Public Test 0.6.0 - Changes for Test 2

[Culiacan_Mexico]

...BB's are gonna take it for the immunity factor...

 

This was my experience on the test server.  Early game I am not sure it help BBs very much, but mid game, when my Hatsuharu starts to shine, BBs with this skill were virtually immune to torpedo attacks.  They simply turned away.

 

I don't know how many BBs will take this skill, but mid game it can offer considerable open water Japanese Destroy protection. 

[sprototles]

i dont know why you afraid of RPF , in most cases, you can predict pposition of enemy, wait for his mistake or hope for smart team-play

i dont think so many players will choose this

[Culiacan_Mexico]

...You can not test RPF, since you don't know which ship on enemy team has the perk... 

Yes, no, maybe.

 

In the games I played with my Japanese DD, in 70% RPF light me up at some point.  In 50% of the game I played I was able to identify which ship was using RPF (mostly BBs).  It was obvious that BB and CA behavior was different from live, but DDs... I am not sure. 

[Culiacan_Mexico]

...There are some concerns about this 'sector' usage, since if it were sector based it would be jumpy when moving between borders of sectors. This isn't the case, the movement is totally fluid... 

I saw the same thing when I tried it on my ships on the test server.

[mtm78]

Yes, no, maybe. am not sure. 

 

Exactly my point

 

I saw the same thing when I tried it on my ships on the test server.

 

Tonight, I will try and edit the image file so it's a nice straight arrow, enable training room and get someone to test the skill in the training room to see exactly how 'accurate' or 'inaccurate' it is ( enable replays and compare replays and indicator bearings ). 

[Culiacan_Mexico]

 

2) The issue the DD hunter faces primarily and most importantly is not lack of  knowledge of the direction of it's prey it's dealing with the supporting ships. If WG believes that cruisers currently don't DD hunt enough it isn't because they don't know which direction the closest DD is it's because of the danger presented to them by their prey's supporting fleet and inability to mitigate this.

This.

 

 

[FallenOrchid]

Radar has the counter of it's reload and limited range, hydro even more so but at the benefit of torpedo detection as well. RPF has no downside.

 

This. RDF being always active without any way to block it makes it OP.

RDF should be a consumable: Radar/Hydro show exact position (of multiple enemies) but a close range, RDF shows only vague direction of nearest enemy but at much higer range.

[Nethraniel]

2) The issue the DD hunter faces primarily and most importantly is not lack of  knowledge of the direction of it's prey it's dealing with the supporting ships. If WG believes that cruisers currently don't DD hunt enough it isn't because they don't know which direction the closest DD is it's because of the danger presented to them by their prey's supporting fleet and inability to mitigate this.

Exactly, it is easy to hunt DD in a CA, however, if I engage a DD in a CA and I really want to kill that DD, I need to maneuver in a way, that I, in my CA, get instantly deleted by all the BBs around.

[wongman66]

 

The idea behind the skill is to improve the role of DD hunters that is crucial to all cruisers and some destroyers. While the skill will certainly be a powerful one, it has quite a high cost and will come at the expense of another skill. We expect this to be an efficient option for these ships, but definitely not a must.

 

The idea is also not to remove a layer of skill, but add a layer of tactical choice in the skill-tree and on the battlefield.

 

 

We put a lot of thought into this change and we don't expect it to be overpowered in ranked as Ranked Battles tend to have more close quarter combat, where spotting is more frequent anyway.

 

As for competitive play, the skill will definitely open up more options for "Recon" ships and some sneaky strategies, both using the skill and maybe abusing the fact that the enemy team is relying on the skill. In general we think that more options here are better for the game.

 

 

We will keep looking at all the feedback, but we will not always be able to make decisions based solely on it.

 

From my part, I can only ask that you guys keep testing the current build and keep providing great feedback. We will make sure that it is heard.

 

 

Your last sentence absolutely sticks in my craw.

