Torpedo tactics

[Wollongong]

Hi all,

please read and answer, and teach me, because I don't understand this.

When I am driving a battleship, I am often surprised by a destroyer that just suddenly pops up within torpedo range, they fire the torpedo before I can do a thing, and I am heading down to Davey Jones' locker.

When I am driving a Destroyer, I never manage to sneak up to a battleship for a surprise torpedo attack.

What am I doing wrong here (apart from being a sucky player), on both vessels?

[ColonelPete]

Good DD players do not get spotted. Launch your torpedos from stealth.

If you spot a DD, use WASD.

If you do not spot a DD in a BB, use WASD every 20 seconds, unless you are sure there is no DD targeting you.

[_Teob_]

Also, keep an eye out for smoke... If you are always in binocular mode, smoke doesn't actually render so you are probably going into a spider web without noticing, you big fat juicy fly. 

 

Also, don't come around close to islands (or stop for a couple of seconds before you do). Try to think what you would do as a DD.

[MeTaLMooSe]

Bear in mind if you are detected, regardless of being targeted and you can't see a ship or plane within your detection radius then a DD is stalking you or near by.

If you are detected then take evasive measures and close to friendlies.

A wary ship is hard to torpedo and a good DD will always try and stay undetected.

[G01ngToxicCommand0]

1 hour ago, Wollongong said:

Hi all,

please read and answer, and teach me, because I don't understand this.

When I am driving a battleship, I am often surprised by a destroyer that just suddenly pops up within torpedo range, they fire the torpedo before I can do a thing, and I am heading down to Davey Jones' locker.

When I am driving a Destroyer, I never manage to sneak up to a battleship for a surprise torpedo attack.

What am I doing wrong here (apart from being a sucky player), on both vessels?

 

-Do not launch all your torpedoes in one salvo but instead launch them in sequence with several seconds between them as you can then use the first salvo to turn the enemy in a direction where your subesequent torpedo salvos are heading.

-Try to get ahead and parallel to your target so that your torpedos has the best chance to intercept perpendicular to the target and which will increase the torpedoes effective maximum range.

- Learn to anticipate where the enemy might be going and launch torpedos toward that area.

- Keep your cools and do not fire torpedos too soon against close targets; wait for them to be in a situation where your torps are at the highest probability of connecting.

-Try to shoot at groups of ships preferably when they are deployed in depth so that the torpedos has a higher probability of hitting a target or even multiple if the enemy is unaware or very closely deployed.

- Launch torpedoes into areas where enemy is known to have been or be in but undetected as that can force the enemy to move away from that area, become detected or even eat a torp. If you have torpedo hits in this fashion tell your team so that it knows that at least one enemy is in that area.

 

Rule of thumb:

-ships on a constant bearing decreasing range to your ship: You can typically add minimum 2 km to your effective maximum range as that is typically the distance the target ship travels in the time it takes for the torpedos to reach it. The greater the range and target speed the greater this additional effective range will be.

-Conversely on a constant bearing increasing range subtract 2-3km from the effective maximum range of your torpedos.

-If sailing parallel to the targets axis and the bearing is perpendicular to your ship subtract at least 2 km from the effective maxium range.

 

 

[Ferry_25]

most simple trick: when your "detected" sign flares on = incoming shells/ torpedoes until proven otherwise = changing speeds and course in an unpredictable patern.

 

v.v.: above your minimap in battle there are small gearing weels. press control and move your mouse to them and select "detection range." That will put a circle around your ship on the minimap. Everything that's getting on or within that circle will see you. Not that some ships might have smaller circles than you do so they might see you and you don't see them. But your detected will flare on and move to step 1 as I explained.

 

Good question OP. Only stupid question is the one not asked.

[Gnirf]

Check before game which DDs are on enemy team and learn their detection range with CE, and their torps (they might not have CE or maybe stock torps so you can learn that too if you are numbers freak) but as a worst case scenario, Then you know which enemys you must be extra afraid of.

Also set your minimap for last known location. And be aware if DDs show up there. They might be unspotted but say your own CV flies over them you can judge how soon they might be a threat or their likely heading. I must say that this thing I added myself far too late in my gaming career, it is of great help. Also when the games goes longer and you might hunting unseen (Battle)ships this is very useful. 

