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Verblonde

Battleships - what am I missing?

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Can someone explain the appeal of most of the battleships in the game, please? I'm very new, so still feeling my way around the classes, so I'm probably missing something.

A lot of battleships seem to involve just plodding along, angling your armour, and taking long range pot-shots at the foe; there isn't much in the way of dynamic game-play.

There do seem to be exceptions (the recent Italian release, for example, seems to play in timescales that aren't geologic), but a lot of what I've played so far follows the above model.

 

I'm still very much at lower tiers though - do they get more interesting at higher tiers?

Or, is that the whole point of battleship play - patience and strategic thinking? If so, how come there are so many of the things in play?

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1 hour ago, Verblonde said:

Or, is that the whole point of battleship play - patience and strategic thinking? If so, how come there are so many of the things in play?

 

Yes. Unfortunately, most of BB come from their IRL popularity, which is way greater than other classes so that means a lot of people which shouldn't be really playing them, are doing it.

 

1 hour ago, Verblonde said:

I'm still very much at lower tiers though - do they get more interesting at higher tiers?

 

Mostly at 7-8 tier when they are not entirely on the mercy of the RNG anymore (unlike lower tiers), but still retain some semblance of mobility (unlike higher tiers) and they arent on the mercy of constant focus and generally more deadly weapon scaling that unpleasantly combine with still being easiest target (unlike higher tiers).

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1 hour ago, ColonelPete said:

They are THAT powerful.

After deleting your first enemy with ONE salvo, you know what I mean.

 

Doesn't that sort of thing get old, after a few times? Especially given that you have to generally give up speed and the ability to manoeuvre to any great degree...?

Whilst I agree that sort of thing is similar to vapourising someone with a spread of DD Skill Rounds, you usually have to do something interesting first to get your DD into position to do that sort of thing to the enemy (I haven't got my hands on any really long-range torps yet, admittedly)...

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1 hour ago, Vanhal said:

 

Mostly at 7-8 tier when they are not entirely on the mercy of the RNG anymore (unlike lower tiers), but still retain some semblance of mobility (unlike higher tiers) and they arent on the mercy of constant focus and generally more deadly weapon scaling that unpleasantly combine with still being easiest target (unlike higher tiers).

 

So, they are worth persisting with, at least until mid-tier?

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10 minutes ago, Verblonde said:

 

Doesn't that sort of thing get old, after a few times? Especially given that you have to generally give up speed and the ability to manoeuvre to any great degree...?

Whilst I agree that sort of thing is similar to vapourising someone with a spread of DD Skill Rounds, you usually have to do something interesting first to get your DD into position to do that sort of thing to the enemy (I haven't got my hands on any really long-range torps yet, admittedly)...

Sinking enemies never gets old, otherwise I would not play this game.

And yes, BB also have to get into position. If you just sail in a straight line towards the enemy, you are doomed in a BB.

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BBs definitely get more interesting as you move up the tiers, especially when you have three tier 7s coming at you and you are in a much slower tier 5. Things like the Gniesenau also carry torps so they are like giant DDs. 

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1 hour ago, Verblonde said:

Doesn't that sort of thing get old, after a few times?

 

Deleting cruisers from full health doesn't get old, but you start to expect it more. Especially when we are talking Neptunes and Minotaurs.

Not only that, you can also one-shot BBs if they make a very big and very stupid mistake.

 

BBs aren't only guns though. You have the best armor and a lot of health, you can push the whole enemy fleet if you have a bit of support. BBs are very powerful, sadly most BB players (see BBabies) stay at the map edges and try to snipe at max range.

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1 hour ago, ColonelPete said:

Sinking enemies never gets old, otherwise I would not play this game.

And yes, BB also have to get into position. If you just sail in a straight line towards the enemy, you are doomed in a BB.

 

Not the sinking bit, but rather the not-doing-very-much-and-then-sinking-someone bit. It may just be that BB play is more cerebral (chess?), whilst cruisers and DDs get to do the fun zooming around, hard turns, dodging of incoming fire, followed by (hopefully) sinking someone...?

I should emphasise that I'm not questioning all BBs, just the slower more ponderous ones.

It's almost like these BBs are WOWS' VK100: heavy, tough, slow, powerful, and only get really exciting when you're probably in big trouble because too many enemies got near you...

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It's prolly something close to a power-fantasy thing with those. You're slow but if played well (and not screwed by mm or RNGesus)

you can laugh while bouncing shells and healing back whatever those puny firecrackers and the following onboard BBQ try to do to your paintwork and deal massive dmg in return, making bbs and dds run while cruisers vanish when your gaze falls upon them.

:cap_haloween: (excuse me)

So maybe yes, could be close to that thing (never played tanks so i wouldn't know)

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6 hours ago, Verblonde said:

 

Not the sinking bit, but rather the not-doing-very-much-and-then-sinking-someone bit. It may just be that BB play is more cerebral (chess?), whilst cruisers and DDs get to do the fun zooming around, hard turns, dodging of incoming fire, followed by (hopefully) sinking someone...?

I should emphasise that I'm not questioning all BBs, just the slower more ponderous ones.

