[TopSecret] How to deal with CONQUEROR

[P2Win]

I'll share the secret that will make your gaming experience better...

SHOOT AP AT IT ....... Conqueror does not need a nerf.

 

[Bortasqu]

Well, if the Conq is stupid enough to stay in the open in a terrible position while you blast him for 90k dmg, I'd say it was the players fault for dying.

 

Give the Conqueror to someone else that isn't braindead, and you're gonna get rekt imo.

[P2Win]

9 minutes ago, Sturmtiger_304 said:

Well, if the Conq is stupid enough to stay in the open in a terrible position while you blast him for 90k dmg, I'd say it was the players fault for dying.

 

Give the Conqueror to someone else that isn't braindead, and you're gonna get rekt imo.

 

I'll have you know that this individual is one of the best player on EU. Don't be quick to judge. It's weakness is AP but everytime people see one they are so scared and run away from it instead of focusing.

[wilkatis_LV]

For over a month I've been saying this.

Truly glad to see that probably for the 1st time there is someone else saying the same.

 

But hey, as long as people like Flamu keep yelling "OMG HE HE HE" every last potato will keep firing HE at them and they will keep healing and laughing at you...

Everything is OP if you try to poke them where they are at their strongest

[Namolis]

As a piece of evidence for why a Conq doesn't need a nerf this picture is not adequate.

[Exocet6951]

6 minutes ago, wilkatis_LV said:

For over a month I've been saying this.

Truly glad to see that probably for the 1st time there is someone else saying the same.

 

But hey, as long as people like Flamu keep yelling "OMG HE HE HE" every last potato will keep firing HE at them and they will keep healing and laughing at you...

Everything is OP if you try to poke them where they are at their strongest

 

Yes, please tell me how a ship with 32mm of plating everywhere, ie plating that can only be overmatched by a single gun in the game, is tots weak in the armor department, and will die with ease as soon as you point and click at it.

What I suspect happened in your match is that you were in a Yammie, and the Conq was permaspotted by a DD.

Wow, totally representative !

Let me just take an NC or a Mogami to repeat that results...
OH WAIT !

[Kartoffelmos]

Interesting.

Does this mean that all other tier 10 battleships need a buff since they are equally weak (or worse, depending on angling) to AP but don't have the super-heal?

[Namolis]

13 minutes ago, wilkatis_LV said:

For over a month I've been saying this.

Truly glad to see that probably for the 1st time there is someone else saying the same.

 

But hey, as long as people like Flamu keep yelling "OMG HE HE HE" every last potato will keep firing HE at them and they will keep healing and laughing at you...

Everything is OP if you try to poke them where they are at their strongest

Conq vs any other BB = Conq will win

Conq vs any CA = Conq will win

In addition; Conq will do as good as Montana and better than Yama and GK vs CV (good AA). Conq will do better than Yama and Montana vs DDs (though perhaps not as good as GK due to hydro).

 

And this ship is fine? No. Friendlies insisting on dying before the Conq can burn down the opposition and clear a path for cruisers does not mean that the ship is fine.

[cro_pwr]

[WeGreedy]

2 hours ago, Exocet6951 said:

Let me just take an NC or a Mogami to repeat that results...

3 hours ago, P2Win said:

SHOOT AP AT IT

 

[wilkatis_LV]

2 hours ago, Exocet6951 said:

 

Yes, please tell me how a ship with 32mm of plating everywhere, ie plating that can only be overmatched by a single gun in the game, is tots weak in the armor department, and will die with ease as soon as you point and click at it.

What I suspect happened in your match is that you were in a Yammie, and the Conq was permaspotted by a DD.

Wow, totally representative !

Let me just take an NC or a Mogami to repeat that results...
OH WAIT !

 

Conq has armour in 2 places. Those would be Port Main Belt and Starboard Main Belt. Anything else? Most cruisers would laugh at that "anything else".

Can be overmatched by just 1 ship? Please, go start a petition how OP broken OMG I CAN'T PEN it every tier 8+ BB is, becuase ALL OF THEM have 32+mm armour, and guess who are the 3 least armoured BBs from tier 8 up - Monarch, Lion, Conq. Amagi has better armour than the Conq, and more or less everyone calls her something between "squishy" and "ridiculously squishy". Go ahead, start a petition how that 32mm is way too much on every tier 8+ BB.

