Maybe put a limit on amount on BBs in a match WG?

[steviln]

. Cruisers should be the most prevalent because they're the most diverse and makes the game the most interesting.

 

But why should that in tiself make them more prevalent? Better to have cruiser for experienced players. But the main problem with cruiser captains are that they whine about CVs being to weak and not being played enough. If more cruiser captains leave the game, it means a CV buff is more unlikely and more BB captains makes further CV nerfs more propable. 

[dasCKD]

But why should that in tiself make them more prevalent?

 

As they are so fundamentally different, they fulfill different roles in the game. Roles that the game fundamentally depends on to retain dynamic movement instead of 20km BB sniping matches. Cruisers have ships like the Schors that prefers to engage at maximum range, cruisers like the Edinburgh that needs to hold lines, Roons that like to get close and personal before ripping everything to piece, and Clevelands that sails with the fleet to provide AA whilst contributing to the team through HE fire. Battleships are all basically ships with big guns that do a lot of damage. An Amagi fulfills basically the same role as a North Carolina and engages at similar ranges.

Better to have cruiser for experienced players.

 

No. Cruisers are, without exception, the starting line for all nations. They exist as the middle group and the universal class. In any multiplayer game you will need more universal ships than specialized ships. That is simply a fundamental trait of multiplayer games especially with random matchmaking. The ships that can perform all roles should be the choice for the majority of the player base, specialized classes should be reserved for better or specialized players. The fact that battleships are the go-to ships for the idiots in the playerbase is a fundamental flaw in game design.

But the main problem with cruiser captains are that they whine about CVs being to weak and not being played enough.

 

No. Cruiser captains complain about battleships being too strong an numerous.

If more cruiser captains leave the game, it means a CV buff is more unlikely and more BB captains makes further CV nerfs more propable. 

 

Cruiser captains are being pushed out of the game by the battleship meta. Before any changes to carrier performance, battleships need to take a nerf bat for the game.

[CleverViking]

Well, this turned quite heated more quickly than expected. 

 

But why should that in tiself make them more prevalent? Better to have cruiser for experienced players. But the main problem with cruiser captains are that they whine about CVs being to weak and not being played enough. If more cruiser captains leave the game, it means a CV buff is more unlikely and more BB captains makes further CV nerfs more propable. 

 

Cruisers are the most inoffensive choice as "filler" for a match.

 

They don't have the game-changing capabilites of CVs (though they are capped at 2 and not really  a problem so lets skip those)

 

They don't have the armor and the "lets roll the RNG dice and see if I randomly cit you twice through the bow" guns of BBs. 

 

They don't have the stealth of DDs or their ability to drop torps risk-free.

 

Even DD captains won't cry too much if there is a match with a lot of cruisers, even though they're supposed to counter them. In my opinion cruisers should be the main filler as the other choices [edited]over the other ships too much.

 

Caps should be set no lower than 4 however, It should prevent matches were certain ships feel too useless but also allow for some variation in matches. 

[Exocet6951]

 

But why should that in tiself make them more prevalent? Better to have cruiser for experienced players. But the main problem with cruiser captains are that they whine about CVs being to weak and not being played enough. If more cruiser captains leave the game, it means a CV buff is more unlikely and more BB captains makes further CV nerfs more propable. 

 

 

The funny thing is that you keep defending BBs, but every time you open your mouth, you let slip even more arguments that BBs are the root of every problem in the game.

 

They need to take a hard stance, and decide if BBs are supposed to be well rounded, in which case damage and survival needs to decrease, or if BBs are meant to be damage monsters, in which case survival and maneuverability needs to decrease substancially. 

There was a running gag back in CBT that the Iowa was the best tier10 cruiser. Never has that been more true.

 

[SovietFury43]

 

No, it certainly should not. I would rather have a limit of 3 cruisers per side. I simply do not see what is so fantastic about cruiserspam?

