Scharnhorst Gun

[SILENT_HUNTER_XX]

Hi to all

I think for this ship
The new upgrade is needed
The current gun is     ( 283 mm L/54.5 Drh LC/34  )  Rate of Fire  20 sec

an new upgrade gun ( 380 mm L/52 Drh LC/34  )   Rate of Fire 26 sec

3*3 gun 380 mm

 

This post has been edited by the moderation team due to use of red

[Ghostychan]

you can get 3x2 380mm guns by getting the regular Gneisenau.

3x3 380mm is impossible - the turret ist too small in order to fit all the guns and you'll get balancing issues

 

thus I conclude

[ParEx]

Hi to all

I think for this ship
The new upgrade is needed
The current gun is     ( 283 mm L/54.5 Drh LC/34  )  Rate of Fire  20 sec

an new upgrade gun ( 380 mm L/52 Drh LC/34  )   Rate of Fire 26 sec

3*3 gun 380 mm

 

 

Can you explain why the upgrade is "needed"?

Other than that, like said. Get the Gneisenau if you want the 380s.

 

Oh, and never use red front color in forums. This color is for Mods only.

[Devantejah]

You should really stop posting this ridiculous stuff.

[shockinhockin]

Apparently this chap isn't aware of a thing called history

 

This ship actually has its historical guns.

 

For the love of god doesn't give WG anymore ideas about making stuff up

[SILENT_HUNTER_XX]

You should really stop posting this ridiculous stuff.

 

Thanks for your comments

[SILENT_HUNTER_XX]

the turret ist too small in order to fit all the guns and you'll get balancing issues

 

 

 

thus I conclude

 

you can get 3x2 380mm guns by getting the regular Gneisenau.

3x3 380mm is impossible - the turret ist too small in order to fit all the guns and you'll get balancing issues

 

thus I conclude

What does that mean it is impossible
The turret is small.
It's just a game

When Großer Kurfürst and Friedrich der Große have  2 model gun

Scharnhorst  can use 380 mm gun

 

[Devantejah]

 

What does that mean it is impossible
The turret is small.
It's just a game

When Großer Kurfürst and Friedrich der Große have  2 model gun

Scharnhorst  can use 380 mm gun

 

 

Biggest problem is that you want to put 9 x 380mm guns on a Scharnhorst..

 

Like it isn't strong enough?

[psl_58]

The original plans for the Twins was actually to go from 3 III 28cm guns to 3 II 35cm guns. The existing turret was supposed to be 'adjustable' to ease this major refit. Maybe that would be difficult but Raeder sold the up gunning to 15" to match French battleship Richelieu .No doubt Hitler loved the idea.

[SILENT_HUNTER_XX]

 

Biggest problem is that you want to put 9 x 380mm guns on a Scharnhorst..

 

Like it isn't strong enough?

 

thanks

[Dominus_Astra]

Why upgrade them? I find them fine as they are. I mince cruisers left right and centre and the AP does enough damage to enemy battleships that you can hold your own, provide you dont overextend. The ship and the cannons are fine, the dispersion is fine, hunt cruisers with her and support other battleships and you'll see how good they are.

[Nightdare]

Oh, and never use red front color in forums. This color is for Mods only.

 

 

Though not relevant to the topic but then the webdesigners should not make it available to the regular posters

[SaxonHoliday]

you can get 3x2 380mm guns by getting the regular Gneisenau.

3x3 380mm is impossible - the turret ist too small in order to fit all the guns and you'll get balancing issues

 

thus I conclude

 

You should've seen this guy's posts in the carrier section. Something about how Midway's strike loadout should be 2/3/0 or something? Consider that along with how strong US plane torpedoes and fighter planes are. And he somehow keeps getting material for posts like these from... somewhere. That one meme with Fry squinting fully applies here.

[_DeathWing_]

Why?

[SILENT_HUNTER_XX]

When the Gun ship be strengthened
The more damage you can enter the opponent.

[Devantejah]

When the Gun ship be strengthened
The more damage you can enter the opponent.

 

Because Scharnhorst is totally underperforming.

 

Failure to do damage is not the fault of the ship.

[Dominus_Astra]

When the Gun ship be strengthened
The more damage you can enter the opponent.

 

 

The gun damage is fine, I have on occasion managed to citadel Colorado class battleships, I have fun deleting cruisers with multiple citadels. A normal salvo can net me 5k, a great salvo can hit for 10k, so yes the Scharnhorst has perfectly fine guns in fact she's one of my favourite ships to go seal clubbing in.

