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Jvd2000

R(evenge) class Premium?

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Inspite of the massive numbers of new premium ships, either real or paper, I would like to propose just one more...it is quit strange to find out that WG passes over one of the most numerous class of battleships actualy made. The R-class (Revenge-class / Royal Souvereign-class) was planned as a group of 8 (!) BB’s to supplement the QE class. Being slightly slower, smaller and more conventional in propulsion they were a cheaper alternative to the QE class. Of the 8 original planned only 5 were finished as planned. Two were converted to battlecruiser and one was cancelled completely.  But neverteless with 5 ships build, together with the QE, the Revenge class is the most numerous class of BB ever actualy build and commisioned.

 

And it is missing in WoW! Boo! Hiss!

 

But the R-class is clearly inferior to the QE for which we already have both a silver and premium ship you say? So why not introduce a R-class ship  and give it the Mutso treatment and place it at tier 5? One of the complaints about the QE ships is that they are after the reconstruction of the bridge. Lets keep the R-class premium in its original bridge configuration with maybe some buff to its aa capacity. Then we will have a good looking historical ship with the largest caliber at tier 5, good armor but limited speed and aa. It does not even have to be overpowered but simply inoring one of the largest series of BB is a waste of potential to make a premium of a real ship that deserves to be in the game.  

 

By the way, I am not British, and yes the RN got some love recently after being ignored for so long but we are talking about the most numerous class of BB ever build and it deserves to be in the game.

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Wouldn't mind an R-Class. But rather a T6 - she'd be a tad too strong for T5. Her real life weaknesses don't mean anything in WOWS - she would be at least as good as QE just a little slow. Which isn't a big problem if you head for the Center of the map like Arizona. That's what she'd be - an Arizona kind of ship (maybe supercharged shells).

 

Hope we see her some day at least she looks far better than these Queen Anne's mansion ships.

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I'd rather see the Rs left as an option for a second RN BB line, the only Revenge that did anything of note was Royal Sovereign and all she did was rust away in a soviet dockyard for most of WWII get promoted into the greatest and most glorious navy ever to grace the oceans for a while, which would also make her a Russian premium rather than a British one). The RN has pretty much enough BBs to have two BB lines, a CC line and a Fast BB line with only a few gaps left in the top tiers and a couple of paper ships here and there.

 

Not to mention how we have enough standard battleships in the game already, it's about time we start to see some more battlecruisers! We currently only have 4 battlecruisers in the game compared to 50ish battleships. Granted, there were more historical BB classes than CC classes, but not in a 10:1 ratio and most major WWI naval powers had enough battlecruisers to at least fill out up to T8 or so with battlecruisers with only a couple of paper designs to fill out the gaps.

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1 hour ago, Cosseria said:

Another mid-tier fat, slow BB? Yeah that's really under-represented in game, bring it on!

 

I like playing fat mid tier slow BB's. As for the Revenge class even if history learns us that they were used during ww2 doing less gloryfull but needed convoy escorts missions. :fish_book: So will happily buy the ship because it has history.

 

But I equally like playing faster nimble BB's, even if the history of the ship puts them as flak boats inside harbors because of fuel shortages and they only sailed out to surrender and switch sides... And getting blasted in the process by an experimental missile by an upset former ally. So will buy Roma as well :Smile_teethhappy:

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2 minutes ago, creamgravy said:

We don't have enough RN BBs at tier 7, give it little speed buff and it can fill the void. :Smile_honoring:

 

Think with 3 premiums we are full. Would actually prefer a R-class at V then another KGV clone at VII though. Dont yet have KGV, but if I keep it I can put premium camo on it.

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4 minutes ago, Lord_WC said:

No more BBs please.

Is it too much to ask to get a DD or a CL?

You are getting 2 dd's and some cruisers :)

 

By the way, talking about premium cruisers, what happened to the Makarov (soviet Nurnberg)?

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3 minutes ago, Jvd2000 said:

You are getting 2 dd's and some cruisers :)

 

By the way, talking about premium cruisers, what happened to the Makarov (soviet Nurnberg)?