It's almost like these BBs are WOWS' VK100: heavy, tough, slow, powerful, and only get really exciting when you're probably in big trouble because too many enemies got near you...

It is only the first few minutes. After that you are in action, unless you went for some genius flanking move at the map border that lets you single handedly win the match, after 15 minutes of non-action and if the enemy is completly blind.

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17 hours ago, Ze_Reckless said:

Not only that, you can also one-shot BBs if they make a very big and very stupid mistake.

Only those with citadel aka game's original BB lines of IJN and USN.

KM BBs have their armor scheme (massive for ship's weight while main guns are light in comparison) preventing citadel hits from any but longer ranges.

While RN BBs had their citadel moved to submarine, plus auto-wreck anything thermonuclear HE, just so that any braindead can play them without need to think.

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21 hours ago, Verblonde said:

If so, how come there are so many of the things in play?

Because most of the player base is Balless&Brainless.

 

17 hours ago, Verblonde said:

It may just be that BB play is more cerebral (chess?), whilst cruisers and DDs get to do the fun zooming around, hard turns, dodging of incoming fire, followed by (hopefully) sinking someone...?

Haven't yet have aiming capable enemies teach you that without enough thinking ahead cruisers/destroyers sink faster than battleship once enemy starts shooting at you?

 

 

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2 hours ago, EsaTuunanen said:

 

Haven't yet have aiming capable enemies teach you that without enough thinking ahead cruisers/destroyers sink faster than battleship once enemy starts shooting at you?

 

 

I'm still at lower tiers in randoms (I think my Leander is as high as I go at the moment, barring mistakes with game selection), so I haven't encountered real people shooting at me with 'finger-of-good-doom-cannons' yet.

My working assumption is that, at higher tiers, speed will still be life - I'll just have to get much better at situational awareness, to avoid things like zooming round an island and right into some BB's pre-aimed spot...

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2 hours ago, Verblonde said:

My working assumption is that, at higher tiers, speed will still be life

Only super fast Soviet "destroyers" like Minsk/Leningrad or "Kebab" (aka Khabarovsk) have enough speed to truly start "outrunning" enemy fire because leading enough is hard.

Standard destroyer speed just isn't enough for that.

And then there are railgun cruisers which can easily hit those to long range if showing too much side.

(broadside target always easiest to lead/hit)

 

 

As for battleships Tier 7 German premium Scharnhorst would be one of the more special ones with very fast turret traverse (faster than in some Soviet gunboat DDs) and reload for BB.

Because of that and KM secondaries it's very good for ridiculing destroyers and farming Close Quarter Experts.

Occasionally you even get to torpedo some destroyer.

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I have a Scharnhorst; I'm only testing it out in PvE at the moment, as I'm not good enough for PvP T7 yet - even in that limited environment, it's rather fun! :)

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I looked into your stats(Not stat shaming, we all have to strat somewhere) and saw the legendary Tirpitz. I don't know, if you even want to start battle pvp. I find pvp more rewarding and really stopped playing against bots in the eraly games. Nowdays when I play co-op it's and accident or my div leader is trolling me. But I highly suggest you to play and try out pvp more. It gives more incentive to improve and try better. From my personal experience playing each ship you own (non-premium) daily, is a good way to "slowly" learn the game. Try out different classes and learning them helps you to ofc play them, but to also play against them in human vs human interaction. I would say that low tier ships do not represent fully the gameplay of their lines in higher tiers. This is true in cruisers. DDs you can differentiate more easily. 

 

You have bought several premiums and used quite a lot of money on them. It's nice to see someone trying and learning them on pve instead of playing pvp, but you propably want to use them in pvp and gain good money and win games. Only true suggestion is to play more and more. It took me many games to get the complete picture. Learn game mechanics, learn good strats and learn every ship in the game. Also looking at YouTube videos and streams is a really good way to get know ships that you haven't tried. I laso recommend on getting to pts. Most players there are just as good as you. You can try out the high tier ships in almost every test. 

 

This comment turned into a small rant and I am sorry about it. If you only want to play chill co-op games it's your choice, it's just not my cup of tea. I hope you improve and get better. Many say it takes atleast 1k games to get decent and I don't disagree. Some people are just better/worse in general. 

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10 hours ago, Skiie said:

I looked into your stats(Not stat shaming, we all have to strat somewhere) and saw the legendary Tirpitz. I don't know, if you even want to start battle pvp. I find pvp more rewarding and really stopped playing against bots in the eraly games. Nowdays when I play co-op it's and accident or my div leader is trolling me. But I highly suggest you to play and try out pvp more. It gives more incentive to improve and try better. From my personal experience playing each ship you own (non-premium) daily, is a good way to "slowly" learn the game. Try out different classes and learning them helps you to ofc play them, but to also play against them in human vs human interaction. I would say that low tier ships do not represent fully the gameplay of their lines in higher tiers. This is true in cruisers. DDs you can differentiate more easily. 

