friedrich der große - some suggestion needed

[Gugulugalaga]

Not at all. Thanks anyway. Now I equipped some upgrades and captain is not in training anymore. No change. Even the rudder shift upgrade seems wasted.

[rnat]

I'd recommend Dmg-Con instead of rudder. The ship is a tad to fat and prefers to be too close to make dodging really feasible.

Do you have the B-Hull yet ? The massive hp-boost and sizable reduction in rudder shift make all the difference.

[Gugulugalaga]

Yes, dodging doesn't work. Only predictive sailing....

[Guillotine]

Predict alot and try to make dispersion play along, i made this ship work in the last strech of the grind. I played 2ndary build becouse i wanted to be close and have tools to deal dmg when main guns shoot the moon.

 

Map awerenes, situational awerenes and escape route.

[Gugulugalaga]

Well, coming from the Bismarck, my Captain is of course built for secondaries. Not sure if that's still good though....

[Gugulugalaga]

After 27 games still junk. Then I ran out of creds and played the Nelson just one game. What a relief. Shots that hit, shots that make damage, a ship that can move around and so on. I guess it really is power creep. But I'd rather play a Nelson as T9. Probably would die as fast, but would deal way more damage.

[almitov]

For me FdG was never a bad ship. It is an oversized Bismarck - better gun penetration and damage, better hydro and more HP. I didn't love mine, but didn't hate it either. Typically I ask my team for help at the beginning and if they respond, I push the cap on which we agreed. With the german hydro, FdG can lead the charge, but always up to a point. You need to get close to do damage (secondary build + poor accuracy) but you also need to have a fallback option to hide (like an island nearby) when you get damaged too much and you need to recover some HP. Try to sync your hyrdo cooldown with the repair party usage - when you hydro is down hide and heal. Once it is up again, resume the push.

Communicate your intentions to your team before you do something, as otherwise you will likely die alone and with no real impact on the match. Do NOT overextend! This is something that I cannot stress enough - with KM BBs you may get the false feeling that you are indestructible and push way ahead of your team. I have done this many times and it is always a costly mistake - go too far and the DDs/CV will focus you. Also going after a CA/CL/gunboat DD when they are running away is a very BAD idea. You will miss them most of the time and you will burn to death.

 

I have had several frustrating moments with its notorious lack of accuracy, but one is burned into my mind - 4 consecutive salvos on a broadside Iowa from about 4-5km with no hits at all. This was the most rage-inducing moment I have ever had in this game, however if you play close range tank/support role, you will do damage and have large impact on the battle outcome. It is best if you play with a friend in a similar BB, so that you could swap places - when one is taking hits, the other one would heal and vice-versa. 

 

Another advice valid for most BBs, but especially the KM ones is - do NOT stay in smoke unless all enemy torpedo boats are visible and far away from you. Having german hydro gives false sense of security and a lot of BB captains tend to stay in friendly smoke while letting all their main and secondary armament rip the enemy to shreds. This often ends badly - you will see the torps, but you will not be able to do anything in time. And the easiest way to citadel KM BBs is via ship torps! 

 

Generally you need map awareness and team communication. GK can carry games in very bad situations, but FdG typically will fail to do so.

[rnat]

Mate the Friederich might just not be for you.

Sell it or let it sit in port until a later date, maybe you'll be able to make it work then.

If you really insist on trying here's some gameplay examples if you want.

Old one from Flamu

Spoiler

 

And 2 newer ones from a potato.

fdg.rar

 

Point is the Friederich let's you get away with "playing poorly", that is taking some liberties when being agressive

as long as your positioning is good enough to prevent the whole enemy team from punishing you for it.

[Gugulugalaga]

On 25.9.2017 at 1:32 PM, almitov said:

I have had several frustrating moments with its notorious lack of accuracy, but one is burned into my mind - 4 consecutive salvos on a broadside Iowa from about 4-5km with no hits at all. This was the most rage-inducing moment I have ever had in this game, ...

 

That's exactly what I mean. The rest is just common sense.

[rnat]

On 28/09/2017 at 6:33 PM, Gugulugalaga said:

 

That's exactly what I mean. The rest is just common sense.

In that case i don't see your problem.

The Friederich can be very troll/frustrating at times, but it makes up for it in other categories.

If you claim that the Nelson would do better, you're clearly doing something wrong.

