What is the point of Battleships?

[RockyRoller]

So far with US and Japanese ships up to level 5/6 they seem to do the least damage, partly because they take absolutely ages to reload or miss at great ranges and they die far too fast in close up brawls for secondary guns to take out Destroyers and Cruisers that close.

[SV_Kompresor]

The point is to play them....simple as that, also they don't die quickly because of the ships being bad but because bad (new) players at those tiers

[Kuningas_Arthur]

Not to burst your bubble but you seem to do the most damage in your BBs. You do at or around 10-15k damage in most of your cruisers, all the way up to tier 7, in destroyers even less than 10k. In BBs you at least manage 20-30k, which is still less than half of your own HP which arguably is a lousy amount. 

[EsaTuunanen]

Battleships are about being able to survive lots of hits when played properly and big APs capable to smashing cruiser from any direction and doing lots of damage to enemy battleships who show side.

(also they hurt bow/stern showing destroyer more than HEs)

 

New York is surely in not so good spot with no speed, König being lot better at brawling and also New York's armor layout being not so good in meta with its rather heavy vulnerability to small caliber HE spam.

New Mexico's hull again is proof against up to 152mm HEs and hence better in line with others if you play properly.

[Aotearas]

Don't count on secondaries for anything.

They won't hit anything unless you spec for the tier IV skill and even then most don't have the range and ballistics to actually be effective, with really only a very few ships actually being capable of running a somewhat effective secondary build.

 

As for dying too fast, battleships can withstand an extreme amount of punishment but that doesn't help much if you put yourself in a position where you recieve extreme amounts of damage in short order, such as showing broadside, getting isolated and focused or allowing yourself to get nuked by a torpedo spread.

[mtm78]

Not to burst your bubble but you seem to do the most damage in your BBs. You do at or around 10-15k damage in most of your cruisers, all the way up to tier 7, in destroyers even less than 10k. In BBs you at least manage 20-30k, which is still less than half of your own HP which arguably is a lousy amount. 

 

Harsh... but fair 

[RockyRoller]

Not to burst your bubble but you seem to do the most damage in your BBs. You do at or around 10-15k damage in most of your cruisers, all the way up to tier 7, in destroyers even less than 10k. In BBs you at least manage 20-30k, which is still less than half of your own HP which arguably is a lousy amount. 

 

well you are not bursting my bubble because that is exactly what I'm talking about

 

Destroyers cap, least that is what I and others use them for, and try to sniper at close range but at that I'm not so good as I miss so much.

Cruisers, easy to be destroyed I've found but they have the power of overwhelming fire power.

(two ships with reasons to get them sunk)

 

But Battleships are not scary enough to make the other side fear them and want to rid the map of them.

 

Expose an Aircraft carrier on the map and the pack go crazy going after it. (easy kill?)

 

That is what they should be doing to BB I think, get it sunk because it is dangerous, but other ships are far more feared.

[mtm78]

Expose an Aircraft carrier on the map and the pack go crazy going after it. (easy kill?)

 

 

Compare how 'easy' it is killing a BB and a CV. Now consider CV's have excellent late game value if they preserved their planes since they can strike across the map, keep DD's spotted, reset cap's and kill isolated targets. 

 

BB's are only more scary if they are sailed by a competent captain, one who actually uses it's armor/hp/alpha/heal/repair party to do something useful before the rest of their team is death. CV's >> BB's and that's normal, as CV's are the reasons BB's went extinct

 

 

 

 

[deadly_if_swallowed]

Overwhelming firepower on a cruiser? Constant damage output yes, but overwhelming... arguably. A battleship has the power to theoretically one-shot almost every ship of her own tier and below, sometimes even above. This ability is mitigated by dispersion (and sometimes just bad luck), but surely you have seen cruisers being blasted out the water by a single BB salvo. You will come to fear good BB players at some point Those ships are sturdy and impenetrable while angled, while they remain able to hit you like a truck. As for the reload, ~30 seconds is not that bad considering the damage potential. 

[mikelight1805]

I'm not the best BB captain by a long shot, but even i can see each nations BBs have a strong point.

 

IJN BBs have comparably weaker armour, but longer range. so these ships should keep threats at arms length

US BBs are slow, heavily armoured and have a hard hitting AP round, so these ships do well at mid ranges

KM BBs have decent armour and good secondaries, so can push forward if supported and brawl.

