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DingMan

HE Ammo is OP as HELL

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Sooo... as a BB I have to fire a salvo every 30 seconds and IF RNGesus is with me I MAY hit a citadel and hit 10k damage, and if RNGOD is with me I hit multiple citadels and do 20k (1 in a billion games). Meanwhile any cruiser on my tier fires salvos of HE every 10 seconds (if not faster) and every single one of them is 99% accurate and does an average of 2.5k of damage (I'm not even going to count fire, I'm ignoring fire completely). So if you do some simple math, on a 10seconds reload (waaaay slow for most CC fire rates which are better), you will get a CONSISTENT 15,000 damage per minute (ABSOLUTE MINIMUM). Meanwhile, as a BB if RNGesus and RNGOD do not give you that 1 in 100 good game, you're barely hitting 2-3k damage per minute (based on a complete random luck 1k overpen stray shell hitting SOMETHING on your target every now and then).

 

If THIS is the way WG intends the game to be played then I would love to hear one single good argument why anyone would go through the grief and aggravation of playing a BB in random battles where tactics and teamplay are null and as such, playing a BB which has NOTHING to offer to a team besides its HP pool, is useless.

Edited by DingMan

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If you're getting 2-3k average damage for every two salvos in a BB, then the problem is you (or you're playing the Mikasa).

 

It's true that cruiser damage is more consistent, but cruiser protection is also equally inconsistent. With less health than a BB and no heal (or a worse one) in most cases, the fight will always be the BB's to lose.

 

I don't even understand how you would reach this conclusion on your own unless you only play BBs and you are also super bad.

Please watch anyone decent play BBs, there are so many YouTube videos out there.

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Edited.
This post has been edited by the moderation team due to inappropriate remarks

Edited by Asklepi0s

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If you're getting 2-3k average damage for every two salvos in a BB, then the problem is you (or you're playing the Mikasa).

 

It's true that cruiser damage is more consistent, but cruiser protection is also equally inconsistent. With less health than a BB and no heal (or a worse one) in most cases, the fight will always be the BB's to lose.

 

I don't even understand how you would reach this conclusion on your own unless you only play BBs and you are also super bad.

Please watch anyone decent play BBs, there are so many YouTube videos out there.

 

The problem with YouTube channels is that they only show you that 1 in 100 games that are great. For every video of someone rocking with something, regardless of game, there's 100 more that go completely bad ;)

 

 

Edited by DingMan

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That logic is coming from I assume completely new player?

BBs are higest avarage damage dealers in game (excluding cvs at higher tiers).

When you learn what broadside is and how to aim, we will talk about battleships. For now we can talk about pussy.

Do you like wet or dry? 

 

 

 

Yeah I'm a new player, and I know how to lead, and I know how to get my RANDOM shells to fall RANDOMLY over the enemy ship and RANDOMLY do 1k damage of overpen through non-citadel areas. I like how there're always a bunch of "pros" that immediately jump with l2p and "you're the one that sucks" posts when it is an established and admitted fact that BBs ARE at the whim of RNGesus and their damage output is 100% based on RNGsus citadels. So thanks for the tip pro-man ;)

 

PS I also like how you're a CV/DD player who has very few battles in BBs so clearly you know everything about BBs :) and I'm sure BBs being underperforming right now doesn't bias you at all as a CV/DD player ;)

Edited by DingMan

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[WOTN]
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I actually thought of a better image for this! 

61690585_p0.jpg

One more thing. You shouldn't be pulling seniority over other people, especially when you have basically none.

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Weekend Tester
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You're too focused on the short term. On any given salvo RNG will play a large part, yes. So the trick is to aim well consistently and in the long run you'll be reaping the rewards, if you're not then it's not luck to blame but yourself.

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Yeah I'm a new player, and I know how to lead, and I know how to get my RANDOM shells to fall RANDOMLY over the enemy ship and RANDOMLY do 1k damage of overpen through non-citadel areas. I like how there're always a bunch of "pros" that immediately jump with l2p and "you're the one that sucks" posts when it is an established and admitted fact that BBs ARE at the whim of RNGesus and their damage output is 100% based on RNGsus citadels. So thanks for the tip pro-man ;)
 

 

Your hit ratio and damage numbers say ...... no.

 

 

Another fact: Citadels my be RNG-ish, but raw hitrates are not. The higher the range of the ship, the less you hit ...coincidence? ... why could that be?

 

Pro-tip: If you want to hit, get close. Effective gun range - aka random cruiser deletion occurs reliably around 15 km or less for Kongo/Fuso. So if the cruiser can shoot you, you can outright delete him - rule of thumb.