 

Becuase the game would be much more dynamic and fluent if there were more Cruisers as opposed to the static braindead BB campfest that it is now.

[steviln]

 

Becuase the game would be much more dynamic and fluent if there were more Cruisers as opposed to the static braindead BB campfest that it is now.

 

So why not simply go back to COD then? I actually think that many players play this game exactly because it is slower than most similar games. If you want something faster and more fluent you have Steel Ocean. 

[Artech52]

 

Becuase the game would be much more dynamic and fluent if there were more Cruisers as opposed to the static braindead BB campfest that it is now.

 

Quoted for infinite truth.

 

Battleships really are a bit too good all round at the moment, and one of the following needs to happen for the situation to improve:

- Buff to cruiser survivability

- Nerf to BBs

- A cap on the number of DDs/BBs.

 

People can yell "git gud" at cruisers until they're blue in the face, but I struggle to take them seriously given some of the insane RNG damage I've done on CAs that were following all the usual common sense guidelines. (And of course been on the other end of...)

 

One lucky shot from my Fuso (a shotgun at the best of times) knocking half an angled Myoko's health off at a good 16k range comes immediately and painfully to mind.

 

In most other games, seeing one particular class stacked in overwhelming numbers in a large proportion of matches would be seen as a gigantic red flag that something is wrong. Why is it only on here that that's instead something to just dismiss out of hand?

[steviln]

 

 

The funny thing is that you keep defending BBs, but every time you open your mouth, you let slip even more arguments that BBs are the root of every problem in the game.

 

They need to take a hard stance, and decide if BBs are supposed to be well rounded, in which case damage and survival needs to decrease, or if BBs are meant to be damage monsters, in which case survival and maneuverability needs to decrease substancially. 

There was a running gag back in CBT that the Iowa was the best tier10 cruiser. Never has that been more true.

 

 

I do not really want BBs to be well rounded, because in real surface combat they were completely superior to cruiser. If you look at real surface engagements, the heavier ship had a clear advantage. You even saw Graf Spee being quite balanced against three british CLs at the battle of the River Plate. Alternatively, CVs were so OP that when they became prevelant in real life, the other classes simply lost most of their importance. No real CV captain in real life would bomb BBS and DDs in a battle where the enemy had effective CVs present. 

 

It is simply important to me that the game stay "thematic". 

[steviln]

Even DD captains won't cry too much if there is a match with a lot of cruisers, even though they're supposed to counter them. In my opinion cruisers should be the main filler as the other choices [edited]over the other ships too much.

 

I cry a lot when I play DD and the match is full of cruisers. I would really prefer that the entire enemy team would be battleships, and preferrably german battleships. 

[steviln]

Cruiser captains are being pushed out of the game by the battleship meta. Before any changes to carrier performance, battleships need to take a nerf bat for the game.

 

No, they rather need to exclude cruiser captains from the forum Even though it may lead to me also being excluded from the forum

[dasCKD]

I do not really want BBs to be well rounded, because in real surface combat they were completely superior to cruiser. If you look at real surface engagements, the heavier ship had a clear advantage. You even saw Graf Spee being quite balanced against three british CLs at the battle of the River Plate. Alternatively, CVs were so OP that when they became prevelant in real life, the other classes simply lost most of their importance. No real CV captain in real life would bomb BBS and DDs in a battle where the enemy had effective CVs present. 

 

Are you arguing that CVs should be buffed to their real life performance? Do you realize that the Yamato's engineers expected the Yamato to take a total of 6 AIRDROPPED torpedoes before she was rendered unfit for further combat? Why do battleship mains always insist on bring up historical performance when they would take a full minute to accelerate, take a few kilometers to turn, and would have their rudder as well as probably their ship beam snapped if they pulled anything remotely like the maneuvers they did in game?

[dasCKD]

No, they rather need to exclude cruiser captains from the forum

 

Well done, you have excluded literally everyone from the forums. If you play World of Warships, you will have to play cruisers. No exceptions. The battleship mentality appears to be that they should be the hero of a first person shooter whilst everyone else is an NPC mook.

