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wilkatis_LV

Explain this one to me

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Explain me this one, I really don't get it.

 

Bow on? Haha, citadel hit and deleted

Stern on? Haha, citadel hit and deleted

Bottom tier? Higher tier cruisers fighting each other 2...3 km outside your firing range.

Go closer? As soon as you open fire - closest target - instantly focused down - die within seconds

Stay where you are? End the game with a beautiful message "no battle performance". Hey, at least you were never spotted so you survived!

 

I could keep going on and on about this

 

What the hell is the point to play cruisers right now? Why would you ever pick a class where no matter what you do you are always at the disadvantage against everyone?

 

RN CLs are closest to any kind of exception for this - you at least can smoke up and have a better chance of engaging someone without getting shot. But it's just a "better chance". Still - the second you are spotted - you're basically dead.

 

What's the point to play them?

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31 minutes ago, wilkatis_LV said:

Explain me this one, I really don't get it.

 

Bow on? Haha, citadel hit and deleted

Stern on? Haha, citadel hit and deleted

Bottom tier? Higher tier cruisers fighting each other 2...3 km outside your firing range.

Go closer? As soon as you open fire - closest target - instantly focused down - die within seconds

Stay where you are? End the game with a beautiful message "no battle performance". Hey, at least you were never spotted so you survived!

 

I could keep going on and on about this

 

What the hell is the point to play cruisers right now? Why would you ever pick a class where no matter what you do you are always at the disadvantage against everyone?

 

RN CLs are closest to any kind of exception for this - you at least can smoke up and have a better chance of engaging someone without getting shot. But it's just a "better chance". Still - the second you are spotted - you're basically dead.

 

What's the point to play them?

Not so pesimistic, dude :). Play RN CLs - From tier VI (Leander) they are one of the strongest cruisers in tiers - but they are very very dependent on player's abilities and captain's skills (10 points is good minimum - you need CE for better concealment). They are glass cannons, but with punishing magic UK AP, smoke, great maneueverability, with strong torps & good AA and with magic heal. Look for hides behind islands, use smoke wisely, dance among incoming shells and enjoy one of the most fun branch of ships in a whole game!

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Faster shooting guns? More action? I love cruisers :fish_cute_2:

Id say angle with Cruisers like u angle against a Yamato... Then the armor might work for u if the enemy aims at your broadside. Show them some and turn in enough to bounce his shells, that usually works best. Nose in is usually bad because almost every Cruiser gets overmatched by the BBs. Same with kiting away.

 

Last one is a defeat, but what u gonna do with retard monkeys on your team... Every ship showing broadside, but when 4 out of 5 BBs never shoot because they obviously wanna killsteal only, then u cant win... Other than that, pretty fun matches atleast for me. (only last couple of days, and didnt play sooo much)

 

Playing BB however is frustrating to me - Cant take the RNG 0 hits 0 damage crap too long. Just today MIssouri 10-15km Scharnhorst Gneisenau FULL BROADSIDE.. 2 overpens, 1 pen 0 damage, no hit at all WUT?... too frustrating...

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While I didn’t like your comments on other recent posts I have to agree with you on this one. Cruisers are in a bad spot at the moment and I play them a lot less these days compared to - say - last year.  No big surprise ranked is BB and DD only pretty much. 

 

I would love to see WG giving them a distinct role - at the moment there is little point in playing them. Want versatile ships? Play BB. Want to go sneaky and (a little) more dynamic? Play DD.

 

The ideas are out there - yet nothing changed. It’s sad.

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18 minutes ago, wilkatis_LV said:

What's the point to play them?

 

I keep asking myself this question... and im a Cruiser main :/ Innitially, what I liked about them, is gone on many tiers. F.e. recently I unlocked Moskva. I waited almost a year to go there, cuz I pretty much knew, its not gonna be fun. And it hardly is. I dont understand why WG feels its ok to give Moskva worse or at best almost same concealment as BBs? Now someone will come with "Moskva is a BB with better relaod". Well, its not. It takes huge damage from everything, needs its captainskills for other things and cant deliver the same numbers in damage then a BB can in most situations.

 

18 minutes ago, wilkatis_LV said:

Bottom tier? Higher tier cruisers fighting each other 2...3 km outside your firing range.