 

The other side around if you are DD. Learn enemy radar ships (f.e. New Orleans , baltimore DM, Chapayev, Belfast etc there are more and their range  ,ships that have hydro (German BBs and cruisers can you at least count on+ several others, Be aware that enemy spotters from ships and CVs may spot your torps so if it is dangerous for you to be known and the game does not need a strike immediately it can make you hold your fire a little. With long torp reloads on some ships this is important. Might be targets elsewhere. Try to follow the advice above from earlier posts.

 

Also accept that in a Battleship if worse comes to worst it it is sometimes worth to take a torp if the alternative might be to show broadside to a Yamato and Montana, it is a sort of damage minimization sometimes. When you are experienced you seldom get completrly devstriked in a Battleship at higher tiers and do not expect to get any either, 1-2 hits is good.

 

At lower tiers there are solo DDs that rush you and they can be tricky to avoid as you are so slow with long reload and slow turrets. 

[HyoukaYukikaze]

5 hours ago, Wollongong said:

When I am driving a battleship, I am often surprised by a destroyer that just suddenly pops up within torpedo range, they fire the torpedo before I can do a thing, and I am heading down to Davey Jones' locker.

 

If a DD gets spoted while dropping torps it is almost impossible for these torps to hit. Or at least more than one. WASD hax and all.
At this point it's better to abort, retreat and find other target or yolo rush and drop from point blank range if guy has no support and you have enough HP to survive (and if you can kill him ofc, Yamato for example can survive 8 direct hits from Harekaze's torps and still have plenty of HP left).

As for how to achieve the ability to torp from stealth? Know your ship, thats all (most importantly torpedo range and both spotting ranges). And some situational awarness is usefull.
But not all DDs can stealth torp.

[AnotherDuck]

For BBs, the best thing is to learn and master map awareness.

1. Check what DDs the enemy team has at the start of the match.
2. If they're spotted, make a note of where they are.
3. Change course for a few seconds.
4. If there are signs of DD activity, such as torpedoes spotted, smoke that's closer than cruiser range, caps being capped, there's probably a DD in that area.
5. Change speed.
6. If there's at least one DD not spotted, and you're not completely behind allied ships, assume there are torpedoes heading your way, and take evasive actions.
7. Change course again.

For DDs, map awareness is still crucial.

1. Check what radar ships the enemy team has at the start of the match.
2. If they're spotted, make note of where they are, and unless you know what you're doing, stay at least 10 km away from them, or 12 km if it's a Russian cruiser. If someone tells you to cap within that radar range, don't cap.
3. Take notes from the BB section on figuring out where enemy DDs are.
4. Find a good target. A good target doesn't have spotting support, and isn't sailing away from you. Ships that sail away from you are much harder to hit, even if your torps can reach them.
5. Observe the target while getting into a good position. Does she make any turns, change speed, or otherwise seem aware?
6. Try to get where you have about 1 km left of your detectability and you're sailing in the same direction the target. Be careful to not get closer than that before you have the same heading. If you don't have detectability on the minimap, get it on the minimap. It's the single most important circle to have there. However, if there's a risk of being spotted (unknown DD locations, etc.), take it very carefully.
7. If a ship is sailing towards you, you can stealth fire torpedoes even if you've got a lower torpedo range than detectabilty. As a rough estimate, cruisers travel half the distance your torpedoes do at the same time, while battleships travel a third of the distance at lower tiers, and half once they get fast. Small anecdote, I once forgot I had Torpedo Acceleration, which lowers range and increases speed, on a captain I used on Kamikaze, which at that point don't have stealth torpedoes, only because I could still stealth fire with that technique.
8. If point 5 tells you it's a straightliner, go ahead, and you can chance a very focused launch pattern. If not, spread out more. If you're not certain and you have a long reload, observe a little more.
9. Depending on what torpedo reload and range you have, you have a few different torping options. However, narrow spread is the only choice unless you know absolutely everything about what you're doing, in which case you don't need a guide like this.
   • Full salvo works most of the time if you spread them out. Don't use wide spread, but aim one salvo at the white marker, and one in front or behind, depending on where you think the ship will turn. Most ships will turn towards you if they spot torpedoes, as that will generally limit the number of hits they take, but it's not certain.
   • Single salvo works if you have large salvos and long reloads (Shimakaze being the archtype for that strategy), as you can adjust the aim after you see reactions. That also keeps flooding if both salvos hit, which will give you a ton of flooding damage.
   • If you're very close, you can focus fire. Just remember that if you're passing a ship at odd angles or within a ship length or two, aiming can be surprisingly tricky. I've often seen people miss at 500 m because of that.
10. Watch your torpedoes, either with Shift zoom or follow them with Z. Learn how players react to torpedoes in different situations so you can better predict them next time.
11. Use the reload time to reposition yourself for the next strike.

