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ThePurpleSmurf

I expect that the Pan-Asian DDs will change the gameplay to the worse

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I expect that the Pan-Asian DDs (PA DDs) will change the gameplay to the worse, especially at high tiers and here are some of the reasons.

 

  1. Deep water torps will only work against BBs, CV, some Cruisers. Some say DDs and Cruisers are safe, yet the official announcement mention repeatedly non-light Cruisers will be targets as well. I expect, that a lot of PA DD captains will ignore objectives even more than before and only go after BBs, because these DDs lost a very important tool against other DDs when it comes to contesting cap points, their torps to flush out enemy DDs from smoke screens.
  2. PA DD captains will overestimate the radar on these ships and think they are the ultimate DD hunter. However, the radar range is kinda short and the duration not very long and you have to give up the smoke consumable to get the radar. What i expect to see a lot is, that PA DDs yolo into caps and the enemy DD will smoke up. The PA DD will pop radar and open fire. This will get the PA DD spotted from inside the smoke for longer due to the gun firing concealment debuff than the radar will spot the DD in the smoke. Once the radar runs out, the PA DD can not use smoke to conceal himself and he will die quickly.
  3. PA DD using radar instead of smoke will die much more often than other DDs. They will be bad cap contester and if they go after BBs only, because of deep water torps, they will get caught out a lot by enemy DDs or catapult fighters and they will have no chance to use a defensive smoke to escape this situation.
  4. PA DDs will get allies killed. I think that quite a few PA DD captains will develop the habbit to torp from second row through smoke screens in which allied DDs or light cruisers sit. This can probably cause a panic reaction by the captain that torps heading his way and he accelerate out of the smoke which will get him spotted and perhaps killed.
  5. Deep water torps will confuse the heck out of players. The average player will have a hard time to distinguish the torp types, despite the tiny torp indicator (triangle vs circle over the torp in the water) and dodge deep water torps as DD/CL when it was not needed, which maybe make them vulnerable to other attacks or they think torps are deep water and they do not dodge at all, but then it appears they just got sunk by normal torps.
  6. Deep water torps in the hands of experienced players will probably be too powerful against BBs, that's why game changing buffs/nerfs will follow up and this could harm other ships/lines. For example, deep water torps are very hard to detect, so maybe the torp acquisistion will be buffed for BBs, which could have a negative impact on the spotting range of normal torps and they'll suffer from the same problem that IJN DDs have, with torps that can be spotted from outer space. From what i've read are the deep water torps the hardest hitting torps with the highest flooding chance. Perhaps this leads to torp belt buffs on BBs or improved flood protection and the normal torps will suffer from this.

 

This all is of course pure speculation, because i have never played a PA DD other than Lo Yang. I just saw some vids and streams with PA DDs, since the NDA was obviously lifted today, and this made me think about it a little bit. Maybe i'm wrong with my assumptions, but i really do believe that these DDs will have the potential to change the meta - unfortunately not to a better.

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As far as i know the DW Torps are class based atm that meas only DDs are safe.That info is from a CC that has acess to them,

 

Radar is as usefull as on RN CL . Your not in a div its useless ur in a div its usefull. Most normal player wont use anthing over smoke.

 

Second line torping isnt worth and with class based torps everyone knows ionly DDs are safe. Complaining about teamkills is as usefull as demanding BBs toch theirW key before the 1st frindly DD died in a cap.

 

DW dont confuse anybody. DDs are safe the rest is not.

 

DW torps are useless agist 99% of BBs because they wont get into DD infested waters anyway and Panasia have to get past your sides DDs to get to a BB, and on away course only teh T10 can hit a BB just like any other DD with 10km or less range Torps. Basically they are US Torps that hit cruisers more easylyunless you yolo around the mapboarder in hope of hiting a BB.

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3 minutes ago, Spellfire40 said:

DW dont confuse anybody. DDs are safe the rest is not.

