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Why such emphasis on win rate

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I have played around 4500 games now got 6x t10s 1350xp per battle and 42k damage..as you can tell i didn't really level up on battleships due to the low battle damage, But here's the thing in my eye's xp and damage per battle is mostly down to the individual yet a lot of clan's want players with high win rate %....now i'm currently at a steady 51% and not to burst my own bubble but i'm often in the top half of my team...Surely win rate is based on the team for there's only so much the individual can do?

Its just a little frustration of mine as i'm currently looking for a clan that will oversee this.

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[CATS]
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There is a reason that some people have Solowinrates of 50% 55% or 60% after thousandth of games: skill.

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[RNS]
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Curious does coop improve this..i play 99% random but i cannot be held responsible for the whole team when they drop like flies

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Coop Winrate is a different value.

 

You are responsible for your own performance. Team performance is random. But after enough games this randomness balances out and your peformance remains.

I suggest you read up on statistics or this discussion will not help you at all.

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[AWG]
Beta Tester
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Some clans recruit only based on statistics (win rate, WTR, or both).

Some clans recruit based on age and personality.

 

If you don't have the statistics required for one of the clans that recruit based on statistics, then find another clan.  Simple solution is simple.

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[BONI]
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It's just a metric that is considered the best indication of skill at the game, though I say that's a flawed concept. If you're a half-decent DD player, you're gonna have at least a couple more % than a half-decent BB player. You just have more influence on the game in a DD in Domination, which is most matches. My damage sucks at under 30k but I play DDs responsibly, going for the caps and not yoloing, and guess what? I have 53% despite doing some of the least damage, being helplessly inaccurate with guns in games, and playing on a satellite connection with 800ms latency.

 

tl;dr: play DDs sensibly if you want to boost WR. You could also go sealclubbing but that's the evil way to do it and not good for EXP gains. After 4k matches it takes a lot to put a dent in it though, so who cares. It's just a number that some people take too seriously.

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DD do not make a difference,

Look at DD server stats.

If what you said where true, DD winrates would be better than other ships.

To the contrary, many BBs have better winrates.

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[QUCA]
Weekend Tester
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3 minutes ago, ColonelPete said:

DD do not make a difference,

Look at DD server stats.

If what you said where true, DD winrates would be better than other ships.

To the contrary, many BBs have better winrates.

Depends on the game mode. They are still the best capping and contesting ships so if capping is important DDs are important too.

Smoke nerf however will leave them in a bad spot, it's way harder to carry your moronic BBs to victory when you can't even hide them.

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[CR-S]
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You have to consider that you alone are only 8% of your entire team (in a 12v12). Which makes you a 4% af the total match (again, in a 12v12). Ofc you can carry games by supporting mates and playing exceptionally well, but there are many things you can´t influence, like an afk player, an accidental teamkill or the Bismarck in line 10.

 

Days ago i played six games in row with the D.d´Aosta. I wanted to get the daily win because i level up my captain.

> In the first five games i was 4x top scorer and 1x 2nd top. We lost them all.

> In the sixth game i detonated on the first hit and was last by score. We won.

 

I gave up bothering ´bout WR  and look more at the behavior of a player than his stats. After being invited by several clans I chose the one that has a "C" in its name that stands for casual, not competitive. Now i have fun and benefit from clan-discounts without being under pressure.

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The worst players and afk bots have a WR of around 40% (some are even lower). The best players have a solo WR of 72%.

That is a 32% window controlled by players and I am sure more is possible.

 

Therefore one can comfortably say that one player can influence up 35% of the match. Not all manage that, but that is enough.

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First off, winrate should never be taken at facevalue. Or any stat really, only considering the complete picture can provide sufficient context.

 

As you said, this is a team game and win rate is effected by more than just one individual.

However, it is also true that the average winrate (to some extent) shows how good an individual player is influencing the game. Not winning the game all by his/her lonesome, but infuencing the game meaningfully, either creating a chance for his team with a crucial play or exploiting a fault of the enemy. Those actions tend to snowball and ultimately lead to victory.

 

At best, no one should get obsessed about stats. They're just an indication (however useful that can be) and you should only take it as such. They can also be inflated (which is why taking a detailed look for context is important, my own stats for example are a lot of division play with good players, my solo winrate is a good chunk below my global average). See if they're going up and if they do, keep going and the rest will follow. If they stagnate, think about changing up your playstyle. If they decrease, something you're doing isn't working, try to find out what it is.

That's really the only thing someone should look for in their stats, see the trend and use it as a motivator. The rest comes as it goes, one way or the other.

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[ODIUM]
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31 minutes ago, Aotearas said:

First off, winrate should never be taken at facevalue. Or any stat really, only considering the complete picture can provide sufficient context.

