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The overbuffing of BBs

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6 hours ago, principat121 said:

In the holy trinity of MMOs, why are in general DamageDealers way more present then Tanks or Healers?

 

So where do BB sit in the trinity?  Are they:

  • damage dealers (they do the most damage);
  • tanks (they have the most armour and hit points);
  • healers (being the only class with universal access to the repair party)?

On the face of it this game combines all 3 classes into BB then leaves CA/DD as what exactly?  And if this is the case what is the point of comparing this game to any other game that does have clearly defined classes.

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36 minutes ago, Capra76 said:

 

So where do BB sit in the trinity?  Are they:

  • damage dealers (they do the most damage);
  • tanks (they have the most armour and hit points);
  • healers (being the only class with universal access to the repair party)?

On the face of it this game combines all 3 classes into BB then leaves CA/DD as what exactly?  And if this is the case what is the point of comparing this game to any other game that does have clearly defined classes.

 

I even had a stealth-build Iowa once. About 12.9k detection range. I once 1v5 BBs, hard-angled, (though some were just T8 Tirpitzes) using that build, as they were permaspotted and no one dared advance because they couldn't see who I was aiming at, and whoever I fired at would get hurt badly at that range. Also, I could just fire at them and stealth out again if they turned their turrets to face other targets, being a pain in the [edited]. I think I held a flank for a full 7-8 minutes that way.

 

Ye, when even BBs have stealth, there's not much left for the other classes.

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7 hours ago, principat121 said:

In the holy trinity of MMOs, why are in general DamageDealers way more present then Tanks or Healers? Are DD overbuffed? No, they (and their gameplay) are just more player-friendly than the other two classes. The same applies for BB in WoWs.

 

That Holy Trinity works on the basis that the best armoured classes that can take the damage get up front and actively tank while taunting to attract and absorb the damage and the healers keep them going, that isn't even marginally the case in WoWs. BB's frequently (almost exclusively in fact) snipe from the back, refuse the tanking job and leave the lighter classes to act as damage pinatas while doing massive damage to any light ships they see. The only way that BB's could be made to "tank" is by cutting their effective gun range by 75%, but not only would that be silly it would be utterly unrealistic.

 

The MMO Holy Trinity model doesn't even come close to WoWs as if nothing else in an MMO situation the tanks are the rare classes, where as in WoWs the BB's are typically the most numerous in any team.

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1 hour ago, ForlornSailor said:

No you are not... I play US BB & RN BB and im often undetected. Usualy, when I want to, I can be. Oh ye, and im not "that guy on A10".

Entirely dependes on playstyle.

 

2 hours ago, Captain_Strawberry said:

Closest I could find (I think it's the right gun... maybe)

Yes,It is an MG-3.

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8 hours ago, cpt_sparrow_jack said:

this has to do with your overall opinion about how to counter the bbs..i read all your posts

 

Doesnt matter what my other posts say, when i quote someone who uses an arguement which is none at all. CVs cant be a real counter to BBs since there is not a CV in every game. He cant use himself as an example when he plays CV. He is not every CV in every match. And this becomes more true when he uses a T10 CV, since there is no tier above it. A Midway can deal better with T10 BBs than a Lexington can f.e. Also with the AA some BBs have they cant be countered by a CV properly. Doesnt matter that IJN have worse AA than other nations, because there are so many different nations out there by now, u might get games with only German and US BBs.

 

 

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5 minutes ago, DFens_666 said:

 

Doesnt matter what my other posts say, when i quote someone who uses an arguement which is none at all. CVs cant be a real counter to BBs since there is not a CV in every game. He cant use himself as an example when he plays CV. He is not every CV in every match. And this becomes more true when he uses a T10 CV, since there is no tier above it. A Midway can deal better with T10 BBs than a Lexington can f.e. Also with the AA some BBs have they cant be countered by a CV properly. Doesnt matter that IJN have worse AA than other nations, because there are so many different nations out there by now, u might get games with only German and US BBs.

 

 

yes whatever the thing is that i told u that was for your overall opinion about bbs and was in the same thread so..i cant quote to every post of u..i have better to play the game instead be a forum warior like u

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1 minute ago, cpt_sparrow_jack said:

be a forum warior like u

 

Litereally took you 5 minutes to reply to my first post of the day... :cap_old: Another one with flawed perception :cap_haloween:

 

2 minutes ago, cpt_sparrow_jack said:

i cant quote to every post of u

 

As i said - why is there a need for it? I even went on and explained in my last post why both your oppinions arent entirely correct in the current state of the game. Its nice that CVs are supposed to counter BBs, but how does it work out when there isnt a CV for x games?