 

This one is seriously hillarious. After WG put in the RN BBs i really think, they had no clue how gameplay looks like. Take Orion, spam Cruisers at 14-16 km, disable their Engine + rudder with HE = they are DEAD in the water without the possibility to even fire back. Everytime I do this, I really feel for that Player - it stinks, its nasty. AND above all - it promotes camping gameplay for BBs - which is so often critizised. Rightfully. But why shall I get to 10-11 km (if we stay with Orion) when I hit almost as good from 14-16 km? HE does the trick anyway.

 

What I like about Cruisers is: fast reload, option to go stealth, relocate fast, react to whats happening on the minimap, have torps, have accurate guns... Yea, some of those things dont apply to all cruisers, and there is already a problem. Also, I cant say it often enough - Give cruisers BOTH CONSUMABLES !!! DEF AA AND HYDRO !!! They need this to do their job... Ofc costs must be put in half.

 

7 minutes ago, 1MajorKoenig said:

Cruisers are in a bad spot at the moment and I play them a lot less these days compared to - say - last year.  

 

No wonder. I myself pretty much switched to RN Cruisers only. Their smoke + torps + low concleament make up for so many things which hurt cruisers right now... When I now see ships like Hipper or Kirov or Shorchs I ask myself right away: Why you guys do this to yourself? Played one last round Shorchs a few weeks ago, grinded it in 2016. No thanks man. Its horrible these days, nothing like it was a year ago...

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14 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

 

No wonder. I myself pretty much switched to RN Cruisers only. Their smoke + torps + low concleament make up for so many things which hurt cruisers right now... When I now see ships like Hipper or Kirov or Shorchs I ask myself right away: Why you guys do this to yourself? Played one last round Shorchs a few weeks ago, grinded it in 2016. No thanks man. Its horrible these days, nothing like it was a year ago...

pure and clear truth...

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The miserable existence for cruisers which throttles gameplay and encourages camping is almost entirely down to the excessive numbers of BB's in every game, it's very rare to see less than 5 BB's a side, I've had quite a few with 6 and even 7 at odd times of the day. The lack of cover in some maps especially at higher tiers is another reason cruisers are horrible to play.

Hard cap of 3 BB per game would make a massive difference even if the queue times increased for the BB obsessed by a minute or so which is a tiny price to pay.

 

Clan Wars proved how good the games are without the active threat of massive BB strikes from every angle and Ranked just puts that into stark contrast.

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4 minutes ago, BeauNidl3 said:

Hard cap of 3 BB per game would make a massive difference even if the queue times increased for the BB obsessed by a minute or so which is a tiny price to pay.

 

Actually who cares? Maybe they would play something else when the waiting time gets too long :Smile_teethhappy:

Its like win-win... But WG would only see profit melting when some ppl might quit the game or wont buy mighty Premium BB because takes too long to start a game.

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15 minutes ago, Max_Kammerer said:

Not so pesimistic, dude :). From tier VI (Leander) are RN CLs one of the strongest cruisers in tiers

Personally didn't like Leander, Fiji's great as long as she's not seen. Haven't bought the Edinburgh - she's a 8, so she'll meet 10s constantly, doesn't sound too fun. Atago I used to play a lot, these days I take her out just for some specific missions if I need to. Pepsi's great as top tier, usable as mid tier and beyond useless as bottom tier. Myokos - Atago is a better version of them, and I have Fiji for 7 - why would I play them. The french seem to be reasonable, but I'm getting through the low & mid tiers so quickly that I'm probably jsut missing most of the horror which I'll run into at 7 & 8. It's just... just no.

Oh, yeah, also russians and germans... Russians require IFHE up to t8, and as I carry the commanders through the line that would require me to retrain all the skills at some point - useless expenses. And Germans? Yeah, I'm not playing Nurnberg. I don't think I've seen any other cruiser deleted as often as that one... No thank you.

 

16 minutes ago, DFens_666 said:

Faster shooting guns? More action? I love cruisers :fish_cute_2:

DDs? Stealthier, more mobile, much smaller target to hit. Not quite high health targets, but that high health helps cruisers only as much as it takes for BB to score 2...3 citadels in 1 salvo.

 

 

18 minutes ago, DFens_666 said:

Playing BB however is frustrating to me - Cant take the RNG 0 hits 0 damage crap too long. Just today MIssouri 10-15km Scharnhorst Gneisenau FULL BROADSIDE.. 2 overpens, 1 pen 0 damage, no hit at all WUT?... too frustrating...

