New player - looking to improuve my CV game

[allc0ck]

Hi guys,

 

I am relatively new to WOWS, having around 400 games most of which are in carriers (IJN line).

 

Below i will list the basic lessons I have learned until now and I will invite you to fill in the gaps I have, so that I can improve my CV skills.

 

Not in the order of importance, this is my checklist of a CV game:

 

1. Setting up the ship (before the game): upgrades, modules, fighters/damage specks, flags, camos, commander skills: mostly to the player's taste - I won't expand this discussion.

 

2. Positioning (ship):
    2.1. Anticipating ally/enemy movements and fights results, and moving the ship accordingly.
    2.2. Staying close enough of the fights for shorter flights, but not too close as to get spotted.
    2.3. Using islands for hiding.
    2.4. Always keeping your allies between you and the enemy and asking for help when a destroyer sneaks in to hunt you.
    2.5. Turning the ship so that it shows its back to the landing planes and the front to the taking off ones, so that you minimize the time that these maneuvers require (for skilled players).
    2.6. Learning map exploits (borders, corners).
    2.7. Predicting enemy CVs sneak attack on your ship and defensive maneuvers against torpedo and dive bombers + "the 15 seconds repair rule" when you burn or flood.
    2.8. Almost always move, so if you get spotted you will be less vulnerable.

 

3. Scouting (fighters but not exclusively): providing info about enemy positions to your team all game long. For advanced players - spot key targets (like destroyers or capping ships).

 

4. Air superiority (fighters):
    4.1. Dominating enemy fighters.
    4.2. Defending ally bombers.
    4.3. Defending ally ships from bombers.
    4.4. Learning Strife (for skilled players).
    4.5. Baiting enemy fighters by keeping them occupied while your bombers attack.
    4.6. Baiting enemy fighters into ally AA and then engage them.

 

5. Damage dealing (bombers torpedo/dive):
    5.1. Key targets (big, slow, without AA, separated, low hp, capping, reseting cap, focus destroyers, etc).
    5.2. Avoiding AA targets (learning AA ships).
    5.3. Sneak by exploiting borders - how to get planes outside map borders (sometimes useful).
    5.4. Learning attacks basics: torpedo attacks from sides, dive bombers from front or back, giving lead, anticipating target moves, etc
    5.5. Learning manual attacks (skills): learning when to manual and when to auto-attack (ex: better to auto-dive-bomb destroyers), torpedo arm distance, learning how to deal with border-hugging targets (close torpedo drop on border).
    5.6. Learning "the 15 seconds repair rule" - for perma fire or perma flood - useful both for attack and defense.
    5.7. Destroyer (and fast-moving targets) torpedo-hunting maneuvers.
    5.8. Baiting AA consumable trigger, then retreating temporarily.
    5.9. Learning when to split up your forces and when not to.

 

6. Communicating with your team: let the know your intentions, comply with their requests, ask for help if needed, etc

 

7. Other useful tricks and basic game mechanics:

    7.1. An "under stress" TB/DB (attacked by fighters or some AA) will be far less accurate (bigger spread) and slower.

   7.2. An empty DB is much faster (use it for running or scouting).

   7.3. Islands and direction changes will slow down your planes.

   7.4. Limited amount of planes - after unloading it's better to drive them manually back to the ship.

   7.5. Sometimes the enemy will follow your planes returning to the ship to find you - so confuse them by not driving the planes home in a strait line.

   7.5. You can cancel a "take-off" command by right-clicking a plane inside the carrier - useful to change the take-off order inside many-squadrons carriers.

   7.6. You can group squadrons together with the key-combination ______ (??? which one? ALT + 7 ?).

 

I don't master by far all I have listed above, but i would like to know what else is there to learn in order to become a better CV player.

 

Ty,

 

Seemann

 

 

 

 

[Doo0ooM]

Which captain skills to pick, this is kinda missing, but that could be a big topic in itself ;) Not going to comment to much on captain skills for now though

 

Your list is already somewhat impressive for a new player, I am a little bit surprised, but at the same time not too much.

 

I thought about what to do with your thread and your topic and your request to gain carrier knowledge.

 

The questions on my mind were:

 

1. What do I get out of it for telling you ?

2. What are the tricks I know that you don't know yet.

 

I have come up with a solution:

 

Sometimes I have the desire to play with a division where I am a destroyer and my division mate a carrier (to do missions). Currently I have "no friends" with a carrier.

 

So here is my deal, I have two different deals for you:

 

1. Either you "friend/add contact" me in World of Warships and then we play together. Every time we play together (you as cv, me as destroyer or something else) I will tell you a trick that you don't know yet/that is not on your list. This way I get something out of it !

