Another CV rant....

[Ragweek]

CV's always ruin games, manual drop should be removed, even better remove CV's from the game altogether

 

Why is it always bad players that say these kind of comments.

 

Ones that have either never played a CV or ones that are very bad in them. This person or the OP have never done a manual drop with a torp ( successfully looking at their stats) ones that sail their bb on their own and wonder why they get picked on buy a CV.

 

CV's have been nerfed more than any other class to the point that there economy is totally broken.

 

At the end of the day CV bring a lot to the game to make it much more interesting and diverse. Some people just want world of Battleships with Cruisers to pick on.

[aboomination]

CV's have been nerfed more than any other class to the point that there economy is totally broken.

 

Which has nothing to do with ingame balance, tho.

[Ragweek]

 

Which has nothing to do with ingame balance, tho.

 

and has everything to do with moaning posts like this! 

[aboomination]

and has everything to do with moaning posts like this! 

 

Maybe

[lezantas26]

 

​CVs counter BBs. We need that

 

CV counter DD more than they counter BB, but anyway...

imo, the problem with CV is they give too much power into a single player, having a good/bad cv can make or ruin a game. my proposal is nerf CVs a bit, and add 3 CV bots per team to each match. that way the power distributes more evenly, and even in matches without human CV there are planes to counter BB/DD

also, that would enable wg to buff CV economy again, since cv performance would be nerfed

and last pro, it would make fighter builds way more useful than they are now

 

*the exp/creds the bots earn, would be distributed among the rest players depending on the % of their contribution. so someone who got 500exp would get half the bonus than someone in the same team that got 1000exp. 

[mtm78]

 

and has everything to do with moaning posts like this! 

 

But bad players deserve to have fun to....

 

 

imo, the problem with CV is they give too much power into a single player, having a good/bad cv can make or ruin a game

 

Which is why tier 8 - 10 already has no more dual CV's per game. They should extend that downwards all the way imo, this way a bad CV can't be matched with another bad cv against a good cv with another good cv. 

 

One good CV is not as game breaking vs a terrible one, as two are against two of those 45'ers. 

[Ragweek]

 

CV counter DD more than they counter BB, but anyway...

imo, the problem with CV is they give too much power into a single player, having a good/bad cv can make or ruin a game. my proposal is nerf CVs a bit, and add 3 CV bots per team to each match. that way the power distributes more evenly, and even in matches without human CV there are planes to counter BB/DD

 

never played a cv: Tick

CV op:  Tick.

 

The main reason why DD's get such a hard time is because at higher Tiers BB's aa in alot of cases is insane!

 

SO Cv's only realistic target is DD's.

 

Only halfway though a game I will come back to the AAA rated bb's. after they are on their own and have had their AA damaged.

[Ragweek]

 

But bad players deserve to have fun to....

 

 

 

Which is why tier 8 - 10 already has no more dual CV's per game. They should extend that downwards all the way imo, this way a bad CV can't be matched with another bad cv against a good cv with another good cv. 

 

One good CV is not as game breaking vs a terrible one, as two are against two of those 45'ers. 

 

This really is an issue . Players like you with an almost 0% played games in a CV have soo much to say.

[lezantas26]

 

But bad players deserve to have fun to....

 

 

 

Which is why tier 8 - 10 already has no more dual CV's per game. They should extend that downwards all the way imo, this way a bad CV can't be matched with another bad cv against a good cv with another good cv. 

 

One good CV is not as game breaking vs a terrible one, as two are against two of those 45'ers. 

 

i edited my previous post a bit. i believe adding CV bots will be better, not only cause of the pros i mentioned in the edit, but also because its stupid to limit a class as a measure of balance. if there are 4 people that want to play CV, then they should be able to, instead of 2 of them having to wait more

 

[mtm78]

This really is an issue . Players like you with an almost 0% played games in a CV have soo much to say.

 

Can you elaborate on which part of my comment is related to my admittedly severely lacking experience of playing CV's myself?

 

edit: just pointing out btw; I am not for nerving CV's and I know CV economy is bullocks now, my comment when I quoted you was a jab at the baddies complaining about single CV's...

 

i edited my previous post a bit. i believe adding CV bots will be better, not only cause of the pros i mentioned in the edit, but also because its stupid to limit a class as a measure of balance. if there are 4 people that want to play CV, then they should be able to, instead of 2 of them having to wait more

 

Bots in PvP

[anonym_EFwxJOPWzlER]

As a Destroyer the carrier should be causing you little to no problems

 

[dasCKD]

i edited my previous post a bit. i believe adding CV bots will be better, not only cause of the pros i mentioned in the edit, but also because its stupid to limit a class as a measure of balance. if there are 4 people that want to play CV, then they should be able to, instead of 2 of them having to wait more

 

The CV population is relatively low anyways, having more than 4 in a game is needless. In fact I believe that having two is more than sufficient. A lot of the skill that goes into carrier battles comes in from the mind games, either guessing where the enemy CV will strike next or scouting forwards and expending time to find the enemy strike and interception forces. Two CV players on each team just results in the two sides butting heads with RNG deciding the winner.