Well, Scharn and Gneis are probably the 2 hardest BBs to hit bcuz of how low in the water they sit. There is almost no hull to go for.

Also I like the saying "if you can't hit you are too far away". Obviously RNG can have you enough for you to miss a flat broadside target at 5km, but that's just 1 in a 1000 shot (unless the RNG decides to be a d**k)

 

9 minutes ago, 1MajorKoenig said:

I would love to see WG giving them a distinct role - at the moment there is little point in playing them. Want versatile ships? Play BB. Want to go sneaky and (a little) more dynamic? Play DD.

 

I genuinely feel like cruiser is a failed cross-breeding of BBs and DDs. You are big, but squishy. You are mobile, but with a citadel. Your guns are right in the middle between both caliber trends. And so on

 

19 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

I dont understand why WG feels its ok to give Moskva worse or at best almost same concealment as BBs?

The Project 66 (Moskva) was what people would call a Battlecruiser... except for all the "balancing" she has like the weakest bow / stern of tier 10 cruisers, and that ridiculously high citadel. As a BB player I saw every Moskva in CB as nothing more than a damage farm, almost every hit would be a citadel

 

50 minutes ago, wilkatis_LV said:

Bottom tier? Higher tier cruisers fighting each other 2...3 km outside your firing range.

This one is probably what I myself see as the biggest problem.

Like, I'd like to think that I have a reasonably good understanding of what & how in the game works, so I can explain stuff to people. When someone asks me how to know what range you would normally fight - the answer is that it's determined by cruiser max range at that tier. Take 8 and 10 as examples. At 8 cruisers generally have firing range around 16km - pay attention to the elongated fights - most of them happen at those ranges. Cruisers can fire, BBs don't go any closer, only DDs are running somewhere in the middle. Now take a look at tier 10 - cruisers easily do 20km. And thus your "normal" fighting range for tier 10 battles is around 20km.

Now, what happens if you put a tier 8 cruiser with his 16km range into a battle where everyone's firing at 20km? Or an even better one - put Monarch with his 18km in there. "No battle performance"

 

16 minutes ago, BeauNidl3 said:

The miserable existence for cruisers which throttles gameplay and encourages camping is almost entirely down to the excessive numbers of BB's

I'm not talking about the number of cruiser played, or rather - lack of it, I'm talking about what's the point to even play cruisers? Even if you take away the part where BBs are good at killing them, most cruisers still are quite... umm, pathetic to be fair

 

18 minutes ago, BeauNidl3 said:

Clan Wars proved how good the games are without the active threat of massive BB strikes from every angle and Ranked just puts that into stark contrast.

I'm not sure how the games were on lower rankings as we (I mean TDM back then) flew through them quite quickly, I spent almost all of the CB time with TDM and ADRIA in Typhoon where I know quite a few people who wouldn't have said no to the ability to have 2nd BB in the team. Ranked is just a massive farce right now, overflown with clueless Depritzes, Bismarks, Kidds and Loyangs. And it also shows how "fun" and "enjoyable" it is when 5 of 7 ships are DDs.

 

17 minutes ago, DFens_666 said:

Actually who cares? Maybe they would play something else when the waiting time gets too long :Smile_teethhappy:

Exactly this. When the current draft system was introduced in League I remember people saying it's going to be horrible for mids as you'll have to wait for an hour in queue to maybe get a game (which initially they did :cap_haloween:) but soon enough other non-support roles got more popular as those players dispersed around.

 

Limiting BBs AND DDs to 4 per side (3 would be... "too much" if you know what I mean) would definitely be a good change.

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50 minutes ago, wilkatis_LV said:

What's the point to play them?

Winning games by making enemy BB's wasting their potential damage on you.

 

Apart from that much that has to be done to improve CA gameplay has already been mentioned here: Reduce number of BB per battle, make cruisers the swiss army knife they deserve to be (Def AA + Hydro/Radar) and give every damn T8 cruiser their much needed heals.

 

P.S.: Was about to buy a prem T8 cruiser over christmas but found exactly none worth buying. Already have the Takao, so Atago is more or less out of question, Prinz Eugen is too much of a carbon copy and also missing a decent gimick (smoke/heal) and Kutusov is not for sale atm. That's right people, currently you can't spent money on a decent T8 cruiser even if you wanted to.