 

So, i would suggest you may be putting your BB in the wrong place. either too far away to do reliable damage for the whole match, or too close and getting focused down by multiple enemies

[allanoneill]

I absolutely understand any reservation towards them but, I however love the game pace and strategy of being a battleship captain - with good skills management one can became a formidable force. 

[kolloth]

This is what a BB can do.

You can pick off cruisers at range (with a bit of luck).

You can draw fire from the enemy to allow your team to do damage.

You can use WASD hacks to avoid torps.

 

BUT!:

you need to pick your fights. Do go 1v3+ and expect to live.

you need to be aware of what the enemy team is doing so you are prepared in advance. Your turrets rotate super slow so if you know you're gonna need them pointing to the other side then start sooner rather than later.

you're slow to turn, so if you think there is a DD near by you've got to start your evasive maneuvering now because once you see the torpedoes it's already too late.

watch out for incoming torp planes. if you see them heading in your direction either turn into them or away, which ever turn is shorter, don't ignore them and give them a broadside.

and don't give a broadside to enemy BBs if you can, even cruisers can punish your broadside at high tiers.

You're gonna burn. get used to it. learn when to put it out and when to let a single fire burn (usually when taking fire from cruisers, or when there are torp/bomber planes incoming)

 

vary your speed to throw off the enemy's aim. same with the rudder.

Use islands to break off combat if you need to retire and heal up.

 

finally, just because there are friendly ships with you now, doesnt mean they will be in 3 minutes.

cruisers will run from BBs, destroyers from cruisers, BBs from destroyers. Hell, I've seen a mix bag of ships sailing with me turn tail and run from a single enemy ship too many times for it to be funny.

 

[RockyRoller]

 

 

Compare how 'easy' it is killing a BB and a CV. Now consider CV's have excellent late game value if they preserved their planes since they can strike across the map, keep DD's spotted, reset cap's and kill isolated targets. 

 

BB's are only more scary if they are sailed by a competent captain, one who actually uses it's armor/hp/alpha/heal/repair party to do something useful before the rest of their team is death. CV's >> BB's and that's normal, as CV's are the reasons BB's went extinct

 

 

 

 

 

well every time and I mean every time i find and show where a CV is on the map, ALL who are remotely near (except a very few players) always head off to kill it. Near a cap, no kill the CV, its like a red flag to a bull so much so I think twice now about exposing them on a map.

 

I absolutely understand any reservation towards them but, I however love the game pace and strategy of being a battleship captain - with good skills management one can became a formidable force.  

 

its not that, its that I think they are missing a real role. Making furthers range less dispersed and better close range 2nd line defence would be a step in changing that.

 

[pihip_wg]

So far with US and Japanese ships up to level 5/6 they seem to do the least damage, partly because they take absolutely ages to reload or miss at great ranges and they die far too fast in close up brawls for secondary guns to take out Destroyers and Cruisers that close.

 

More or less my issue with battleships, but I'm below average as a player so most of it has to do with my inexperience. Doesn't change that I've found some battleships to be far more effective than others, but that's entirely subjective.

 

I also agree with the issue that secondaries can't keep up with destroyers and cruisers. Cruisers maybe to an extent because some of them are pretty large (Soviet ones for example), but destroyers are extremely quick and nimble, they WILL take some damage if they do a driveby, but that will usually be fully repaid by lots of torpedo damage, flooding and broken modules.

[RockyRoller]

Overwhelming firepower on a cruiser? Constant damage output yes, but overwhelming... arguably. A battleship has the power to theoretically one-shot almost every ship of her own tier and below, sometimes even above. This ability is mitigated by dispersion (and sometimes just bad luck), but surely you have seen cruisers being blasted out the water by a single BB salvo. You will come to fear good BB players at some point Those ships are sturdy and impenetrable while angled, while they remain able to hit you like a truck. As for the reload, ~30 seconds is not that bad considering the damage potential. 

 

poetic licence, but that really is a cruisers role, superior suppressing fire power, that is why it should fire faster than any other ship in the battle

 

I've been 1 shotted so to speak (1/3 health left) by others in a BB, can't say I ever 1 shotted in a BB.