 

WG YOU ARE SO ABSOLUTELY EFFING ARROGANT!!

 

RPF has received plenty of negative feedback from various sources since it 1st appeared yet you are too arrogant to even modify or rethink it for the 2nd PTS. Happy to modify 4/5 of the others which attracted far less attention but oh no...RPF WG knows best, "plays know s**t", it needs no changes. Show us the evidence, show where the requirement comes from or even the assumptions you have based this on then maybe we would shut up but your arrogance prevents you from sharing or communicating.

 

And sticking with WG's arrogance, your refusal to learn from bad decisions/mistakes that have hit your other titles WoT & WoWp is just being perpetuated here hence this continuing "bad blood" built up with your playerbase.

 

Wanted to give you a chance but the continual failure of how WG approaches things has used up all my goodwill so will be off within a day or 2 once RPF is introduced (just ot see how "bad" it will get).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[NoirLotus]

 

The idea behind the skill is to improve the role of DD hunters that is crucial to all cruisers and some destroyers. While the skill will certainly be a powerful one, it has quite a high cost and will come at the expense of another skill. We expect this to be an efficient option for these ships, but definitely not a must.

 

The idea is also not to remove a layer of skill, but add a layer of tactical choice in the skill-tree and on the battlefield.

 

I have a question : Why is it so important to help cruisers (and gunboats) to hunt DDs ?? At this time, DDs have the weakest average damage of all 4 classes, and torpedo boats are the weakest of DDs.

 

Moreover, DDs already have to avoid radars, planes, sonars to remain unspotted, and if their torpedoes are spotted, they'll do no damage ... And as some said, the problem is not to hunt DDs, it's to survive when you attack them because they usually have a team to support them.

 

About competitive play, WG was complaining that TB turned into passive games where all the team sit in DD's smoke and shoot at spotted targets. Having played some competitive games in WoT, I know that one major thing of this format is to be where the enemy doesn't expect you. With RPF, how can you do such a thing ?? So more camp in smoke and shoot spotted enemies ??

 

By the way, did WG think about the impact of RPF on torpedo boats gameplay ?? If a torpedo boat wants to be effective while this skill exists, it basically have to never be the closest ship to the enemy. So this will push torpedo boats to shoot torps from 2nd line, with a great risk of hitting allies ...

 

 

 

 

[anonym_1YeUldJS8pjx]

By the way, did WG think about the impact of RPF on torpedo boats gameplay ?? If a torpedo boat wants to be effective while this skill exists, it basically have to never be the closest ship to the enemy. So this will push torpedo boats to shoot torps from 2nd line, with a great risk of hitting allies ...

A fear I share. We might either see:

a) Torpedoboats using long range torps (e.g. Shima 20km) launched from 2nd row just hoping for luck, or

b) suicide torpedo runs: Full speed ahead towards enemy because he will be warned about your direction but probably not be able to kill you before you launched your torps.

 

Every Ninja and flanking tactics in this game might be destroyed. But it's easy - if the fun of the game is destroyed, we all save a lot of livetime.

[Shadisar]

So lets sume this changes ...

 

A. We refuse to delete wall hack from are game ... and yes I put my head on the line that in one month hack will be added to game allowing for perfect line toward ship spotted by RPF ...

B. We don't see problem with nerfing ship and telling players to use skill to make HE workable... Yes Akizuki we talk about you. Its massive fun to bounce all shots in tier VIII DD from Aki as long as you don't give her you broadside.

 

Well I See a problem, first of all this going to kill DD game play, leading to less DD playing game and leaving game/ moving to another class, this will lead to CA/CL not having targets to hunt and thx to less DD in MM more BB per game, that will lead to less CA/CL in game and more BB...In few month we can end with world of BBis and crap ton of draws. That will definitely keep game afloat and make a lot of money right ? Well yes another corporations going to earn more money as player start leaving this game. Truly great idea WG.

[celephais]

so this skill became even more powerful, with increased cost.

