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roofy80

Invincible Saipan fighters

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Hi guys

so recently i have been struggling with my CV battles against saipan,they get the extra fighter extra bomber perk (so its 4 fighters not 3)and keep running from my fighters in battle (the ALT+ click ) and they dont lose an aircraft due to the rule that applies to it (doesn't lose a fighter because its base fighter squadron is 3 planes only) , they are invicible ! so is this intended because they are premium CV's or what ?

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Other CVs can also use that captain skill.. (+1 fighter, +1 DB)

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If the saipan you meet is lead by a skilled one you have no hope . Thanks god there are few skilled of them ,in the before rank session it wasn't op but now with that recent change it is.

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54 minutes ago, lup3s said:

Other CVs can also use that captain skill.. (+1 fighter, +1 DB)

Yes, but they don't get the same result from that. USN gains the least (since they have big squads), IJN get more (although they don't use DBs that much) while for Saipan int's +33% of fighter squadron strength.

 

But it's not this skill that is the problem, really (3 fighters/squadron is very few). The problem is that Saipan gets special treatment with game mechanics. She has better planes than anything she faces, her strafes are devastating and her speed enough to never get caught in dogfight unless she wants to. There is no reason to punish the opponent that manages to intercept Saipans fighters somehow! This is such an awful design. I would consider it ok-ish if it was a general rule for everyone: if your fighter squadron has 3 or less planes, it can run away without losing planes. But that's not how it works, right? It's not a game mechanic that benefits certain premium more than silver ships: it's outright special treatment. WG claims that "premiums are not excepted from global mechanics changes" apparently don't apply to Saipan.

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1 hour ago, lup3s said:

Other CVs can also use that captain skill.. (+1 fighter, +1 DB)

its not the skill that is the problem , the problem is they they dont lose an aircraft when they escape (ALT+ click) the skill is just to top it off. the IJN carriers have 4 planes to begin with and they lose an aircraft if they escape a dogfight

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1 hour ago, eliastion said:

Yes, but they don't get the same result from that. USN gains the least (since they have big squads), IJN get more (although they don't use DBs that much) while for Saipan int's +33% of fighter squadron strength.

 

But it's not this skill that is the problem, really (3 fighters/squadron is very few). The problem is that Saipan gets special treatment with game mechanics. She has better planes than anything she faces, her strafes are devastating and her speed enough to never get caught in dogfight unless she wants to. There is no reason to punish the opponent that manages to intercept Saipans fighters somehow! This is such an awful design. I would consider it ok-ish if it was a general rule for everyone: if your fighter squadron has 3 or less planes, it can run away without losing planes. But that's not how it works, right? It's not a game mechanic that benefits certain premium more than silver ships: it's outright special treatment. WG claims that "premiums are not excepted from global mechanics changes" apparently don't apply to Saipan.

Well said exactly my thoughts

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2 hours ago, eliastion said:

Yes, but they don't get the same result from that. USN gains the least (since they have big squads), IJN get more (although they don't use DBs that much) while for Saipan int's +33% of fighter squadron strength.

 

But it's not this skill that is the problem, really (3 fighters/squadron is very few). The problem is that Saipan gets special treatment with game mechanics. She has better planes than anything she faces, her strafes are devastating and her speed enough to never get caught in dogfight unless she wants to. There is no reason to punish the opponent that manages to intercept Saipans fighters somehow! This is such an awful design. I would consider it ok-ish if it was a general rule for everyone: if your fighter squadron has 3 or less planes, it can run away without losing planes. But that's not how it works, right? It's not a game mechanic that benefits certain premium more than silver ships: it's outright special treatment. WG claims that "premiums are not excepted from global mechanics changes" apparently don't apply to Saipan.

 

1 hour ago, roofy80 said:

its not the skill that is the problem , the problem is they they dont lose an aircraft when they escape (ALT+ click) the skill is just to top it off. the IJN carriers have 4 planes to begin with and they lose an aircraft if they escape a dogfight

 

I understand the problem, and I do think it should be fixed (dogfighting with Saipan is just ridiculous: tag enemy fighters, strafe with other squadron while exit-strafing with the tagged one & repeat). You can basically devastate the double 7-fighter squadrons of an AS Ranger with only losing a couple of fighters yourself.

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I have to say, for now I only fought once a skilled Saipan in my Kaga (obviously playing 2/2, cause you know, skilled Saipan will take 3/1 are so rare it may be a lost specie), and that was a horrible match for the both of us since any attempt to sneak the bomber close to the enemy team was followed by immediate counter move by the fighters. Be it his TBs or mine.

I pray for never fighting a skilled 3/1 Saipan with Kaga.

 

On the other hand, I also own a Saipan. Playing 2/2 of course. Overall it's not that amazing of a ship as a damage dealer (I love getting cursed by DDs too), but those fighters are clearly broken. (Add to it that most CV players are scrubs.)

I fought once another 3/1 Saipan with mine, he kept during THE WHOLE MATCH his fighters stuck to his bombers and never spotting, never strafing, never even attacking mine. He went afk after my second strafing. xD

 

Overall, the average Saipan player is so bad that most of the time you won't have to fear them. Just time well your strafing and the issue is solved in 2 or 3 attacks.

But when you fight someone who know how to uses the mechanics, those fighters are just broken. Not losing plane on straff when you only have 3 fighters, I can accept that. But please WG remove that protection when the CV has the +1 fighter skill... That wouldn't even be a nerf in regard to those teleporting planes with high HP and DPS... 

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I have a Saipan and never knew about this Alt click stuff, how do you get this knowledge? Mind you the passage of information by WG is mind bogglingly awful. It took many practices to get the strafe thing right, actually I think it just complicates an already busy play style. The manual ship attacks are good but watching two sets of fighters trying to strafe each other gets real boring real fast.

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Saipan fighters are just BROKEN.
Against skilled Saipan player you have 0 (ZERO) freaking chance of winning the dogfight, since he can just strafe out of combat all the time.
Just remove that thing allready. (Thankfully I managed to get to Shokaku, so I don't have to fight that abomination anymore)

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There is a single thing you can do to win a dogfight against a Saipan:

As soon as you see him disengage from a dogfight, give a move command to the fighter being disengaged from to follow them then strafe after the disengaging fighter squad. This will usually allow you to dodge an incoming strafe as well as wipe out the fighters running away.

This however requires precise timing (give a move command too early and your fighters stay rooted to their spot, give it too late and they're also dead) and the UI not screwing you over. And the latter tends to happen a lot, so it is by no means a reliable counter.

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well customer support replied to my ticket with the following :

thank you for contacting our Customer Support regarding your issue.

I am sorry to hear that you are not satisfied with game.

Unfortunately, our team is not able to influence or make any changes on the game development at all, therefore we are unable to assist you about such issues, nor forward your feedback to the developers. As much as we'd love to help, your request is beyond what we're able to do for customers. Should you have any constructive ideas on the game development, please make sure to post them on our forum:

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6 hours ago, peoplescavalry said:

I have a Saipan and never knew about this Alt click stuff, how do you get this knowledge? Mind you the passage of information by WG is mind bogglingly awful. It took many practices to get the strafe thing right, actually I think it just complicates an already busy play style. The manual ship attacks are good but watching two sets of fighters trying to strafe each other gets real boring real fast.

Look at the Controls section in the Settings? :Smile_sceptic: That's at least how I found out about manual attacks (even before I started playing CVs).

But you're correct that WG should give some additional (i.e. more clear) information about manual attacks.

Removing it from T4-T5 didn't help it though; there are a LOT of CV players at T6 & T7 who don't know about manual attacks. :Smile_facepalm:

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