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Update 0.6.13 - Balance Changes

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Hi guys,

 

Please post all feedback regarding the balance changes in Update 0.6.13 below.

 

Cheers,

Kandly

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The smoke change on the RN CLs was a step in the right decision. it will help many new players get comfortable playing the line. The frequent gliding out of smoke, a problem notorious for these ships, will be a thing of the past.

However this change does not mitigate the excessively large detection from smoke which weakened the ships previously. And while it improved the QoL of this line, more changes are needed to properly compensate them for the loss of effectiveness.

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Hello.
I just bought the Kidd and there is a big balancing problem on this ship with the torpedo charging time: it's similar to the Benson but has only one torpedo group (the Benson has two ).
Yet, the torpedo reload time is the same: 122 seconds.
This is not normal: the time should be halved (61 seconds) since it launches only 5 torpedoes unlike the Benson which launches 10.
Please send this info back to developers to change the Kidd torpedo reload time to 61 seconds.


Another solution could to define an intermediate reloading time:
Mathematically: the difference is 122 - 61 = 61.
We take the half: 31/2 = 15.5.
As a final recharge value: 61 + 15.5 = 76.5 seconds.
It is reasonable and sensible.
Please contact the developers to inform them of my request.

Thank you !

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On 9.11.2017 at 5:51 PM, Aragathor said:

The smoke change on the RN CLs was a step in the right decision.

Disagree.

I already explained some days ago, how this buff bwill backfire to "noobs", because good RN cruiser player will get even more impact with their ships.
Besides... making the game more "noobfriendly" is really the wrong way to go with this game. Yes RN cruisers have a high skill cap. But thats how these ships are balanced: Only a aggressive, but clever captain can unleash the true power of these ships (Minotaur can be real broken with a unicum player), and one small mistake can always be the end of any RN cruiser.

Also... i thought it was supposed to reduce the smoke meta and not increase them? Now even RN cruisers can give smoke to other allied cruisers, so even more ships will be allowed to smoke camp.


The possiblity in (unicum) divisions to carry games increased with this change. And who will suffer from this?
Exactly, the "new players".

My prediction:
The average performance of RN cruisers wont increase much, but strong players will get even higher numbers - especially in divisions.

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18 minutes ago, Terendir said:

Besides... making the game more "noobfriendly" is really the wrong way to go with this game.

 

Yes, let's make this game playable only by a self-defined elite of people, who can devote excessive amounts of time to master overly complicated mechanics.

Instead of, you know, making it accessible to an average player who might play only a few games every week.

 

I don't buy your argument. The change is good, but doesn't compensate for the smoke detection.

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15 hours ago, Aragathor said:

 

Yes, let's make this game playable only by a self-defined elite of people,

Triggered? Or why do you go semi-personal already?

 

Quote

who can devote excessive amounts of time to master overly complicated mechanics.

1st: RN CLs were always supposed to be hard to play. That hard punishment of mistakes on them is part of their balance.
2nd: How is pressing "S" and waiting until you are at half speed complicated mechanic? Seriously, thats one of the easiest parts of these ships. The only complicated things about there ships are positioning, map awareness, target priority and aiming.
 

Quote

I don't buy your argument. The change is good, but doesn't compensate for the smoke detection.

You know whats the main difference between "self-defined elite of people" and average/bad players is?

The "elite" tries to adapt and learn instead of crying for buffs because its "overly complicated".

Also very weak that you dont even have ONE point against my fact, that especially the unicum RN cruisers will stomp even harder now - especially in divisions.

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The change was presented as a Quality of Life change. I have tested it to see whether it makes RN CLs easier to utilize. It does, as the longer active time on the smoke generator prevents the ships from gliding out of their smoke.

Making all ship lines accessible to all players should be a goal of WG. And this change will help players to properly use the RN CLs to their full potential. The effectiveness of unicums in divisions won't be impacted, as they already adapted to all the smoke changes. And frankly, the game doesn't need to be balanced around them.

 

Your argument that this line should be hard to play is invalid, as WG has nerfed them very hard through the new smoke detection rules. Also the failure of WG to educate new and bad players, by not having any ingame information about ship lines and mechanics, is almost criminal or at least very disappointing. But since WG doesn't plan on properly educating new players, we should at least accept their attempts to help new players out.

 

I don't see the need to debate you, as this is a WG patch feedback thread. I have informed them about my subjective opinion about RN CL smoke duration change. You can do the same. But I am in no way required to spend my time trying to discuss it with you. I'd rather play the game.