 

I think that the increased cost argument is inefficient. I doubt people won't use it just because it is "expensive". The "more powerful" effect though is too powerful to ignore.

 

As for RDF you already saw a poll with more than 80% of player base saying NO. It was NO, not just "no". The reasons are too obvious and the mistakes EU WG is making are piling up actually. People keep giving you feedback because they do want a better gameplay experience. It is so easy to think...do not [edited]this up!

[Aotearas]

If RPF stays, the likelyhood of my staying alongside with my wallet will dramatically decrease. Not going to say that I'll immediately quit, but my wallet will not be very spendy for certain!

WG will find that if my (and those of many other players) concerns are not reciprocated, our motivation to spend money on their services will equalize proportionally.

[MrWastee]

 

The idea behind the skill is to improve the role of DD hunters that is crucial to all cruisers and some destroyers. While the skill will certainly be a powerful one, it has quite a high cost and will come at the expense of another skill. We expect this to be an efficient option for these ships, but definitely not a must.

 

[...]

 

 

wait woat?! ..... sorry, reads very(!) trollish! so, AFTER EVEN GIVING RADAR TO A BB, u guys think that f.e. a baltimore or des moines WITH HAS, RADAR AND RPF would be a good thing and kinda balanced rofllmao? HOW CAN ANYONE THINK ANY DD WOULD STAND A CHANCE AGAINST SUCH HUNTERS?!?!

 

seriously: introduction of this skill will end in a runaway-from-each-other-race! i can't even bear the.... to me obvious mentally implications this comes with... not a must?! lol.... really.... if this would have been introduced by mod, that mod would've been blocked a few hours later, and that i'm dead sure on!!....

 

......................

 

 

on fp:

yeah, great logic.... "performed ver well on pts", so let's even buff it further to lower potential damage from THE LEAST DANGEROUS SOURCE OF DAMAGE..... ... anyway, if u want to, go on and enjoy..... rpf is not debateable though and just needs to go!

 

 

just a lil example: yesterday hunted down 2 dd's in my montana, backed up by a bismarck. HAS has been very helpful already, but indeed it not has been a great thing to hunt them down without (been the spearhead, bismarck behind me and sometimes too far for hydro).

now give me rpf and i start to hunt down dd's not only in the "dedicated dd hunters" (which are already VERY powerful with german HAS, radar or even normal HAS and radar on one ship), BUT IN EVERY FRCKNG SINGLE SHIP I GOT...

on top u go onto invisfiring and give german dd's markerguns ("shoot me, here i am").......... SOON ALL CLASSES EXCEPT BB'S WON'T GET PLAYED ANYMORE if u guys continue on this path ....

[HidesHisFace]

 

The idea behind the skill is to improve the role of DD hunters that is crucial to all cruisers and some destroyers. While the skill will certainly be a powerful one, it has quite a high cost and will come at the expense of another skill. We expect this to be an efficient option for these ships, but definitely not a must.

 

The idea is also not to remove a layer of skill, but add a layer of tactical choice in the skill-tree and on the battlefield.

 

This is absolute nonsense.

I play mostly cruisers - and ability to spot DDs is NOT A PROBLEM for any cruiser/dd hunter.

 

Why? Let me explain:

Cruisers, who are generally speaking stereotypical, basic DD hunting class are usually the second rank in a battle line - there are DDs, Cruisers, BBs and somewhere far away, Carriers. So... Given the fact that cruisers are generally relativley close to the frontline and good chunk of them has quite decent detectability range means one thing - if I get detected in a cruiser, in most cases that means that there is an enemy DD within a range of around 10-12km. That is already a good enough approximation and with some decent awareness about your surroundings you can predict in which direction said DD is likely to be - no need for a precise wallhack.

Besides - cruisers are already full of hydroacustic search to help against torps, many also have radar that is able to detect DDs in relatively decent range and through concealment and cover.