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23 hours ago, DFens_666 said:

 

Litereally took you 5 minutes to reply to my first post of the day... :cap_old: Another one with flawed perception :cap_haloween:

 

 

As i said - why is there a need for it? I even went on and explained in my last post why both your oppinions arent entirely correct in the current state of the game. Its nice that CVs are supposed to counter BBs, but how does it work out when there isnt a CV for x games?

yea dude just play more battles and stop *edit in all threads of the forum..just that..

Edited by Jbnn
This post has been edited by the moderation team due to inappropriate remarks.
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No matter what buffs BBs get, the majority of their captains have no clue on how to actually be supportive for the team.  Either they rush die for no obvious reason or they camp and snipe from the longest possible distance leaving all brawling burden to destroyers and cruisers.

This is regardless of tier 1 or 10....

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23 hours ago, cpt_sparrow_jack said:

yea dude just play more battles and stop *edit in all threads of the forum..just that..

 

There are ppl that post valueable informations, help other players, participate in discussions - and there are ppl that only write useless off-topic stuff :)

 

Woeps, nearly classified for the last group. Well, anyway:

On 1/2/2018 at 7:08 AM, mariouus said:

Entirely dependes on playstyle.

 

Yes and no. I play german BBs also and there im not as often undetected. Still happens, when the enemy runs tho. My playstyle in the other nations BBs even seems very offensive, atleast, judging from the minimap. I´d like to have a german BB infront of me, which usualy doesnt happen (and they are in the game, just crusing behind me - most of the time). So if im already blinking or undetected from time to time - they must be aswell.

 

23 hours ago, tsounts said:

No matter what buffs BBs get, the majority of their captains have no clue on how to actually be supportive for the team.  Either they rush die for no obvious reason or they camp and snipe from the longest possible distance leaving all brawling burden to destroyers and cruisers.

 

Exactly this.

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43 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

There are ppl that post valueable informations, help other players, participate in discussions

but those people arent u and your friend ...u 2 get as as sport to Edited in all the threads of this forum ..u are noobs that acting like you know it all..rename your clan as forum wariors and give us a break.i cant take u serious if u have 280 battles in  bbs and u talk about themlike expert noob

Edited by Asklepi0s
This post has been edited by the moderation team due to inappropriate remarks

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44 minutes ago, cpt_sparrow_jack said:

but those people arent u and your friend ...u 2 get as as sport to Edited in all the threads of this forum ..u are noobs that acting like you know it all..rename your clan as forum wariors and give us a break.i cant take u serious if u have 280 battles in  bbs and u talk about themlike expert noob

Edited 6 minutes ago by Asklepi0s
This post has been edited by the moderation team due to inappropriate remarks

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_forum

 

https://forum.worldofwarships.eu/announcement/3-world-of-warships-forum-rules/

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1 hour ago, tsounts said:

No matter what buffs BBs get, the majority of their captains have no clue on how to actually be supportive for the team.  Either they rush die for no obvious reason or they camp and snipe from the longest possible distance leaving all brawling burden to destroyers and cruisers.

This is regardless of tier 1 or 10....

100%, but. And its a big but. There are some good BB players out there. And when BB's gets buffs after buffs after indirect buffs, their potential DMG output is ridiculous. And its not like they only blap CL's. They blap everything. On top of that they are super tanky. I do not agree with that at all. Its fine that BBs should be stronk(That much is clear), but let them have atleast one weakness!!?

Lately my biggest fear when playing DD's is to get spotted and then shoot at by a BB. Who cares about radar CA's and low consealment CL's? Those are supposed to be scary, but its the ships you are supposed to counter that counter you.....!!...

Does not make any sense? I agree. :Smile_hiding:

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38 minutes ago, MortenTardo said:

100%, but. And its a big but. There are some good BB players out there. And when BB's gets buffs after buffs after indirect buffs, their potential DMG output is ridiculous. And its not like they only blap CL's. They blap everything. On top of that they are super tanky. I do not agree with that at all. Its fine that BBs should be stronk(That much is clear), but let them have atleast one weakness!!?

Lately my biggest fear when playing DD's is to get spotted and then shoot at by a BB. Who cares about radar CA's and low consealment CL's? Those are supposed to be scary, but its the ships you are supposed to counter that counter you.....!!...