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On 11.11.2017 at 9:55 PM, BlueManCa said:

Hello.
I just bought the Kidd and there is a big balancing problem on this ship with the torpedo charging time: it's similar to the Benson but has only one torpedo group (the Benson has two ).
Yet, the torpedo reload time is the same: 122 seconds.
This is not normal: the time should be halved (61 seconds) since it launches only 5 torpedoes unlike the Benson which launches 10.
Please send this info back to developers to change the Kidd torpedo reload time to 61 seconds.


Another solution could to define an intermediate reloading time:
Mathematically: the difference is 122 - 61 = 61.
We take the half: 31/2 = 15.5.
As a final recharge value: 61 + 15.5 = 76.5 seconds.
It is reasonable and sensible.
Please contact the developers to inform them of my request.

Thank you !

 

The torpedo reload time is always based on the number of torpedoes in the launcher, not the total amount of torpedoes. It is like this on all ships, not only the Kidd. So nope, they are not going to change that. Kidd has other strengths to compensate, just don't play it as torpedo boat.

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4 hours ago, Aragathor said:

Making all ship lines accessible to all players should be a goal of WG.

Says who? You?

Games that balanced for the weakest type of players are games like Call of Duty, games that were balanced around the competetive scene are games like Counter Strike or League of Legends. Do you know which one of these games have large E-sport scenes, are very famous to ALL kind of players (including beginners and simply weak players), and which one is seen as... well... child toy, that no one can take serious?

 

4 hours ago, Aragathor said:

And this change will help players to properly use the RN CLs to their full potential

Slowing down before popping smoke is not the key factor that makes a average RN cuiser player to a unicum one. The true deep gameplay aspects of these ships are - like i already said - positioning, map awareness, spotting, experience, aiming and priority targeting. If someone cant even handle the most easy aspect of these ships (the smoke), they wont handle the rest either. In other words: They will perform very badly with these ships, and the majority of players does. The RN cruisers are insanely strong and have huge impact on matches, since they are the only cruisers that can really go deep and support DDs on mid or even close combat.

 

Quote

The effectiveness of unicums in divisions won't be impacted, as they already adapted to all the smoke changes.

Complete nonsense. I already noticed the far more easier aspects of this change: 15 sec smoke launcher means more smoke area, that means iam WAY harder to get hit from torps or even be forced out of my smoke. I can camp even more, deal even more damage and iam even more safe than before. I would not be surprised if my Minotaur, Neptune and Leander Winrate will grow above 70% solo winrate now. But yea tell me more how this change dosent affect experienced players at all :fish_book:

 

Quote

And frankly, the game doesn't need to be balanced around them.

Every balance change that were made for weak players only made the game more weak. The gameplay performance of average players never improved with these changes, often the meta just got more and more passive over time. Thats one reason why the smoke mechanic was (finally) changed in the first place.

 

Quote

Your argument that this line should be hard to play is invalid

Listen up. Maybe you have some kind of Napoleon Complex, that would explain why you are thinking that your opinion is a neutral fact that everyone has to accept. But flash news: Your opinion is just your opinion and not the word of god.

Also: Its not MY argument that this line should be hard to play. This line was DESIGNED to be hard to play from Wargaming themself.

I did not made this up, this is what this line always was and still is, even with that longer smokelauncher.

 

Quote

as WG has nerfed them very hard through the new smoke detection rules.

"nerfed very hard" Oh boy. Oh boy. Oh boy. I dont even have words for this...

 

Quote

Also the failure of WG to educate new and bad players

"bad players" are bad because they dont care, and they will never care. No tutorial in this world will change this. But you can stay optimistic on this topic if you want, i'd like to belive in that too, but i wont rely on that.

 

4 hours ago, Aragathor said:

But I am in no way required to spend my time trying to discuss it with you.

Just ironic, that you were the one starting this argument in the first place. I just gave my (different) opinion to this balance change and it seems you felt attacked. Having a different opinion seems to trigger you so hard that you even had to semi-insult me in your very first line, instead of just accepting that someone has a different opinion. You dont have to agree but you have to accept it.
 

British cruisers didnt need this "buff" at all. Thats my opinion. Deal with it.


And if you dont believe me, just wait some months and keep an eye on the average stats of RN cruisers. Time will show who is right.

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On 12.11.2017 at 11:12 PM, Terendir said:

British cruisers didnt need this "buff" at all. Thats my opinion. Deal with it.

But it is nice to have. Or good to know someone who has it. yahoo.gif In this smoke i can undisturbed do evil torp-spewing with my DD or BB without notice. yahoo.gif

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