And don't forget the superstructure. It was what - 19mm? That would be like what - 279mm gun to overmatch it? And hell, it's not a small superstructure on it.

---

I almost never play my Yamato, after the Izumo that ship is a massive disappointment to me. Basically all of my experience going against Conqs is in the Amagi, Kii and Missouri. Have to say, Amagi and Missouri had no problems, and the sample size in Kii is a bit too small to judge accurately.

Permaspotted by DD? You know what a spotting aircraft / catapult fighter are, right? Conq has a bit hard time hiding from planes. even if you don't have that - Fire back at him every time he fires, you'll have 20 seconds to do it every time. As long as someone is within 24-ish km from him when he fires.

---

Let me compare Atago to my Yamato. Damn, Atago can't overmatch tier 10 BBs bow, must be a horribly bad ship, oh unlucky me for buying such a bad ship! Oh w8, a tier 8 ship is a great comparison to a tier 10 ship, isn't it...

 

 

 

1 hour ago, Namolis said:

Conq vs any other BB = Conq will win

Conq vs any CA = Conq will win

In addition; Conq will do as good as Montana and better than Yama and GK vs CV (good AA). Conq will do better than Yama and Montana vs DDs (though perhaps not as good as GK due to hydro).

 

And this ship is fine? No. Friendlies insisting on dying before the Conq can burn down the opposition and clear a path for cruisers does not mean that the ship is fine.

Conq vs BB = BB will win with 2 simple rules.

1) BB isn't dumb eneough to spam HE which Conqu can repair and ignore

2) BB realizes that angling vs HE means less hits = less damage. You have 25...30 seconds between each shot, use it for something better than scratching your [figure it out yourself] and sitting flat broadside on to him.

---

Conq vs CA

Yeah, because CAs stand such a good chance against other BBs. Oh how I miss the times before RN BB release when no CA got instantly deleted, god damn RN BBs with their special deleting powers!

---

Will do great against CV... in the first few min if the CV holds his planes over Conqs head. Conq has mid-range AA. Not long-range like Monty for example. Not sure if you've played the RN BBs yourself, but at lest from  QE to Lion they all have one rather distinct AA trait. And I doubt it suddenly changes on Conq.

All of them have great mid-range AA, and all of them lose it the second some HE starts coming in. Just today my Lions AA went from 509 to 73 in 1 HE volly from an Ibuki. Much AA, such wow, will almost save the DD ramming you from getting TB'd.

---

Good vs DDs? Yeah, because a ship who's infamous for firing HE will do badly against a lightly armoured target next to him. That would be like wondering why Deathstar in WoT can oneshot a light with his HESH, I mean, it's a light for god sake! Shouldn't the TD go vs heavies or something?!

And Yama does badly vs DDs because of her abysmally bad turret traverse, at close range you are unable to track DDs as your turrets aren't fast enough. You almost have to literally aim ahead and wait for them to come in your sights instead of aiming directly

---

Yes it is fine. As long as [insert a fitting swearword] keep spamming HE and fires against Conq, he will keep healing, as long as everyone insists on "no point to angle vs HE" he will land more shells than he should. What a surprise.

---

 

 

 

You are literally trying to run through a wall and wondering why it doesn't work instead of going through the doors.

[ClappingLollies]

The awesome 10k AP salvos from a Des Moines <3. Only potaoes struggle more with the Conq than any other BB. 

[lup3s]

38 minutes ago, wilkatis_LV said:

Amagi has better armour than the Conq, and more or less everyone calls her something between "squishy" and "ridiculously squishy".

 

At least you can hit the citadel of an Amagi (and it doesn't have the zombie heal the Conqueror has).

 

I would just like WG to raise the citadel of the Conqueror; not too much, just not hidden far below the waterline.

[ClappingLollies]

3 minutes ago, lup3s said:

 

At least you can hit the citadel of an Amagi (and it doesn't have the zombie heal the Conqueror has).

 

I would just like WG to raise the citadel of the Conqueror; not too much, just not hidden far below the waterline.

You mean for all the BBs, not just the Conq? 

[wilkatis_LV]

45 minutes ago, lup3s said:

 

At least you can hit the citadel of an Amagi (and it doesn't have the zombie heal the Conqueror has).