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The point of Cruisers now seems to be to provide targets and easy xp for the World of Warships master race, the BB mains.

 

Used to be that Cruisers were needed to support the BBs and protect them against DDs and aircraft. That is no longer so, because most BBs can now perfectly well defend themselves against both, and are in some cases even better at killing DDs then Cruisers. Used to be that Cruisers were the only class of ships that had hydrophones and could spot DDs in smoke, but since the release of the German BB line WG started giving BBs Hydrophones and radar left and right, and now even other DDs.  

 

There is just simply no point in Cruisers any more. Even if you do good damage in a match, you just simply don't have the impact of a BB or DD. I played two ranked matches in the Atago, first match around 90k damage, last one left alive against 3 enemy BBs, defeat. Second match around 110k damage, again last one left, defeat. Jumped into the Kagero, two wins both around 50k damage. That's how much more a DD can influence the battle then a Cruiser, even a relatively well played Cruiser.

 

I have warned that this would happen a year ago. Because of the endless crap stream of BB buffs and nerfs to literally everything else, you now basically have a game where BBs are the only viable ship class (and only DDs still being somewhat useful).

 

I really loved this game back during and shortly after the beta. When it was still 5 ship classes mixing it up. Now i am forcing myself to play it. Why WG keeps listening to the idiot, strait sailing, whining BBabies i will never understand.  

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3 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:
  • Use Cover
  • Keep the closest enemy cruiser/BB at the edge of your firing range

 

Great! More passive gameplay! How fun!

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10 minutes ago, wilkatis_LV said:

And Germans? Yeah, I'm not playing Nurnberg. I don't think I've seen any other cruiser deleted as often as that one... No thank you.

Germans T8 and up are real heavy cruisers and are considerably tanky (as is Myoko T7 for example) in addition to having great firing ranges. Especially Roon does excel in kiting BB's due to the unique dual rear turret arrangement.

 

By the way I do use IFA on all my cruisers captains to good effect.

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4 minutes ago, SovietFury43 said:

 

Great! More passive gameplay! How fun!

It is not the job of cruisers to lead the charge.

You have to chose your battles carefully. If you are lowtier, you must be careful.

If you are toptier, your can play your cruiser more agressivly.

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6 minutes ago, wilkatis_LV said:

DDs? Stealthier, more mobile, much smaller target to hit. Not quite high health targets, but that high health helps cruisers only as much as it takes for BB to score 2...3 citadels in 1 salvo.

 

But in the end they play totaly different. With cruisers i mostly rely on my guns to deal damage, while DDs are better peashooters and rely on fire on top of that to deal damage. But still torps as primary armament (yes depends on nation).

In my few DD matches it might have happened that, after i fought off the enemy DD, i might not touch my guns anymore. Sometimes its enough to smoke your team (thx WG btw...), spot for them, spot torps, get caps to win a game. I rely more on my team to do stuff, and i help them with my stealth.

 

6 minutes ago, wilkatis_LV said:

Well, Scharn and Gneis are probably the 2 hardest BBs to hit bcuz of how low in the water they sit. There is almost no hull to go for.

Also I like the saying "if you can't hit you are too far away". Obviously RNG can have you enough for you to miss a flat broadside target at 5km, but that's just 1 in a 1000 shot (unless the RNG decides to be a d**k)

 

Ye but still i mean <15km ^^... full broadside wouldnt even evade. First salvo was 2 overpens in his superstructure, the rest went below and above. 2nd salvo just 1 pen 0 damage. 3rd salvo no hit at all. And they were all deadcenter coming down on him. But RNG says half falls short, and the other half goes too far... Missing shots at close range, yep nothing new there, happens frequently with my Bismarck. 1,9km Edinburgh out of smoke he had 15k health i basicly needed 5 hits i think... well nope, got 3 Hits LOL! Othes went just left and right. Full broadside BB at close range... nope they just fall into the water. Or lately Izumo full broadside at 6km when i surprised him. Front turrets 3 fall in the water below his turrets, 1 flies over him^^

Guess its just me then. On the other hand dealing 30-40k damage at 17-22km seems to be easier actually, only RNGesus knows why...

