Destroyers sunking battleships with artillery

[Puzur_Inshushinak]

Even you should be able to do it.

Why are you try to insult me my opinion is different than yours.
If you don't have good arguments or not inadequate brain power you can be at least polite.

Thing is have you ever so anyone that apply it in the game. 

Every single game is uncoordinated chaos with, very often, ships bumping into each other.
It's a good thing that WarGaming didn't count this as ramming if tey will half of the players wil be in pink.

[ColonelPete]

It might be chaos for you and that is your problem.

 

You deny the existence of tactics in this game and even when shown to you, you will not accept it.

The problem is obviously on your side, as shown in the very existence of this thread.

[Puzur_Inshushinak]

"Tactics - the science and art of disposing and maneuvering forces in combat"
So what are you saying is - every battle is perfectly coordinated ballet with every player doing his part.
Please show me battle even remotely close to it and I will accepted.

You haven't proof anything and You wrote that it's my "problem" that I don't accept non existent proof. 
How convinient.

Regards
Sylwester_75

 

[ColonelPete]

"The science and art of disposing and maneuvering forces in combat" is not ballet, that should be obvious.

[Combat_Hamster]

I hate being  'sunked'......

[Puzur_Inshushinak]

Do you have a slight idea what i'm talkin about.

That "fancy" thing that I was using is called - figurative speech.

[Puzur_Inshushinak]

I hate being  'sunked'......

 

me to I hate it a lot 

[Takeda92]

The closest stealth firing DD can do is 9.2 km from Kagero and that DD has crapDPM. It's range is 9.8 km. The only DDs that can stealth fire greatly are the USN DDs above 10 km and their shell velocity is very poor, you can easily dodge the shells even in a BB.

[Puzur_Inshushinak]

 

I can see your point but with:

Maximum Speed 27.2 not

Rudder Shift Time 26 sec

its not easy to dodge anything except long range fire

And you still have to consider torpedoes and zigzagging.

Let see Fletcher:

Main Battery

127 mm/38 MK 305 х 1 pcs.

Rate of Fire 18 shots/min.

Reload Time 3.33 sec.

Surface Detectability Range 7.4 km

Firing Range 11.8 km.

That give you 4,4 km "to play with"

 

I'm not complaining it just look like they have realy great amount of fire power and a "cap of invisibility" .

In one of the battles I was up against one of DD's which just came out from behind the island and my main battery wasn't capable of turning quickly enough to even try to defend myself and that is the thing this guy was skilful and knew how to use his speed, maneuverability and smoke screen. I so what is coming and that is ok (he did hit me with a lot of torps). 

 

[ColonelPete]

No, not really. The detections range increases when you fire.

The invisibility window becomes extremly small or does not even exist at all, depending on DD.

 

Btw, everything over 9km is long range fire for US DD.

[El2aZeR]

Not sure where that "firepower" you're talking about is coming from. Those guns barely do any damage to BBs (if any) and you'll be lucky to even start a fire after a couple dozen hits (which, again, is not easy to achieve at stealth firing ranges if your enemy isn't a complete potato or otherwise distracted).

 

Fletcher stealth firing range starts at 9.2, and that's only if you have taken all concealment skills and upgrades.

[G3Virus]

I can see your point but with:

Maximum Speed 27.2 not
Rudder Shift Time 26 sec
its not easy to dodge anything except long range fire
And you still have to consider torpedoes and zigzagging.

Let see Fletcher:

Main Battery
127 mm/38 MK 305 х 1 pcs.
Rate of Fire 18 shots/min.
Reload Time 3.33 sec.
Surface Detectability Range 7.4 km
Firing Range 11.8 km.

That give you 4,4 km "to play with"

 

I'm not complaining it just look like they have realy great amount of fire power and a "cap of invisibility" .

In one of the battles I was up against one of DD's which just came out from behind the island and my main battery wasn't capable of turning quickly enough to even try to defend myself and that is the thing this guy was skilful and knew how to use his speed, maneuverability and smoke screen. I so what is coming and that is ok (he did hit me with a lot of torps). 