 

I would just like WG to raise the citadel of the Conqueror; not too much, just not hidden far below the waterline.

 

Wait, you can hit Amagis citadel? But it's 100% under water! It's submerged! It's OP CANT HIT NEW MECHANIC STUPID GIMMICK, isn't it? And the Amagi actually has a turtleback, which I'm pretty sure Conq doesn't have...

And as for "can't citadel Conq" - all 3 of my examples - Amagi, Kii and Missouri - plus the [insert swear word here] we call the British tier 8 BB - the Monarch - disagree with you. Have scored cit hits on Conq with all 4 of those.

 

Of course if you'll insist on spamming HE you're not going to get the citadel, as of late I've learnt that this has to actually be specified for most people...

[WashedandDeceased]

17 minutes ago, wilkatis_LV said:

 

Wait, you can hit Amagis citadel? But it's 100% under water! It's submerged! It's OP CANT HIT NEW MECHANIC STUPID GIMMICK, isn't it? And the Amagi actually has a turtleback, which I'm pretty sure Conq doesn't have...

And as for "can't citadel Conq" - all 3 of my examples - Amagi, Kii and Missouri - plus the [insert swear word here] we call the British tier 8 BB - the Monarch - disagree with you. Have scored cit hits on Conq with all 4 of those.

 

Of course if you'll insist on spamming HE you're not going to get the citadel, as of late I've learnt that this has to actually be specified for most people...

 

Dude, just because you have managed to citadel the damn thing does not mean that you can do it reliably. I have managed to citadel Kurfursts, but that doesn't prove anything. Also yes, Amagi does have a turtleback, but that doesn't mean you're safe.

IMO if you show your flat broadside to an enemy and said enemy is a good shot, normally you should be punished. My issue is not with just the Conqueror, but with most high tier BBs in general. Almost impossible to citadel ze Germans, US BBs had their citadels lowered, UK BBs were lowered from the start.. only thing you can reliably blap is the Yamato. 

I love my BBs, but this is a tad too much. Let the British have their insane HE (although I'm wondering if the 1/4 pen is really needed) and fire chance and zombie heal, maybe even let them (like cruisers) be able to repair more than 10% of citadel hits, but making them a bit less forgiving would be nice (i.e. raise the citadel a bit). Good players will angle, potatoes will need to learn to adapt

[RamirezKurita]

14 hours ago, Freyr_90 said:

 

Dude, just because you have managed to citadel the damn thing does not mean that you can do it reliably. I have managed to citadel Kurfursts, but that doesn't prove anything. Also yes, Amagi does have a turtleback, but that doesn't mean you're safe.

IMO if you show your flat broadside to an enemy and said enemy is a good shot, normally you should be punished. My issue is not with just the Conqueror, but with most high tier BBs in general. Almost impossible to citadel ze Germans, US BBs had their citadels lowered, UK BBs were lowered from the start.. only thing you can reliably blap is the Yamato. 

 

Agreed on this, it's almost impossible to land citadel hits on most battleships these days, particularly more than 1 in a single salvo. I see that this has caused the knock-on effect that battleships tend to ignore each other in favour of shooting other ship types as they can't effectively damage each other, further pushing other ships out of the game as they just get focused down. I remember back in early OBT when a battleship sailing full broadside resulted in 3-4 citadel penetrations from another battleship at short ranges, nowadays it is more likely to just be a few regular pens, if that.

 

I personally think the Yamato should be the norm, not the exception, for citadels. Particularly as the whole reason why the AoN (All or Nothing) armour works is that the citadel alone is meant to provide enough reserve buoyancy to keep the ship afloat, and that doesn't make sense for underwater citadels as otherwise their center of buoyancy would cause them to capsize immediately. The worst part is that you can see where the citadel is meant to be in the armour viewer by looking at the parts that were actually armoured - in an AoN ship the citadel and the conning tower are the only parts of the ship to be armoured. On half of the battleships in the game the citadel isn't even armoured! All the armour is placed on the "casemates", when really half of what WG are classing as the casemate is actually part of the citadel.