[darky_fighter]

The most important tool: Minimap

The most important player skill: Situation Awareness

 

Quote

When I am driving a Destroyer, I never manage to sneak up to a battleship for a surprise torpedo attack.

 

Analyze the reason.

 

Try japanese DDs. They are very good for learning a stealthy gameplay.

 

Example: Umikaze

Detectability Range: 5,6 km

Torpedo Range: 8 km

So there is enough space to stay invisible.

[AnotherDuck]

4 minutes ago, darky_fighter said:

Example: Umikaze

Detectability Range: 5,6 km

Torpedo Range: 8 km

 

Umikaze is an awesome sealclubber low tier DD (see my stats). Personally I find she actually works better at T4-T5, though, where her stealth has more space to make itself unknown.

[Cyclops_]

I can not add to the very good info already added, makes good reading and I have learnt from the info given, many thanks guys.

I would also like to add that it is nice to see positive posts that answer the OP's concerns rather than negative and sarcastic  responses you often see, nice to see. 

[AnotherDuck]

57 minutes ago, OGHF_Cyclops said:

I would also like to add that it is nice to see positive posts that answer the OP's concerns rather than negative and sarcastic  responses you often see, nice to see. 

 

People respond far better to someone honestly asking for help rather than to someone complaining about stuff. You more often see the latter, so you more often see the negative and sarcastic responses.

[Deckeru_Maiku]

8 hours ago, Wollongong said:

Hi all,

please read and answer, and teach me, because I don't understand this.

When I am driving a battleship, I am often surprised by a destroyer that just suddenly pops up within torpedo range, they fire the torpedo before I can do a thing, and I am heading down to Davey Jones' locker.

When I am driving a Destroyer, I never manage to sneak up to a battleship for a surprise torpedo attack.

What am I doing wrong here (apart from being a sucky player), on both vessels?

 

One doesn't drive ships - on does sail them! That's what You do wrong. You have to evolve from a ship driver to a sailor.

[darky_fighter]

10 minutes ago, Deckeru_Maiku said:

 

One doesn't drive ships - on does sail them! That's what You do wrong. You have to evolve from a ship driver to a sailor.

 

I am not a native speaker but I think that you drive destroyers rather than sailing them. Example:

 

Quote

Heinrich Bruns was married and had 2 children; a daughter and a son. His main passion in the navy lay in 2 things; sailing the big three-masted sail training vessels and driving destroyers.

 

http://uboat.net/men/commanders/144.html

[Deckeru_Maiku]

8 minutes ago, darky_fighter said:

 

I am not a native speaker but I think that you drive destroyers. Example:

 

http://uboat.net/men/commanders/144.html

 

I'm no native english speaker either, but I guess so aren't the people responsible for that web page (= Sandro Coletta, Guðmundur Helgason & Jürgen Schlemm )

 

So how about some native english speaker (no american, please) to give us a final call: Do you SAIL or DRIVE a destroyer?

[Hedgehog1963]

8 hours ago, Wollongong said:

Hi all,

please read and answer, and teach me, because I don't understand this.

When I am driving a battleship, I am often surprised by a destroyer that just suddenly pops up within torpedo range, they fire the torpedo before I can do a thing, and I am heading down to Davey Jones' locker.

When I am driving a Destroyer, I never manage to sneak up to a battleship for a surprise torpedo attack.

What am I doing wrong here (apart from being a sucky player), on both vessels?

 

 

You might not be using the "right" destroyers.  Many Destroyers have a detection range greater than their torpedo range.  Japanese and higher tier other nations generally have greater torpedo range than their detection range and can "stealth launch." The first thing you'll know is when you first see the volley of fish coming for you.

 

The counter to this when in  a Battleship is to constantly change speed and course so that the destroyer fires and misses.  Rudder hard left-- hard right -full ahead - full astern randomly for five seconds at a time.