[CleverViking]

I do not really want BBs to be well rounded, because in real surface combat they were completely superior to cruiser. If you look at real surface engagements, the heavier ship had a clear advantage. You even saw Graf Spee being quite balanced against three british CLs at the battle of the River Plate. Alternatively, CVs were so OP that when they became prevelant in real life, the other classes simply lost most of their importance. No real CV captain in real life would bomb BBS and DDs in a battle where the enemy had effective CVs present. 

 

Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't the amount of big beefy battleships limited by each country's resources due to the high investment required? If you want to be all realistic then maybe we shouldn't have 3 Yamato's on either side?

 

If you want a ship sim that's fine, but WOWS isn't a sim, has never tried to be a sim and classes should be balanced to suit gameplay not misguided "realism". I'm sure there's some sims out there if you'd like, don't let the door hit you on the way out.

[RUSSIANBlAS]

A class cap for everything would actually make random battles a bit boring. Games would start to take the same format every game. At least a lol MM keeps things mixed up and keeps some folk complaining 

 

[CleverViking]

A class cap for everything would actually make random battles a bit boring. Games would start to take the same format every game.

 

That's actually true. Sometimes the absurdity of the MM is as entertaining as the match itself.

 

Still the match I screenshotted turned into a survival-horror for the two poor cruisers. Don't think they were as amused 

[Gaunter_O_Dimm_]

I F4CKING LOVE the vast number of BB's in games these days.

 

The amount of damage you can farm is phenomenal. In any ship class if you know what you're doing.

 

In a BB be MANLY (but also smart). Don't throw your life away but don't be a little pussy sitting at the back. 

 

In a CA/CL be cautious. Use cover. Spam the living sh!t out of BB's with HE when it is safe to do so. Watch them burn and cry like BBABIES.

 

In a DD just create torpedo soup or ambush the gonads from them. Laugh at the salty tears from complaints of DD's being invisible.

 

ENJOY being a tw4t to the enemy in how you position your self NOT how you behave in chat.

 

Work WITH your team mates even if they don't seem to be working with you. THAT is how you carry your team.

 

No more burning or torpedo soup next patch sadly

[_ramrus_]

Limiting amount of BB players would directly limit the amount of WoWs players.

I would rather transfer some BB players to all day ranked. I had great fun playing Bayern in ranked, but after 10 battles I could go no more, and had to grind it out in random.

[SovietFury43]

 

I do not really want BBs to be well rounded, because in real surface combat they were completely superior to cruiser. If you look at real surface engagements, the heavier ship had a clear advantage. You even saw Graf Spee being quite balanced against three british CLs at the battle of the River Plate. Alternatively, CVs were so OP that when they became prevelant in real life, the other classes simply lost most of their importance. No real CV captain in real life would bomb BBS and DDs in a battle where the enemy had effective CVs present. 

 

It is simply important to me that the game stay "thematic". 

 

In real life Japanese torpedoes had a 22km range at 50kts, and left no wake behind them. Should we make them like that in the game as well, or do only BBs get the privilege of the "historical accuracy" argument?

[dasCKD]

 

In real life Japanese torpedoes had a 22km range at 50kts, and left no wake behind them. Should we make them like that in the game as well, or do only BBs get the privilege of the "historical accuracy" argument?

 

A torpedo hit would also almost definitely spell an end to any ship. Maybe we should have that in game as well!

[SovietFury43]

Limiting amount of BB players would directly limit the amount of WoWs players.

I would rather transfer some BB players to all day ranked. I had great fun playing Bayern in ranked, but after 10 battles I could go no more, and had to grind it out in random.

 

 

Crippling cruisers and CVs like they did already caused quite a few players i know to leave the game because they don't want to play "world of battleships". Where is the concern for them? 

[steviln]

 

 

Crippling cruisers and CVs like they did already cause quite a few players i know to leave the game because they don't want to play "world of battleships". Where is the concern for them? 

