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PseudoMi

Giulio Cesare - the tier5 Nikolai ?

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Print screen from RU server (WR 58,6%) and NA server (WR 56%). Cesare's stats seems not yet indexed on EU server.

 

Far ahead of its competitors in WR and DMG.

 

Bear in mind that Nikolai's WR and reputation would be lower if same MM as Cesare's -1/+2.

GC.jpg

 

 


Update two days later :

After drooling at those beautiful stats I finally bought myself the Cesare.

Ten games later, 80% WR (lucky streak) and 81k avgDMG, I can say that I feel like Cesare is the proof that God exists and He loves me. Me being one of the laziest players, one of the most perspicacious BB whinner and the most eager to win a game by just pressing a button.

 

This cutie is a wonderwaffe. If you are skilled enough to don’t show broadside, then the deal (the win) is sealed : you dominate the game, with several exceptions, all related to who can overrun your crazy speed and have enough strike power to havoc you : Tier 6/7 CV and the Scharnies brothers.

 

You don’t care about DDs, this thing is a gazelle walking on the water. You easily smash them with your good dispersion once they get detected. With such a speed, you can even hunt them by suddenly turning toward their direction !

You don’t care about CAs. Sure, they can catch you up with their superior speed but your precise cannons will dissuade them, even angled, to maintain the chase. Most probably they will disengage and go find an easier victim elsewhere.

You don’t care about other BBs, as you can circle them, outplay them and harass them with your almost-cruiser speed, save the two Scharnie brothers who are your natural predator.

You don’t care about T4 and T5 CV as your AA is good enough. But you need to be careful with T6 CV (alt drop) and play as if you don’t have AA at all with a T7 CV.

 

Only T7 CV and two T7 BBs can stop the T5 Cesare to do whatever he wants. All the rest can be outplayed with that speed of 28,4 knots and good maneuverability at Tier 4-7.

 

One big surprise I had : even if the turrets are faster than anything else, this cutie turns so tightly that succeed to outturn its turrets ! The rudder response is average but when it finally turns, IT TURNS !

It is a little disturbing for a lazy BB player (pleonasm?) like me to suddenly switch for such a speedy ship : my biggest concern was about those islands which treacherously jump in front of you whenever you fall asleep or look outside your PC screen.

Overall Cesare allows one of the most relaxing games ever, as you can be sure that you can extract yourself from any hot situation - you just pack your toys up and leave.

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Look at stats of Texas how much fluctuation is possible with the same ship.

 

GC is a strong ship, but not that superior to the rest.

She is simillar, but better than Kongo.

Koenig is stronger than GC.

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GC when at T4 MM is an utter monster, nothing can live with her guns, speed or even armour.

 

 

T7 games not so much as plenty can just overmatch any angles you try to adopt.

 

I'm finding the guns are very accurate for the tier, they feel more like higher tier BB guns in that respect. Almost like a T5 Amagi.

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GC rewards a skilled hand owed to her speed, manueverability and accuracy. She doesn't handle focused fire though, she's too squishy for that. Thus I use her as a mid range ship allowing me to drop off detection and reposition if necessary before opening up again. Broadside cruisers die very fast to her, BB's get somewhat punished but at longer ranges I think she loses a LOT of penetration on her AP. Mid range is where she excels and heck you CAN brawl with her just be prepared to soak up damage on your way there unless you play SMART and use terrain etc to shield yourself and give you the advantage.

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29 minutes ago, Negativvv said:

GC when at T4 MM is an utter monster, nothing can live with her guns, speed or even armour.

 

Absolutly.

 

Also, looking at T5, the powercreep is very obvious. Who wants to play a New York these days? Even Kongo has dropped to the bottom of the stats, and if she wouldnt have the speed still going for here, she´d be as lost as the New York. Just think about the competitors introduced in the near past: Oktober, Iron Duke and Cesare.

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indeed, unlike nikolai she has one big downside - shes squishy and cant take much fire

 

anyway these stats are somewhat deceiving...hows that the texas is so much above new york? does the middle turret's firing arc make so much difference? or the aa?

or arp kongo vs regular kongo

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6 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

 

Absolutly.