 

6 minutes ago, wilkatis_LV said:

This one is probably what I myself see as the biggest problem.

Like, I'd like to think that I have a reasonably good understanding of what & how in the game works, so I can explain stuff to people. When someone asks me how to know what range you would normally fight - the answer is that it's determined by cruiser max range at that tier. Take 8 and 10 as examples. At 8 cruisers generally have firing range around 16km - pay attention to the elongated fights - most of them happen at those ranges. Cruisers can fire, BBs don't go any closer, only DDs are running somewhere in the middle. Now take a look at tier 10 - cruisers easily do 20km. And thus your "normal" fighting range for tier 10 battles is around 20km.

Now, what happens if you put a tier 8 cruiser with his 16km range into a battle where everyone's firing at 20km? Or an even better one - put Monarch with his 18km in there. "No battle performance"

 

Also depends on playstyle id say, f.e. German Cruisers have only 17,8km range, but i rather go for Main battery mod then range mod, so my reload is 8,8sec. Flamu gave me a good idea, so i play hindenburg with spotter plane and spotter mod now, really pushed the damage once more. Also nice vs RN CLs in smoke behind rocks :cap_haloween:

 

6 minutes ago, wilkatis_LV said:

I'm not talking about the number of cruiser played, or rather - lack of it, I'm talking about what's the point to even play cruisers? Even if you take away the part where BBs are good at killing them, most cruisers still are quite... umm, pathetic to be fair

 

Well maybe some are, but not in general id say. question is how would hightier matches look like with lets say 7 Cruisers each side. Happens not that often (if ever), but on lowertiers it does happen sometimes. Usually less campy ofc.

 

 

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It remind me a video of Notser when the French cruisers were released.

 

To sum up the video he was talking about french cruiser vs USSR DD.

Back then I believed it was stupid to compare the two.

 

But now that I've unlocked kiev.... I understand him.

If it wasn't for the fire chance the KIEV would be flat out better than Charles martel.

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1 hour ago, wilkatis_LV said:

 ...cruisers suck...

ummm i think RN CL are the worst...german cruisers, soviet cruisers, and french and japanese middle to high tier are just awesome. I dont get why ppl complain. You got 4,073 battles and you still havent figured out what to do with your cruisers? I dont know how anyone can help you. But sometimes ppl just cant perform in some ships. Its a bich i know but thats life mate. You know "git gud" "learn to play"....and stuff...go watch youtube vids...watch flamu or jingles or flambass or...you'll definately find a channel you like. Go watch and learn what other ppl do to farm you so one day you'll be able to farm other ppl as well :cap_haloween: 

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2 minutes ago, Aethanos said:

ummm i think RN CL are the worst...german cruisers, soviet cruisers, and french and japanese middle to high tier are just awesome. I dont get why ppl complain. You got 4,073 battles and you still havent figured out what to do with your cruisers? I dont know how anyone can help you. But sometimes ppl just cant perform in some ships. Its a bich i know but thats life mate. You know "git gud" "learn to play"....and stuff...go watch youtube vids...watch flamu or jingles or flambass or...you'll definately find a channel you like. Go watch and learn what other ppl do to farm you so one day you'll be able to farm other ppl as well :cap_haloween: 

 

I wish BBabies could have taken that advice before they ruined the game. But i guess "L2P" applies only to Cruiser players.

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2 minutes ago, SovietFury43 said:

Great! More passive gameplay! How fun!

 

Dont take ContradictorPomPom serious, he leaves comments like this in every thread.

 

13 minutes ago, Ubertron_X said:

P.S.: Was about to buy a prem T8 cruiser over christmas but found exactly none worth buying. Already have the Takao, so Atago is more or less out of question, Prinz Eugen is too much of a carbon copy and also missing a decent gimick (smoke/heal) and Kutusov is not for sale atm. That's right people, currently you can't spent money on a decent T8 cruiser even if you wanted to.

 

Yea good that you saved that money. Atago is so powercreeped these days, you can sit behind an island and hope something is in range for you... Its a good pick if you want to do torpedomissions done tho. Just yolo from the spawn to the places, where the BBs usualy gather. Brought me the fastest 90k dmg every. Well and prolly the shortest round ever aswell.

 

16 minutes ago, Ubertron_X said:

and give every damn T8 cruiser their much needed heals.