[Redcap375]

We all have one (maybe more), but this is MY frustrating ship. 

 

I've changed the captain skills around so many times trying to get it right, but still cant find the answer.  I play it as a brawler but it suffers at high tier camping games.

 

It's tanky but receives a ton of damage by anything.  You slip up or drive too far out then your toast. CV will own you.  DDs will hurt you real badly if positioned incorrectly.

 

I play it too aggressively i know, but IMHO it was meant to be played this way.  The acc of the guns at long range is awful and only having 8 at tier 9 is painful.  I'm a Cruiser and CV player so i play BBs for sometime different, to smash face up close.  This style suffers at high tiers.

 

Its a rugby player in a football match.  It cant unleash its full potential as the game simply does alow it half the time.  Oh it can do well when the game turns into a brawing match, but they are more rare than the norm i'm afrade. I find that taking it slowly and waiting for the right moment (tanking at the same time) to push comes too late half the time as your team is already dead from long range firepower. Hindenburg/Roon will set you on fire and kite, Moska will set you on fire, angel AND hurt you, Zao will again, burn you.  All whilst your trying to hit them at 14 km + range with a 8 barrell shotgun.

 

Its smart play so i'm not blaming them at all.

 

Got so tired of being set on fire i changed from IFHE to FP.  I really liked the IFHE on the secondary and found i did alot more damage against Cruisers and DDs, but fire was stripping my health off far too quickly.  The arrival of RN BB made it alot worse.  

 

Its a good ship no doubt, but i just cant get my head around it.

 

56% Winrate with 84 battles under my belt. Avg Dam 65.0000. Not great at all compared to most of my other ships. 

[Gugulugalaga]

Now I have the B-hull, 42 games and 59.52% winratio. My tier 4 Orion has a higher average damage output. I would like to do damage in the FDG too. Can't. Only the secondaries can. When I win, it's because everyone and their mother shoots that large target and it gives my teammates more freedom. I don't consider not hitting your chosen target and instead letting secondaries do the job and trying to burn down as slowly as possible fun. Next goal are the bigger guns. Let's see, if I make more damage then. I certainly won't hit more.

If you're top tier it has some presence. People will run, if you rush them. No idea why.

[Mucker]

Get the 420s. They feel more powerful and consistent than the 406s especially at longer ranges. 

[Dropman12]

23 hours ago, Redcap375 said:

We all have one (maybe more), but this is MY frustrating ship. 

 

I've changed the captain skills around so many times trying to get it right, but still cant find the answer.  I play it as a brawler but it suffers at high tier camping games.

 

It's tanky but receives a ton of damage by anything.  You slip up or drive too far out then your toast. CV will own you.  DDs will hurt you real badly if positioned incorrectly.

 

I play it too aggressively i know, but IMHO it was meant to be played this way.  The acc of the guns at long range is awful and only having 8 at tier 9 is painful.  I'm a Cruiser and CV player so i play BBs for sometime different, to smash face up close.  This style suffers at high tiers.

 

Really? AFAIK FdG can be build into AAA monster. So CV are not such problem (and if it is to you, look for AA build). You have hydro so torps are not that much problem either. Plus if you compare it to T10 cruisers - if you can easily own them, something would be wrong, dont you thing? Another note is that if you position badly, DD will punish you reagardless of what your ship is. CV can own almost every lone ship, you know it better than me. Its as you point out - brawler in snipe meta. Not suited, but it doesnt make her bad ship.

 

14 hours ago, Gugulugalaga said:

Now I have the B-hull, 42 games and 59.52% winratio. My tier 4 Orion has a higher average damage output. I would like to do damage in the FDG too. Can't. Only the secondaries can. When I win, it's because everyone and their mother shoots that large target and it gives my teammates more freedom. I don't consider not hitting your chosen target and instead letting secondaries do the job and trying to burn down as slowly as possible fun. Next goal are the bigger guns. Let's see, if I make more damage then. I certainly won't hit more.

If you're top tier it has some presence. People will run, if you rush them. No idea why.

So you are judging stock ship without experience with it...good. Might be new to you, but stock ship perfom worse than elited one. With common sence you should know to grind it till you start judging it.

P.S: If you do more dmg in your T4 Bb than in T9 one, its clearly not for you. Leave it, for sake of your team.