 

For example I use the secret W-W-W-W-hack at the beginning of the match, so my BB hitrates are usually only worse by a few % compared to my cruiser. (varies with ships obviously).

 

 

 if you do some simple math, on a 10seconds reload (waaaay slow for most CC fire rates which are better), you will get a CONSISTENT 15,000 damage per minute (ABSOLUTE MINIMUM).

 

Lets do some simple math: So your survive in your Kolberg only 2 minutes engaging the enemy? :trollface: ......... Well sorry to say but you gotta not only work on your BB-aim, BB-bravery and BB-positioning - but also on your cruiser skills. :trollface:

 

Flash news: Often ~half of the (properly aimed) HE shells do nothing (and if you got a cl and he/ap you can outright go screw yourself anyway), HE has a very low base dmg, can (on a BB) only deal 33 % of that low-to-beginn-with-damage-rating and if you want anymore damage you gotte enlist in the damn firey lottery that that takes ages to kill a BB, can be put out multiple times and completely healed back -> So yeah, think again.

 

I ll be completely honest: BB are the most catered to class by WG and most OP-towards-their-supposed-prey-class in the game (CVs are more op, but not only against the supposed prey but all other classes) - they just shi7 on cruisers. I know, because I play both. You may not want to hear this, but a pointless whine-thread will get you no where.

 

Esp. with those baloney pulled-out-of-a$$ numbers you are only making yourself a laughing stock: Want to know what the avg. damage for a T 5 cruiser is? Between 18-30 k. So according to your calculation those cruisers survive 1-2 minutes after being engaged.

 

 

If anything they need a buff so not every noob who cant aim, but got lucky with dispersion for throwing one shell widely into a cruisers cit, can randomly hurt a proper played cruiser. Not even talking about people who are really able to aim and just go omnomnom when the see a cruiser. 

 

 

It's true that cruiser damage is more consistent, but cruiser protection is also equally inconsistent. With less health than a BB and no heal (or a worse one) in most cases, the fight will always be the BB's to lose.

 

For the most part its very consistent on cruisers: Random citadels from all angles - maybe from even only one shell going rogue; thats the reality for most cruisers.

Edited by havaduck
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Sooo... as a BB I have to fire a salvo every 30 seconds and IF RNGesus is with me I MAY hit a citadel and hit 10k damage, and if RNGOD is with me I hit multiple citadels and do 20k (1 in a billion games). Meanwhile any cruiser on my tier fires salvos of HE every 10 seconds (if not faster) and every single one of them is 99% accurate and does an average of 2.5k of damage (I'm not even going to count fire, I'm ignoring fire completely). So if you do some simple math, on a 10seconds reload (waaaay slow for most CC fire rates which are better), you will get a CONSISTENT 15,000 damage per minute (ABSOLUTE MINIMUM). Meanwhile, as a BB if RNGesus and RNGOD do not give you that 1 in 100 good game, you're barely hitting 2-3k damage per minute (based on a complete random luck 1k overpen stray shell hitting SOMETHING on your target every now and then).

 

If THIS is the way WG intends the game to be played then I would love to hear one single good argument why anyone would go through the grief and aggravation of playing a BB in random battles where tactics and teamplay are null and as such, playing a BB which has NOTHING to offer to a team besides its HP pool, is useless.

 

seems like your skill is underpowered, maybe WG can buff it?
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[TORAZ]
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So if you do some simple math, on a 10seconds reload (waaaay slow for most CC fire rates which are better), you will get a CONSISTENT 15,000 damage per minute (ABSOLUTE MINIMUM).

 

Wow, so a cruiser can kill a BB in 3-4 minutes, not counting fires, heals, proper positioning and use of DamCon, stealth and all the other factors.

Meanwhile a BB can kill a cruiser in 1 salvo. If you're having trouble getting citadels, especially at T4-6 in which so many citadel magnets run around, well, then I have some bad news for you.

 

L2p. Seriously.

 

Also mandatory Bbingo

bbbingo.jpg

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Yeah I'm a new player, and I know how to lead, and I know how to get my RANDOM shells to fall RANDOMLY over the enemy ship and RANDOMLY do 1k damage of overpen through non-citadel areas. I like how there're always a bunch of "pros" that immediately jump with l2p and "you're the one that sucks" posts when it is an established and admitted fact that BBs ARE at the whim of RNGesus and their damage output is 100% based on RNGsus citadels. So thanks for the tip pro-man ;)

 

PS I also like how you're a CV/DD player who has very few battles in BBs so clearly you know everything about BBs :) and I'm sure BBs being underperforming right now doesn't bias you at all as a CV/DD player ;)

 

So, you think you know it all after just 300+ games? You don't like us to point out that you have weaknesses and then call us "pros"?