 

 

Funny how you just forget to mention that Fletcher only has 5% fire chance, suppose that wont work with your view on things would it?

 

If one wants to invisible fire on usually have to use "Advanced Firing Training" and most want "Concealment Expert" to that btw no longer stacks with invisi firing but still a must on most DD's. This means no Demolition Expert in most cases on a DD except for RU DD's that suck on the concealment part either way so they usually go with AFT and DE and just skip CE and go yolo all the time instead since that what they where built for.

 

Anyway a Fletcher has a low fire chance, it can spam yes but it shoots to the moon and back anyway at any real ranges just like most US DD's and some Cruisers so there practical range is short and the shell flight time is so long they are easy enough to duck.

 

Also many DD's that "invisi fire" are not realy doing it, its often just easier to have some on spot for you, sit in smoke or behind some island an lobby shells over it than the detection range is less of an issue.

Its a good tactic for any ship type realy and one can even get away with it in a BB.

 

My favourite Invisi firing ships is Fubuki, if you run in to a good Fubuki player he can invis fire from 9.3 to 12Km and sure the rate of fire is low but Alpha damage is good and fire chance is 9% to offset the low rate of fire.

 

My record is some where past 90K fire damage with AFT and no DE on my Fubuki but realy invisi firing is hard because it requires NO ship with in your detectability range when firing and that is like I sad 9.3km for a Fubuki with Camo and the Concealment Upgrade and who plays with out camo?

So most of such damage is done by using smoke and island for cover or just take your 3 man DIV and find that Solo warrior that dont know tactics and kill him, its hard for him to shoot all 3 ships and especially the small DD's.

Anyway doing over 90K fire damage without DE in a DD is not something that happens often and in my 7K matches total in WOWS that have happened once in my Fubuki and invisi firing is not done every match thats for sure and it only works for a short time usually since some one always tries to spot that DD and if not once again that solo warrior without tactics is the victim and deserves to be sent back to port to learn to play.

 

Anyway Fubuki will be  T6 and they will take the crappy T9 kagero that is inferior since the torp nerfe to the fubuki and make it a T8 so you will get your nerfs that you scream for just like all t he other people that cant L2P and just complain instead of fixing the real problem that is them self.

 

The invisi firing range is available for all ships in there stats or just press H during battle and it will be shown. Detection range when firing main guns.

 

You dont play DD's so you know little to nothing about them and what your read and and heard about them is just the very surface of an icberg and any "real" fact about them is realy irrelevant to the game.

You cant expect to EVER get good at playing a BB and face of against a DD if you know nothing about there tactics, play-style, weapon load outs and configuration and thats what's your stats are saying to.

 

I mean when I see a DD and I play a BB I know its torp range, I know its torp arks, I know what kind of launchers it has, I know enough to know precisely how close I can safely go and I can exploit any weaknesses that DD might have. But yea if you dont play DD its just another blip that migth pop up for you from time to time and thats about all you ever know about that.

If you know how a DD plays and you know the configuration of a specific DD you can predict his most likely moves, Its super fun when you know a DD drops his torps and you know his gonna do a 180 to drop the other side to, just hit him when he comes around with those big BB guns. Then you just euro beat those torps you now know he sent on your course. Know your enemy and its a lot easier.

 

I played BB's first, then I learned to play DD's and I got a hell of a lot better at playing BB's  as a result because now I know my enemy.

 

But yes please keep blaming the game and everyone else that plays it better then you.

Personally I just think your a big Troll because its either that or you just cant face the fact that your bad at this game and the rest of us should not suffer for that just because your not happy.

[Puzur_Inshushinak]

And that how it supposed to be (but why all DD's does not have the same small window or nothing at all, how on earth someone decide who is getting it and who don't, what are the criteria ?)

With that rudder shift times (it take a realy long time to big ship to respond) you can try to dodge somthing that is capable of firing 5 shells every 3,3 second.
It is obvious that your opponent will correct his fire. 

[Glig69]

"Help, vee are sunking!"  "Yesss, what are you sunking?"  Nope, doesn't work I am afraid.  It's gotta be "sinking".