 

2. You could also join my team... but there is no point yet... cause no team games... and I also don't have a clan yet... maybe never will, so there is no point in deal 2.

 

But deal 1 can be rewarding/interesting for you. I am very experience carrier commander and I know of some tricks that are not yet on your list... and you will love these tricks, trust me =D

But I want something for it in return... so you think about it... and if you want to take me up on my offer... send me a personal message. This deal is also open for other carrier commanders... the more the better ! ;)

 

I will add a conditional to it though, you should keep my tricks secret, cause they do win me battles in ranked games. Some tricks apply in rare cases, if the enemy don't know it, I win, simple as that ;)

[Jaylah]

Learning how to manually drop, strife with fighters and good positioning is the most important thing.  When you join the game, while on the loading screen you can compare you ship to the others ingame. This way you can check which ships have upgraded AA and which don't. It makes it more efficient when picking targets for strikes. 

[allc0ck]

@ Jaylah - thx!

@ Doo0ooM - I am a new player in WOWS but i have over 20.000 WOT games so .. i guess i knew the basic mechanics from there. About your offer - i like it but i only play a couple of games every day after work and that's not every day. So I will take you up on it but when i will have more time to spend. Also, I play better when there are no stakes ... when nobody expects me to play good, because I only do it for fun. So .. I guess i will ad you at friends and we'll see what happens. Ty

[Ferry_25]

Having very little xp in CV play in mind. I checked your stats OP and I know that's part of the story. But given that: I think you're already doing a fantastic job in your CV's already. In fact I'm already afraid to face you in combat: everything is screaming your a big pain in the @ss in a CV. Now given that I cannot give you anymore very good clues and advice in how to play a carrier. What I can give you is the insight a CV is actually IRL and even in this game the apex ship. Unless you make a real stupid mistake lots of teammates, including me, will try everything to save the carrier, even if it means getting sunk myself. Losing a CV is a blow on the soft part regarding points. Losing a BB is even less bad that losing a CV for that matter. Your key is your "god POV" of the battle. Your main allies in combat are your DD's. Keep talking: assure your DD's you're with them. The planes are the fastest moving objects in game. Tell your DD's: just ping were I need to scout for you. When you have fighters: reassure your BB's: tell them you'll be there in times of need. If your BB's get the TLC of the enemy CV whey will highly appreciate your attempt to disrupt the torpedo plane spam. Your ship is very vulnerable in ship to ship combat. So your "exit strategy" is to stay a closely as possible to the cruisers: they can swat the pesky dd's hunting for you. Keep oversight! Don't killsteal the isolated ship which is being hammered to the bottom by your allies anyway. Also keep explaining to your team you can't be everywhere at the same time. Last but not least: keep your ship the [edited] moving at all times. Even if that means circling in stupid patterns: always keep in mind a moving ship is always, in 100% of the cases more difficult to hit than a stationary.

IMO the trick in CV play is multitasking and directing your fleet. If you can master that (aside of the manual drops/ strafing skills) you will become a vital aspect of your games. I'm clearly not saying it'll be the most rewarding task I'm advising. But the most effective to contribute to your team.

 

@ WG: given OP this info, together with his already for me very impressive stats, I'd humbly ask you to put me in his team forever.....

[bushwacker001]

First tip OP .... Taking any notice of Doo0ooooom/skybuckflying will only end in tears. 

n.b. you are already a better CV player than him and I will wager you are well behind him on team kills.

[Doo0ooM]

Don't let yourself get bitten by the dragon... I have many nice and delicious tips for you which I will gladly share with you, in return for helping me out with missions.

 

It gonna be great... you can contact me whenever you like... cause there is no rush.

 

And if we fail objectives in Random Battles that's ok, I play for fun too ! =D

[mtm78]

I have many nice and delicious tips for you which I will gladly share with you, in return for helping me out with missions.

 

Do they include how to get your account banned on the forums so you have to use an alt?

 

 

Also, 'helping' sounds a whole lot like 'rigging'

[xXx_Blogis_xXx]

easy , play coop and learn all self ^^ since alpha i never looked any vids

[Doo0ooM]

 

Do they include how to get your account banned on the forums so you have to use an alt?

 

 

Also, 'helping' sounds a whole lot like 'rigging'

 

This post has been edited by the moderation team due to inappropriate remarks.

[RobS80]

Impressive start for you there, with lots more knowledge than the average low tier player. 

 

I would fully echo the other comments and stay very very well clear of any advice from or time with DooOoom/Skybuckflying

 

Do a search of his banned Skybuckflying account to see some of his amazing 'tips'.

