Nanopizza

Returning Player looking for some advice :)

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Hey there! 

So I recently decided to come back to the game after a very long break, that being that I mostly played in the alpha/beta and have only casually played the odd game since then. 

Since I moved to the UK recently I decided to totally remake my account on EU and start fresh - I've been having a lot of fun! ... But I have some questions and concerns I'd quite like to get some answers to that have been causing me some issues. 

 

Firstly, unless my memory fails me, it seems like there are oh-so-many more Battleships in every match than there was back when I used to play, like i'm talking at least 5-7 players per team will be battleships with maybe 1 or 2 cruisers max (like really where have all the cruisers gone? O.o) and a few destroyers. The thing is I like to play Cruisers but the whole "everyone's a battleship" is causing me a lot of headaches. As far as i'm aware Cruisers are countered by Battleships, so how is one wanting to play a cruiser supposed to be competitive when almost all the enemies are your counter? Am I playing wrong, is this an issue with me or are cruisers just in a naturally bad place with matchmaking like this? Are Cruisers struggling right now because of this or are they as good as ever? If this is the case, is there any reason for this Battleship spam and is it likely to subside? (I'm currently playing tier III-VI ships right now so i'm not sure if it's the same at tier IX to X).

 

My second concern is that I'm currently on the Furutaka and i've read peoples suggestions and advice on how to play it but I just don't seem to be able to make it work. I hear this ship is actually a really good so It leaves me a bit disheartened for continuing the rest of the IJN cruiser line. Is this more-or-less the play-style of the rest of the ship line or does it get better? Is the Furutaka an oddball IJN cruiser that doesn't really play much like the others or is she a good indicator of the rest of the line of those ships? I have issues with the whole "you gotta keep your front towards the enemy at all times and never expose broadside thing." like how does one actually maneuver around the battlefield if you have to be head-on all the time? People say "you gotta play it like a Battleship" but I can't stand Battleship gameplay, it's far too slow and non-adaptive for me, so is the rest of the line like this ethos? Or could my issues be due to my aforementioned Battleship spam? 

 

Another thing is that I've been thinking of giving the Frenchie cruisers a go; However I recall when I was watching Jingles' review video of them on Youtube when they were in the test server that the tier 10 was rather underwhelming and not very competitive, did this change before release? Or is it still rather mediocre? I got the tier VI De Grasse premium cruiser and I really like how it plays, is the rest of the line similar? Also, i've been thinking of trying the German Destroyers. I love the guns on the Russian DD's and the amazing, long range, Torps' of IJN ones - and I hear the Germans are somewhat of a middleground? How is that line, is the tier 10 good? 

 

Sorry for the question spam - i'm just really getting into the game but feel a little bit lost on some fronts and would like to find a line of ships to really focus on as well as get some clarification on some concerns of mine. As I last played the game seriously in alpha/beta I think I had a Fubuki and Mogami (when those were tier 7) and remember liking the Myoko but not the Fubuki so much but I think that was mainly because I needed to learn how to play it xD. I remember wishing it had way better guns so I had something to do between torps' though. 

 

Thanks to anyone who can answer me i'll make sure to monitor the thread and I look forward to some responses :) 

 


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Welcome back , to cut it short the game is full of BBs , Stealth Firing has been removed ,  WG hate CVs , IJN DDs took a nerf bat to the nuts , And CA/CLs can still be deleted in one shot , Apart from that I hope you enjoy your return. :Smile_smile:


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1. Its world of Battleships now. Basicly they have been giving all the tools to play alone (Good to Awesome AA, Hydro on German BBs, Missouri has Radar, Hard/Impossible to Citadel (German and UK), insane heal (Hightier UK) and whatelse). Most other Classes did get (lots of) nerfs inbetween.

Playing Cruiser is not really easy. Hightier will get worse when BBs are more accurate.

 

2. IJN Cruisers should mostly be HE spammers at long ranges. Bow on doesnt work on higher tiers as BB will overmatch your armor. The best thing is to kite away and melt your opponents with Fire.