 

It seems that the people who want to play "World of Battleships" outnumber those who want "World of CVs and Cruisers". For my part, if every match start to feature CVs I will leave the game.

[Exocet6951]

 

I do not really want BBs to be well rounded, because in real surface combat they were completely superior to cruiser. If you look at real surface engagements, the heavier ship had a clear advantage. You even saw Graf Spee being quite balanced against three british CLs at the battle of the River Plate. Alternatively, CVs were so OP that when they became prevelant in real life, the other classes simply lost most of their importance. No real CV captain in real life would bomb BBS and DDs in a battle where the enemy had effective CVs present. 

 

It is simply important to me that the game stay "thematic". 

 

Except for, ironically, destroyers who still exist today as backbone of any fleet, and cruisers who were still the go-to ship for any fleet action up until the 50s, when guided missiles just made anti-surface guns redundant.

 

BB weren't "completely superior" to every other ship, seeing as there are multiple incidents where destroyers using only their guns fought off battleships.

Again, real life wasn't like this game. You had to spot a target, get its bearing, speed, get a firing solution, then hope for the best. I'll let you guess what's easier to shoot at, a small destroyer that can quickly maneuver and adjust its fire, or the massive battleship that takes ages to do any maneuver and has to sequence its salvoes over the course of minutes just to correct its fire.

 

 

You're so stuck in a "BB master race"  mindset, both ingame and IRL, that I feel embarrassed for you.

[steviln]

 

In real life Japanese torpedoes had a 22km range at 50kts, and left no wake behind them. Should we make them like that in the game as well, or do only BBs get the privilege of the "historical accuracy" argument?

 

It is a matter on how unrealistic a game should be. A game where a cruiser is equally powerful as a battleship simply become to much in my opinion at least. Even now, battleships are a lot less effective compared to cruiser relative to what they were in actual combat. I am not saying I want the game to be a simulator. 

[steviln]

 

Except for, ironically, destroyers who still exist today as backbone of any fleet, and cruisers who were still the go-to ship for any fleet action up until the 50s, when guided missiles just made anti-surface guns redundant.

 

BB weren't "completely superior" to every other ship, seeing as there are multiple incidents where destroyers using only their guns fought off battleships.

Again, real life wasn't like this game. You had to spot a target, get its bearing, speed, get a firing solution, then hope for the best. I'll let you guess what's easier to shoot at, a small destroyer that can quickly maneuver and adjust its fire, or the massive battleship that takes ages to do any maneuver and has to sequence its salvoes over the course of minutes just to correct its fire.

 

 

You're so stuck in a "BB master race"  mindset, both ingame and IRL, that I feel embarrassed for you.

 

When did destroyers fight off battleships with their guns only? the cruisers were the most used class in surface engagements because they were seen as more expendable than the battleships, but at Jutland you see what happens to lighter ships taking part in a major fleet action. 

 

Off course battleships were totally useless against carriers, but the strength difference between those two classes were so huge in real life, that a game should not have player controlled ships of both those classes!

[1MajorKoenig]

 

But why should that in tiself make them more prevalent? Better to have cruiser for experienced players. But the main problem with cruiser captains are that they whine about CVs being to weak and not being played enough. If more cruiser captains leave the game, it means a CV buff is more unlikely and more BB captains makes further CV nerfs more propable. 

 

Are you trolling?

 

If you build a class based game all classes need to be a viable choice. That should be obvious to you. Same if you make a PvP shooter game and everyone plays only snipers. It is bad.

 

At the moment it is a lot of fun driving BBs - but the other classes struggle and it can be frustrating/hard work to achieve anything significant in them.

 

Of course releasing a highly anticipated line lets the player numbers peak. But this is now not a peak anymore it is a permanent situation. And a significant imbalance in class share that needs to be corrected either through making other classes more attractive, BBs less attractive or through hard caps.