They are technically safe, but they are not psychologically safe. A less experienced player WILL feel uncomfortable or even panic if torps head his way, no matter what type of torps. And as we know, the average player will probably not even read the patch notes and know what deep water torps are. This will cause panic reactions for some players for sure.

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Torpedo alert only triggers if the torps can hit you, so the amount of accidents from people being confused will probably be minimal. Most players don't have any situational awareness and would only know that torps were incoming from the alarm in the first place.

 

And if those players get killed then that is no huge loss anyway

I expect that at most these DDs will powercreep IJN DDs in their niche of dealing damage with torps and that is about it.

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16 minutes ago, ThePurpleSmurf said:

I expect that the Pan-Asian DDs (PA DDs) will change the gameplay to the worse, especially at high tiers and here are some of the reasons.

 

  1. Deep water torps will only work against BBs, CV, some Cruisers. Some say DDs and Cruisers are safe, yet the official announcement mention repeatedly non-light Cruisers will be targets as well. I expect, that a lot of PA DD captains will ignore objectives even more than before and only go after BBs, because these DDs lost a very important tool against other DDs when it comes to contesting cap points, their torps to flush out enemy DDs from smoke screens.
  2. PA DD captains will overestimate the radar on these ships and think they are the ultimate DD hunter. However, the radar range is kinda short and the duration not very long and you have to give up the smoke consumable to get the radar. What i expect to see a lot is, that PA DDs yolo into caps and the enemy DD will smoke up. The PA DD will pop radar and open fire. This will get the PA DD spotted from inside the smoke for longer due to the gun firing concealment debuff than the radar will spot the DD in the smoke. Once the radar runs out, the PA DD can not use smoke to conceal himself and he will die quickly.
  3. PA DD using radar instead of smoke will die much more often than other DDs. They will be bad cap contester and if they go after BBs only, because of deep water torps, they will get caught out a lot by enemy DDs or catapult fighters and they will have no chance to use a defensive smoke to escape this situation.
  4. PA DDs will get allies killed. I think that quite a few PA DD captains will develop the habbit to torp from second row through smoke screens in which allied DDs or light cruisers sit. This can probably cause a panic reaction by the captain that torps heading his way and he accelerate out of the smoke which will get him spotted and perhaps killed.
  5. Deep water torps will confuse the heck out of players. The average player will have a hard time to distinguish the torp types, despite the tiny torp indicator (triangle vs circle over the torp in the water) and dodge deep water torps as DD/CL when it was not needed, which maybe make them vulnerable to other attacks or they think torps are deep water and they do not dodge at all, but then it appears they just got sunk by normal torps.
  6. Deep water torps in the hands of experienced players will probably be too powerful against BBs, that's why game changing buffs/nerfs will follow up and this could harm other ships/lines. For example, deep water torps are very hard to detect, so maybe the torp acquisistion will be buffed for BBs, which could have a negative impact on the spotting range of normal torps and they'll suffer from the same problem that IJN DDs have, with torps that can be spotted from outer space. From what i've read are the deep water torps the hardest hitting torps with the highest flooding chance. Perhaps this leads to torp belt buffs on BBs or improved flood protection and the normal torps will suffer from this.

 

This all is of course pure speculation, because i have never played a PA DD other than Lo Yang. I just saw some vids and streams with PA DDs, since the NDA was obviously lifted today, and this made me think about it a little bit. Maybe i'm wrong with my assumptions, but i really do believe that these DDs will have the potential to change the meta - unfortunately not to a better.

 

Or

the dds, at last, becomes a relieve force, for the rest of the fleet, instead of just going exclusive capping or spot, they can spot in the 1 phase and second phase fight along side with cruisers and bbs, taking advantage of the already engaged  red ships, they still can do late caps, Laying slightly back and at the same time making easier for cruisers to protecting them. Not to speak in the important role they might play of equalizing the bb portion per game.

Other ships can also detect other dds in smoke, a dd can do a support role for a cruiser or a bb instead of taking point.

