the myth that taking rpf means sacrafices...

[Kutfroat]

...in any other skill tree and so not everyone will take it, is to me just this...a myth. i'm mainly a dd and cruiser player, but i will take rpf on every bb i own over every other t4 skill. why? it completely negates the most dangerous tactic useable against a bb, flanking.

 

concealment is crap to start with on most bb. so although it might have some use...not being able to get flanked with torps => concealment.

 

survival expert...being able to take some shells more and only having 2 instead of 3 fires against NEVER being prone to get flanked...no brainer.

 

manual secondaries...although i have the bismarck...again, i will never get flanked!

 

manual aa...there are so few cv currently played...not worth taking 4 points over hard countering your hard counter.

 

(only play random and very rarely ranked though)

 

this "skill" negates any flanking against a bb! your only hatdcounter. and not only japanese dd are screwed. basically every dd capable of stealthtorping, so even us ones from mahan on!

 

rpf is, in my opinion mandatory (or will soon become), and only as second and third t4 skill you should take something else. compared to rpf, the damage negation potential of the other t4 skills is minimal. how one cant or doesnt want to see this, is beyond me...

[RUSSIANBlAS]

Possibly yes, as concealment can be 20km for all it matters as long as you can see the closest opponent to you...

 

I will consider this for my BB builds.

[Arctic_Nation]

I found it interesting that Flamu didn't recommend it for any of his Tier X BB builds, but once you consider that it would be very powerful either when pushing early in the game or when trying to avoid that single DD stalking you near the end of a game, I don't think I'll skip it in many ships.

[RUSSIANBlAS]

Information is the #1 most important thing as you are powerless unless you can plan your next move.

 

Torp walls are still the most dangerous thing a BB can face as it'll often be by surprise.

[Kutfroat]

Information is the #1 most important thing as you are powerless unless you can plan your next move.

 

Torp walls are still the most dangerous thing a BB can face as it'll often be by surprise.

...my point. with rpf there is no such thing as "surprise torpwall" for a bb anymore.

[WingedHussar_Adler]

Ussles skill for bb most of time. Secondary spec and stealth are much more productive for ijn and km and aaa spec for usa

 

This is offensive skill for dd hunters.

[WingedHussar_Adler]

I found it interesting that Flamu didn't recommend it for any of his Tier X BB builds, but once you consider that it would be very powerful either when pushing early in the game or when trying to avoid that single DD stalking you near the end of a game, I don't think I'll skip it in many ships.

Because flamu is not noob. This is noob skill on bb. Because you sacrifise other more importan skills. 

 

 

 

 

[WingedHussar_Adler]

...my point. with rpf there is no such thing as "surprise torpwall" for a bb anymore.

Torphits will invrease because noobs will stop loooking aroind and depend on rdf. . They will see icon that nerest ship is somwhete east. Cruiser behind iceland. Rn in smoke other dd. And got hit with torps from other source. Other dd or cruiser. 

 

Most torphits hapens when close fight begins. And apsolitly ussles skill in that. Because you will hav 5-6 shops in 10 km range and no idea what skill points. Probably will point target you see most of a time. 

[ilhilh]

...my point. with rpf there is no such thing as "surprise torpwall" for a bb anymore.

 

Except that it won't necessarily tell you the number of ships there, their distance, whether they have even launched torps.  WASD + minimap can counter most of the problems and at the same time you have made yourself weaker against the CAs and BBs who will enjoy facing a weaker ship and will shoot you every. single. battle.

 

EDIT:  Honestly, whilst I can see the benefits of RPF in a BB, I cannot see me putting it on any of my many BBs as I want to specialise in making myself tankier and/or more deadly.  There is simply too much else available that I think will benefit me more consistently.

[eliastion]

Well, I don't think I'll take it on ANY of my ships. I might consider it for Ranked builds but for Randoms? Sure, I've had my share of moments where it would've been useful (and even more moments when I thought in my DD "well, this only works because there's no RPF yet" ) but there are so many less situational/more important skills. On cruisers I'd take CE and manual AA over this. On BBs there's manual AA, manual secondaries, the "try burning me down now, b*tches" skill AND concealment... and I'm only listing t4 skills here, 4 points might mean 2 t2 skills instead.