 

If they wanted to make capital ships more survivable, there's much better ways of doing it than simply lowering citadels. Simply reducing penetration of all BB and CC guns would make them more forgiving against each other while also giving the chances to punish bad play (and making angling the better armoured cruisers a more viable strategy), alternatively altering ballistics to make shells arc more would both create a mid-range immune zone while also making plunging fire a thing and keeping the lethality of point-blank fire.

[Dazo_2015]

NoZoupForYou is entirely correct in his youtube video. Everyone is having 'kneejerk' reactions screaming "Conqueror is OP!" because of seeing what high ranked players who have free exp to Tier 10 can do with the ship who are all experts at staying alive in any ship. The high damage stats done by Conqueror is due to including the fire damage which can all be healed back. That does not help the conquerors team.

 

Whenever I tell people about all the bad battles I've had in the Conqueror they just say that's because I'm a crap player. Do well and that is because its OP. Well I've had absolutely no difficulty getting 6 kills in the KGV and I don't hear anyone calling that ship OP!

 

I've played Conqueror and been sunk by just 2 torps from a DD. I've been sunk 1 minute into a battle by 15 carrier aircraft because the cruiser I was with just didn't bother to defend me.

It needs time for more average casual players to earn the Conqueror before screaming OP.

 

I got a lot of the same when HMS Minotaur came out which is dead easy to sink but whenever I do well in that ship everyone just says I ONLY did well BECAUSE the Minotaur is so OP! Which it is not.

 

Conqueror is the "Minotaur of tier 10 battleships", its dead easy to sink! I don't care about coming up against Conqueror when I am in Minotaur. Of all the Tier 10 BBs Conqueror is by far the easiest one to sink! It has No spotter plane, No Sonar like German BBs, no Radar like USS Missouri, and low HP with a crappy anti torp belt so unlike the Yamato (that has taken a full 8 torp spread from my Mino and survived) Conq has no defense against Minotaur's torps.

 

Its a sitting duck, its blind and the super heal does not work against torpedo damage and it is just as vulnerable to Steel Rain as every other BB in the game!

 

Most Conqueror players just run away and let other ships fight the Minotaur while the Conq just spams HE at other battleships.

 

But "I can kill all tier 10 BBs with Minotaur so easily anyway because Minotaur is just so OP!"  Right? that's what I always get told.

 

I have also instantly deleted at least 4 full HP Minotaurs with HE salvoes from the Conquerors 457mm guns because the 18 inch HE shell penetrates 114 mm of belt armour.

 

And the Minotaur player said "I only did that because the Conqueror is OP!"

 

I cant win!

 

My team screws me over and my Conq gets sunk first, then its obviously because I'm a crap player!

 

However, I do great, and its only because my ship is OP.

 

Stop all the OP-new RN ship-hate-must nerf  propaganda. The ships win rate is no different than other T10 BBs. Its how the team plays that matters and a focused conqueror dies very fast indeed!

 

Flamu got so damn lucky with fires in his video.

 

In 1 battle I put 19 X 18 inch HE shells into an enemy BB with my Conqueror and I only caused 1 fire!

 

I have got almost as many kills with AP shells as I have with HE and like the first poster says AP shells work great on other Conquerors too.

 

The Conqueror is a very good all round battleship. If Conqueror gets nerfed it will become a lemon.

 

If you want to complain then complain about something that is truly OP such as the Moskva.

 

I say again NoZoupForYou was the ONLY youtuber who was being objective. He said "Should it be nerfed? NOT YET!"

[1MajorKoenig]

On 14.10.2017 at 4:27 PM, P2Win said:

I'll share the secret that will make your gaming experience better...

SHOOT AP AT IT ....... Conqueror does not need a nerf.

 

 

Hahaha our teaboos again desperately fighting for their braindead monkey ships.

 

Yes she does deserve a nerf and a quite harsh one. And the only way to kill these lollipop heals is to focus them down with the whole fleet. But that can't be the solution. They need to loose the heal at minimum.

[piritskenyer]

The problem isn'T that you need a brain and AP to defeat a Conqueror, the problem is that he doesn't need either of those things to defeat you.

[159Hunter]

34 minutes ago, Dazo_2015 said:

 

I've played Conqueror and been sunk by just 2 torps from a DD. I've been sunk 1 minute into a battle by 15 carrier aircraft because the cruiser I was with just didn't bother to defend me.

It needs time for more average casual players to earn the Conqueror before screaming OP.