It's not that the current dd's can't do that  already, but if that helps, let's see.

 

This is also speculation, a more positive POV than yours, but most probable, will happen something in the middle.

   

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I can see this scenario being repeated a thousand times across the various WoWS servers...

 

A BB sees DWT, notices they go under other ships and they nuke him.

 

Said BB gets the fear and never goes into effective range ever again, destined to lurk around the map edges.

 

:cap_like:

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I only see DW torps pushing Cruisers further back. I mean, those torps wreck BBs. imagine how it is to take them when in cruisers. If you are unlucky and take one IJN torp now, half your HP is gone. Only with DW torps, they are much harder to spot. 

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Tier 10 smokes are nuts on the PA DD. Much shorter duration (70s) than US DDs, but they have 6 charges (premium and SI) and the cooldown is only 80 seconds.

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4 hours ago, MortenTardo said:

I only see DW torps pushing Cruisers further back. I mean, those torps wreck BBs. imagine how it is to take them when in cruisers. If you are unlucky and take one IJN torp now, half your HP is gone. Only with DW torps, they are much harder to spot. 

These torps do same damage as average ones, its not a gimmic, just stealthier. On the other note, GZ at this point has DW torps that dont hit cruisers like Hindenburg. So this is yet to be seen how they play out, as we know how things can change 5 min till reliece...

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4 hours ago, Negativvv said:

I can see this scenario being repeated a thousand times across the various WoWS servers...

 

A BB sees DWT, notices they go under other ships and they nuke him.

 

Said BB gets the fear and never goes into effective range ever again, destined to lurk around the map edges.

 

:cap_like:

 

Love your humor!!!!!! :fish_cute_2:

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28 minutes ago, ImperialAdmiral said:

Just imagine all those people typing "HACKER" when their torps go beneath dds without any hits.

 

Yep, give it a few hours after patch for the first 'hacker' thread. :Smile_Default:

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As I see it it seems more or less yet another DD line. With handicapped torpedoes. Have to try it out myself of course but as of now I don't see value in DWT over regular ones.

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10 minutes ago, Ferry_25 said:

As I see it it seems more or less yet another DD line. With handicapped torpedoes. Have to try it out myself of course but as of now I don't see value in DWT over regular ones.

The DWT will cause some memorable moments for sure. I've watched some streams from NA where CCs played these ships. Oh boy did they curse when they send out torps at BBs behind caps and all of the sudden an enemy DD ran randomly right into the torps and with normal torps the DD would be dead, but he survived and spotted for the BBs behind them. Torps wasted, no damage dealt, didn't get the DD kill and a portion frustration on top of it. :cap_like:

Exactly this is why i see more negative impact on the game than positive things. But we'll see when they are released. The bigest strength i have seen so far is their smoke. It blooms long, it has an okay duration but it reload super quick and you get 6 charges with SI and premium consumables. The radar looked pretty useless so far.

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5 hours ago, Negativvv said:

I can see this scenario being repeated a thousand times across the various WoWS servers...

 

A BB sees DWT, notices they go under other ships and they nuke him.

 

Said BB gets the fear and never goes into effective range ever again, destined to lurk around the map edges.

 

:cap_like:

 

Inb4 "I used a DD as torpedoe shield but they still hit me" threads. :Smile_teethhappy:

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Gameplay is dead already. WG has no clue how to fix it.

 

It can change to the worse. It is ok for me. I already have no hope at all.

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43 minutes ago, Tungstonid said:

 

Inb4 "I used a DD as torpedoe shield but they still hit me" threads. :Smile_teethhappy:

nice catch! that shouldn't happen though as the ships that are sinking should sit deeper in water obviously. Should produce some confusion indeed. :cap_haloween:

 

Nice Escaflowne avatar btw.! i never noticed because i never really looked (read) at it. :Smile_teethhappy:

 

On topic at op:

point 6..... Really? You are suggesting BB buffs already?