 

I don't like this skill, I believe it shouldn't be in the game but as for its actual usefulness/balance... I just see so many others that I consider more relevant in Randoms. Maybe dedicated DD-hunters should pick it up, yes. But that's about all. 

[RUSSIANBlAS]

Part of me thinks there will be enough DD hunters with RDF equipped and most torp boats are going to stop playing then again it might be better to be self sufficient...

[robihr]

Ussles skill for bb most of time. Secondary spec and stealth are much more productive for ijn and km and aaa spec for usa

 

This is offensive skill for dd hunters.

 

for ranked and clan battles yes. for random no. RDF is OP defensive skill for non unicum bb players. there will be dd every battle, but cv are in 1 out of 5 or 10 battles. knowing that there is dd close to you and his position makes dodging torps easy for all but non brain dead players. so it makes more sense to spec bb with rdf rather than manual AA or even AFT.

[Hedgehog1963]

I found it interesting that Flamu didn't recommend it for any of his Tier X BB builds, but once you consider that it would be very powerful either when pushing early in the game or when trying to avoid that single DD stalking you near the end of a game, I don't think I'll skip it in many ships.

 

I have a lot of time for Flamu, but me slavishly following his advice would mean I have a hope of doing what he does.

 

 RDF is clearly going to be more help to an average player than it is to someone like Flamu (not the best but way, way better than me at playing WoWS) so I will attach it to any ship at risk to stealth fired torpedoes. I know that RDF will let me know if I need to zig zag and, should a lonely DD be the last enemy ship I will be able to hunt him mercilessly. 

[Hedgehog1963]

Well, I don't think I'll take it on ANY of my ships. I might consider it for Ranked builds but for Randoms? Sure, I've had my share of moments where it would've been useful (and even more moments when I thought in my DD "well, this only works because there's no RPF yet" ) but there are so many less situational/more important skills. On cruisers I'd take CE and manual AA over this. On BBs there's manual AA, manual secondaries, the "try burning me down now, b*tches" skill AND concealment... and I'm only listing t4 skills here, 4 points might mean 2 t2 skills instead.

 

I don't like this skill, I believe it shouldn't be in the game but as for its actual usefulness/balance... I just see so many others that I consider more relevant in Randoms. Maybe dedicated DD-hunters should pick it up, yes. But that's about all. 

 

Taking manual AA over RDF.

 

Ask yourself which is more common:  Destroyers or Carriers?

[El2aZeR]

It honestly doesn't matter if BBs take RPF or not, because DD hunters will most definitely do, thus preventing DDs from getting into position to damage/kill a BB in the first place. It's a passive buff, but a buff nonetheless.

[creamgravy]

Because flamu is not noob. This is noob skill on bb. Because you sacrifise other more importan skills. 

 

No BB captains chose situation awareness until they started getting wrecked by it.

 

What happens if you show broadside to an enemy BB you can't see or know where they are?

 

[principat121]

RPF shows the nearest (enemy) ship not the nearest (enemy) DD.

[daki]

...my point. with rpf there is no such thing as "surprise torpwall" for a bb anymore.

 

I guess you will be surprised then once you start using this skill

Come on mate, you just show that you neither tested it nor you have much clue on how it works.

 

It can help of course in some specific situations to avoid "the wall" but its far from solid protection.

As a simple example (which I saw plenty times on PT), I would love to see your face once your mighty RPF just shows the BB or CA close-by that you are brawling, while a DD launches his wall of torps  at your side

[ilhilh]

 

for ranked and clan battles yes. for random no. RDF is OP defensive skill for non unicum bb players. there will be dd every battle, but cv are in 1 out of 5 or 10 battles. knowing that there is dd close to you and his position makes dodging torps easy for all but non brain dead players. so it makes more sense to spec bb with rdf rather than manual AA or even AFT.

 

Well, manual AA is a waste of a skill I think but:

 

• AFT has its place for most BBs - increased AA all around (particularly USN/KM) and for secondaries of higher tier IJN and KM BBs.
• Manual secondaries - definitely viable for KM BBs and the Yamato.
• Fire prevention - this is very big for tankiness.  Whilst it may not be as obvious as RPF, I feel this will be working for you every game.
• Inertia fuse - only worth it for KM BBs but it is very strong for them and I really like the idea of bringing a whole new level of pain to secondary builds.
• RPF - talked to death.  A good skill with value... but good enough?
• CE - getting into position before unleashing a broadside can give you an edge.  Spending an extra 2 mins not getting shot at because you are unspotted makes you more survivable.  Being able to break off contact in some circumstances again makes you more survivable.

