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charley_harman

Greek Ships

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who here would like to see the addition of Greek ships to World of Warships? i think having ships such as the RHN salamis, RHN elli and RHN Giorgios Averof would be great premium ships, as they are quite unique compared to other ships in the game

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After WG starts running out of ships, sure

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Let's see. In my entire fantree which covers pretty much the entire world, I have... 7 greek ships including one paper. That's... not much compared to many other larger and/or minor nations. Greeks don't really have the ships it takes to have a flavour of their own, be that unique, or make up even half a branch.
Maybe much later but certainly not that early on. Several nations deserve some sort of tree / premiums before Greece - and I'm not talking 'boiut Italy or stuff. More like, Spain, Netherland, Sweden for example. To quote only a few.

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5 minutes ago, LastButterfly said:

 More like, Spain, Netherland, Sweden and the Dutch,

I know the dutch are often times high on weed... but since when does that make them count double? it only makes them see double...

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2 minutes ago, Tyrendian89 said:

I know the dutch are often times high on weed... but since when does that make them count double? it only makes them see double...

 

I... Er... Well... Yeah. Let's just say that my stupidity has no bound. I'll correct that...

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I vaguely remember, the last time this was discussed, someone mentioned the notion of a pan-Europe and/or Mid East tree; that might not be a bad idea, provided you can live with a lack of consistent theme through the tiers.

My knowledge isn't good enough on the less obvious navies, but you could maybe have two trees even: northern Europe (NL, the various Scandinavian countries) and eastern Med (Greece, Turkey, maybe Israel et al)?

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The problem with the Greek Navy is that it has very few suitable ships. No dreadnought and the Averof has mixed main armament and is a protected cruiser. Beyond using some ex RN destroyers, there is very little that is usable. That does not demean the Greek Navy, but the game demands certain features and the requirements of the Greek Navy looked for different attributes.

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1 minute ago, Verblonde said:

I vaguely remember, the last time this was discussed, someone mentioned the notion of a pan-Europe and/or Mid East tree; that might not be a bad idea, provided you can live with a lack of consistent theme through the tiers.

My knowledge isn't good enough on the less obvious navies, but you could maybe have two trees even: northern Europe (NL, the various Scandinavian countries) and eastern Med (Greece, Turkey, maybe Israel et al)?

 

In fact, I personally have four trees of destroyers and two for cruisers.
The four DDs trees are as such :
-A Scandinavian one, dominated by Norway and Sweden with a hint of Denmark
-A North Ottoman one, with vessels from Greece, Turkey, and also one Yugoslavian, Romanian and Bulgarian
-A Continental Tree uniting Austria-Hungary, Poland and the Netherland
-An Iberian tree nigh full of Spanish but with one or two Portuguese vessels

As for cruisers, I combined the four geographical categories in two :
-A Norther Force of Swedish and Dutch light cruisers, with a Polish and Austro-Hungarian too
-A Mediterranean Force mainly made of Spanish cruisers, but withs a few from Greece and Turkey, with the branch switching from light to heavy at tier 6

 

I couldn't complete a decent battleship tree without going into too invented designs, but for sure only one branch of BBs can be made in the whole Europe - though lower tiers have a couple choices.

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9 hours ago, LastButterfly said:

 


-A North Ottoman one, with vessels from Greece, Turkey, and also one Yugoslavian, Romanian and Bulgarian

 

North Ottoman? What do you mean?

And would be a rather bad idea to include Greek ships in that, sentiments still run pretty high.

It would look as ridiculous as Chinese and Taiwanese ships in the same tech tree / with the same dragon flag.

Oh wait, Pan Asians, no you didnt WG....

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1 hour ago, tank276 said:

It would look as ridiculous as Chinese and Taiwanese ships in the same tech tree / with the same dragon flag.

Oh wait, Pan Asians, no you didnt WG....

 

They should have used a panda flag...

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3 hours ago, LastButterfly said:

 

...[snip]...