 

3. I dont think Henry IV is weak now. But some ppl say u cant really carry a game in that (flamu). French Cruisers have a weird armor layout which kinda eats damage.

 

 


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8 minutes ago, DFens_666 said:

1. Its world of Battleships now. Basicly they have been giving all the tools to play alone (Good to Awesome AA, Hydro on German BBs, Missouri has Radar, Hard/Impossible to Citadel (German and UK), insane heal (Hightier UK) and whatelse). Most other Classes did get (lots of) nerfs inbetween.

Playing Cruiser is not really easy. Hightier will get worse when BBs are more accurate.

 

2. IJN Cruisers should mostly be HE spammers at long ranges. Bow on doesnt work on higher tiers as BB will overmatch your armor. The best thing is to kite away and melt your opponents with Fire.

 

3. I dont think Henry IV is weak now. But some ppl say u cant really carry a game in that (flamu). French Cruisers have a weird armor layout which kinda eats damage.

 

 

Hmmm ok, from what i've been reading just browsing the forums and the replies here it seems the Battleship spam is indeed a thing, which is a bit of a shame. 

 

By eat damage do you mean that's a in bounces/shrugs off a lot of damage or as in takes a lot of extra damage and gets rekt easily?

 

Thanks :)


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19 minutes ago, Nanopizza said:

Firstly, unless my memory fails me, it seems like there are oh-so-many more Battleships in every match than there was back when I used to play, like i'm talking at least 5-7 players per team will be battleships with maybe 1 or 2 cruisers max (like really where have all the cruisers gone? O.o) and a few destroyers. The thing is I like to play Cruisers but the whole "everyone's a battleship" is causing me a lot of headaches. As far as i'm aware Cruisers are countered by Battleships, so how is one wanting to play a cruiser supposed to be competitive when almost all the enemies are your counter? Am I playing wrong, is this an issue with me or are cruisers just in a naturally bad place with matchmaking like this? Are Cruisers struggling right now because of this or are they as good as ever? If this is the case, is there any reason for this Battleship spam and is it likely to subside? (I'm currently playing tier III-VI ships right now so i'm not sure if it's the same at tier IX to X).

BBs are the easiest class that even the lowest skilled can play, thanks to their great survivability. And WoWs has many players with low skill ^^

That's why there are so many BBs and I doubt their number will shrink.

And yes, cruisers have a hard time with that many BBs around. But they are still strong. (With a few exceptions.) You just have to play more careful.

 

25 minutes ago, Nanopizza said:

how does one actually maneuver around the battlefield if you have to be head-on all the time?

You only maneuver when not spotted. Or when you are sure nobody is shooting at you. (That's why Priority Target is a must-have on every cruiser).

 

29 minutes ago, Nanopizza said:

Furutaka

Have you already seen this one?

 

28 minutes ago, Nanopizza said:

Also, i've been thinking of trying the German Destroyers. I love the guns on the Russian DD's and the amazing, long range, Torps' of IJN ones - and I hear the Germans are somewhat of a middleground? How is that line, is the tier 10 good? 

The Z-52 is very strong with it's 5.8km hydro and fast reloading torps.


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7 minutes ago, Commander_Cornflakes said:

BBs are the easiest class that even the lowest skilled can play, thanks to their great survivability. And WoWs has many players with low skill ^^

That's why there are so many BBs and I doubt their number will shrink.

And yes, cruisers have a hard time with that many BBs around. But they are still strong. (With a few exceptions.) You just have to play more careful.

 

You only maneuver when not spotted. Or when you are sure nobody is shooting at you. (That's why Priority Target is a must-have on every cruiser).

 

Have you already seen this one?

 

The Z-52 is very strong with it's 5.8km hydro and fast reloading torps.

Thanks for the video link I checked it out and I think it helps a bit, i'll give it a try tomorrow. I watched some of Yuro's videos before but as I wasn't playing the game I didn't really pay attention to the contents of the guide itself xD. 