 

So KM BBs have to pick a maximum of 3 out of 6 viable level 4 skills.

Yamato (or any ship with a captain training for that top level) has max 3 from 5.

USN BBs might find it more palatable but I think they require CE more than other nations due to their armour scheme and AFT is pretty much a must IMO.

 

And all of that assumes that people will all go for only 1x level 2 and 1x level 3 skill - as soon as you want more than 1 skill at either of those levels 3x4 becomes impossible.

 

Then you need to work out which order you get your level 4 skills in - most captains won't have the 18 points required for 3x4 and as such you can't even have all 3 if you want them.  Which do you go with first?  Which do you go with second?

 

There will be some tough decisions to be made but I will be happy sailing past your burning (2 centreline) RPF equipped Yamato 2 minutes in whilst I am still stealthed in mine.

[Rozbrus]

Still totaly useless on any BB imho. I have now learned quite well to predict DDs movements and if I am still caught by a torpedo wall, it just means I made a mistake and DD used it. Not to mention that having that arrow or whatever constantly on my screen would kill me sooner that those torpedoes I will use the (almost) same builds. Secondaries on Bismarck, concealment on Scharnhorst and US BBs. Still have not decided about Japanese ones though.

[El2aZeR]

RPF shows the nearest (enemy) ship not the nearest (enemy) DD.

 

While true, you also forgot that it shows the nearest UNDETECTED enemy ship. That's usually a DD more often than not.

[WingedHussar_Adler]

 

for ranked and clan battles yes. for random no. RDF is OP defensive skill for non unicum bb players. there will be dd every battle, but cv are in 1 out of 5 or 10 battles. knowing that there is dd close to you and his position makes dodging torps easy for all but non brain dead players. so it makes more sense to spec bb with rdf rather than manual AA or even AFT.

 

i told you, average dmg of torps per t 10 game is 50 k....half bbs health......you die from other sources...AP, fire, cv.....and you sacrifise your offensive arsenal (manual secondaries), defense against HE AP (stealth) or cv AFT, manula AA.....you need to give something away.....and that will cost you more because average torp dmg is really low......but hey....CV will thank you....and every other ship if you in KM dont go full secondaries build

[WingedHussar_Adler]

 

No BB captains chose situation awareness until they started getting wrecked by it.

 

What happens if you show broadside to an enemy BB you can't see or know where they are?

 

 

if RDF spots BS (minium 13 km from you) than you or team did something veryyyyy wrong....i mean...did somebody actualy got recked from BS in stealth? .

 

and RDF WILL NOT SPOT HIM....and it will not tell you if that is BS or are you broadside to him.....it is not bacial skill..it only poinst sektor whee is nearest ship and most times it jumpes from place to place in group fight.

 

i mean, i tried it on PTR...and 90% of time i know that enemie is thre where it showed me, so it was waste of 4 th skill for me.

 

it has more sence for ca and DD for hunt....but still sometimes you get recked and find out it was not dd there but des moines and you die in wild chase

[RoyalColor]

It would be situational on a BB. If you gunfight with BB, which is in front of you, when suddenly RL shows that stealthy DD is flanking, do you turn into new threat just to give BB your broadside?

 

This skill will empower DDs and CLs/CAs the most imo.

 

On a BB it might be of some use in a late game, but still I wouldn't and I don't think many people would take it as a first choice on a BB. And if not the first choice, then we will rarely see it on BBs, as I don't think that many people have 14 point BB cpts. 

[eliastion]

 

Taking manual AA over RDF.

 

Ask yourself which is more common:  Destroyers or Carriers?

 

The question is not "what is more common: Destroyers or Carriers". The question is "what is more common: a DD attack that got me but wouldn't (or would hurt less) if I had RPF or a CV strike that got me or someone right next to me that could've been dealt with/blunted with manual AA".

Basically - while I meet DDs much more often than CVs, these encounters rarely make me wish for a skill like that. Encounters with CVs make me wish for some more AA much more often.

 

Then again, even if I did reconsider - manual AA is just one of the skills I mentioned, possibly the least important one. Fire prevention, manual secondaries, AFT - there are just so many skills/combinations of skills I'd prefer to RPF.