 

You have bought several premiums and used quite a lot of money on them. It's nice to see someone trying and learning them on pve instead of playing pvp, but you propably want to use them in pvp and gain good money and win games. Only true suggestion is to play more and more. It took me many games to get the complete picture. Learn game mechanics, learn good strats and learn every ship in the game. Also looking at YouTube videos and streams is a really good way to get know ships that you haven't tried. I laso recommend on getting to pts. Most players there are just as good as you. You can try out the high tier ships in almost every test. 

 

This comment turned into a small rant and I am sorry about it. If you only want to play chill co-op games it's your choice, it's just not my cup of tea. I hope you improve and get better. Many say it takes atleast 1k games to get decent and I don't disagree. Some people are just better/worse in general. 

 

No need to apologise: I got the Derpitz cos it's cheap at the moment, not because I'm ready for it - I have absolutely no intention of going near PvP in it any time soon! Ditto the Atago.

My approach at the moment (for the most part) is to play no higher than T6 in PvP, and preferably lower (it depends a bit on what tier friends want to play at, as well as tier requirements for missions), whilst I get the hang of things. I'm taking the same approach I took in WOT (I'm an 'average' player on the NA server, where my main account lives), and playing as wide a range of boats as possible; this will mean I'm less good, but won't get bored. I don't have the patience to play the same boat over and over again.

As my profile says, I'm currently based in Canada; this means that getting into PvP battles in a reasonable timescale isn't really possible after around 19:00 my time; as soon as queues start taking too long (or sooner, if I'm tired), I switch to PvE and break out the things I can't justify using yet in PvP.

The only exceptions to that are if I mess up the 'battle type' selection!

In WOT, the consensus seem to be that around 10K battles are needed to get tolerably au fait with the game; to judge by the battle counts shown on people's profiles, it's rather fewer in WOWS, although I assume what actually matters is your battle count in PvP. At my current rate of progression (and depending a bit on whether an influx of newbies via Steam dilutes the skill pool), I expect I should be starting to be able to have a crack with T8s by January some time...

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Addendum: in games that matter (PvP), I'm on a count of 247, and a WR of 44.94%, at time of writing i.e. full-blown tomato. Average tier: 4.3 (only one game at T8).

I think I'm doing okay in terms of not stinking up the higher tiers in real games...

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You could always buy one of the lower Tier Premium BBs - Konig Albert or Isizuchi would provide good and cheap bang for your buck - and play that ship until you feel you've mastered the basics of positioning, teamwork, ammunition choice, captain skills, modifications, etc. You can also use those games to train Captains who can be used on other ships in that line as you level up, so you'd be gaining an advantage as you learn. A lot of people - I include myself in this - level up too quickly and get thoroughly found out at Tier VI, so definitely worth pausing and really getting to grips with one low-Tier boat.

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I do have a couple of lower tier BB premiums, including three IJN (including the pre-dreadnought that was at Tsushima, although I suspect that isn't terribly representative); I haven't really played them that much yet though, mainly because I'm yet to fully get the hang of the enjoyment of BBs (apart from brawlers/anything fast).

I'm intending to revisit BBs though, in part because of this thread; I suspect I'll always prefer faster ships, but people have been kind enough to elucidate a bit the attraction of BBs...

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I see you posting a lot. Good job being a part of the community :Smile_smile: I suggest on hopping to pts to test ships out. Ships change during the tree a lot. US BBs change from slow dreadnaughts to fast battleships in the later tiers. 

 

you have a good sized Premium fleet already. Lolyang is perfect for aggressive and fast paced gameplay if you like it. Coming from WoT you have good habits that you inherited. With enough practice you will be a fine sailor. all that depends on how much time you would like to invest learning ofc. But playing bots will not be sufficent for it when you know where to shoot etc. Lower tier pvp is good to learn more than that. People suggest to play to T5-6. I would like to say that T5 is a good tier to play into with EVERY line to get a grasp of what they can and will do. Although some ships lines are just brutal in early game. (I hate emerald)

 

If you ever want to get a fast battleship for brawling Scharnhorst is a very good BB for it. Fast firing guns, fast turret rotaion, fast ship overall, good handling and torps. Good for ultimate German BB training seeing that you also have the tirpitz. 

 

I highly suggest watching Flamu in YouTube. His streams can be immature and not for everyone, but his videos are in good quality. 

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The majority of people always seems to be attracted to what is considered the "most powerful". Regardings warships this usually means that nearly everyone wants to have Bismarck-, Yamato- or Iowa-class ships. Regarding tanks everyone wants to have a "King Tiger". Regarding real wildlife predators, people are crazy for tigers, lions, great white sharks. It's a psychological thing, I guess. So in WoT or WoWs a lot of people play battleships or heavy tanks, not exactly because of the style of play, but because of the connotation of power. That's what defines their popularity, in my eyes.

 

Yes, most BBs are about patience and strategic thinking, as you aren't flexible (= fast and maneuverable) enough to change your strategy once you are a few minutes into the game. At higher levels, when speed and range of the BBs grow, things may be a bit different. Can't tell you first hand, since playing on a on-and-off-base and levelling all nations and classes (except CVs) at the same time, I haven't progressed past tier 7 and in fact prefer tiers 4 - 6.

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