Oh nice, okay then, go ahead with your BB:D

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Would love to see some British DD's, Tribal or Daring class destroyers added rather than more BB's

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I'd suspect the R class will fill either the T5 or T6 slot (depending on upgrade status and "Stalinium treatment") in the inevitable RU BB line whenever that shows up...

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I don't see a place in the RN lineup for the R class battleships. They were, generally speaking, hopeless: slightly downgraded QE class battleships capable of only 21 knots, intended to defend the British mainland if external supplies of oil dried up (the QEs ran on oil only, the R's on coal or oil), with cheaper armour layouts which were still based on the ideas of short-range battleship exchanges. You might be able to make a case for having them in the Russian BB line, though.

 

Renown, though: fully upgraded to WWII spec, she'd make a fine Tier VI - 32 knots, 15 inch guns, 9 inch armour belt, torps and spotter plane... slap -bang between Kongo and Gneisenau, no need for gimmick ammo. 

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Hmm, personally I would rather prefer the BC Renown, whether as a Premium or maybe, as tier 9or10 Cruiser for a possible British Heavy Cruiser-line spinoff? :cap_old:

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Or perhaps the much famed HMS Outrageous, a tier 4 Prem BC? :cap_haloween:Bwahhahahaa! In fact Brits could perhaps do with almost a complete line of BattleCruisers (well, the only country to produce them in large numbers anyway). I would find that quite interesting, maybe from tier 3 up to tier 8 or some such partial tree. Perhaps the British line I would be most interested in, since I like freaks. :Smile_teethhappy:

 

A pity they already wasted Hood as a premium, it would have made a perfect top tier for the line.:Smile_sad:

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46 minutes ago, RAHJAILARI said:

Or perhaps the much famed HMS Outrageous, a tier 4 Prem BC? :cap_haloween:Bwahhahahaa! In fact Brits could perhaps do with almost a complete line of BattleCruisers (well, the only country to produce them in large numbers anyway). I would find that quite interesting, maybe from tier 3 up to tier 8 or some such partial tree. Perhaps the british line I would be most interested in, since I like freaks. :Smile_teethhappy:

 

A pity they already wasted Hood as a premium, it would have made a perfect top tier for the line.:Smile_sad:

HMS Tiger yes please !

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Actually, I was a bit wrong previously. It turns out that Germany also produced quite a few BC's in its day and could also produce at the least a partial tech tree of BC's but also in this case... A pity Schanhors and Gneisenau have already been expended as they would have made excellent top tiers for any such and contest the seas against the British BC... Somehow, one gets the distinct impression that WG has not planned the tech trees and tier structure very well (or at all?) but are kinda just proceeding purely on ad-hoc basis.:cap_hmm:

 

I guess Alaska could also make a nice premium BC to placate the Yanks...:cap_popcorn:

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56 minutes ago, RAHJAILARI said:

Or perhaps the much famed HMS Outrageous, a tier 4 Prem BC? :cap_haloween:Bwahhahahaa! In fact Brits could perhaps do with almost a complete line of BattleCruisers (well, the only country to produce them in large numbers anyway). I would find that quite interesting, maybe from tier 3 up to tier 8 or some such partial tree. Perhaps the British line I would be most interested in, since I like freaks. :Smile_teethhappy:

 

A pity they already wasted Hood as a premium, it would have made a perfect top tier for the line.:Smile_sad:

 

The Kaiser and his Admiral would like to have a word with you on that sir!

 

No seriously, both Germany and Britain can field a full BC line, eg like the following:

 

T3: von der Tann / Indefatigable 

T4: Moltke / Lion

T5: Derfflinger / Tiger 

T6: Mackensen / Renown 

T7: Ersatz York / Admiral or J3

T8: Gneisenau / G3 

T9: GK Design 6x42 / ?