 

The first thing you should do is to ask yourself "What can I do differently to be better?" and "Where can I find that information?". I know that reflection is not the strong side of most people, and that is the reason you get this reaction on this forum now.

 

Now, if you think that HE is so OP, how about you go and start playing Cruisers for a while? At the moment we have a BB flood in the game. And that comes with a reason. BBs are very strong not only on the gun side but also on survivability. Go and find me a low tier cruiser with a repair ability or with the same torpedo damage reduction. You have a one-shot potential with BBs against CAs/CLs. Can you also say that for CAs? What is your proposal to HE? How do you think cruisers should do damage to BBs?

 

You are throwing around numbers in your initial post without any sources. Where do they originate from? I can already tell you: "It feels like this...so it must be right." Is that about correct?

 

Someone already told you that there are a lot of youtube vids about how to play BBs. But instead of taking hints and accepting criticism you start lashing out. It is an understandable reaction, but it not only makes you an easy target on the forum but also in the game. You are weakening yourself with your reaction in more than just one way.

 

Once again. We can see your stats and therefore we can anticipate how you play. There are other sites like warships.today that show you how mr. average is playing all the ships. And they show that for example your Kongo stats are below average in nearly every aspect. Again, they show you the average stats for an average player (thats a bolt hint!).

 

To come to the forum and start whining is one thing. We all do it from time to time (not me of course). But to decline to learn is a bad sign. Not only for your rep on this forum but also for your future gameplay fun. It is not important for us if your stats are crap as long as you want to learn and as long as you want to work on yourself to make that happen. As you can see it is all about you and not about us.

 

Coming back to your little HE problem. There is an older table of the damage distribution. I am not sure if there is alreay a new one. If someone got it, it would be nice if you could post it. Anyway, this table shows you how damage is being generated in this game. And it may surprise you it is not HE that is dealing the most damage but AP. Therefore I disagree with your thesis and say that AP is OP. Pls nerf.

 

Statistik_AP_HE.jpg

 

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Sooo... as a BB I have to fire a salvo every 30 seconds and IF RNGesus is with me I MAY hit a citadel and hit 10k damage, and if RNGOD is with me I hit multiple citadels and do 20k (1 in a billion games). Meanwhile any cruiser on my tier fires salvos of HE every 10 seconds (if not faster) and every single one of them is 99% accurate and does an average of 2.5k of damage (I'm not even going to count fire, I'm ignoring fire completely). So if you do some simple math, on a 10seconds reload (waaaay slow for most CC fire rates which are better), you will get a CONSISTENT 15,000 damage per minute (ABSOLUTE MINIMUM). Meanwhile, as a BB if RNGesus and RNGOD do not give you that 1 in 100 good game, you're barely hitting 2-3k damage per minute (based on a complete random luck 1k overpen stray shell hitting SOMETHING on your target every now and then).

 

If THIS is the way WG intends the game to be played then I would love to hear one single good argument why anyone would go through the grief and aggravation of playing a BB in random battles where tactics and teamplay are null and as such, playing a BB which has NOTHING to offer to a team besides its HP pool, is useless.

 

I think you are trying to reach a point, but your skill is not good enough. Therefore you are trying to nerf your "opponent" ... kinda selfish, dont you think?

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Sooo... as a BB I have to fire a salvo every 30 seconds and IF RNGesus is with me I MAY hit a citadel and hit 10k damage, and if RNGOD is with me I hit multiple citadels and do 20k (1 in a billion games). Meanwhile any cruiser on my tier fires salvos of HE every 10 seconds (if not faster) and every single one of them is 99% accurate and does an average of 2.5k of damage (I'm not even going to count fire, I'm ignoring fire completely). So if you do some simple math, on a 10seconds reload (waaaay slow for most CC fire rates which are better), you will get a CONSISTENT 15,000 damage per minute (ABSOLUTE MINIMUM). Meanwhile, as a BB if RNGesus and RNGOD do not give you that 1 in 100 good game, you're barely hitting 2-3k damage per minute (based on a complete random luck 1k overpen stray shell hitting SOMETHING on your target every now and then).

 

If THIS is the way WG intends the game to be played then I would love to hear one single good argument why anyone would go through the grief and aggravation of playing a BB in random battles where tactics and teamplay are null and as such, playing a BB which has NOTHING to offer to a team besides its HP pool, is useless.

 

99% accurate?

 

Ok, where are these magic rounds sold? Is it a premium purchase I do not know about?