[allc0ck]

Well .. even a banned guy may still have nice (legal) tips to share .. as i bet even Hitler had his good sides ))

 

The reason i ask for help is that regardless of my stats, almost (or more then) half of my games i get dominated very very hard by the enemy CV .. so clearly i have a LOT more to improve!

 

And more then that, with my IJN CV i hit 1 or 2 torps with one squadron most of the time. So i guess that if i learn to hit better (like 3 torps/squad. in average) my stats could even grow.

 

Ty for your kind words and i am waiting for more juicy tips

[Agantas]

You can also scout with bombers while the fighters defend your fleet and prevent enemy scouting. Empty dive bomber is a fast scout.

 

Spotting enemy DDs for the team is also an important task for a CV, as this can be a pretty difficult or time taking task for ships to do.

[pra3y]

When it comes to damage dealing, you can more than just scout against DDs. If a DD does not turn about too much and sail in straight line, a simple estimation and manual drop will kill the DD. If the DD maneuvers about wildly aka constant turning, manual cross torping with your IJN TBs will help make it easier to hit them. Taking out enemy DDs early game will help your team alot since the enemy team will not only lose a scout and potentially huge damage dealer, but also the capping advantage late game.

 

Also I don't know if this actually works but for me it does. I group my TBs together and manual drop from 1 direction. Damage saturation aside I tend to find that I lose less planes this way, especially in high tier games where AA can get ridiculous.

[allc0ck]

I have edited a new section: "Other useful basic game mechanic" - see it at the top. Who has more points for me?

 

[HeHe9228]

Your list is already looking very good!

 

In terms of targets:

A lot of DD's tend to rush caps at the starts of games, which makes them easy targets for a CV. Espacially an IJN CV.

Crosstorping a DD takes some practice.

But if you are able to pull it off, you can influence the game heavily in your favour.

Same goes for dive-bombing DDs. Takes some practice but is so much better.

I had a Haku auto bombing my Yugomo. He tried it 6 or more times. Didn't hit a single bombe.

 

[allc0ck]

Good! this goes under 5.7. Destroyer (and fast-moving targets) torpedo-hunting maneuvers. What else?

 

[Doo0ooM]

You can also scout with bombers while the fighters defend your fleet and prevent enemy scouting. Empty dive bomber is a fast scout.

 

Spotting enemy DDs for the team is also an important task for a CV, as this can be a pretty difficult or time taking task for ships to do.

 

Critical information, how did you find out these planes can move faster if they are empty ? ;)

[DutchDelightsNL]

Not being an CV player at all,tried2 but then not for me.

Always good to have an understanding of how a ship works,besides just be bothered by those pesky planes.

Then again, flying over the border, not to get spotted this should be fixed.

I know it is in the game, and you should always use thing given for free( i totaly understand)

but staying almost undetected, and play low tier (up till VI) and use flying over the game border giving players no chance(low tier seals), not realy something to be proud of up from VI it is, mandatory that you know about this!

We all know it is just a point and shooting game, it about startagy,planning ahaead and anticipating the enemy

I am preparred to take the salt about my stats or my comment so be it, but that is what i think

On the other hand do you have replays of your playing(style), if you explain what you wrote and also have it on youtube i guess (people would like to see this)

you can help people out

And i would like to know what are youre thoughts on IJN ships versus USN CV

always good to see a dedicated player

[Doo0ooM]

Flying planes on border does not make them completely invisible as far as I know ? ;)

 

What part of it does it actually make invisible ?

 

Maybe doesn't show on minimap ? (probably does)

 

Maybe doesn't show on main map ? (probably does)

 

It's just a way to avoid detection and fly around enemy fighters.

 

So this in C&C game once in a computer club... funny... nod bikes going on lowest line ;)

 

Also transport heli falls off screen at top line. (Discovered this myself and was very funny, only a shadow could be seen ;))

[allc0ck]

DutchDelightsNL, on 12 March 2017 - 10:00 AM, said:

I know it is in the game, and you should always use thing given for free( i totaly understand)

 

but staying almost undetected, and play low tier (up till VI) and use flying over the game border giving players no chance(low tier seals), not realy something to be proud of up from VI it is, mandatory that you know about this!

