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Kazomir

High time to add heals to heavy cruisers of lower tiers.

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I am of the opinion heavy cruisers are nigh useless ATM.  Light cruisers have more maneuverability, with IFHE more damage to BBs while countering DDs better, more concealment and in RN case, smoke AND heals.

 

This can be seen in ranked where a myoko or pensa, or yorck aswell, are niw dead weight as light cruisers with IFHE, smokes and radars have replaced them. 

 

WG, those ships are overtaken by power creep, little more survivability does not harm!

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It's fairly obvious the premium cruisers are outperforming the standard in ranked, but I'm not sure heal is the best solution. The ships will still be plain worse, just now with prolonged suffering. I'll wait and see what treatment WG comes up with. Nerfing smoke and radars perhaps?

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I'd say tier 8 is the lowest it should go. My Mogami would really benefit from having the heal. It may just give me that extra bit of survival after taking battleship shells. Any lower is a no go. 

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Alpha Tester
658 posts

i aggred with give heal in low tier cruisers but only 1 charge and just upper t4.

i say this many times when devs sent a survary and this new HE skill is my old AP skill reworked version,that too say the devs.

my originally skill is this:

"AP expert" this only cruisers

+25% AP penetration

+500 damage for main battery guns

+15m/s for AP shells

-7% fire chance

-5% effective HE againts Battleships,cruisers

well this the old skill i made

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[AAO]
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I say lets get cruisemissile skill destroyer. 100k damage and destroy carry missille 7pcs 2 tier starting. Remove all other weapons and range 20-150km to be albe to shoot into other matches.

  • Cool 1

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Beta Tester
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Not unless they're from the best Navy.

 

You must mean that well known master of the high seas.. the Russian Navy...:trollface:

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[CATS]
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Myoko does not seem to be dead weight in ranked.

 

Nevertheless Heal for Tier VIII cruiser would be ok and probably for Tier VII too.

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Weekend Tester
430 posts

This can be seen in ranked where a myoko or pensa, or yorck aswell, are niw dead weight as light cruisers with IFHE, smokes and radars have replaced them. 

 

Potato cruiser main reporting. Can confirm, tried both Yorck and Myoko in ranked. 100% dead weight.

The Yorck in particular, after this first single game test, was enough to convince me to switch to other ships for ranked.

 

shot_17_02_10_15_59_10_0358.jpg

 

The battle achievement was High Caliber. Pls gib heal.

 

Jokes aside, Yorck and Myoko definitely have and advantage over Pensacola. Pensacola received a huge concealment buff and that will definitely improve her stats, but the lack of torps will still result in it getting less average damage I think.

As for light cruisers replacing them, I'm not convinced at all. While they do have advantages, the disadvantages are there as well. You wrote about IFHE, but it's not like most players have got a 14 point commander ready for light cruisers at tier VII-VIII. Also, heavy cruisers are way less prone to random deletions from range when they are not broadside.

I'd be game for some cruiser buffs, but it's not like every cruiser should get access to heal imho. A straight hp buff for some ships (ex. New Orleans which has less hp than her counterparts) would be helpful enough without giving it heal.

Edited by Live85

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Potato cruiser main reporting. Can confirm, tried both Yorck and Myoko in ranked. 100% dead weight.

The Yorck in particular, after this first single game test, was enough to convince me to switch to other ships for ranked.

 

shot_17_02_10_15_59_10_0358.jpg

 

The battle achievement was High Caliber. Pls gib heal.

 

Jokes aside, Yorck and Myoko definitely have and advantage over Pensacola. Pensacola received a huge concealment buff and that will definitely improve her stats, but the lack of torps will still result in it getting less average damage I think.

As for light cruisers replacing them, I'm not convinced at all. While they do have advantages, the disadvantages are there as well. You wrote about IFHE, but it's not like most players have got a 14 point commander ready for light cruisers at tier VII-VIII. Also, heavy cruisers are way less prone to random deletions from range when they are not broadside.

I'd be game for some cruiser buffs, but it's not like every cruiser should get access to heal imho. A straight hp buff for some ships (ex. New Orleans which has less hp than her counterparts) would be helpful enough without giving it heal.

  

Myoko and yorck are definitely less effective. What they gain in armor (not much difference) they lose in concealment and maneuverability, while lacking the crucial, for ranked especially, smoke/radar. Damage is on par, with CLs having an advantage by virtue of spam and ability to keep their guns on target.  

 

Argument for skilled captains is moot since nobody should go with a sub 10 captain past rank 10, all classes are way less effective with untrained captains.

 

Just to clarify. My point is for 200+mm armed cruisers of tier 7 and 8. 1 charge for 7, 2 for 8.

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Firstly, RN light cruisers don't have HE except Belfast, making IFHE pointless for the RN line in general.  Every RN CL in the tech tree only has a "Super" AP shell with a hair trigger on the shell arming so that it never over penetrates and bounces somewhat less.


 

To make up for the HE spamminess of Belfast I'm given to understand that she doesn't get either heal or torpedoes, which the rest of the RN CL's have so it's not the case that the CL is just out and out "better" than a CA.  A properly handled CA (excluding Pensacola) is a practically insurmountable obstacle to a RN CL unless they are obliging enough to get torpedoed.

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Weekend Tester
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Myoko and yorck are definitely less effective. What they gain in armor (not much difference) they lose in concealment and maneuverability, while lacking the crucial, for ranked especially, smoke/radar. Damage is on par, with CLs having an advantage by virtue of spam and ability to keep their guns on target.  

 

Argument for skilled captains is moot since nobody should go with a sub 10 captain past rank 10, all classes are way less effective with untrained captains.

 

Just to clarify. My point is for 200+mm armed cruisers of tier 7 and 8. 1 charge for 7, 2 for 8.

 

Compared to what, premium ships? because if we stick to regular ship trees the differences aren't that noticeable. Shchors and Fiji have got the worst two base rudder shift time of all tier VII cruisers, and when it comes to concealment Fiji is the only one that has an edge over the other tier VII cruisers. Armor gain can definitely be felt during grinds, and I talk from experience here.

 

Ships aren't (and won't) be balanced around performance in Ranked battles, Developers already talked about this multiple times. The argument for skilled captains is not moot, since it changes heavily the performance of ships. What are we seeing now (and discussing) is a byproduct of this ranked season. When Belfast was launched there was some degree of hype around it due to it's great performance. But, like every hype, it was quickly forgotten due to the "low" number of those ships around and the battleship heavy meta. The new ranked season, based on tier VII, simply demonstrated how superior those ships can be when people slap on them highly experienced commanders from other grinds, and the edge Radar/Smoke gives them. It doesn't automatically mean that regular ships should be buffed because those ships exist. When you play random battles, how many of those have you seen dominate their games?

Edited by Live85

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This can be seen in ranked where a myoko

 

It is well known with WG, If they add something, for instance, heal on the Myoko then they will nerf something like torp range or speed, shorter main battery firing range, be careful what you wish for.

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I agree that there's a problem. I'm not sure that heals are the answer.

The problem, IMHO, is IFHE. It's just too strong on 6" guns (I speak here as somebody who's been on both ends of it quite a lot). It means that a light cruiser with a well-skilled captain (enough for IFHE, and perhaps IFHE+CE) is very strong, and as you say doesn't really have any disadvantages compared to an 8" CA, but a light cruiser without IFHE is much weaker against anything with armour.

While that that one skill makes such a difference, they'll be very hard to balance.

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Just No.  :red_button: 

 

What may go wrong? More cruiser survivability may make them willing to risk going in closer range.

 

But then we wont have BB players whining about invisi-fires, no?

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