 

Also, looking at T5, the powercreep is very obvious. Who wants to play a New York these days? Even Kongo has dropped to the bottom of the stats, and if she wouldnt have the speed still going for here, she´d be as lost as the New York. Just think about the competitors introduced in the near past: Oktober, Iron Duke and Cesare.

 

Kongo is still an AMAZING ship, I think powercreep isn't much of an issue for her. She's still the fastest, has the longest range and great accuracy compared to most of the competition. I played 10 games in Kongo to unlock the Fuso, got a 100% WR in her :). Play the ARP Kongo ships now to preseve that glorious one night win streak if I want Kongo fun now.

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5 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

 

Absolutly.

 

Also, looking at T5, the powercreep is very obvious. Who wants to play a New York these days? Even Kongo has dropped to the bottom of the stats, and if she wouldnt have the speed still going for here, she´d be as lost as the New York. Just think about the competitors introduced in the near past: Oktober, Iron Duke and Cesare.

 

I've been using Hiei fairly often these days and she's still viable as the guns are high calibre for T5 and there's the obvious massive speed advantage over everyone. I still like the Kongo class lots but there is power creep. NY and even Texas are bad these days.

 

2 minutes ago, puxflacet said:

indeed, unlike nikolai she has one big downside - shes squishy and cant take much fire

 

It's all about the speed, in lower tier MM games you'll often be one of the fastest BBs on the map. Being able to transport that sort of firepower around a relatively small map can make a huge difference. 

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Agree the US BB's are pretty terrible, I never played the line because they're so bloody slow. I only wanted the NC/Iowa class out of the entire line. I have Alabama, similar ship... just waiting to get enough free XP for Missouri and then I'll never need to grind the line as I have no interest in the Montana.

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3 minutes ago, Drunken_Jedi said:

Kongo is still an AMAZING ship, I think powercreep isn't much of an issue for her.

 

3 minutes ago, Negativvv said:

I've been using Hiei fairly often these days and she's still viable

 

Thats because you two guys are obviously good players, if I may be so bold to say that. You know how to play the ship by its strenghts. :cap_like: I personaly like the Kongo-class myself, I learnd to play BB with it, simply, cuz of the speed it was more foregiving if you positioned yourself badly or overextended. I often see players now using Kongos advantage to their disadvantage, f.e. when Im in Orion. Those players rush towards me, instead keeping the distance. Well, may well be the reason why Kongos stats look as terrible as they do.

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1 hour ago, ColonelPete said:

Look at stats of Texas how much fluctuation is possible with the same ship.

 

 

A slow ship without AA might be a prime target for CVs. Seeing how many CVs play lowtier, maybe thats one reason? :cap_hmm:

A T4/5 CV has no chance dropping a Texas.

Also i guess one reason might be the higher range of NY which stupid ppl just use (texas 19,? with plotting room while NY has 20,6 with plotting room (and maybe some ppl use AA range upgrade on Texas instead of Plotting room, which would make the difference even higher))`also an indication of the lower MBH.

 

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It is highly unlikely that thousandth of players on one server play a ship only one way and other thousandth of players on another server play the ship a different way.

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4 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

It is highly unlikely that thousandth of players on one server play a ship only one way and other thousandth of players on another server play the ship a different way.

Are you trying to tell us, New York and Texas are the same? Cant really tell for sure what you want to say

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3 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

Are you trying to tell us, New York and Texas are the same? Cant really tell for sure what you want to say

 

i dont have texas. is she really so much better?

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5 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

It is highly unlikely that thousandth of players on one server play a ship only one way and other thousandth of players on another server play the ship a different way.

 

Not sure either. Oh i got it now, i thought u were talking about Texas compared to NY, not Texas RU compared to Texas NA.

Well look at the battles played? I see a lot of Texas fans playing the Texas on NA, so it seems to me playing on NA Its much more likely to have 2 Texas' in one battle facing each other than on RU server. So naturally the WR will tend more to 50%.

Also the Survivabilty on RU server seems better in general (look at all ships) so they seem to play differently. Also 12000 battles played will result in much more individual players than only 1500 battles (RU server 3300 individual texas players (+ some hidden ofc) and NA has 8800 (+hidden).