 

So much this. Besides from that - I also never fully understood, why BBs shall have heal always and cruisers only on high tier? I mean, why cant every Cruiser have a heal....

19 minutes ago, wilkatis_LV said:

Pepsi's great as top tier, usable as mid tier and beyond useless as bottom tier.

 

Problem is, with the low playernumbers on high tier cruisers - T7+ Cruisers arent that often Toptier. Its true tho, when they are toptier, they perform a lot better. Even Chapayev can really shine and make a play when there are only T6 BBs. But thats once in a blue moon...

 

21 minutes ago, wilkatis_LV said:

The Project 66 (Moskva) was what people would call a Battlecruiser... except for all the "balancing" she has like the weakest bow / stern of tier 10 cruisers, and that ridiculously high citadel. As a BB player I saw every Moskva in CB as nothing more than a damage farm, almost every hit would be a citadel

 

Actually, I really wish we´d had a class like Battlecruisers in game. Seperate from the BBs. It would prolly be my class. But for that, we need clear cuts between Cruisers and BBs first. There are a ton of Battlecruisers (CB), that could fill the gap between CA und BB. Scharnhorst & Gneisenau should be rated as Battlecruisers, the US had the Alaska, which I´d love to see in the game. Moskva would be one, obviously, which would give the opportunity for a better end of the russian line - one, that would fit the gameplay from T6 to T8. CBs would have accuracy between Cruisers and BBs, lower Health then BBs but faster. Fast guns aswell. They would also be a a better counter for BBs thus fighting the overpopulation. But I think im dreaming too much... before that, we prolly see a 3rd line of russian DDs.

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1 minute ago, SovietFury43 said:

 

I wish BBabies could have taken that advice before they ruined the game. But i guess "L2P" applies only to Cruiser players.

I agree...but the cruisers can be "playmakers" in the right situation. BBs are stupid and slow anyway, dont expect much from them, lots of fire hp to farm. Cruisers and DDs are the ones that will make a battle epic. So L2P applies to them more, come on you know its more difficult to play cruisers...BBs are forgiving, cruisers can get a few shots and DDs are oneshot for everyone. The smaller the ships the more skill you need...carriers are a different thing though.

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29 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:
  • Use Cover
  • Keep the closest enemy cruiser/BB at the edge of your firing range

 

How exciting...

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1 hour ago, wilkatis_LV said:

Explain me this one, I really don't get it.

 

Bow on? Haha, citadel hit and deleted

Stern on? Haha, citadel hit and deleted

Bottom tier? Higher tier cruisers fighting each other 2...3 km outside your firing range.

Go closer? As soon as you open fire - closest target - instantly focused down - die within seconds

Stay where you are? End the game with a beautiful message "no battle performance". Hey, at least you were never spotted so you survived!

 

I could keep going on and on about this

 

What the hell is the point to play cruisers right now? Why would you ever pick a class where no matter what you do you are always at the disadvantage against everyone?

 

RN CLs are closest to any kind of exception for this - you at least can smoke up and have a better chance of engaging someone without getting shot. But it's just a "better chance". Still - the second you are spotted - you're basically dead.

 

What's the point to play them?

 

FwimXLl.png

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11 minutes ago, 1MajorKoenig said:

How exciting...

Not exciting but necessary on high tiers with those bloody maps.

 

And even then...

 

Just a zao game on okinawa. Enemy bbs all were more towards border than towards cap - 2 of them even started reversing from the beginning of the game. We had all caps, they still did jack sh*t. Over in 9 or so minutes, 70k or so damage.

 

And I've been having a lot of those in other ships as well, especially high tiers. BBs just stay at their max range, and what are you going to do in a cruiser, rush their spawn?

 

 

Masterrace has been given ultimate weaponry, and they do nothing with it, except turn every game in a boring snipe- and fapfest. And, of course, run away and cry for mommy once that first HE shell goes towards them.

 

 

I've been considering taking range mod on hinden & taking spotter on zao just to make sure... :(

 

45 minutes ago, Ubertron_X said:

and Kutusov is not for sale atm.


AFAIK, It will not come back. Which sucks for you, because it is the best cruiser at that tier and makes excellent credits.

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5 minutes ago, PzychoPanzer said:

ot exciting but necessary on high tiers with those bloody maps

 

That is what I said. In an ideal world cruiser WOULD be exciting!

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