 

We all know it is just a point and shooting game, it about startagy,planning ahaead and anticipating the enemy

 

I am preparred to take the salt about my stats or my comment so be it, but that is what i think

 

On the other hand do you have replays of your playing(style), if you explain what you wrote and also have it on youtube i guess (people would like to see this)

 

you can help people out

 

And i would like

 

Hi, don't worry about the stats, just play for fun . About the flying outside the map - i don't think it's OP because you lose a lot of time doing it, time that would probably be better spent by doing damage. And at low tiers there are not a lot of enemy fighters or AA anyway .. so why do it? About youtube - i don't have anything yet because i don't have any replays that i am proud about .. i consider myself a beginner (noob or ... lucky noob if you want). i only had 1 nice game (in 500), when i killed 6 ships, but sadly back then i didn't know how to save replays (i'm coming from wot where the replays are saved by default).

Ty

 

Doo0ooM, on 12 March 2017 - 10:26 AM, said:

Flying planes on border does not make them completely invisible as far as I know ? ;)

 

What part of it does it actually make invisible ?

 

Maybe doesn't show on minimap ? (probably does)

 

Maybe doesn't show on main map ? (probably does)

 

It's just a way to avoid detection and fly around enemy fighters.

 

So this in C&C game once in a computer club... funny... nod bikes going on lowest line ;)

 

Also transport heli falls off screen at top line. (Discovered this myself and was very funny, only a shadow could be seen ;))

 

Hi, flying outside the borders, as far as i know, makes the planes invisible on the minimap (i don't know on the M map).  I think it is sometimes useful because most of the time the enemy fighters won't scout so close to the borders.

What does "Also transport heli falls off screen at top line" mean? i don't quite understand.

Cheers

 

[Doo0ooM]

The sprite in that game would "lift off", meaning it would go vertically up the screen... so much so that it would simply fall of the top of the screen, not visible, like you scrolled the screen down ;).

 

Anyway some further questions, I would also like to test that minimap theory of yours ;)

 

Are planes less detectable if they fly low ?

 

Can flying low be triggered by bombing and then cancelling before bombing ?

 

I do believe sometimes mountains can obstruct detection of planes ?!

 

Do planes fly slower while going up mountains ? (Doesn't seem to be the case)

 

Do planes fly faster while going down mountains ? (Probably not)

 

Are planes easier to detect on top of mountains ?

 

Do planes see ships better if high on mountain ?

 

Is plane-2-plane detection range still 8 km ? or has it changed ? Can it be influenced somehow ?

 

Does torpedo plane have smaller detection range ? Does seem to be the case sometimes...

 

"You can cancel a "take-off" command by right-clicking a plane inside the carrier - useful to change the take-off order inside many-squadrons carriers."

 

Did not know about this one. How does it exactly work ?

 

I select the squad first ? And then right click on top of the carrier itself ? Or do I need to right click on the icon ? I probably tried right clicking on the icon before... either this is a new feature, or mouse binding different/new

cancel command... or it's clicking on the carrier ?! hmm... will try this out...

 

Will test this one too:

 

"Islands and direction changes will slow down your planes."

 

To see if it makes sense to fly around islands, or that flying over is still faster than going around  ;)

 

"Learning "the 15 seconds repair rule" - for perma fire or perma flood - useful both for attack and defense."

 

15 seems a bit long... usually 10 is enough... with special upgrade max is probably 13.

 

[DutchDelightsNL]

 

Hi, don't worry about the stats, just play for fun . About the flying outside the map - i don't think it's OP because you lose a lot of time doing it, time that would probably be better spent by doing damage. And at low tiers there are not a lot of enemy fighters or AA anyway .. so why do it? About youtube - i don't have anything yet because i don't have any replays that i am proud about .. i consider myself a beginner (noob or ... lucky noob if you want). i only had 1 nice game (in 500), when i killed 6 ships, but sadly back then i didn't know how to save replays (i'm coming from wot where the replays are saved by default).

Ty

 

well i hope you do have something in the future qwould like to see.

This game is al about learning and improving.

It to me is like driving a car, first youhave to learn about the gas and stop, then learn the shift,corners etc and then surrounding and signs.

but seeing those streamers do it make me learn faster(where to hit etc) it did improve my game overal

by the way you can always post replays at @jamin411  wowsreplays (linkhere)

that is offcourse if you have replays enabled, you can take it as an option from different mods like aslain or such or do it yourself like

you can find here (linke here)

[Doo0ooM]

Hmm this flying outside the map might explain one of my x-files (009) ! ;) Though in this x-file the "detected warning" triggers late, so now I wonder if the "detected warning" might be surpressed too if flying outside border...

 

Hmm cancelling take off, indeed works now. It will still show a  F for take off... but eventually it's cancelled ! Funny, this definetly a new feature which I requested some time ago ! ;)

 

Flying over mountains does not seem to slow planes down, perhaps the very high ones, but even there I remain skeptical ;)

 

The torpedo plane is slowed down by very high mountains.

