but yes, there was a shift that made mm of t6 ships slightly better and that of t8s - a bit worse.

[Butterdoll]

5 minutes ago, Infiriel said:

This

Have fun playing your T8 cruisers vs Yamatos, i dare you.

 

It`s funny that WG actually had THE SAME PROBLEM in world of tanks, and they solved it by making limits on top tier tanks in a game (T10 in this case). This solution works pretty damn good there so why not apply it to WoWs aswell?

 

 

Quantity of players base it's one of the reasons

[xxNihilanxx]

24 minutes ago, Butterdoll said:

 

 

Quantity of players base it's one of the reasons

 

Low player numbers could, indeed, lead to longer queue times.

 

"If you are waiting too long in the queue try picking a different ship or choose a different tier."

[RenamedUser_92906789]

Again all the leet players with "its fine", "l2p", "deal with it" and so on ... funny as hell.

But when they are drawn into T10 with T8 ship ... or with T5 ship into T7 ... they all cry with me like little babies in TS.

1 hour ago, xxNihilanxx said:

Low player numbers could, indeed, lead to longer queue times.

Dont give me that crab ;)

With the amount of ships present in the game +-1 MM could work. More players - better MM. Better MM - less frustration.

Currently even in "prime time" MM is crab. It is being used for science - read: to balance WR closest to 50% as possible.

 

I understand that in some hours it might not be possible (5am, 10 am...) ... but most of the time it would - specially prime time.

 

Tin foil hat area again you say? Yeah, and it always will be, because we have no clue how the code looks.

Why else should there always be players with massive advantage or massive disadvantage? ..... For fun? Gimme a break.

 

As long as some of you guys defend +--2 MM there will be frustration in the game. And dont lie that you like it... cause you dont.

 

+-1 would work, but WG has no intention to implement it. But if they would, you would see that it would work. But its too big of a "leverage" for WG to manipulate MM.

[ColonelPete]

7 hours ago, _Caution_BraincellNr2 said:

Right, have to make a topic out of it..

 

I'm really getting sick of that horrible MM for tier 8. WG, please fix that horrible 'thing', i'm really tempted to just quit the battle, or just sell all my T8 ships. 90% of the battles i play in T8 ships are T10 battles. and though i don't mind being bottom tier, everyone has to be every now and then, this is way beyond the 'fun and engaging' part of the game. This has been going on for quite some time now, and really, DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT. please.. the difference between T10 and T8 ships is already way to big to be a fair fight in my opinion, certainly in cruisers. I know, 'L2P'.. and stuff like that. I'm not the best player out here, but i'm certainly not the only one facing this horrible stuff. I really like the T8 ships, they are among the most fun ships to play imo, but it's that MM that kills all the fun. I lost count of the times i was the only T8 ship in a battle, the other team did have a person that had the same bad luck, but i'm past believing this is just bad luck.

I'd love to hear if there is something to do about this, and IF WG is actually going to do that...

 

thanks for reading, and have a nice day.

Let me guess, there is no braincell nr 3.

 

Another one who does not get the difference of a Tier VIII in a match with 22 Tier X ships and a Tier VIII in a match with 2 Tier X ships...

 

 

So much for poor Tier VIII ship in Tier X battle:

https://replayswows.com/replay/16712#stats

[elblancogringo]

2 hours ago, xxNihilanxx said:

 

Low player numbers could, indeed, lead to longer queue times.

 

"If you are waiting too long in the queue try picking a different ship or choose a different tier."

let's hope that the steam community will make the player base grow which will solve the MM issues

right now, I guess nothing can be done about it.

[RenamedUser_92906789]

45 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

So much for poor Tier VIII ship in Tier X battle

 

I think my inner organs just shifted from all the "leetness".

[Ysterpyp]

42 minutes ago, nambr9 said:

 

I think my inner organs just shifted from all the "leetness".

Thats my ex gf reaction when i ask her to cuddle :P

 

#feelsgoodman

 

[Ysterpyp]

if(players > 20000) 

tierspread = 1 

else

tierspread = 2

 

some simple MM code logic ???? 

 

u like wg???