 

Damage is the thing, the shells fire all over the place. I just think right now this defeats its role of a long arm fighter when most shells miss it seems. For game equality a lower hit chance at close and medium would be balance, but as DD are meant to be ninja close in BB need a better auto defence in close which is the secondary guns. Until then, no role no point? A line of cruisers could be better than a slugging brawl than a line of BB?

[mtm78]

I've been 1 shotted so to speak (1/3 health left) by others in a BB, can't say I ever 1 shotted in a BB.

 

Doesn't this tell you the problem might be that you need to aim better?

[ShinGetsu]

And that you need to expose less often your broadside, maybe.

 

To be very honest with you : no matter which kind of ship we are talking about, you are very, very bad in all of them. Don't blame the ship, blame the player. The only issue right now is you, and only you.

 

Take your Atago : 15.000 average damage. You should be able to at least double that, and that would still be terribad. 2.5 times your average would be a starting point.

I don't know if you're too agressive or not enough, but you should really do something. Start by improving your hit ratio maybe. 28% is not enough. Then, don't expose your broadside unless you are sure there is no danger. Use premium repair consumable for the extra charge and the improved reload. Get Priority Target, this skill should help you to survive. Get the concealment module if you don't already have it. That should do it for a start.

 

That's the same for your New Mex : 17% average hit ratio is terribadorrible. Learn to aim calmly, adjust your aim, maybe start by not firing all of your guns at the same time, but instead do sequential salvoes. Don't broadside, again, because you'll take massive damage. If you have trouble to hit at long range, that's normal. BBs are supposed to be in the front line. Get closer, and shotgun the cruisers, citadel the broadside BBs, be alert for eventual DDs and torps, and so on.

[EsaTuunanen]

But Battleships are not scary enough to make the other side fear them and want to rid the map of them.

You should like enemies not being overly worried about your battleship!

Because BB APs can smash careless/unaware cruisers real fast from any direction.

And when not being constantly focused you can better avoid getting burned down and use heals to get hitpoints back.

 

I've been 1 shotted so to speak (1/3 health left) by others in a BB, can't say I ever 1 shotted in a BB.

If knowing how/where to aim BB guns will eventually give Devastating Strikes especially on cruisers...

Already ability to always smash through their armor from some direction means that when RNG smiles you don't need many hits.

https://youtu.be/QuWO60RGol4?t=31s

 

And your aiming definitely needs some work.

 

While yourself don't show ship's side to enemies, unless wanting to be "roadkill" for even lighter class ship:

 

Only exception to rule are German BBs which can afford showing side momentarily to other BB and take only heavy damage instead of massive irrepairable damage.

[tenacious_torps]

For improving your aim you might want to consider to stick to cruisers or gunboats for a while, something with less dispersion so you get more reliably feedback on your skills. Adjusting your aim is also easier when it's not half a minute between shots, so the target had time to change course and speed. Try something Russian with rapid firing accurate guns, good starting point. And for the love of $supernatural_entity_of_your_choice stay away from higher tiers until you improve. That Atago clearly isn't for you right now. Btw, when I say improve your aim what I really mean is learn to hit citadels reliably. Especially for a BB that's where the damage is and that's why they're feared. Go back to them once you are sure how to do that. 

 

So, next. Best attack is only so good as the defense backing it up. Learn to angle properly, learn against what ships you can't angle because their guns overmatch your armor and avoid them. Get the notion out of your head, that the number of guns you can bring to bear is the deciding factor in your damage output. Nice, if the opportunity arises, but timing is more important. Yes, citadels again. Don't wait for all your guns to have turned, when you have a broadside-showing target. You can hit at a 90° angle, you do it, with whatever guns you happen to have pointing that way. And most importantly: neverever expose your broadside just to get an additional turret firing. Not even when brawling in a BB at closest distances btw. You go in firing your front turrets, use the very close range where most people don't know how to depress their guns enough to actually get to your citadel to turn away, you citadel them on your way out with your back turrets while they turn to keep showing you their broadside, because you've angered them and now they want to put all their manly guns to work. 9 times out of 10. Did you get the general idea? Even at close range you can and absolutely should protect your citadel at all times. That's priority numero uno, second is you don't just want to hit the enemy ship, you want to hit where it hurts and the damage sticks, so their citadel. Try to become a member of the proud minority who sail with their brain switched on.