If you mixed these with South American nations - so a 'Rest of the World' type tree, you would get some capital ships and also the possibility of CV's...?

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5 hours ago, charley_harman said:

who here would like to see the addition of Greek ships to World of Warships? i think having ships such as the RHN salamis, RHN elli and RHN Giorgios Averof would be great premium ships, as they are quite unique compared to other ships in the game

I'd love to see the Georgios Averof in the game but unfortunately Wargaming has unequivocally stated that armoured cruisers, of which the Georgios Averof is the very last remaining one in the world, will not be introduced into World Of Warships because it has mixed calibre primary batteries which Wargaming has decided against being player controlled which would mean it would have two 2 x 9.2 inch guns turrets that is player controlled rather than two 2 x 9.2 inch guns and four 2 x 7.5 inch guns turrrets. Wargaming only wants players to be able to control one type of battery so pre dreadnought battleships, with the sole exception of the HIJMS Mikasa, and armoured cruisers will never be introduced into WoWS ever.

I lament the decision not to include armoured cruisers but Wargaming wanted the game to be super stupid simple and dumbed down to the point where all the players have to do is to poin the curser at enemy ships and press the left mouse button so anything that resemble reality is banned from the game.

What I am trying to say is that Wargaming will never introduce the Georgis Averof no matter that she is a magnificent ship and will most likely not introduce the Hellenic Navy bar a few premium ships.

Just one of the reasons that made me quit the game but not quitting complaining about it.

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5 hours ago, charley_harman said:

who here would like to see the addition of Greek ships to World of Warships? i think having ships such as the RHN salamis, RHN elli and RHN Giorgios Averof would be great premium ships, as they are quite unique compared to other ships in the game

 

i would like to see RHN pepperoni. :Smile_trollface:

 

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Both Greece and Turkey have enough number of destroyers bought from countries like US, UK, Italy and France to make whole DD trees for theirselves. Though their only iconic ships are Battlecruiser Yavuz(ex-SMS Goeben) and Protected Cruiser Giorgios Averof. Tier4 and tier3 material precisely.

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I'd like a Swedish tree. With or without other Scandinavian or Baltic countries involved. There are some interesting ships there, like an aviation cruiser (Gotland), and the coastal defence ships (which essentially were small battleships designed down to work in shallow waters).

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They should take Błyskawica and change the "nation" to Pan-European-Minor-Nations.  Then they could bring out all sorts of ships. No disrespect to the Poles intended.

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6 hours ago, tank276 said:

North Ottoman? What do you mean?

And would be a rather bad idea to include Greek ships in that, sentimenst still run pretty high.

It would look as ridiculous as Chinese and Taiwanese ships in the same tech tree / with the same dragon flag.

Oh wait, Pan Asians, no you didnt WG....

 

This is just a temporary name describing the general geographical region covered by this branch - the big Greece/Slovenia/Romania triangle plus Turkey.

 

4 hours ago, philjd said:

If you mixed these with South American nations - so a 'Rest of the World' type tree, you would get some capital ships and also the possibility of CV's...?

 

South Americans have in my own little world their own little tree of destroyers, which I am very happy of. For cruisers, I paired South-America and Asia/SEA together.
I have a 'rest of the world" branch for destroyers which covers nations not present in any other branch.

 

For capital ships, the problem is no atter what you pair together no minor nation has BB capable of tier VIII or above - even with paper. If you search far and wide you CAN find a tier VIII for, like, Spain, maybe. But that's about it. South America is like everywhere else : low tier BBs are extremely easy. Past tier 6/7 it becomes impossible no matter wha you pair them with.

 

I think I have an experimental carrier branch of minor nations all together but it stops at T VIII.

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There is (IMHO) a very liable DD line, let's call it Adriatic line, combined of AU and Yugoslav DDs:

 

T II -  Tatra 

T III    Husar

T IV    Durmitor Class (Ariete)

T V     Triglav (Cyclone - already in game)

T VI    Beograd

T VII   Kotor (W-Vlass)

T VIII  Dubrovnik

T IX    Split (As designed)

T X     Split (As finished)

 

Regards!

