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elblancogringo

French BB captains, hybrid build?

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Dear battleship captains,

I've seen some videos about upcoming french BB line, and I have been thinking about how to spend skill points in my captain.

I like the gameplay of secondary builds, and even though some people would argue that any secondary build is sub-optimal at tier 9 and 10, I don't want to pass on that with French BB with their good fire chance.

I would like your opinion and comments on a hybrid captain build, the one I think could be fine with my play style and desire.

I indeed think that French BBs are a line where you have the opportunity to go in many different ways, hence the hybrid possibilities. How to spend the points in the best way to be a Jack of All Trades with at the same time good enough AA, survability and secondaries?

Here is the build I will probably do. Please note that I plan to use Jean Jacques Honoré, which is why I take EM and AR at tier 2.

Thoughts?

 

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Personally, I'd probably skip Expert Marksman (improved or not, France already has 36s base traverse, which is good enough for my taste) as well as Basics or Survivability (I have a hard time rating that skill for 3pts...), and grab either Fire Prevention or Concealment Expert instead (plus probably Priority Target because what else... much more useful than Prev Maintenance anyway on a BB because when do you have your engine or rudder incapacitated anyway... although admittedly I cant say much about the turrets on France yet so who knows...). Either of those skills will be huge boosts to your survivability, and in the case of Concealment also to your damage potential.

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I definitely want to experiment a bit. Especially with Alsace when I reach her.

 

PM, EM, AR, BFT, SI, AFT and MAA.

 

Boost AA to the max and see how other skills are gonna benefit secondaries.

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1st of all concealment is a thing you want to take pretty much always

 

Other than tahat - they have no armour, unless you plan to be a useless moron sniping from max range you'll need to invest in survivability

 

This is what I'm planing to go with, at least from what I've seen about them:

 

http://shipcomrade.com/captcalc/0100000010100000100001000100000119

 

Not yet sure for the last 2 to go into AR or HA, but seeing their lack of armour and at t8 & t10 having just 2 turrets you probably want your repair up as quick as you can.

 

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This is the build Ill be dying to try first. 

Ill also be trying to switch CE for FP, or both CE and EL for BoS and EM

 

My reasoning for skippinh AFT is that I habe both manual secondaries and MFCAAA for defensive purposes. Meaning secondaries will mostly carry their weight through shooting at DDs and I need to be able to shrug off as many planes when they attack me, something AFT doesnt do as well as MFCAAA. 

 

Other than that I have no issue giving up survivability skills on them as Ill be playing them mostly on flanks and good positions. This is because unlike lets say a Yamato or GK frenchies can move around much more freely, meaning I dont have to force myself to tank that much... Well its not like frenchies would be good at it anyways.

 

But I wont be using the unique commander on my BBs, using him on my cruisers seem like a much better idea.

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8 minutes ago, Affeks said:

But I wont be using the unique commander on my BBs, using him on my cruisers seem like a much better idea.

Why is that?

 

EM and AR comes in more handy on a BB than a CA/CL

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22 minutes ago, Ulvesnutepostei said:

Why is that?

 

EM and AR comes in more handy on a BB than a CA/CL

Henri has just a tiny bit too bad turret traverse, meaning if youre turning at full rudder the turrets cant always keep up. The upgraded EM should help overcome that theshold of faster turret traverse than ship turning, at least in some situations. Also in cruisers (especially french) you are constantly throwing your ship around and due to faster reload you constantly change targets, resulting in spending much more time traversing the turrets over the course of a match.

 

Also I find that high tier cruisers are better at staying alive on low HP. People might disagree, but I find that the speed and concealment that cruisers has makes it easier to survive and fire from behind islands or on preffered engagement ranges.

 

So while AR is debatable, I find that EM on BBs is highly overrated.

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4 minutes ago, Affeks said:

Henri has just a tiny bit too bad turret traverse, meaning if youre turning at full rudder the turrets cant always keep up. The upgraded EM should help overcome that theshold of faster turret traverse than ship turning, at least in some situations. Also in cruisers (especially french) you are constantly throwing your ship around and due to faster reload you constantly change targets, resulting in spending much more time traversing the turrets over the course of a match.

 

Also I find that high tier cruisers are better at staying alive on low HP. People might disagree, but I find that the speed and concealment that cruisers has makes it easier to survive and fire from behind islands or on preffered engagement ranges.

 

So while AR is debatable, I find that EM on BBs is highly overrated.

I usually boat around at a distance with my top tier french cruisers at full speed to harass as many enemies as possible with HE while our BBs takes them out with AP so imo EM and AR doesn't really compute in that style of play .... at closer range I definately see your point 

 

I will have to try a few things before making my mind if Gonorea will be a BB or cruiser captain ...

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2 hours ago, wilkatis_LV said:

1st of all concealment is a thing you want to take pretty much always

 

Other than tahat - they have no armour, unless you plan to be a useless moron sniping from max range you'll need to invest in survivability

 

This is what I'm planing to go with, at least from what I've seen about them:

 

http://shipcomrade.com/captcalc/0100000010100000100001000100000119

 

Not yet sure for the last 2 to go into AR or HA, but seeing their lack of armour and at t8 & t10 having just 2 turrets you probably want your repair up as quick as you can.

 

Why not trading EM for AR in your build? Tyrendian was saying that turret traverse is good at high tier?

So basically you don't want any point in secondaries or AA, you max out survability capacities. This is already what I do with all my BBs (except german ones) so I wanna try something new.

Thank you anyway.

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Just now, Ulvesnutepostei said:

I usually boat around at a distance with my top tier french cruisers at full speed to harass as many enemies as possible with HE while our BBs takes them out with AP so imo EM and AR doesn't really compute in that style of play .... at closer range I definately see your point 

 

I will have to try a few things before making my mind if Gonorea will be a BB or cruiser captain ...