As you said, this is a team game and win rate is effected by more than just one individual.

However, it is also true that the average winrate (to some extent) shows how good an individual player is influencing the game.

At best, no one should get obsessed about stats. 

What you said is very true. This is a team game after all. 

 

I, for one, take my personal winrate way to seriously. Im currently kindof stuck around the 55.7% but used to be around the 53% mark. There is one thing I cannot suggest more of if you are looking to improve your winrate. You got to enable your replays and rewatch the ones where you feel you did poorly/well. This way, by means of self-examination, you can sea for yourself what you a.) need to improve b.) are doing well. This has helped me a lot. Also, when your getting your fist games of the day started, dont start in a high tier ship, start lower. Im not saying tier 2-3, but tier 4-5 is a good place to get a warm-up match or two done. If you play well, then it gives you more confidence for the rest of the games, and if it goes poorly you can either stay at low tiers untill you start to play properly or switch it off for a while. 

 

I always find that if Ive had a bad run of games, my personal contribution to the team goes down. If you want your stats to improve, dont continue on a loosing streak. your mindset will become more and more unmotivated/angry/flustered, therefore (yeah, thats right, I used a kickass word) keeping you on a loosing streak and destroying your concentration. 

 

Also, if you are trying to pad your stats, NEVER, and I really mean this, NEVER play on the weekends. This is when, and I am sorry for the generalisation, the kiddies come out who tend not to have the best strategic planning and/or care about winning. It is hard to consistently win games if you have teams who 'Just Want to Have Fu-un'...

 

You could also do the scumbag thing and get yourself a nice OP low tier ship, like the St. Louise, Kuma, Tachibana, Wickes, Konig Albert, Duguay-Tourin, Imperaitor Nikolai, and/or Octyabraskitkikdyia Revoluskitiidkyieia, ALL of which are low-tiered OP ships. They are all extreemly fun to play and are a pain to run accross in the battlefield (when sailed by someone who knows what WASD is). They, of course, do not guarentee victory but they are extreemly powerful and are quite easy to seal-club in.

 

Hope you enjoyed???!?!!! What was the question again?!?!

 

 

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Win rate is useful because it serves as a kind of a bottom line on whether you're helping your team. Individual games are affected by random MM issues -- your team might suck, or you might get a few real "tryhards" on your side who carry the game. But across a (very) large number of games, your team will suffer of these issues equally compared to your enemy -- and the remaining thing making a difference is ... you.

 

So it kind of cuts through a lot of unnecessary analysis. Should you cap vs. fight, do you farm "unhelpful" damage with HE, all that. If you tend to win more, then whatever you do is probably helpful.

 

Now there are still a lot of caveats:

  • Do you play bad or good ships? A 55% win rate in a Myogi is impressive, however it's significantly below server average in a Nikolai. So someone who's spending a lot of his playing time in the "flavour of the month" ships will have an inflated win rate.
  • Do you play alone or in a division? Playing in a division might either help or hurt you, depending on the quality of the division mates. In most cases it likely helps.
  • What tier do you play in? This is at least looking at my stats a huge factor. Many people tend to grind out to high tiers, and then mainly play there. But some people have a preference for playing in low-to-mid tiers a lot, despite being experienced players. For example in some of my old Tier 3-4 favourites I have win rates of 70-80% after 100 games. At Tier 8-10 I'm only somewhat above average. So if I played in low-mid tiers exclusively, my win rate would skyrocket.

I'm kind of a poster child here. My win rate is a relatively impressive 60%, but I play 2/3 of my games divisioned up with fairly good players. And we stick to mid tiers a lot.

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2 hours ago, jss78 said:

Win rate is useful because it serves as a kind of a bottom line on whether you're helping your team. Individual games are affected by random MM issues -- your team might suck, or you might get a few real "tryhards" on your side who carry the game. But across a (very) large number of games, your team will suffer of these issues equally compared to your enemy -- and the remaining thing making a difference is ... you.

 

So it kind of cuts through a lot of unnecessary analysis. Should you cap vs. fight, do you farm "unhelpful" damage with HE, all that. If you tend to win more, then whatever you do is probably helpful.

 

Now there are still a lot of caveats:

  • Do you play bad or good ships? A 55% win rate in a Myogi is impressive, however it's significantly below server average in a Nikolai. So someone who's spending a lot of his playing time in the "flavour of the month" ships will have an inflated win rate.
  • Do you play alone or in a division? Playing in a division might either help or hurt you, depending on the quality of the division mates. In most cases it likely helps.
  • What tier do you play in? This is at least looking at my stats a huge factor. Many people tend to grind out to high tiers, and then mainly play there. But some people have a preference for playing in low-to-mid tiers a lot, despite being experienced players. For example in some of my old Tier 3-4 favourites I have win rates of 70-80% after 100 games. At Tier 8-10 I'm only somewhat above average. So if I played in low-mid tiers exclusively, my win rate would skyrocket.