[HyoukaYukikaze]

1 hour ago, Deckeru_Maiku said:

 

Do you SAIL or DRIVE a destroyer?

In  a series of books by Jack Campbell they "drive" their ships. Granted, it is sci-fi, but afair he served in navy, so he might be getting terminology right.
And yeah, hes american :P so it might not count.

On the other hand i wouldn't be suprised if brits sailed their ships, as they seem to be attached to traditions. But if you ask me sailing a ship that doesnt have sails seems kinda strange. Imho driving fits modern ships much better.
 

3 hours ago, OGHF_Cyclops said:

I would also like to add that it is nice to see positive posts that answer the OP's concerns rather than negative and sarcastic  responses you often see, nice to see. 

Here is why:

9 hours ago, Wollongong said:

 

What am I doing wrong here (apart from being a sucky player), on both vessels?

OP is trying to find what he does wrong and corect his mistakes. He doesnt rage on torps being OP and BBs being UP as most ppl that come to formus with similar problems do. Thats why ppl react by being helpful.

[darky_fighter]

Quote

Steffan Watkins, an information technology security consultant who writes for Janes Intelligence on ship tracking, said the path of the Crystal, as posted from its Automatic Identification System, “looks like an automated course.” Instead of stopping so the crew could investigate what had just happened, the ship corrected its course and “kept accelerating” toward Tokyo, he said.

“It looks very much like the computer was driving,” he said.

 

NY Times is the source and the statement is from a ship tracking expert.

 

[ColonelPete]

Jingles said that they called it driving when he was in the Royal Navy.

[RenamedUser_92906789]

16 hours ago, Wollongong said:

Hi all,

please read and answer, and teach me, because I don't understand this.

When I am driving a battleship, I am often surprised by a destroyer that just suddenly pops up within torpedo range, they fire the torpedo before I can do a thing, and I am heading down to Davey Jones' locker.

When I am driving a Destroyer, I never manage to sneak up to a battleship for a surprise torpedo attack.

What am I doing wrong here (apart from being a sucky player), on both vessels?

 THIS !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

THIS is the exact reason why every other class except battleships gets nerfed to the ground.

Because BB players refuse to LEARN ... they just want to have it the easy way and not dealing with stuff like DETECTION MECHANICS.

 

Are you detected and there are no ships in your detection circle?

Then there must be a ship (probably a DD within you detection range). Launch a plane, and boom ... you will see torpedoes.

And dont venture alone ... because if you fail to dodge his torps its entirely your fault for venturing alone without support.

 

And dont sail in a straight line, because that DD had to predict where you will be in 30 second or so, so his torps would hit you.

If he has short range torpedoes, well ... he had to work HARD to sneak up on you ... and you let him, because you are not paying attention to your surroundings (minimap, detection status, planes....)

 

The key for success in this game (besides teamplay) is ... KNOW YOUR ENEMY (ships).

 

I see TOOOOOONS of BB players crying about EVERYTHING... and its just because they never even tried playing a DD or a cruiser.

Its not so easy to be successful in a DD as it might seem, because you have tons of ships and TOOLS (planes, hydro, radar...) working against you ... plus if you dodge torps the enemy has to sail in a straight line for some time.

A very simple WASD (course and speed change) and all your torps will miss.

 

 

[Procrastes]

17 hours ago, Wollongong said:

Hi all,

please read and answer, and teach me, because I don't understand this.

When I am driving a battleship, I am often surprised by a destroyer that just suddenly pops up within torpedo range, they fire the torpedo before I can do a thing, and I am heading down to Davey Jones' locker.

When I am driving a Destroyer, I never manage to sneak up to a battleship for a surprise torpedo attack.

What am I doing wrong here (apart from being a sucky player), on both vessels?

 

First of all, kudos to you for asking constructive questions instead of going into a diatribe against destroyers.

 

How you avoid torpedoes:

- Keep changing course and speed now and then, unless you are positively sure that you are not being spotted.

- Always assume that any nearby smoke screen is your enemy. If you see one, chances are good that torpedoes (hostile or friendly) are already in the water.

- If you are approaching an island, and get spotted, you should assume that the first thing that will meet you as you come around the corner, is a shoal of metal fish. This kind of torpedo ambush is a favourite destroyer/cruiser tactic.