In terms of DD hunting ALONE, there is no problem in this game AT ALL.

 

However, this is true that cruisers and the like have problems in performing their role - but it is NOT related to their ability to detect their prey.

Remember the battle lines I mentioned in the begging? 

Combine this with detection values - cruisers may be aware of DD's presence, but they are still the first ones to be spotted, and given their general lack of armour - this is the problem they have - they get shot at by absolutely everyone and their mother the second they get detected - DD hunting, therefore, is a bloody suicide in early-mid stages of the game. During that time, most DDs will still be undetected, and BBs? They will sit comfortably out of range or at range when fire is not effective enough. Cruisers sit in the middle - between hammer and anvil - way too often it is a choice between taking a torp or getting citadelled - or you may just say "screw this" and drop destroyer hunting entirely - which is the most viable option at the moment.

 

And they do not really have ANY proper defensive mechanics - that is the problem - for a class that is bound to sit relatively close to the frontline, they get nothing - their armour is not good enough to deal with barrage of a BB - and they are usually outnumbered by said BBs anyway.

 

RPF basically is another layer of defense for BBs at this point - completely negating the ability to flank them. And in late match scenario - it is also a death to any form of stealth related play.

[Culiacan_Mexico]

,,,RPF basically is another layer of defense for BBs at this point - completely negating the ability to flank them. And in late match scenario - it is also a death to any form of stealth related play.,,

 

I think you just explain why RPF is going live.  

[Maaseru]

 

blabla

 

No one wants to play a multiplayer game with an integrated wallhack! What makes you think anyone would like this? I guess a poll with more than 80% saying 'NO' isn't enough... You also want feedback for the whole new skill tree? Great... This disgusting perk will continue to attract the maximum attention and every other perk is not as important as this gamebreaking b.ullshit because other perks won't matter if you stop playing this game due to this one skill...

[FredKarno]

 

RDF will stay in the client at least for the second iteration of the public test, this decision was made after looking at the concerns voiced by the community and careful evaluation of the test data.

 

We will have more detailed information on why we we made this decision soon and I am happy to try to address specific concerns and questions about the skill here. 

 

Thank-you for the communication MrConway.

 

Why have you not already provided more detailed information about how you believe RDF is conducive to more enjoyable gaming?

 

In the unlikely event you have some rationale the community has been unable to interpret from the tests I'd like to hear it. Communicating this information might assuage the concerns so many are expressing, I doubt it but why not try?

 

Might you explain why you have decided that the "concerns of the community [about RDF] " have had no effect?

 

Septic.

[Joergensen]

Did write a long post, but it wont help, i see good atemts to make MrConway explain why and hows, but i see WG in action and the questions we wonder about wont be explained.

 

Been playing WG games for 6 or is it 7 years now,, have almost had it, world of warships did have and does have such potensial but if RPF comes live i quit all WG games.

[Didoguard]

RPF not removed ... (facepalm) Does anyone from WG side actually even play the game to test and see how it works ?

[Joergensen]

after MrConways posts i seriously doubt it ;/

[halfik]

REMOVE RDF

That is all.

 

this +1

[Guderina]

REMOVE RDF

That is all.

 

+1

 

Hard for me to explain how disappointing is that RDF skill remaining on the new tech tree. Feel I lost my time trying to leveling up DD's.

[Ken_Itchi]

MrConway is just the messenger, so don't shoot him.

But WG hasn't listened to the complaints of the supertesters about this quirky RDF skill.

They haven't listened to the community feedback of PTS 0.6.0 V1.

Do you really think they will be listening to the community feedback of PTS 0.6.0 V2 ?

 

If they want to make this game more causual gamer friendly, they should implement an official aim assist and an automatic cruise suggestion to avoid torps and shells, so the gamer just have to mark the targets and click on the left mouse button... 7-year old kids will be happy (but do they spent money ?), but I will delete this game in this case, which is a pitty, as I liked it a lot...