Well for Charles or Sain Louis EM is a waste, but on Henri EM is more less a must. The insanely good AP means its a waste to spend the opening parts of tve match tickeling targets with HE. I likr to scoot over to a flank, create a crossfire and demolish cruiser broadsides. Ofc this means heavy maneuvering and tanking some incoming damage. Meaning I often spend the majority of matches at sub 50% HP.

 

Ofc this playstyle might not click with everyone, but if not the impact Henri has is way too low to carry matches.

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3 minutes ago, elblancogringo said:

Why not trading EM for AR in your build? Tyrendian was saying that turret traverse is good at high tier?

So basically you don't want any point in secondaries or AA, you max out survability capacities. This is already what I do with all my BBs (except german ones) so I wanna try something new.

Thank you anyway.

 It might be good but it's still a BB - I play far more aggressive then the average player and thus I value my ability to quickly switch between targets (or keep on target while maneuvering). Personal preference I guess.

 

That's pretty much what I already have on IJN and RN BBs, yeah. US are great for AA and Germans for secondaries - thus I have those there. But of course, feel free to experiment around (remember to take expert rear gunner on Richelli....whatever - it has many rear guns :Smile_trollface:)

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1 hour ago, Affeks said:

This is the build Ill be dying to try first. 

Ill also be trying to switch CE for FP, or both CE and EL for BoS and EM

 

My reasoning for skippinh AFT is that I habe both manual secondaries and MFCAAA for defensive purposes. Meaning secondaries will mostly carry their weight through shooting at DDs and I need to be able to shrug off as many planes when they attack me, something AFT doesnt do as well as MFCAAA. 

 

Other than that I have no issue giving up survivability skills on them as Ill be playing them mostly on flanks and good positions. This is because unlike lets say a Yamato or GK frenchies can move around much more freely, meaning I dont have to force myself to tank that much... Well its not like frenchies would be good at it anyways.

 

But I wont be using the unique commander on my BBs, using him on my cruisers seem like a much better idea.

with the AA suite the France has, I would probably take AFT over MAA even just for plane killing purposes alone, the benefit to Secondaries aside... You have a lot of damage invested in your medium-caliber aura, which at 4.5km base range benefits quite a bit from AFT.

 

27 minutes ago, wilkatis_LV said:

 It might be good but it's still a BB - I play far more aggressive then the average player and thus I value my ability to quickly switch between targets (or keep on target while maneuvering). Personal preference I guess.

 

oh, it's definitely a matter of preference. I am just used to and comfortable with that exact level of turret traverse from my German BBs (so yes, playing aggressively is a check on my end too)... to each their own, but I feel like AR will pretty much always give me more shells fired that getting the guns on target a little earlier with EM, and at the end of the day that's what both skills are there for: helping you spew out more shells at the enemy :cap_rambo:

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24 minutes ago, Tyrendian89 said:

with the AA suite the France has, I would probably take AFT over MAA even just for plane killing purposes alone, the benefit to Secondaries aside... You have a lot of damage invested in your medium-caliber aura, which at 4.5km base range benefits quite a bit from AFT.

Remember the dps aura for 5km and 5.2 km are still 160. So even on France the increase in dps is better than the few seconds extra inside the 4.5 km and 5.2 km aura.

 

Not to mention that Alsace gets 200 extra from MFCAAA, Gascogne benefits from MFCAAA and almost all of Dunkeks AA is in the 5.2 km aura.

 

Remember when a CV in top tiers go for you 1km is closed in by aircraft in a very short time and a lot of the time CV captains remaneuver within 5km to get a better drop angle, in which MFCAAA is much more valuable than extra range. Not to mention cyclones where planes are spotted well inside 4.5 km.

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How about this:

-Priority target( 1 point)-how many want a piece of you!

-Adrenaline rush( 2 points)-i take damage i shot even faster than before 

-Superintendent( 3 points)-more heals, speed boost.

-Advanced firing training( 4 points)-better range and it boosts AA as well 

-Manual control for secondary batteries( 4 points)-better dispersion

-Fire prevention( 4 points)-this will increase fire protection

Preventive maintenance( 1 point)- dont want to break your turrets 

 

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Well I guess this is kinda relevant now. 

AA builds are useless now so just skip all those, even for a secondary build I usually skip AFT now, at those ranges the damage is highly limited anyway.

 

This is what Ive been using lately for Jean Bart, Bourgogne and Gasscan. IFHE+manual secondaries is enough to make the 100mms secondaries deadly to DDs or 127mm secondaries put cruisers on a timer especially those that bounce the main guns with 27mm plating. 152mm guns on all these ships pen 32mm suddenly and provide noticable DPM in those bow on bow duels. 

 

I find Fire Prevention is hard to give up, but completely fine as none of these ships really want to tank HE spam anyway. Use islands and flanks to avoid most sustained fire, together with speed and pretty good concealment thats more than doable.

 

BoS is fine to give up as well. Having dmg con mod 2 and flag is enough for fire reduction.

 

With this build you die a bit faster, but you will suddenly find secondaries dealing considerable damage if the engagements are approached correctly. Chosing between aiming systems modification or secondary mod is an ongoing debate in my head. In the end I would recommend aiming sys, as 7.7 and 8.3km secondary range is enough most of the time and main guns will always be more important anyway.

 

Wouldnt recommend this build for Republique though, that ship's too big and not stealthy enough.

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On 2/26/2019 at 7:17 AM, gopher31 said:

Preventative maintenance is a must for those 381mm quad turrets.

Expert loader is more important imo. PM just reduces the chance of the guns being incapacitated, not permanently destroyed. Its nice, but EL takes the priority and PT is a good alternative to PM as well.

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