2 torps = one detonation = unlucky.

Getting killed by CV 1 minute in game is factually impossible. And ofc it's your CVs fault and not yours...

 

34 minutes ago, Dazo_2015 said:

Conqueror is the "Minotaur of tier 10 battleships", its dead easy to sink! I don't care about coming up against Conqueror when I am in Minotaur. Of all the Tier 10 BBs Conqueror is by far the easiest one to sink! It has No spotter plane, No Sonar like German BBs, no Radar like USS Missouri, and low HP with a crappy anti torp belt so unlike the Yamato (that has taken a full 8 torp spread from my Mino and survived) Conq has no defense against Minotaur's torps.

Please tell me what you've been smoking, cause it's some good ****. Calling the Conqueror the easiest BB to sink? Maybe you need to look at tour positioning and correct use of your superheal.

 

34 minutes ago, Dazo_2015 said:

Its a sitting duck, its blind and the super heal does not work against torpedo damage and it is just as vulnerable to Steel Rain as every other BB in the game!

And it's super stealthy so getting out is soo much easier than any other BB when getting focussed.

 

34 minutes ago, Dazo_2015 said:

Most Conqueror players just run away and let other ships fight the Minotaur while the Conq just spams HE at other battleships.

?

 

34 minutes ago, Dazo_2015 said:

I have also instantly deleted at least 4 full HP Minotaurs with HE salvoes from the Conquerors 457mm guns because the 18 inch HE shell penetrates 114 mm of belt armour.

And there you have the problem, no need to even switch ammo cause HE does it all. That's just braindeath gameplay.

 

34 minutes ago, Dazo_2015 said:

My team screws me over and my Conq gets sunk first, then its obviously because I'm a crap player!

Look at your positioning. If you always die first, you probably play to aggressive.

 

[P2Win]

15 minutes ago, 1MajorKoenig said:

 

Hahaha our teaboos again desperately fighting for their braindead monkey ships.

 

Yes she does deserve a nerf and a quite harsh one. And the only way to kill these lollipop heals is to focus them down with the whole fleet. But that can't be the solution. They need to loose the heal at minimum.

 

You're lucky she doesn't have radar. What makes RN class special is the super heal. I doubt they will remove this.

[RamirezKurita]

4 minutes ago, P2Win said:

 

You're lucky she doesn't have radar. What makes RN class special is the super heal. I doubt they will remove this.

 

You mean the the super HE, the submerged citadels, super concealment and the super heal? They could remove 2 or 3 or those things and the RN ships will still have their special traits.

[dCK_Ad_Hominem]

Yeah, ofc you can heal the fire damage back, but then again this thing reliably scores 8k salvos with HE, destroys a ton of modules and at some point you will have to dc, at which point the C*ntqueror can easily stick permanent fires which will reduce your health to levels, even if momentarily, where you can be killed. 

 

Honestly, bb gameplay has turned way too much into easy mode as long as you don't eat torps. The point another poster made is quite valid. Why would I shoot a broadside bb I will likely hit for 10k despite perfect aim if I can instead absolutely wreck any cruiser not named roon or Hindenburg (whose immunity to close range citas is also very questionable)? Heck, when it comes to a Kurfürst even yamato cannot citadel that thing through the nose. Broadside should involve calculated risk. It did back in the day and that was perfectly okay. You could never know if you'd survive such a move. Today you can pretty much do the math and then decide to derp or not.

 

Sub 12km concealment shouldn't exist for bbs. Those ships are meant to tank, ergo removing them from view is contradictory right there, and again shifts the focus on cruisers which are pretty much doomed if they don't get the spotting advantage (Moskva might be the exception). 

 

I detest both RN lines. They are the same stupid gimmick lines that the French were in WoT. And they need so many things just to be viable like super heal, not losing speed when turning, magic pen values for low calibre guns. ... The list goes on.

[ShinGetsu]

Lol at people "omg I can do 10k AP salvo on Conqueror with cruisers so it's not OP"

I guess you sucks at aiming then, because I do the same with any cruisers tier8+ loaded with AP on any broadside BB.

 

But Conqueror actually also heals those AP damage easily as long as it's not a citadel hit. Far more easily than any other BB, and they eat the same 15k salvoes from my Moskva, Henri IV, or Hindenburg.