 

Destroyers against carriers are interesting to say the least. On the one hand, being harassed by a 80% WR carrier in a destroyer basically ends games. On the other hand I've seen a Hatsuharu and an Ognevoi both die to a single autodrop by a Ranger so the Problem is hardly just the CV's fault.

[Ragweek]

 

Can you elaborate on which part of my comment is related to my admittedly severely lacking experience of playing CV's myself?

 

 

Bots in PvP

 

Sorry you must have a bad memory. In the past when you have flamed at me you admitted may times, that you do not play CVs and have limited experience in them.

 

 

[mtm78]

 

Sorry you must have a bad memory. In the past when you have flamed at me you admitted may times, that you do not play CVs and have limited experience in them.

 

How does that relate with your remark about my comment? 

 

ps: 

 

edit: just pointing out btw; I am not for nerving CV's and I know CV economy is bullocks now, my comment when I quoted you was a jab at the baddies complaining about single CV's...

 

Also I don't think I flamed you, I guess you felt like that for some reason but that was never the intend. And yes my memory is such that I don't even remember disagreeing with you on any CV related subject, but either way how would that be related to this topic? 

[Ragweek]

 

 

Classic. I know as a dd I have very few issues from cv's. First of all I very rarely see them. Then as I know Cv's well and it takes a lot of skill to hit a good dd player, I know how to avoid them.

 

 

[lezantas26]

 

Can you elaborate on which part of my comment is related to my admittedly severely lacking experience of playing CV's myself?

 

 

Bots in PvP

 

sure why not? either that or severely nerf CV so more can play in each game, but nerfs wont attract more players to play cv, and there is no warranty that every game will have a sufficient number of them anyway. if you want CV to keep check in BB/DD power, then CV bots are the best bet imo

 

i dont understand why they made it a player class in the first place. it plays completely different so not many players would like to play, AND its big piece in the balance puzzle, but each game may or may not have CV. any way you look at it, CV are better fitted as AI class, so i see no problem with letting both ai and player CV into the games ;)

[Ragweek]

 

How does that relate with your remark about my comment? 

 

ps: 

 

 

Also I don't think I flamed you, I guess you felt like that for some reason but that was never the intend. And yes my memory is such that I don't even remember disagreeing with you on any CV related subject, but either way how would that be related to this topic? 

 

I you read my previous comment It might help.....

 

"CV's have been nerfed more than any other class to the point that thier economy is totally broken." 

Then I said that that reason came from precisely from negative comments from people who dont know how to play CV's

 

 

Ps you did flame at me on the Cv forum, to the point you comment had to be removed.

 

 

[mtm78]

Then as I know Cv's well and it takes a lot of skill to hit a good dd player, I know how to avoid them.

 

They can still spot you and your torpedoes, but yes a good CV player will have much higher situational awareness and will know when to use allied ships to avoid to much CV attention. But in late game, IJN DD's are not that hard to cross drop by an equally competent CV player. I think you would have no issues cross dropping me in the IJN DD's, and I'm by most accounts not a bad DD player. USN DD's ( not all ofc ) are more agile / turn better, and have access to AAA consumable to avoid to much CV attention. VMF DD's usually play at longer ranges where it's easier to run for allies to use their AAA umbrella. Idk yet about Germans, I assume they are very easy to kill for a competent CV due to their huge turning circles. 

 

I you read my previous comment It might help.....

 

"CV's have been nerfed more than any other class to the point that thier economy is totally broken." 

Then I said that that reason came from precisely from negative comments from people who dont know how to play CV's

 

So my comment was supporting you, as it's the baddies which keep claiming CV's are ' broken ', yet this whole discussion went sideways because you were still thinking about an unpleasant former encounter?

 

Ps you did flame at me on the Cv forum, to the point you comment had to be removed.

 

Mods remove more posts of mine which they shouldn't. I also rarely if ever post in CV forum.. 

 

Sorry I can't recall any of this nor is it in any way related to this topic

 

[Ragweek]

 

sure why not? either that or severely nerf CV so more can play in each game, but nerfs wont attract more players to play cv, and there is no warranty that every game will have a sufficient number of them anyway. if you want CV to keep check in BB/DD power, then CV bots are the best bet imo

 

i dont understand why they made it a player class in the first place. it plays completely different so not many players would like to play, AND its big piece in the balance puzzle, but each game may or may not have CV. any way you look at it, CV are better fitted as AI class, so i see no problem with letting both ai and player CV into the games ;)

 

As someone who spent months perfecting the art of manual torpes and bombs. I for one dont want to go back to the clicky artillery style game play of bb's  and CA's.

[Nechrom]

CVs have way too much influence for a single player.

Whether it's down to map control like spotting or doing lots of damage, they have way too high impact on the battle.