I'm kind of a poster child here. My win rate is a relatively impressive 60%, but I play 2/3 of my games divisioned up with fairly good players. And we stick to mid tiers a lot.

 

That was a very good rundown! Quoted for emphasis.

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1 hour ago, Aotearas said:

 

That was a very good rundown! Quoted for emphasis.

I second that. Well said jss78!

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[-AS-]
[-AS-]
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My opinion is that in public matches win rates don't mean anything, ANYTHING, at all. You could be the most skilled player in the world, if your team messes up big time chances are you'll still lose.

 

Typical example: Played a T6-T8 game yesterday with my Graf Spee along with a friend of mine in a division and despite us having sunk about half of the total kills we made on the enemy team (we killed off 2 Hippers and an Akatzuki) my team still lost bigtime because people in Bizmarck/Tirpitz/New Orleans etc were not paying attention and either got focused fired on or made a wrong move and were out of combat for the remainder of the game.

 

It's an entirely different affair in ranked matches though because of the smaller teams where one player can make more of a difference.

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Seems someone got it wrong:

Stats show tomato, 42k average dmg and WR are just a component of the overall performance of a player (and his favorite ships)

Simply as already said: 42K average dmg and 20% WR in a Flint = big tomato -> simply because the ship is OP and usually better players are behind the wheel.

 

Now let's start the dissection session:

3k+ battles with

50% WR

42K average dmg

32% survival

0.7 average kills

= tomato

 

now let's dig deeper

Favorite most played ships:

For the top 6:

Not a single one has good performance and some are downright tomato level stats and they are ships that, in the right hands, can perform very well.

5 are T10 and the sixth one is the OP T7.

 

This implies:

- after 3k+ battles the player has not mastered the basics.

- even with OP or borderline OP ships the player has a tomato level performance.

- even in DIV there is not significant increase in performance.

 

Advice:

- Go L2P in lower tiers, master the basics such as angling, basic positioning, aiming, WASD'ing

 

 

Oh and sorry to burst the bubble but........this type of performance while mainly playing T10 means a tomato who is a liability to his team -> 'positive point' there are plenty of tomatoes at T10............if only they could all be in the red team.

 

Like I said, go L2P at lower tiers instead of thinking the performance is good.......

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[LEGIO]
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5 hours ago, SinkTheOthersNotMe said:

Seems someone got it wrong:

Stats show tomato, 42k average dmg and WR are just a component of the overall performance of a player (and his favorite ships)

Simply as already said: 42K average dmg and 20% WR in a Flint = big tomato -> simply because the ship is OP and usually better players are behind the wheel.

 

Now let's start the dissection session:

3k+ battles with

50% WR

42K average dmg

32% survival

0.7 average kills

= tomato

 

now let's dig deeper

Favorite most played ships:

For the top 6:

Not a single one has good performance and some are downright tomato level stats and they are ships that, in the right hands, can perform very well.

5 are T10 and the sixth one is the OP T7.

 

This implies:

- after 3k+ battles the player has not mastered the basics.

- even with OP or borderline OP ships the player has a tomato level performance.

- even in DIV there is not significant increase in performance.

 

Advice:

- Go L2P in lower tiers, master the basics such as angling, basic positioning, aiming, WASD'ing

 

 

Oh and sorry to burst the bubble but........this type of performance while mainly playing T10 means a tomato who is a liability to his team -> 'positive point' there are plenty of tomatoes at T10............if only they could all be in the red team.

 

Like I said, go L2P at lower tiers instead of thinking the performance is good.......

Is it really necessary to go so deep just to point out that a player is bad? There is some hysteria over stats in this forum. WR ain´t everything. I agree with OP about that :) 

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Going so deep = trying to point out what the player should try to improve -> if he wanted to really improve.

 

The worst is a player who thinks he is a good player when in reality he is just a liability to his team at high tiers, being a tomato is not an issue, I am a CV tomato -> the issue is when a tomato wants to convince publicly on the forum everyone that he is good and the teams he is put in are the bad ones.........

 

Also the post was to point that WR is not everything -> dmg dealt in regards to specific ships + average kills and K/D ratio show the real picture, add to that solo stats against DIV stats......

 

But yes obviously if players with more than 2k battles who are still performing under the server's average persist to believe they are good then they are of course free to think so -> just that they should not come cry when they try to brag on the forum and receive some flak.

 

and L2P is not that difficult if one wants to contribute to his teams (nobody is asked to be a unicum all the time)

 

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