Does not make any sense? I agree. :Smile_hiding:

Yep, I totally agree, besides I never asked for BBs to get buffed, I'm just complaining that the constant BB captains' whinning does not make them better players just messes up gamepley even more.

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2 hours ago, cpt_sparrow_jack said:

as i said forum warior...just confirmed..

 

If you have no argument beyond calling everyone a forum warrior, shut up and get out!

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20 hours ago, SovietFury43 said:

 

If you have no argument beyond calling everyone a forum warrior, shut up and get out!

once a *edit

Edited by Jbnn
This post has been edited by the moderation team due to inappropriate remarks.

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Not aiming at anyone, just saw that potato thing and couldn't resist.

mcds fries shutterstock.jpg

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Tirpitz HE penetration for 360-mmSpr.Gr. L/4.6 increased from 64mm to 95mm.

Tirpitz has 36 cm guns?

 

Also, while I'm not saying IJN DDs deserved getting torpedos nerfed (or still deserve it now that we have a line with super-stealthy high damage torps), if that nerf was a BB buff then the entire introduction of PA DDs would count as a nerf to all BBs, because apart from three German BBs, no other BB has hydro and even the Germans have theirs for a limited time. Obviously, trying to dodge deep water torpedos on detection is hard even on a non-hydro cruiser or DD, but the reverse is also true for the IJN DD nerf.

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The real problem here isn't that BB's are overbuffed.

 

The issue is the quality of the game player base.

 

BB's are by far the easiest class to play badly in and survive, whilst appearing to perform OK. You can make multiple mistakes in a BB and live to tell the tale, In cruisers and DD's you make one mistake and unless you are lucky ,you end up dying very quickly.

 

In a BB you can fail your way up the tiers learning very little as you go. In a DD or cruiser you either learn from your mistakes or have very long painful grinds to the next tier.

 

Most players don't really want to learn the way to play the ships properly, they want to get in a nice shiney high tier ship as quickly as possible and go kill other ships.

 

The BB is the easiest class to do this in. So what happens. You see many more BB's in game because most players cant play the other classes and survive.

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30 minutes ago, Riselotte said:

Tirpitz has 36 cm guns?

 

Also, while I'm not saying IJN DDs deserved getting torpedos nerfed (or still deserve it now that we have a line with super-stealthy high damage torps), if that nerf was a BB buff then the entire introduction of PA DDs would count as a nerf to all BBs, because apart from three German BBs, no other BB has hydro and even the Germans have theirs for a limited time. Obviously, trying to dodge deep water torpedos on detection is hard even on a non-hydro cruiser or DD, but the reverse is also true for the IJN DD nerf.

 

That would be a valid point except instead of implementing DW torps that couldn't hit light cruisers as originally hoped for they made it so they hit all cruisers who are more in the firing line than BB's in many situations. So not a nerf to BB's alone if you want to be sensible about the DW torps.

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18 minutes ago, Fat_Maniac said:

The real problem here isn't that BB's are overbuffed.

 

The issue is the quality of the game player base.

 

BB's are by far the easiest class to play badly in and survive, whilst appearing to perform OK. You can make multiple mistakes in a BB and live to tell the tale, In cruisers and DD's you make one mistake and unless you are lucky ,you end up dying very quickly.

 

In a BB you can fail your way up the tiers learning very little as you go. In a DD or cruiser you either learn from your mistakes or have very long painful grinds to the next tier.

 

Most players don't really want to learn the way to play the ships properly, they want to get in a nice shiney high tier ship as quickly as possible and go kill other ships.

 

The BB is the easiest class to do this in. So what happens. You see many more BB's in game because most players cant play the other classes and survive.

 

Isn't that the very definition of OP? 

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Defended the point almost alone against 4 enemy ships, last one left alive against a NC on about 20% hp and Shokaku. Shokaku fighters spot me (i think that was all he had left of his planes, the NC fires, i dodge most of the salvo, but one round hits my stern, and i hear that dreded, idiotic, fcking, god damn sound! Citadel hit! I am left on 2% hp.

 

BBs fair and balanced.

shot-18.01.02_17.07.30-0982.jpg

shot-18.01.02_17.10.03-0393.jpg

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12 minutes ago, SovietFury43 said:

 

Isn't that the very definition of OP? 

It could be, I'm not really sure.

I'd really like Wg to stop tweaking ships to try and balance them in the current meta, and actually fix the MM to give us more class balanced matches. If we were to ever get that then WG good go and start tweaking ships to make them competitive.

 

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