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Ysterpyp

Why does this game not have kill assists

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Hi

 

This is the most basic feature missing in this wg product , why not reward people that do X% amount of damage to enemy target ?

 

For instance , i smoke up my team. I land a few torp hits , they kill secure it . I get no kills the whole game and my stats looks like @SS and dont get rewarded.

 

But the guy who kill secures it gets rewarded more 

 

It would be nice to see kill assist stats aswell for better analysis.

 

Thanks

 

 

 

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It is rewarded in XP...

 

Kill stealing gets you almost nothing unless you break a Kraken.

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It is rewarded in XP...

 

Kill stealing gets you almost nothing unless you break a Kraken.

 

Yea but xp is not used to calculate your wtr. Because its a flawed statistical metric 
Edited by Ysterpyp

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Yea but xp is not used to calculate your wtr. Because its a flawed statistical metric 

 

True but the only stat that matters is WR, unlike WoT where damage nets you the most XP.

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Supertester
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Hi

 

This is the most basic feature missing in this wg product , why not reward people that do X% amount of damage to enemy target ?

 

For instance , i smoke up my team. I land a few torp hits , they kill secure it . I get no kills the whole game and my stats looks like @SS and dont get rewarded.

 

But the guy who kill secures it gets rewarded more 

 

It would be nice to see kill assist stats aswell for better analysis.

 

Thanks

 

Although it works well on WoWp where planes have limited health pools, here on WoWs many ships (with larger health pools) can be hit by many different ships dealing similar amounts of damage, and that is where the problem lies. WHo, or how many of the players get 'Kill Assists'? 

 

What I do think is a little unfair, is when a player deals significant damage to a ship, and then for one player to deal a very small amount of damage to get that kill. I suggest that kills that do a very small amount of damage (<5%?) that culminate in the kill, get it 'downgraded' to 'Kill Assist'. I am in no way suggesting that the current system gets undermined, but merely to suggest that the registering of ship kills can be split, for example; Instead of 10 ship kills being registered, using the percentage of damage dealt by the 'killer', it could be 8 kills and 2 assists. Experience gained is not altered at all, just the registering of the kill.

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Kill assists sound just as flawed as kills themselves in this kind of game. What we do need is the damage% counter that would be a MUCH more useful statistical tool than raw damage numbers (in a game where two equal tier ships can have one 20k and the other 100k hp).

 

Where assists would be nice is rewarding with some XP the ship that forced repairs. It sometimes happens so that one ship sends torps, these hit and cause flooding, the ship repairs and then suffers another flooding shortly after - in such situation the second torper gets all the rewards for the flooding despite the fact that this damage being dealt at all is all thanks to the previous flooding a bit earlier. Similar situation with fires: the one who sets first couple fires is left with little reward for his trouble unless he's also the one to set fires after the first bunch gets extinguished.

There should be some system registering conditions (fires, flooding) that get repaired and some fraction of reward reaped by subsequent flooders and firesetters should be also received by the people who made sure that these later conditions stick for their full duration.

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Yea but xp is not used to calculate your wtr. Because its a flawed statistical metric 

Complain to the people who made WTR. That is not WGs responsibility.

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View PostYsterpyp, on 16 May 2017 - 08:25 AM, said:

 

Yea but xp is not used to calculate your wtr. Because its a flawed statistical metric 

Complain to the people who made WTR. That is not WGs responsibility.

It actually is , why dont they just return base xp insteal of modified xp in their API..

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I get no kills the whole game and my stats looks like @SS and dont get rewarded.

 

 

:( I was just thinking 'there's a guy who's stats look like@SS and doesn't get rewarded' while randomly looking at your stats.:amazed:

 

No one except you gives a damn about your stats.....who really gives a crap who get's the death shot as long as it's a win? 

Edited by bushwacker001

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It actually is , why dont they just return base xp insteal of modified xp in their API..

That is a completly different issue.

WTR is an abitrarily generated value. WG does make the formula.

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It actually is , why dont they just return base xp insteal of modified xp in their API..

It is because Players care about stats and high XP looks good on paper.

It is rewarded in XP...

 

Kill stealing gets you almost nothing unless you break a Kraken.

Doing the kill gets you 1/5th of the XP you get for destroying the whole ship. So for example doing the last 1000 Damage on a Yamato and killing her has the same XP Value as doing 20.000 Damage to her without killing her. So its kind of exploiting. Annoying but nothing you can do against it. See this quite often, that ships hold their fire for the very last shot.

Plus people who care about stats feel better with that higher kill ratio.

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That is a completly different issue.

WTR is an abitrarily generated value. WG does make the formula.

 

But WG prevents access to stats that could actually be useful for such formula, especially:

 - base XP

 - dmg% (rather than absolute numbers that say nothing)

WTR has an arbitrary formula but there's little point in complaining about said formula when it's mostly the lack of crucial data that makes it so unreliable.

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You sink ships as soon as you can.

Too often enemy ships with low HP get ignored.