T10: GK Design 8x42, eg GK4245 / K2 or K3

 

Of course we would "steal" Gneisenau from the BB line but could backfill with L20a

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9 hours ago, 1MajorKoenig said:

 

The Kaiser and his Admiral would like to have a word with you on that sir!

 

No seriously, both Germany and Britain can field a full BC line, eg like the following:

 

T3: von der Tann / Indefatigable 

T4: Moltke / Lion

T5: Derfflinger / Tiger 

T6: Mackensen / Renown 

T7: Ersatz York / Admiral or J3

T8: Gneisenau / G3 

T9: GK Design 6x42 / ?

T10: GK Design 8x42, eg GK4245 / K2 or K3

 

Of course we would "steal" Gneisenau from the BB line but could backfill with L20a

 

I don't know about the T10 being the Ks, they were certainly larger and a more potent design than the Gs but they were definitely not T10 material. Considering how the Conqueror is basically just a K2 that has been uparmoured and with modern AA, I'd say that a modernised K2//3 would fit nicely into T9 as a follow on from the G3. This does unfortunately leave the T10 gap open though, but I don't know of any RN battlecruiser designs that could possibly fill it. Similarly, rather than the J3 at T7 I'd say it would make more sense to fit the F2/3 class battlecruisers into that tier (the Fs were battlecruiser designs made to treaty limits of 35,000 tons, although their battleship cousins the O3s were actually built instead). If anything, the Js would fit fine into T8, having similar displacements to the Gs but trading a small amount of calibre for more convenient turret positions.

 

Going even further, I could see the RN having the battlecruiser line split somewhat around T6 or so into armoured and unarmoured battlecruisers, with the armoured battlecruisers reaching T9 while the unarmoured ones reach T8.

 

For the Germans, the obvious choice for T8 wouldn't be the Gneisenau, but the GK10 class battlecruiser. The GrosseKreuzer 10 was to be basically the German equivalent to the Amagis, the Lexingtons and the G3s/Admirals with a displacement of about 45,000 tons and was designed following Jutland. Couple this with armour slightly thicker than the Ersatz Yorck, a 32 knots speed as stock and a 420mm main battery and I could see them being a decent force at T8 (particularly if given an interwar engine refit for 34+ knot speeds, improved torpedo protection and some AA).

 

The IJN could also quite easily reach T8 with battlecruisers, with only a few gaps being filled by the more obscure paper designs. The Amagis had quite a protracted design process and their preliminaries could easily fill T6-7, while T3 could be filled with the Ibuki class armoured cruisers (probably under the name Kurama due to the T9 Ibuki class). Going beyond that is quite tricky, as the Amagi is the last and strongest undisputed battlecruiser they developed, any potential T9 designs have zig-zagged between being designated as battlecruisers and battleships, although there's not much stopping them from grabbing any of the 30+ knot interwar or WWII designs to fill the gap.

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In the Battleships and Battlecruisers of "Hachi-Hachi" Fleet book you have plans for advanced battleships and battlecruiser, the latter could include 13 class variants with 10-18/8-18/6-18 in fact this book which is in japanese but I have it nonetheless, the plans are translated in English as battlecruiser for the 13 class variants.the 6-18 inch variant 37 kts.

In the Hiraga archives which a few years ago wre made public on some japanese site there are plenty of variants and scetches but how far were they, well made by a famous architect but if they were discussion material they may be more or less just variants, I know f.e. of a high speed Nagato variant if I recall correctly with 35 kts speed so fantasy with some connection in reality if limited is possible.

It was difficult for non-japanese to search, it was more or less to click on various files and see what it was, I printed a few scetches, sadly my old link do not work. But the archive was huge and maybe it has just moved.

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On 11/7/2017 at 3:06 PM, Jvd2000 said:

Inspite of the massive numbers of new premium ships, either real or paper, I would like to propose just one more...it is quit strange to find out that WG passes over one of the most numerous class of battleships actualy made. The R-class (Revenge-class / Royal Souvereign-class) was planned as a group of 8 (!) BB’s to supplement the QE class. Being slightly slower, smaller and more conventional in propulsion they were a cheaper alternative to the QE class. Of the 8 original planned only 5 were finished as planned. Two were converted to battlecruiser and one was cancelled completely.  But neverteless with 5 ships build, together with the QE, the Revenge class is the most numerous class of BB ever actualy build and commisioned.