 

Dive bombers too, even when empty ;)

 

At least in training room, not sure if this also applies to combat situations, eventually probably doesn't matter much since fighters would be slowed down too ? ;)

 

At least in case of interception scenerios ;)

 

Interestingly enough the "plane icon" indeed falls of the minimap, not just for the enemy but for me too ! LOL, I could also loose track of my planes, this has probably already happened some times ! LOL.

 

This is exactly like C&C ! (command n conquer ) LOL. (Except in C&C it would also fall of completely, mini map, main map, real map whatever )

 

Making minimap as small as possible does help a little bit to detected it, rounding changes or so.

 

Now I finally understand why I have had so much success with this ! It's somewhat proven to work. On main/zoom out map they remain visible ;)

 

Neh, it probably mostly has to do with bad scouting from enemies ! Or enemies not using main map and mini map only ! ;)

 

This technique is still very valuable vs ships to fly by them since most only watch minimap ;)

 

The launch cancelling of planes does not work when:

 

1. Viewing the ship in 3D and putting the planes on "guard" on the carrier itself. So it's very unreliable.

 

So far it only seems to work when viewing the carrier from the top, on main map it wont work, in 3d it wont work.

 

The reason is probably "control" has to be held in 3D mode, maybe control-right click is not implemented for this... or just different cases. However on main/zoom out map control does not have to be held, also there it dont work... so probably a bigger issue, not all cases implemented.

 

Remember one thing: No matter how well you play you cannot make up for noob teams and noob players or that one ship you cant destroyed, be it too tiny, too fast, too good AA.

 

Other players must up their game too, or loss after loss will occur.

 

Example:

 

Leningrad killing Ranger. Very hard to kill leningrad with just bombs, even japanese will struggle a bit with those slow torps ;)

 

Other example:

 

Noobs torping their own team/battleship.

 

[RobS80]

Well .. even a banned guy may still have nice (legal) tips to share .. as i bet even Hitler had his good sides ))

 

Er, if you say so....

 

Hmm this flying outside the map might explain one of my x-files (009) ! ;) Though in this x-file the "detected warning" triggers late, so now I wonder if the "detected warning" might be surpressed too if flying outside border...

Hmm cancelling take off, indeed works now. It will still show a  F for take off... but eventually it's cancelled ! Funny, this definetly a new feature which I requested some time ago ! ;)

 

Flying over mountains does not seem to slow planes down, perhaps the very high ones, but even there I remain skeptical ;)

 

The torpedo plane is slowed down by very high mountains. Dive bombers too, even when empty ;)

 

At least in training room, not sure if this also applies to combat situations, eventually probably doesn't matter much since fighters would be slowed down too ? ;)

 

At least in case of interception scenerios ;)

 

Interestingly enough the "plane icon" indeed falls of the minimap, not just for the enemy but for me too ! LOL, I could also loose track of my planes, this has probably already happened some times ! LOL. Making minimap as small as possible does help a little bit to detected it, rounding changes or so.

Now I finally understand why I have had so much success with this ! It's somewhat proven to work. On main/zoom out map they remain visible ;)

Neh, it probably mostly has to do with bad scouting from enemies ! Or enemies not using main map and mini map only ! ;)

This technique is still very valuable vs ships to fly by them since most only watch minimap ;)

 

The launch cancelling of planes does not work when:

 

1. Viewing the ship in 3D and putting the planes on "guard" on the carrier itself. So it's very unreliable. So far it only seems to work when viewing the carrier from the top, on main map it wont work, in 3d it wont work.

 

The reason is probably "control" has to be held in 3D mode, maybe control-right click is not implemented for this... or just different cases. However on main/zoom out map control does not have to be held, also there it dont work... so probably a bigger issue, not all cases implemented.

 

Remember one thing: No matter how well you play you cannot make up for noob teams and noob players or that one ship you cant destroyed, be it too tiny, too fast, too good AA.

 

Other players must up their game too, or loss after loss will occur.

 

Example: Leningrad killing Ranger. Very hard to kill leningrad with just bombs, even japanese will struggle a bit with those slow torps ;)

 

Other example: Noobs torping their own team/battleship.

 

Yep, seems like he will be amazing help for you. Totally pro. Yep. 

 

FWIW his 'amazing OP tips' revolve around 80% guess work, 10% strike ranger and 10% early game CV snipe where he takes dive bombers all the way around the map one way, and torps all the way around the map the other way, and hopes to alpha strike enemy CV since strike Ranger would have no hope against any decent CV captain.