[Gugulugalaga]

4 minutes ago, Dropman12 said:

So you are judging stock ship without experience with it...good. Might be new to you, but stock ship perfom worse than elited one. With common sence you should know to grind it till you start judging it.

P.S: If you do more dmg in your T4 Bb than in T9 one, its clearly not for you. Leave it, for sake of your team.

Sigh.... I was implying this, right? Right. Please read.

Second. Why do you think you can give me advice, when you've hidden your stats. Usually such players suck hard.... really hard and are sick of being called noobs due to their bad stats.

[Dropman12]

23 minutes ago, Gugulugalaga said:

Sigh.... I was implying this, right? Right. Please read.

Second. Why do you think you can give me advice, when you've hidden your stats. Usually such players suck hard.... really hard and are sick of being called noobs due to their bad stats.

I did. Point is that if you played Colorado or something like it, you should know there can be huge difference in performance of stock and elited ship. So bad performance of stock ship can be simply made by this. If I understand it, you played brawler with inferior speed, agility and HP pool. It is simple logic that it will not go well. And there is nothing to do until you elite it. Sorry, but it is something everybody should learn.

Second. I realy dont care what you or anybody else think about my stats. Im not saying my feelings, I simply say that if your dmg output is lower than in 5 tiers lower ship, you simply sucks in it. Im not judging, thats simply fact. Its brawler in camping meta, not the best place to be. Might not be suited for you, but there are plenty of ships and noone said you must be fine with every single one. I also wanted to be good CV captain just to found Im probalby the worst CV player ever. So CVs are sold, no shame. Life goes on...

 

[Gugulugalaga]

3 minutes ago, Dropman12 said:

I did. Point is that if you played Colorado or something like it, you should know there can be huge difference in performance of stock and elited ship. So bad performance of stock ship can be simply made by this. If I understand it, you played brawler with inferior speed, agility and HP pool. It is simple logic that it will not go well. And there is nothing to do until you elite it. Sorry, but it is something everybody should learn.

Second. I realy dont care what you or anybody else think about my stats. Im not saying my feelings, I simply say that if your dmg output is lower than in 5 tiers lower ship, you simply sucks in it. Im not judging, thats simply fact. Its brawler in camping meta, not the best place to be. Might not be suited for you, but there are plenty of ships and noone said you must be fine with every single one. I also wanted to be good CV captain just to found Im probalby the worst CV player ever. So CVs are sold, no shame. Life goes on...

 

Sigh again. That's all I have to say to this.

[Redcap375]

25 minutes ago, Dropman12 said:

1) Really? AFAIK FdG can be build into AAA monster. So CV are not such problem (and if it is to you, look for AA build). You have hydro so torps are not that much problem either. Plus if you compare it to T10 cruisers - if you can easily own them, something would be wrong, dont you thing? Another note is that if you position badly, DD will punish you reagardless of what your ship is. CV can own almost every lone ship, you know it better than me. Its as you point out - brawler in snipe meta. Not suited, but it doesnt make her bad ship.

 

 

Never said she was a bad ship, did I? 

 

It CAN be a AA monster no doubt m8, but to be honest does it warrant all that AA when only 1/4 of tier 9-10 games actuality have a CV in it? Already have BFT & AFT and IF a CV is in game then solo is a no-go (rhymes) anyway. Only been owned once in the Freddy when i was way out of position and pushed (rightly or wrongly) without the team.  I know what a Tahio  can do to the fat Freddy as i play it alot and its  one of the first targets on my list.  Bad turn, long, huge and poor torp bulge.

 

As you know, you face alot of tier 10 cruisers at tier 9. A Moskva will bow on tank, whilst throwing laser shells that hit hard AND set you on fire.  A Mino will rain a hail of AP death from a distance (in smoke) AND torp you when you try and get close to use hyrdo.  A Zao will just have you on fire all the time and the Hindenburg the same.  Correct me if i'm wrong, but a BB SHOULD be able to own a cruiser? One on One? Even one that is a tier above?  I would bet my mortgage on a moska beating a Freddy any day of the week. Kite all day long setting all the fires under the sun from a nice safe distance.  I mean, the freddy hardly has a good concealment does it? 

 

I can say that as i've played more games in a cruiser than any other ship. Anyway, one good hit on the Minator broadside and it goes boom.  I would say that was owned?