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Yeah I'm a new player, and I know how to lead, and I know how to get my RANDOM shells to fall RANDOMLY over the enemy ship and RANDOMLY do 1k damage of overpen through non-citadel areas. I like how there're always a bunch of "pros" that immediately jump with l2p and "you're the one that sucks" posts when it is an established and admitted fact that BBs ARE at the whim of RNGesus and their damage output is 100% based on RNGsus citadels. So thanks for the tip pro-man ;)

 

PS I also like how you're a CV/DD player who has very few battles in BBs so clearly you know everything about BBs :) and I'm sure BBs being underperforming right now doesn't bias you at all as a CV/DD player ;)

 

Right then, I play a good chunk of BBs. Go check up my stats if you like.

 

That forming the basis of my argument:

You're not aiming correctly and that is the single most influential thing that ends in your low damage results. Gunnery in WoWs is subject to some RNG, but it's not nearly as bad as you make it out. If you can't hit a target consistently, you're not aiming right, period.

 

You won't like to hear this, but this is a clear-cut learn to play issue. Everyone started somewhere so there's no shame in not being an instant expert, just practice (preferably in the lower tiers where more competent enemies won't put you down too fast) and try to learn and improve. Just don't come here complaining about stuff you frankly know very little about because you're not getting the results you'd like to. Everyone who got good at the game earned that by learning, not by complaining.

 

Check out some Youtubers like iChaseGaming (he's got a lot of newbie friendly tutorials that cover the essential gameplay mechanics and basic skillset you need) and Flamu (a very, very good player with a plethora of commentaries that show how to play certain ships, including captain builds, etc. pp.).

 

Trust me, it really helps to just sit down for a couple videos and then try to emulate that ingame. For basic skills (aiming and evading) the effect is instantanous and for advanced skills (target priorization and positioning) it helps immensely to know what spots to typically go for in what ship and which spots to avoid.

 

 

My biggest advice though would be to dial back the attitude considerably and just accept that you're still new and inexperienced. Once that mindset settles in, you'll find it's a lot easier to get answers and tips by asking about specific stuff or advice in general. Just (wrongly) complaining will simply (and rightfully, though not helpful) net you "l2p" responses in most cases.

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Right then, I play a good chunk of BBs. Go check up my stats if you like.

 

That forming the basis of my argument:

You're not aiming correctly and that is the single most influential thing that ends in your low damage results. Gunnery in WoWs is subject to some RNG, but it's not nearly as bad as you make it out. If you can't hit a target consistently, you're not aiming right, period.

 

You won't like to hear this, but this is a clear-cut learn to play issue. Everyone started somewhere so there's no shame in not being an instant expert, just practice (preferably in the lower tiers where more competent enemies won't put you down too fast) and try to learn and improve. Just don't come here complaining about stuff you frankly know very little about because you're not getting the results you'd like to. Everyone who got good at the game earned that by learning, not by complaining.

 

Check out some Youtubers like iChaseGaming (he's got a lot of newbie friendly tutorials that cover the essential gameplay mechanics and basic skillset you need) and Flamu (a very, very good player with a plethora of commentaries that show how to play certain ships, including captain builds, etc. pp.).

 

Trust me, it really helps to just sit down for a couple videos and then try to emulate that ingame. For basic skills (aiming and evading) the effect is instantanous and for advanced skills (target priorization and positioning) it helps immensely to know what spots to typically go for in what ship and which spots to avoid.

 

 

My biggest advice though would be to dial back the attitude considerably and just accept that you're still new and inexperienced. Once that mindset settles in, you'll find it's a lot easier to get answers and tips by asking about specific stuff or advice in general. Just (wrongly) complaining will simply (and rightfully, though not helpful) net you "l2p" responses in most cases.

 

Youtube helped me get allot better with Brit CLs

 

With my Warspite I tend to fire one battery to get the lead and range, adjust and then fire all the others

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[NWP]
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So when shooting with your Kolberg, every HE volley you hit on a BB does on average 2.5k dmg?

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The problem with YouTube channels is that they only show you that 1 in 100 games that are great. For every video of someone rocking with something, regardless of game, there's 100 more that go completely bad ;)

 

If your issue is cherry-picking, then watch streams instead.

 

Regardless of any random behavior of BB shells you can easily find out the average hit% and damage of ships on one of several statistics aggregate sites out there (like Warships.Today or WoWS Stats & Numbers).

That's way more useful than anecdotal information.

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[DREAD]
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.....AND the one-millions anniversary thread about a BB melted by HE!

 

Congrats you won a hair dryer!

 

*ding ding ding*

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I just came to give a like to the first one who posted the BB bingo.

 

The game is on a straight course to become world of BBs, yet the BBabies' whining is strong as ever. Carry on guys, WG is not yet removing HE ammo and torps from the game, you must whine a lot louder!

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