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I think premiums is the way to go for nations unsuitable for a whole branch. Mixing nations that have not always been very friendly doesnt seem too wise.

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so far i didnt figure out or heard any reasonable suggestion how to balance armored cruisers which is averof (guys, averof is not protected cruiser). they belong to tier 2 - 3 and are something between cruiser and battleship (somewhat predecesors of battlecruisers) ...but the big problem is their mixed-caliber armament

 

Elli would be very anemic cruiser even for tier 1

 

Salamis is only reasonable candidate for premium right now - t4 battleship

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1 hour ago, Zen71_sniper said:

There is (IMHO) a very liable DD line, let's call it Adriatic line, combined of AU and Yugoslav DDs:

 

T II -  Tatra 

T III    Husar

T IV    Durmitor Class (Ariete)

T V     Triglav (Cyclone - already in game)

T VI    Beograd

T VII   Kotor (W-Vlass)

T VIII  Dubrovnik

T IX    Split (As designed)

T X     Split (As finished)

 

Regards!

 

I have a couple objections on these
First, Ariete/Durmitor - same stuff - hardly belong above tier II, at MOST III. It's fairly slow, with hardly any gun power, it only has old 450mm torpedoes, and most of all, it displaces less than 900t. This thing'll be an underarmed one-shot kill. It's a torpedo boat, if you want it in a line, TII is the most I see.


Trigvlav is even worse, in fact, you're confusing the French destroyer Cyclone from the Bourrasque class with the Italian Ciclon-class torpedo boat. It's even slower than Ariete - 26kn -, it has only 4 tubes compared to 6, and has virtually the same firepower - absolutely none.  Its only advantage on Ariete is that it displaces 1100t, which still makes it a one or two shot kills, for anyother stats virtually worse. I don't even think it belongs to TII.

 

Dubrovnik is in my opinion too high, and so is Split. The 140mm Skoda wasn't that great a gun, and these ships didn't have much other advantage than their high caliber. Sure, when you look at Split, she was all rounded, with good torpds, decent firepower and good hull and speed, but overall, she hardly goes anywhere above TVIII, mainly because she just lacks what it takes to tackle the higher tier ships.

 

Split "as finished" thus I guess you mean the American version, is slow as hell - 33kn max - with only 4 guns, the same as on Fletcher. She only carries one quintuple tube, and her only really good stat should be her AA power. Virtually, she has worse guns, torpedoes, manoeuverability and speed than Fletcher. I don't think any variant of Split is good enough to fit above TVIII, even the Spalato one. Maybe - just maybe - could Spalato be a TIX, and yet, it's stretching a lot.

 

I had a hard time finding Huszar. Once again, it's a slow as hell, extremely underarmed ship. She couldn't even fit at tier I, with her single 66m and only 2 450mm, she's virtually far worse than Tatra which is no higher than TII material.

 

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11 hours ago, triumphgt6 said:

The problem with the Greek Navy is that it has very few suitable ships. No dreadnought and the Averof has mixed main armament and is a protected cruiser. Beyond using some ex RN destroyers, there is very little that is usable. That does not demean the Greek Navy, but the game demands certain features and the requirements of the Greek Navy looked for different attributes.

The Greeks did order a BB from Germany, with 14" guns supplied from the United States. It was uncompleted because of WW1. The guns and turrets were sold to the British and used on monitors.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_battleship_Salamis

 

Also a potential German premium ship.

 

The Greeks also ordered Vasilefs Konstantinos ( built to the same design as the French Bretagne class) from France. It was also uncompleted because of the war.

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12 hours ago, domen3 said:

After WG starts running out of ships, sure

Which will (except for paper designs) be in another 2 or 3 years (at least as far as BB's).

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