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9 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

Are you trying to tell us, New York and Texas are the same? Cant really tell for sure what you want to say

I am Talking about Texas and not Texas and New York.

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1 minute ago, puxflacet said:

i dont have texas. is she really so much better?

 

Right now you face nearly all the time CVs, often even 2 per team. Texas just shredds through those planes and is pretty much untouchable. You want to support your CV with shooting down planes, which helps in getting air superiority. All this, New York cant. When im HE-spammed in my Texas and lose all my AA, then I know how it is to have a New York. Its certainly no fun, cuz you lost your biggest strenght.

 

Taking about BB vs BB battle: Texas (New York) has a hard time with faster BBs. Thats Kongo and the Cesare, looking on T5. It can however deal better with a Kongo; the few times ive encountered Giolio Cesare with Texas, I had a hard time dealing more damage to them as they did to me. It can win a fight vs Kongo pretty easy - if the oponent doesnt play to the strenghts of Kongo. And both Kongo and Cesare can engage/disengage to their liking. Iron Duke is special (who would have thought), but is pretty soft. Manageable. Texas / New York vs König I feel at a small disadvantage across the board.

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30 minutes ago, ForlornSailor said:

 

 

Thats because you two guys are obviously good players, if I may be so bold to say that. You know how to play the ship by its strenghts. :cap_like: I personaly like the Kongo-class myself, I learnd to play BB with it, simply, cuz of the speed it was more foregiving if you positioned yourself badly or overextended. I often see players now using Kongos advantage to their disadvantage, f.e. when Im in Orion. Those players rush towards me, instead keeping the distance. Well, may well be the reason why Kongos stats look as terrible as they do.

 

Kongo has always been better than her stats. She is really difficult to play at high performance because of her battlecruiser concept: Fight close to weaker enemies (cruisers), keep distance to superior enemies (battleships).

 

However, power creep on Tier V is a problem. New York is simply outdated, and König has lost most of her charme because she suffers greatly from British HE spam (as she needs to fight close to the enemy). GC seems to be a (braindead) jack of all trades, and October is stupidly resistant to any small calibre fire.

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So the Iron duke is pretty run of the mill compared to the GC and HE spamming RN BBs don't seem to be a problem at this Tier how very strange.

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12 minutes ago, MacFergus said:

So the Iron duke is pretty run of the mill compared to the GC and HE spamming RN BBs don't seem to be a problem at this Tier how very strange.

 

I think, this can be explained. Iron Duke is not the choice for statpadders and sealclubbers, cuz it gets T4 to T7 mm - and is lowtier quite often. Orion however, is pretty much the same ship but gets the juicy T3 to T5. I know thats my reason why I play the Orion... yep, guilty as charged. :Smile_amazed:

 

34 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

I am Talking about Texas and not Texas and New York.

 

I dont see the big difference from Texas to Texas then? Its both times no2 on the list. Looking at the numbers played, it looks like, Texas is favoured by the masses in NA - makes sense cuz of her reputation over there, its the the Tirpitz for german players - which always brings the stats down a little.

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NY is trash tier now, literally nothing going for her. Grind past and buy a Texas if you hate CVs.

 

Konigs or whatever is meh for me as I never got on with her guns.

 

GC, Kongo, Dunker and Hood all play in very similar ways. They are all fast ships that can dictate engagements and they all shouldn't brawl. 

 

 

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I have had a blast in every game I have played in the Giulio Cesare, which is not something I can say of most battleships other than the German ones. Like her Regia Marina sister, the Duca D'Aosta, she's fast enough to quickly get into trouble, but unlike the Duca, she's tough enough to keep fighting if she starts taking fire. And she's such a gorgeous ship to boot... I think I'm a bit star-struck here, honestly! :fish_cute_2:

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1 hour ago, ColonelPete said:

It is highly unlikely that thousandth of players on one server play a ship only one way and other thousandth of players on another server play the ship a different way.

 

It's not completely implausible if you consider likely differences in the player-base, e.g.: Texas (EU) - dedicated skilled BB players v Texas (NA) - every man and his dog.

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