The whole point of those Torpedos where to invent a weapon against BBs! (which is a failure because it actualy punishes cruisers more)

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I said this in my own thread awhile back but can someone tell me why DWP are a positive addition to the meta?  

 

It simply punishes those few brave BB who actually fight with their smaller allies and it only increases the potatoes to camp even further back.

 

None of those delicious random DD kills with DWP either.

 

I struggle to see anything that's positive about them.

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Well I wouldn't want to be that pessimistic @P4RDUS.

 

The potatoe in me is getting, ever so slightly slow, somewhat warmer and I've found out the most important role of the DD is to scout. I'm playing them torpedo focussed and torping alone for the damage harvesting will miss me a lot of potential. It's the mind game I'm fond of. Not launching torps can be as devastating for the reds' morale. Especially BB's are so terrified of torpedo's. I guess suffering from a very hurt ego when they were oneshot with a fistfull of them combined with the "superepic godlike YT players" saying you're a fool when that happens to you. Though indeed dealing massive damage a BB can survive one or 2 (detonation aside). When having some slight insight of the game, it's in 99% brain.exe hack to figure out it's global position. Even without RPF. And yes: in the rest of the 1% cases I'm vaught with my pants down and seeing the fish with the "next match sign" flashing on them coming for me.

 

Now regarding the DWT. As I understand they are somewhat harder to detect but they can't hit DD's? I'm not sure where's the value lying in that. When I manage to get my second neuron firing (thus making use of 100% of brain capacity) I'll take evasive maneuvres regardless. Avoiding the whole bunch or getting away with 1 or 2 at most. (talking from BB/ CA POV). In the "pants caught down situation" I'll go down regardless of how deep the torps go. But with DWT I'll miss the opportunity to flush away smoke camping DD's. (A feat I'm proud to say I've only fallen for once).

 

Now I would see some value if the possibility would come to switch between them in battle. But as I see it now I'm having a neutral POV.

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39 minutes ago, P4RDUS said:

Gameplay is dead already. WG has no clue how to fix it.

 

It can change to the worse. It is ok for me. I already have no hope at all.

This. 

Stealth HE spamming BBS, camping BBS and cruiser....  Why not add more sillyness  to the game!? 

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5 minutes ago, Miessa3 said:

You are suggesting BB buffs already?

I frickin hate BBs and wish no more than that they nerf them to the ground. So no, i do not suggest that they buff BBs, but if these torps appear to be too strong, all the BBabies will start to cry until they get what they always want, more buffs, be it direct buffs or indirect buffs by nerfing other classes.

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5 minutes ago, ThePurpleSmurf said:

I frickin hate BBs and wish no more than that they nerf them to the ground. So no, i do not suggest that they buff BBs, but if these torps appear to be too strong, all the BBabies will start to cry until they get what they always want, more buffs, be it direct buffs or indirect buffs by nerfing other classes.

BBs are fine, Cruisers are fine,  destroyers are fine, carrier.....  Odd class balanced ... What you actually do here is to accuse one class of crying, yet you turn a bit to "crying your self at the end :Smile_hiding:.  

 

 

But you are right.  We'll see some confused posting by some BB captains when their straight ahead sailing BBS get blown out of the water. 

 

 

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Having watched Notsers video this morning on the train to work i quite like the look of the T10 Pan Asia. 

however i have concerns not on the ships themselves which to be honest look fun (i want the T7, cause N Class)
but its the detection on the deep water torps (0.8km)

how long before the BBabies complain and they get nerfed into the same detection as japanese?

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7 hours ago, Spellfire40 said:

 Basically they are US Torps that hit cruisers more easyly

 

this  is the fact why i do not like the idea of DW that hit cruisers.

torp hits are so damn punishing for cruisers already

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I remain skeptical about the general usefulness of DW torpedoes, and PA DDs in general, as well as somewhat fearful of how powerful they could be.

For me, it's wait and see.
I don't see them being played much, as restricting your choices of target is fundamentally against the very notion of a DD, both ingame and IRL, but we'll see.

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