 

Good luck in that endeavor. 

[ColonelPete]

So far with US and Japanese ships up to level 5/6 they seem to do the least damage, partly because they take absolutely ages to reload or miss at great ranges and they die far too fast in close up brawls for secondary guns to take out Destroyers and Cruisers that close.

 

Keyword: seem

Reality is a bit different.

[mtm78]

For improving your aim you might want to consider to stick to cruisers or gunboats for a while, something with less dispersion so you get more reliably feedback on your skills.

 

Ow boy, best ship to work on your aim is Yubari / Katori because they got the 40% accuracy increase module. Ofc this also means it kind of tricks you into taking a lot of long range 'risky' shots it is the ultimate gun setup to test your aiming skills 

[tenacious_torps]

 

Ow boy, best ship to work on your aim is Yubari / Katori because they got the 40% accuracy increase module. Ofc this also means it kind of tricks you into taking a lot of long range 'risky' shots it is the ultimate gun setup to test your aiming skills 

 

I keep hearing that, but don't own either. Soviet railguns are a good second best though, techtree-wise that's what I'd point people to. Certainly the ships that got me to improve my aim. As I started out as a torp spammer that took some rethinking. My initial approach was to just throw so much crap at the wall that some must stick. Given the horrible dispersion of most low tier ships I worked under the impression that praying to RNGeezus was all you could possibly do... I really have no troubles seeing where OP is coming from here. OP, if you're still reading: I forgot to mention the armor viewer in port. Use it. You can't hit, what you can't locate. Understanding where the citadel is and how it is protected isn't optional.  

[RockyRoller]

 

Doesn't this tell you the problem might be that you need to aim better?

 

Not at all, because I am hitting them, just not with all my shells, and this is the point people like you ignore as you are out to silence the debate or improve the game mechanics in any way... leetism in its finest.

[RockyRoller]

And that you need to expose less often your broadside, maybe.

 

To be very honest with you : no matter which kind of ship we are talking about, you are very, very bad in all of them. Don't blame the ship, blame the player. The only issue right now is you, and only you.

 

Take your Atago : 15.000 average damage. You should be able to at least double that, and that would still be terribad. 2.5 times your average would be a starting point.

I don't know if you're too agressive or not enough, but you should really do something. Start by improving your hit ratio maybe. 28% is not enough. Then, don't expose your broadside unless you are sure there is no danger. Use premium repair consumable for the extra charge and the improved reload. Get Priority Target, this skill should help you to survive. Get the concealment module if you don't already have it. That should do it for a start.

 

That's the same for your New Mex : 17% average hit ratio is terribadorrible. Learn to aim calmly, adjust your aim, maybe start by not firing all of your guns at the same time, but instead do sequential salvoes. Don't broadside, again, because you'll take massive damage. If you have trouble to hit at long range, that's normal. BBs are supposed to be in the front line. Get closer, and shotgun the cruisers, citadel the broadside BBs, be alert for eventual DDs and torps, and so on.

 

another one of the leet crowd this time erecting strawmen about my cruiser to belittle a person learning a gift the got, when the OP question is about battleships.

 

just FYI I watched some YT advise about cruisers and hiding, and had been practicing that.. getting as close as I can using the land cover.. of course I will get to sink faster that way...

the N Mex, again its a case of I am hitting far more than the stats suggest. eg I fire a round but only 17% of the shots hit where I targeted (at long range), the rest land in the water. There will be times at angled shots I miss, too much behind, but not by the second salvo as I correct, and its back to hitting the target with a few shells the rest land all around in the water. Even when the ship is head on charging it is like 50% of shots will always land in water and 50% on target. That is a game issue of all the shells not going where I aimed. I guess your answer to that is never fire salvos and the front guns should be aimed separately to the rear ones. 

 

Don't broadside is the only comment that makes any sense from you, why not add hide as far away from their ranged shots as that is what most seem to do at the start?

[mikelight1805]

Are you firing full broadside salvos or are you firing each turret individually?

 

If you are firing at a target that is manoeuvring, your hit rate will improve if you fire each turret separately along the path you predict the manoeuvring target will take

 

only shoot a salvo at a broadside target.