I'll keep the Z-52 in mind then too, thanks :)

 


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The BB situation is a bit annoying with max amounts of BBs almost every battle, thankfully 5 per side is the limit.

IJN CAs are relatively good in this situation though with the best HE shells of all cruisers.

Furutaka is pretty typical of IJN CA but the rate of fire gets better as you go and then at tier 10 you get some really comfortable guns on the Zao with great ballistics. Having torpedoes which are actually usable in non-suicidal situations is also pretty nice.

I don't know much about French cruisers above tier 8, but they feel like another line of HE spammers but with worse HE than the IJN. Not seeing much about that line which would make me pick it over the IJN tbh. I think that for HE you either pick IJN or RU, both have a different approach to it.


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Oh? There is a limit to BB numbers? I did not know that... Hallelujah! Finally some sensible news then. Though that said, i still hate the games with 5BB, 5DD and only 2 Cruisers.... Hehe! Especially, since I am currently trying to learn how to cruiser, hard to learn or to accomplish anything, if you spend the entire game just dodging BB's and hiding.

 

That said, I have come to conclusion that Furutaka is a very good ship, though as any Cruiser it is an easy kill for any BB and having a good game can be very conditional but it is the same in any Cruiser. Survivability just isn't something they have going for them, well not until they limit the number of BB's per team to 3 at least. Furu is a very good foretaste on what to expect with IJN Cruisers and plays exactly like her bigger cousins, so it is an excellent teacher. I had quite a few good games in her recently.

 

I think the key to playing Cruiser is to always assume that every BB in the game is targeting you in particular (as Cruiser, you are ALWAYS the priority target for an easy kill) at every moment. If / when you are spotted, you WILL BE instantly targeted by every gun in the enemy team. Remember that they all can one shot you from any range and angle, if they hit and - especially in IJN Cruisers, torpedoes can be your saving grace, when used deftly. HE spam is the way you will do most damage, AP, if you are lucky enough to have a game with many other Cruisers, but that is rare indeed.

 

French Cruisers play kinda like large, very un-stealthy gun DD's with poor armor and very few torpedoes. Germans have a good AP, but that advantage is conditional due to scarcity of other cruisers to target, they also have (well relatively speaking - You still get citadelled a lot by BB's) good armor. Russians are basically flamethrowers with no armor but good speed, they also get radar at higher tiers. USN Cruisers are gunships, fast-firing and again relaticely good armor. IJN? Well, they are excellent and I specialize on them, but they are kinda awkward to play mostly due to poor torpedo firing angles, which may force you to expose your side at very inopportune moments, if you intend to use them. Playing them takes some advance planning and their guns have a good fire chance and damage. British cruisers fire only AP and are made of paper, BUT they do have smoke and torps and are quite agile, very good for killing DD's (unfortunately I have learned this the hard way  - I am a DD main myself).

 

The reason why you see so many RN BB's is that they were basically custom-made for the unskilled so that the player need not bother about learning any d*mn tactics (like occasionally switching ammo type etc. "difficult" stuff) but can just spam HE the entire match and still get good results, also their citadels have been sunk lower (almost) below the waterline so they are not so easy to Citadel when compared to others.

 

So that's most of it in a nutshell... Have fun! :cap_old::Smile_playing:


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Thanks for all the replies guys, it's been real useful. I'll keep banging away at the Furutaka and try to get my head around it. It's a bit of a shame that BB spam seems to be an issue but oh well, maybe i'll just throw some more Destroyer gameplay into the mix with all those juicy, slow targets:P

 

 


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9 hours ago, Nanopizza said:

By eat damage do you mean that's a in bounces/shrugs off a lot of damage or as in takes a lot of extra damage and gets rekt easily?

 

Its like a black whole. Not always getting all the damage u should. F.e. i was shooting a De grasse 2-3km away from me got 9 Pens and i made 2k Damage...