 

A CV can own almost every lone ship? Well well, if that was true then wouldn't that be easy?  Only that ships like the Fletcher, Gearing, Biti, Des Mons, Zao, Hindenburg, Roon, Mino, Iowa, Mon, Mini, (That Russian tier 10 dd) or any high tier ship for that fact that can pick defensive AA can avoid even the best torp drops and give any set of planes a real bloody nose.  Oh have i included the new RN tier 9 and 10 Ships? Wow they pack a AA punch when spec.

 

A cruiser has alot better chance of getting out a fix against a DD than a BB has (generally).  Acceleration for a start is quicker and turning circles (on most).  

 

I like the ship.  I like what i stands for, but its like you have stated its a brawler in a snipe meta.  That means its already ice skating up-a-hill before the game had even begun.

 

Its just frustrating to play for me. Its not bad its just that that good either. A Imuzo knows what to do, a Iowa knows what to do and the Lion defently knows what to do, but the Freddy just feels lost. IMHO

[Dropman12]

8 minutes ago, Redcap375 said:

 

Never said she was a bad ship, did I? 

.....

No, I was not refering directly to you. Didnt meant to argue with you. Was just saying that what you said about FdG can be said about most of others so its not only problem of FdG. While I agree with you, I dont think Iowa has better time when fighting Zao. But hey, thats question of game desing, kind of OT.

[Redcap375]

45 minutes ago, Dropman12 said:

No, I was not refering directly to you. Didnt meant to argue with you. Was just saying that what you said about FdG can be said about most of others so its not only problem of FdG. While I agree with you, I dont think Iowa has better time when fighting Zao. But hey, thats question of game desing, kind of OT.

 

Arguing doesn't get anyone anywhere .  Its an opinion at the end of the day.

 

Does a Iowa has a better time fighting a Zao? I wouldn't know as i don't have that lovely ship yet (got the Alamba tho) but its better at fighting in the meta than the Freddy.  Its not just a problem with the Feddy but it does, IMHO, suffer the most of all tier 9 BBs because of it.

 

To beat a Zao at its own game, i would rather be in a Iowa to be perfectly honest.

 

[Gugulugalaga]

Just to give you an idea, why I'm not happy with that ship. And there are ships that are perfectly fine even stock. I use the big guns now and I can't really see much of a difference.

[Dropman12]

3 hours ago, Redcap375 said:

 

Arguing doesn't get anyone anywhere .  Its an opinion at the end of the day.

 

Does a Iowa has a better time fighting a Zao? I wouldn't know as i don't have that lovely ship yet (got the Alamba tho) but its better at fighting in the meta than the Freddy.  Its not just a problem with the Feddy but it does, IMHO, suffer the most of all tier 9 BBs because of it.

 

To beat a Zao at its own game, i would rather be in a Iowa to be perfectly honest.

 

 

True that.

 

Well it does. 1 vs 1 Zao is not that much fearsome. Point is that Iowa does have great concealement, under 14km if Im correct. At that range Zao cant fire undetected, it must get inside 14km than open fire. At that distace you should be able to hit him. But its theory, in practise Zao burns you from distance as you are spoted by others. Make note I dont have Iowa neither. Im just theorycrafting.

[anonym_CsauhrZtDqUP]

Can't stand the ship, in my experience all tier 9 battleships have to be lacklustre to make the tier 10's look good.

[RAMJB]

Stock is an awful ship and I can't predict her being any better when researched. Because just one thing.

AP bombers.

The second there's an american carrier in the opposing team you're as good as dead and there's NOTHING you can do to prevent it. Nope, not even sailing next to a DM, because if the CV knows to add 1+1 he'll take his planes away when DFAA goes up, wait a minute, come back and send you back to port in one go. And if that doesn't work, you'll die in his second wave.

Ship is poor as it is, that on top of it makes it nigh unplayable. That travesty has to go out of the game. NOW.

[RAMJB]

10 hours ago, Dirty_Dunc said:

Can't stand the ship, in my experience all tier 9 battleships have to be lacklustre to make the tier 10's look good.

 

Iowa in my experience was pretty good. Well, except for the abject teams I had to suffer with her. Ended up free-XPing her into Montana because I just coudln't stand the horrible streak of nosepicking gluesniffers I was put besides every damned battle. Other than that's she was OK.

 

In fact I'll have to return back to her at some moment. I have a 40% ish WR on that poor ship, and she really doesn't deserve it. Nor do my stats :P