 

A lot of it comes from their ability to strike/spot virtually anywhere on the map. That's not something you can do a lot about without adding fuel mechanics or something similar. So I think they should be balanced in other ways.

Removing manual drop just lowers the skill ceiling and makes them more boring, so I'd instead just increase the arming range for their torps so they would have to predict maneuvers and give the target at least some chance to avoid.

I'd also completely remove the ability of planes to spot torpedoes. Not even 5% of CV players do it intentionally anyway, so there is almost no loss in making that change, and you end up giving torpedo DDs a small buff which they sorely need.

[mtm78]

Removing manual drop just lowers the skill ceiling and makes them more boring, so I'd instead just increase the arming range for their torps so they would have to predict maneuvers and give the target at least some chance to avoid.

 

This would lower their avg damage output incrementally since CV's have to deal with distance / flight time with each strike. But it might be something they could test on a PT, with small steps.

 

I'd also completely remove the ability of planes to spot torpedoes. Not even 5% of CV players do it intentionally anyway, so there is almost no loss in making that change, and you end up giving torpedo DDs a small buff which the sorely need.

 

As a DD player I would like this a lot. I will admit I <3 CV's who keep spotting around smoke to give early warning for torpedo's fired from it as well as being able to strike the DD when the smoke runs out.

[Ragweek]

 

They can still spot you and your torpedoes, but yes a good CV player will have much higher situational awareness and will know when to use allied ships to avoid to much CV attention. But in late game, IJN DD's are not that hard to cross drop by an equally competent CV player. I think you would have no issues cross dropping me in the IJN DD's, and I'm by most accounts not a bad DD player. USN DD's ( not all ofc ) are more agile / turn better, and have access to AAA consumable to avoid to much CV attention. VMF DD's usually play at longer ranges where it's easier to run for allies to use their AAA umbrella. Idk yet about Germans, I assume they are very easy to kill for a competent CV due to their huge turning circles. 

 

One one nation is either easy or hard. I find its just how skilled the player is. Sometimes I find the dd that knows how to rely on his teams AA can be an issue. 

 

They have a CV too .

 

I'm not the best of cv captains but when I have 8 air groups to control  I dont get time to cross torp at the start of the game. pluss DD use smoke more at the start.

 

I just are very aggressive and are relentless in my tactic rather that waiting for the perfect timing. 

[lezantas26]

 

As someone who spent months perfecting the art of manual torpes and bombs. I for one dont want to go back to the clicky artillery style game play of bb's  and CA's.

 

sure but you are the minority. plus, perfecting the art of torps and bombs is half the mastery of cv. fighters being neglected says a lot about their viability, cv simply dont want to play with AA builds as it severely limits their effectiveness and rewards. more targets would fix that, but giving cv more squadrons would make them even more potentially powerful, worsening the current situation of matchups even more

 

hence why the 3 cv bots suggestion, now there is plenty of targets for your fighters to practice on 

 

CVs have way too much influence for a single player.

Whether it's down to map control like spotting or doing lots of damage, they have way too high impact on the battle.

 

A lot of it comes from their ability to strike/spot virtually anywhere on the map. That's not something you can do a lot about without adding fuel mechanics or something similar. So I think they should be balanced in other ways.

Removing manual drop just lowers the skill ceiling and makes them more boring, so I'd instead just increase the arming range for their torps so they would have to predict maneuvers and give the target at least some chance to avoid.

I'd also completely remove the ability of planes to spot torpedoes. Not even 5% of CV players do it intentionally anyway, so there is almost no loss in making that change, and you end up giving torpedo DDs a small buff which they sorely need.

 

check my suggestion in the previous page

[Ragweek]

CVs have way too much influence for a single player.

 

never played a cv: Tick

CV op:  Tick.

 

There is getting a pattern here...

[dasCKD]

Removing manual drop just lowers the skill ceiling and makes them more boring, so I'd instead just increase the arming range for their torps so they would have to predict maneuvers and give the target at least some chance to avoid.

 

The drop distance is already significantly larger than what they would be IRL, about three to four times longer if my estimations are correct. Destroyers are already able to avoid drops unless the drops are executed in such a way that they are literally unavoidable which is something that very few CV players can do. Battleships shouldn't be able to evade a torpedo drop anyways, they have a strong AA to protect themselves. Cruisers also have the defensive fire or insane AA DPS themselves. That is not a nerf that is in any way necessary nor justifiable unless massive overhauls are made to the class interactions in game.

I'd also completely remove the ability of planes to spot torpedoes. Not even 5% of CV players do it intentionally anyway, so there is almost no loss in making that change, and you end up giving torpedo DDs a small buff which the sorely need.

 

The CVs are primarily used for fleet reconnaissance and destroyer acquisition in clan wars as well as in ranked battles. If destroyers having their torpedoes spotted is a problem, then just reduce the range that the planes can spot their torpedoes so carriers will have to spot actively or their planes will miss the torpedo spreads.