 

​Aint that true. I have seen plenty of occasions where a ship has shot off with almost no health left, only to pop up right at the end and secure the win for the other team.
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I've had many games where I didnt get a single kill yet ended up on the top of the "Team Score" page above people with 3 or 4 kills.  So the team ranking page must be taking %damage into account.   Thats fine with me.  I wish they would also give more credit for caps and defends.

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It is because Players care about stats and high XP looks good on paper.

Doing the kill gets you 1/5th of the XP you get for destroying the whole ship. So for example doing the last 1000 Damage on a Yamato and killing her has the same XP Value as doing 20.000 Damage to her without killing her. So its kind of exploiting. Annoying but nothing you can do against it. See this quite often, that ships hold their fire for the very last shot.

Plus people who care about stats feel better with that higher kill ratio.

 

​I have help off attacking a ship that is almost out of health if a teammate is attacking it. But if the health of the two ships is similar, or there is any doubt what so ever, I will not hesitate to try and finish it off. But people who 'Kill Steal' don't always do it for malicious reasons. The sooner you sink a ship, the quicker you build up your numerical (and points) advantage, so they get a little trigger happy and just shoot at targets that are quick to finish off.

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But WG prevents access to stats that could actually be useful for such formula, especially:

 - base XP

 - dmg% (rather than absolute numbers that say nothing)

WTR has an arbitrary formula but there's little point in complaining about said formula when it's mostly the lack of crucial data that makes it so unreliable.

That does not change the fact that the weight of the different variables is completly arbitrary.

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​I have help off attacking a ship that is almost out of health if a teammate is attacking it. But if the health of the two ships is similar, or there is any doubt what so ever, I will not hesitate to try and finish it off. But people who 'Kill Steal' don't always do it for malicious reasons. The sooner you sink a ship, the quicker you build up your numerical (and points) advantage, so they get a little trigger happy and just shoot at targets that are quick to finish off.

 

I agree... its the old adage "a dead enemy cant shoot you" -- which doesnt work for CV's or artillery/torps already in the air/water, but its still a good idea to finish the low hp guys asap.

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Weekend Tester
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Yea but xp is not used to calculate your wtr. Because its a flawed statistical metric 

 

Easiest solution is to stop caring about your WTR. It doesn't properly take into accounts all the aspects of a game that contribute to a win and it's too easily farmable in DDs. You said it yourself that it's flawed, so don't get worked up over it.

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And AFAIK the harder a target is to damage the more rewarding it is. Hitting a DD in a BB with an overpen shot will yield more than 1 citadel on a fellow BB. Also hitting higher tier targets than you are is yielding more result. That's why I don't mind being out tiered often.

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Any damage you do is rewarded. Afaik the actual frag is only worth 15% of the victims potential XP/Credit reward, so anyone who sinks a ship on a sliver of health gets little reward for it and those who did the actual damage to it will get the full XP and credits for the damage they did.

 

I would say though that smoking up allies should be rewarded with XP and credits too. Smoking up good damage dealers is extremely valuable teamwork as they can work their dpm much more unimpeded when unspotted, so players who selflessly smoke up others should be rewarded a percentage of allied ships' damage (assisted damage, roughly the same principle as damage upon your spotting). And any allied ship exploiting a friendly smoke even if not laid for them specifically still gets the benefit from it, so the bonus can just apply to any smoked up ally without any need for working out a way to differentiate between purposefully smoking up allies or not).

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Yup, 15%, not 1/5 (which is 20% for those that might not know).

 

 

Which is still a nice chunk, for just doing the finishing blow.

 

You could argue that kills should be rewarded as taking out enemies wins matches, but then there really are that people who hold back fire just to get the kill. And thats as contraproductive as it can possibly get.

 

An assist badge would do no harm to anyone and if it keeps just 1 out of 1000 people from holding back fire, its already a win for everyone.

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15% is a fair reward. Securing kills is important, but I think 15% is small enough to keep the vast majority from blatantly trying to kill secure and not really contribute. That normally happens when there is some "kill 200 something something in two weeks" mission. At present I don't see that many kill steals (as in holding back until the very last second). It happens, but usually it is due to the ship doing it being low HP or otherwise in a risky position.

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Although it works well on WoWp where planes have limited health pools, here on WoWs many ships (with larger health pools) can be hit by many different ships dealing similar amounts of damage, and that is where the problem lies. WHo, or how many of the players get 'Kill Assists'? 

 

What I do think is a little unfair, is when a player deals significant damage to a ship, and then for one player to deal a very small amount of damage to get that kill. I suggest that kills that do a very small amount of damage (<5%?) that culminate in the kill, get it 'downgraded' to 'Kill Assist'. I am in no way suggesting that the current system gets undermined, but merely to suggest that the registering of ship kills can be split, for example; Instead of 10 ship kills being registered, using the percentage of damage dealt by the 'killer', it could be 8 kills and 2 assists. Experience gained is not altered at all, just the registering of the kill.

 

Look to FPS games for this in BF3 it was based on the procentage of damage .... the kill gave 100exp and assist was the one with the most % damage as exp. I think it was a good system.

 

 

 

Mang

 

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