 


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If you are returning you should get a feel for the new captain skills. Flamu has a whole bunch of video's up on YouTube. As an IJN cruiser player you have to beeline to 10 points for concealment expert:

 

row 1 - priority target

row 2 - expert marksman, after 10 points come back and grab adrenaline rush

row 3 - demolition expert

row 4 - concealment expert

 

Some cruisers (<155mm cal) benefit greatly from inertia fuse for HE, you might want to take that before CE if you play the soviet line for example.


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9 hours ago, Nechrom said:

The BB situation is a bit annoying with max amounts of BBs almost every battle, thankfully 5 per side is the limit.

Nope, there's no such limit for BBs.

ea6e273940.png


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But 99% its only 5 BBs. Those all BB matches mostly happen because one player (i guess mostly CV?) is too long in the queue and after he gets a second one the match starts instantly with the available ships at that time. Which are mostly BB.


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French cruisers play pretty much similarly from tier 4 all the way up to tier 10. So if you like Emile, you'll like Henri.


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9 hours ago, Commander_Cornflakes said:

Nope, there's no such limit for BBs.

ea6e273940.png

This limit exist. It just gets deactivated if a dumb carrier waits in the queue for too long (over 3 minutes). As soon as another rare Tier X CV finaly clicks battle the MM drags in 22 other poor souls that are available in the queue at the moment (which means lots of BBs) without waiting another secound or looking if he could form a smarter teamdistribution and matches like the one you posted happen.

This also causes other really funny stuff like matches 8 vs 8 in random outside of nighttime.

Usualy the players owning a Tier X CV know this (because they are so rare this can happen to them on a regular basis) so one of those Hakus was a d*ck that didn't care what happens and readily screws over the MM of 22 other players.


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9 hours ago, RAHJAILARI said:

Oh? There is a limit to BB numbers? I did not know that... Hallelujah! Finally some sensible news then. Though that said, i still hate the games with 5BB, 5DD and only 2 Cruisers.... Hehe! Especially, since I am currently trying to learn how to cruiser, hard to learn or to accomplish anything, if you spend the entire game just dodging BB's and hiding.

 

That said, I have come to conclusion that Furutaka is a very good ship, though as any Cruiser it is an easy kill for any BB and having a good game can be very conditional but it is the same in any Cruiser. Survivability just isn't something they have going for them, well not until they limit the number of BB's per team to 3 at least. Furu is a very good foretaste on what to expect with IJN Cruisers and plays exactly like her bigger cousins, so it is an excellent teacher. I had quite a few good games in her recently.

 

I think the key to playing Cruiser is to always assume that every BB in the game is targeting you in particular (as Cruiser, you are ALWAYS the priority target for an easy kill) at every moment. If / when you are spotted, you WILL BE instantly targeted by every gun in the enemy team. Remember that they all can one shot you from any range and angle, if they hit and - especially in IJN Cruisers, torpedoes can be your saving grace, when used deftly. HE spam is the way you will do most damage, AP, if you are lucky enough to have a game with many other Cruisers, but that is rare indeed.

 

French Cruisers play kinda like large, very un-stealthy gun DD's with poor armor and very few torpedoes. Germans have a good AP, but that advantage is conditional due to scarcity of other cruisers to target, they also have (well relatively speaking - You still get citadelled a lot by BB's) good armor. Russians are basically flamethrowers with no armor but good speed, they also get radar at higher tiers. USN Cruisers are gunships, fast-firing and again relaticely good armor. IJN? Well, they are excellent and I specialize on them, but they are kinda awkward to play mostly due to poor torpedo firing angles, which may force you to expose your side at very inopportune moments, if you intend to use them. Playing them takes some advance planning and their guns have a good fire chance and damage. British cruisers fire only AP and are made of paper, BUT they do have smoke and torps and are quite agile, very good for killing DD's (unfortunately I have learned this the hard way  - I am a DD main myself).