 

And it is missing in WoW! Boo! Hiss!

 

But the R-class is clearly inferior to the QE for which we already have both a silver and premium ship you say? So why not introduce a R-class ship  and give it the Mutso treatment and place it at tier 5? One of the complaints about the QE ships is that they are after the reconstruction of the bridge. Lets keep the R-class premium in its original bridge configuration with maybe some buff to its aa capacity. Then we will have a good looking historical ship with the largest caliber at tier 5, good armor but limited speed and aa. It does not even have to be overpowered but simply inoring one of the largest series of BB is a waste of potential to make a premium of a real ship that deserves to be in the game.  

 

By the way, I am not British, and yes the RN got some love recently after being ignored for so long but we are talking about the most numerous class of BB ever build and it deserves to be in the game.

The Revenge (Royal Sovereign) class was not upgraded between the wars as were the Queen Elizabeth class, therefore, they were relegated to secondary duties at which they excelled.  Due to design limitations, and the induced roll through stability which was thought to enhance gunnery, it was not practicable for these ships to be upgraded or fitted with more powerful machinery, however, for there design period they were still very potent weapons platforms and served through both world wars, one even being lent the Soviet Union as the Archangelsk 

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5 hours ago, RamirezKurita said:

 

I don't know about the T10 being the Ks, they were certainly larger and a more potent design than the Gs but they were definitely not T10 material. Considering how the Conqueror is basically just a K2 that has been uparmoured and with modern AA, I'd say that a modernised K2//3 would fit nicely into T9 as a follow on from the G3. This does unfortunately leave the T10 gap open though, but I don't know of any RN battlecruiser designs that could possibly fill it. Similarly, rather than the J3 at T7 I'd say it would make more sense to fit the F2/3 class battlecruisers into that tier (the Fs were battlecruiser designs made to treaty limits of 35,000 tons, although their battleship cousins the O3s were actually built instead). If anything, the Js would fit fine into T8, having similar displacements to the Gs but trading a small amount of calibre for more convenient turret positions.

 

Going even further, I could see the RN having the battlecruiser line split somewhat around T6 or so into armoured and unarmoured battlecruisers, with the armoured battlecruisers reaching T9 while the unarmoured ones reach T8.

 

For the Germans, the obvious choice for T8 wouldn't be the Gneisenau, but the GK10 class battlecruiser. The GrosseKreuzer 10 was to be basically the German equivalent to the Amagis, the Lexingtons and the G3s/Admirals with a displacement of about 45,000 tons and was designed following Jutland. Couple this with armour slightly thicker than the Ersatz Yorck, a 32 knots speed as stock and a 420mm main battery and I could see them being a decent force at T8 (particularly if given an interwar engine refit for 34+ knot speeds, improved torpedo protection and some AA).

 

The IJN could also quite easily reach T8 with battlecruisers, with only a few gaps being filled by the more obscure paper designs. The Amagis had quite a protracted design process and their preliminaries could easily fill T6-7, while T3 could be filled with the Ibuki class armoured cruisers (probably under the name Kurama due to the T9 Ibuki class). Going beyond that is quite tricky, as the Amagi is the last and strongest undisputed battlecruiser they developed, any potential T9 designs have zig-zagged between being designated as battlecruisers and battleships, although there's not much stopping them from grabbing any of the 30+ knot interwar or WWII designs to fill the gap.

 

Would any BB have been able to reach 35+ even 37 knots?!

 

I'm fairly sure Iowa class ships needed huge power plants and long hulls even to go a few knots faster. I did just read that one of them hit 35 knots in speed trials post WW2.

 

Isn't 30 knots the sensible practical speed for capital ships?

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