 

How you torpedo a battleship

If your target practises safe battleship driving, as outlined above, pulling off a surprise torpedo attack is not as easy as it sounds. Here are some few tricks that I have picked up.

- If you attack an enemy that is already spotted by other ships, he will not be warned by his detection sense suddenly going off.

- If you attack while the enemy is distracted, such as when he is under fire or is himself shooting at your allies, the chances to achieve surprise is better.

- The shorter the range at which you manage to launch your torpedoes, the less time will pass until they reach the target, and the less risk for the target making a random change of course or speed.

- Wait a few seconds between each torpedo launch. If the torpedoes come from different angles, it will usually be harder to dodge them all.

- More importantly: Try, and try again! Keep launching torpedoes, not only at targets you can see but at places where a target might conceivably appear. Try to outguess your opponent; "If I were an enemy captain, where would I be going right now?"

- Most importantly: Do not fire torpedoes from second line!

 

Good luck with your future endeavours! I look forward to meeting you on the battlesea!

[procrastinatingStudent]

It is also worth noting that if you use Priority Target skill locking on woth torps does not count but your main guns do, so switching between gun to torps just to launch is another way of telling them "HEY GUY I JUST FIRED MY TORPEDOES AT YOU DON'T MOVE". (assuming that they to use PT). this works for all ships, say tripz can be even move stealthy vs ships

[Azrael_Ashemdion]

22 hours ago, Wollongong said:

Hi all,

please read and answer, and teach me, because I don't understand this.

When I am driving a battleship, I am often surprised by a destroyer that just suddenly pops up within torpedo range, they fire the torpedo before I can do a thing, and I am heading down to Davey Jones' locker.

When I am driving a Destroyer, I never manage to sneak up to a battleship for a surprise torpedo attack.

What am I doing wrong here (apart from being a sucky player), on both vessels?

 

Hmm...I can't say with authority without seeing a few replays, but I can give you some advice I give clanmates:

 

Drive a DD backwards from how you drive a BB.  

What this means is that you need to reverse how you approach the enemy - as a BB, generally you want to be nose on, with some cover to duck behind as you plod forward.  Closing into visual range is pretty unavoidable in this class of ship when tackling cruisers and larger targets.  

Things to look for when you are in a BB:

• Did you suddenly see your "ships targeting me" counter drop by 1?  That might be a DD switching to torpedoes.
• Are you sailing close to an island that the rest of your team can't see behind (check minimap)?  Was a DD seen in your area recently?  Start jinking and changing speed if yes to either of those.  
• When there is a DD who just popped up, train your 2ndaries on him immediately and get your guns on - even a big AP salvo might kill him before he can torp you, or at least it can damage him a lot and soften him up for your teammates to kill. 

In a DD, it's a different story - you don't want to be seen.  So instead of nose-on, you want to approach, then turn into a parallel course well before you enter spotting distance.  If you're following a parallel course and leading your target just a bit, you're in DD heaven.  Turn off well in advance of entering spotting range, the distance will close surprisingly fast.  You can always adjust distance gradually if you pulled off too soon, but you can't adjust if you end up getting too close and get spotted. 

Otherwise, if you decide to charge a BB and are going head to head with him, you want to go nose to nose and nudge off at the last minute so you can get your spread off and duck under his guns (or at least only eat one salvo).  

Things to look out for when you are in a DD:

• Battleships sailing on the outside of the enemy's "bubble" without a screen. 
• Are you sailing close to an island that the rest of your team can't see behind (check minimap)?  Was a DD seen in your area recently?  Be ready for an emergency duel if yes to either of those.  Otherwise try to use islands to hide behind while your target comes trundling along on the other side of it.  If you set up right, you can torp him and he'll never see you there. 
• If spotter planes are in the area, stay away.  Just don't try it.  Wait for the plane to land and then go in on him. 
• If you're spotted at all, change course every 1-3 seconds and maybe change speed a little too.  You're going to be shot at.  

Hope this helps - 

 

  Az

[aboomination]

17 hours ago, HyoukaYukikaze said:

If a DD gets spoted while dropping torps it is almost impossible for these torps to hit. Or at least more than one. WASD hax and all.

Unless the DD wanted to get spotted to make the target maneuver into the wrongly(?) placed torps ^^ But that lvl of finesse is rare.