 

The reason why you see so many RN BB's is that they were basically custom-made for the unskilled so that the player need not bother about learning any d*mn tactics (like occasionally switching ammo type etc. "difficult" stuff) but can just spam HE the entire match and still get good results, also their citadels have been sunk lower (almost) below the waterline so they are not so easy to Citadel when compared to others.

 

So that's most of it in a nutshell... Have fun! :cap_old::Smile_playing:

 

The reason why you see so many RN BB's is that they were basically custom-made for the unskilled so that the player need not bother about learning any d*mn tactics (like occasionally switching ammo type etc. "difficult" stuff) but can just spam HE the entire match and still get good results, also their citadels have been sunk lower (almost) below the waterline so they are not so easy to Citadel when compared to others.

 

 

 

I'm exclusivly using AP in my Monarch and have found it to be exceptionally good. Not touched HE..


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4 hours ago, Miessa3 said:

This limit exist. It just gets deactivated if a dumb carrier waits in the queue for two long (over 3 minutes). As soon as another rare Tier X CV finaly clicks battle the MM drags in 22 other poor souls that are available in the queue at the moment (which means lots of BBs) without waiting another secound or looking if he could form a smarter teamdistribution and matches like the one you posted happen.

This also causes other really funny stuff like matches 8 vs 8 in random outside of nighttime.

Usualy the players owning a Tier X CV know this (because they are so rare this can happen to them on a regular basis) so one of those Hakus was a d*ck that didn't care what happens and readily screws over the MM of 22 other players.

Well, this is not cv related.

The MM algorithm has a kind of safety valve, which will trigger when a certain threshold in the BB% queue population is reached.

Then it will launch a game with only BBs, or at least 90% BBs, to help decrease faster the BB queue population.

This is wargaming logic: better totally f**k up one game than several others a bit.


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Then why are there always CVs in those matches? I think ive seen several screens of those and there has been always a CV. Maybe it can happen otherwise too, but the CV thing makes much more sense.

Btw ive seen queues with xxx BBs would have thought that couldnt happen then according to u?


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13 hours ago, Dragnorak said:

I'm exclusivly using AP in my Monarch and have found it to be exceptionally good. Not touched HE..

And Kudos to you for doing that good SIR. I did not mean to say that all, who play RN BB's are necessarily potatoes, naturally skilled players play them too and they will use AP (of course) for better results. My intention was merely to point out the main reason, why RN BB's seem to be so extraordinarily popular with those BB players, who use neither their rudder nor AP - Ever -> Because they do not need to. Well, Warspite is an exception of course.:cap_like:

 

In any case it is clear that these ships OP HE have specifically been created to act, as a crutch to those unable to grasp the concept of using AP, since they will make consistently good results anyway, so why bother?:Smile_Default: After all, otherwise you would at least sometimes see the same happening with other nation's BB's too, but you do not often encounter German BB's for example spamming HE or even IJN (and they have a relatively decent fire chance).

 


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2 hours ago, RAHJAILARI said:

And Kudos to you for doing that good SIR. I did not mean to say that all, who play RN BB's are necessarily potatoes, naturally skilled players play them too and they will use AP (of course) for better results. My intention was merely to point out the main reason, why RN BB's seem to be so extraordinarily popular with those BB players, who use neither their rudder nor AP - Ever -> Because they do not need to. Well, Warspite is an exception of course.:cap_like:

 

In any case it is clear that these ships OP HE have specifically been created to act, as a crutch to those unable to grasp the concept of using AP, since they will make consistently good results anyway, so why bother?:Smile_Default: After all, otherwise you would at least sometimes see the same happening with other nation's BB's too, but you do not often encounter German BB's for example spamming HE or even IJN (and they have a relatively decent fire chance).

 

 

Yes agreed. Actually the beest tactic is to set a fire or 3 and then switch to AP to continue but ive been getting such good damage with AP alone ive not bothered doing that myself. Perhap ill focus on that exclusivly this weekend and see if it makes a difference.


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