[SILENT_HUNTER_XX]

But to harm ships Tier 8 up weak
I tried again

Especially the battle with North Carolina and Iowa

[SV_Kompresor]

Ah yes, zamani.....the new skycrapflying

[Affeks]

Your proposed upgrade is wrong in so many ways. Its unbalanced in game, its ahistorical, its unrealistic due to the design of the ship itself and lastly why would Scharnhorst need this anyway? The ship is more than strong enough already and we already have Gneisenau with 3x2 380mms that is already considered to be strong as well. Stop posting bait pls

[BlackYeti]

If anything, the Gneise should be able to mount 283mm on A hull not the other way around and A hull should be the same as Scharn's hull not the enlarged version for the 380mm's. And yeah, bait.

[puxflacet]

EDIT - because some people were really confused by my post:

START OF THE JOKE -----> the exact reason why scharnhorst class would not handle additional weight was that their waterline was so high - with high waves the A turret was practiacally useless. so gneisenau's rearm to six 380 needed elongated bow for additional buoyancy. with nine 380 she would turn into monitor...but imagine that citadel protection

END OF THE JOKE

[CPL_Sivi]

Gneise has no problem taking down NC when u have 1 vs 1 situation. Scharn should even have easier job since u use 9 barrels instead of 6. Iowa has a chance only if she turns and runs before u drop distance under 5 km. When u get that close Iowa takes cits easy while both sharn and gneise have turtleback. And torps. And secondaries. If NC and Iowa defeated u in scharn u just got outplayed. The ships r fine as they are.

[SILENT_HUNTER_XX]

ok

[RAMJB]

 

the exact reason why scharnhorst class would not handle additional weight was that their waterline was so high - with high waves the A turret was practiacally useless. so gneisenau's rearm to six 380 needed elongated bow for additional buoyancy. with nine 380 she would turn into monitor...but imagine that citadel protection

 

There was no way Gneisenau would take 15'' triples. The turret well wasn't big enough, and historically it was impossible to enlarge them.

 

Besides there was no triple mount designed in germany at all for anything larger than 11.1'' guns. The T-X grosser kurfust is totally nuts in that sense, even H-44 had a 4x2 configuration, and was just a theoretical work noone took never seriously as a real prospective build (in fact no design after H-41 was intended to be built at all).

For whatever reason the Design Department of the Kriegsmarine was frontally opposed to anything bigger than dual mounts for guns that big, which translated into the huge displacement inefficiency that was a signature of classes like the Bismarcks or the planned H-39 and H-41.

 

Oh, and Scharnhorst's turrets weren't "modifiable" for the 15'' gun. That's not the way things worked. First you design a gun. Then you design a turret to hold that gun. the Scharnhorsts were built for the triple 11.1'' turret, endstory. There was no "intended upgunning" when they were designed at all. Between many other reasons, because Germany had no 15'' dual turret by then (it had not been designed yet).

 

What actually happened is that later on, when the 15'' dual turret was actually designed (for the Bismarcks) it was noticed that the turret rings of the Twins were big enough to allow for fitting the 2x380mm turret. But the upgunning was never seriously considered in the short term - Germany was in the middle of a mass navy expansion, light cruiser and destroyer production was already far too slow due to the major resources invested in building the twins, the Bismarcks and the H-39s, resources were far too strained to even keep that up (the famous "plan Z" was unnafordable for the German shipbuilding capacity).

 

Building a battleship's turrets was the longest and most expensive part of building such a warship (to the point that some battleships never got built because of the builder nation being unable to spare the enourmous resources needed to build the turrets - see the case of the Lion class battleships).

.For Germany to build six extra mounts, to then spare the drydock space, and refitting investment demanded, to upgun the Twins was out of the question. There were much more important projects at hand.

 

it's true however that it was loosely planned that ,"at some time" during their lifetime (probably in a mid-life refit), the Twins would've been modified with 15'' guns, hopefully at a moment where the german shipbuilding industry could allow the effort.

But midlife refits for capital ships can happen easily 15 years after being completed. the Scharnhorsts were completed in 1936-37. So maybe by 1946-1951 they'd have received those guns, had WW2 not happened. No other immediate plans for that upgunning existed. Not until Gneisenau's whole bow was pretty much blown apart in a magazine detonation during an airstrike when she was at port in 1942. The repairs to bring her back to operational status, alone, were estimated to need at least 3 years of work, so with all the other major german warship building efforts shut down (exception made of the U-boat construction) it was decided to seize the chance and upgun her then during that time. But Scharnhorst was never scheduled for such a conversion, and, had Gneisenau's magazine not gone off, she'd never been either.

 

The whole "upgunning" stuff of the Twins and how they were "designed to be upgunned" is pure WW2 myth. It was more a case of pure chance that their triple 280mm turrets and the double 380mm turrets were similar enough in ring sizes that made it possible. And it doesn't mean it was going to happen even then.

 

(and before anyone jumps in here putting forward the idea: no, the 380mm dual turret was designed independently and making it compatible with the Scharnhorst's turret wells wasn't in the plans. Was a matter of coincidence, not of design, that both turrets ended up being mountable in the Twin's turret wells)