[Puzur_Inshushinak]

 

 

Funny how you just forget to mention that Fletcher only has 5% fire chance, suppose that wont work with your view on things would it?

 

If one wants to invisible fire on usually have to use "Advanced Firing Training" and most want "Concealment Expert" to that btw no longer stacks with invisi firing but still a must on most DD's. This means no Demolition Expert in most cases on a DD except for RU DD's that suck on the concealment part either way so they usually go with AFT and DE and just skip CE and go yolo all the time instead since that what they where built for.

 

Anyway a Fletcher has a low fire chance, it can spam yes but it shoots to the moon and back anyway at any real ranges just like most US DD's and some Cruisers so there practical range is short and the shell flight time is so long they are easy enough to duck.

 

Also many DD's that "invisi fire" are not realy doing it, its often just easier to have some on spot for you, sit in smoke or behind some island an lobby shells over it than the detection range is less of an issue.

Its a good tactic for any ship type realy and one can even get away with it in a BB.

 

My favourite Invisi firing ships is Fubuki, if you run in to a good Fubuki player he can invis fire from 9.3 to 12Km and sure the rate of fire is low but Alpha damage is good and fire chance is 9% to offset the low rate of fire.

 

My record is some where past 90K fire damage with AFT and no DE on my Fubuki but realy invisi firing is hard because it requires NO ship with in your detectability range when firing and that is like I sad 9.3km for a Fubuki with Camo and the Concealment Upgrade and who plays with out camo?

So most of such damage is done by using smoke and island for cover or just take your 3 man DIV and find that Solo warrior that dont know tactics and kill him, its hard for him to shoot all 3 ships and especially the small DD's.

Anyway doing over 90K fire damage without DE in a DD is not something that happens often and in my 7K matches total in WOWS that have happened once in my Fubuki and invisi firing is not done every match thats for sure and it only works for a short time usually since some one always tries to spot that DD and if not once again that solo warrior without tactics is the victim and deserves to be sent back to port to learn to play.

 

Anyway Fubuki will be  T6 and they will take the crappy T9 kagero that is inferior since the torp nerfe to the fubuki and make it a T8 so you will get your nerfs that you scream for just like all t he other people that cant L2P and just complain instead of fixing the real problem that is them self.

 

The invisi firing range is available for all ships in there stats or just press H during battle and it will be shown. Detection range when firing main guns.

 

You dont play DD's so you know little to nothing about them and what your read and and heard about them is just the very surface of an icberg and any "real" fact about them is realy irrelevant to the game.

You cant expect to EVER get good at playing a BB and face of against a DD if you know nothing about there tactics, play-style, weapon load outs and configuration and thats what's your stats are saying to.

 

I mean when I see a DD and I play a BB I know its torp range, I know its torp arks, I know what kind of launchers it has, I know enough to know precisely how close I can safely go and I can exploit any weaknesses that DD might have. But yea if you dont play DD its just another blip that migth pop up for you from time to time and thats about all you ever know about that.

If you know how a DD plays and you know the configuration of a specific DD you can predict his most likely moves, Its super fun when you know a DD drops his torps and you know his gonna do a 180 to drop the other side to, just hit him when he comes around with those big BB guns. Then you just euro beat those torps you now know he sent on your course. Know your enemy and its a lot easier.

 

I played BB's first, then I learned to play DD's and I got a hell of a lot better at playing BB's  as a result because now I know my enemy.

 

But yes please keep blaming the game and everyone else that plays it better then you.

Personally I just think your a big Troll because its either that or you just cant face the fact that your bad at this game and the rest of us should not suffer for that just because your not happy.

It is simple you can't fight things that you can't see.

I omit that part of 5% of fire starting simply because it was an example and irrelevant.
I don't even remember what DD's dat was. 

If you will show me the part how exactly those 5% are counted I will take that for consideration (right now my ship catches fire every second HE salvo it takes).

It feels like it is counted from an amout of shells fired not hitted by.

Take the rudder times and check how long it takes to big ship to resspond to it and try to dodge if you are up against somone "clever enough" to correct his fire. 

He will miss couple of shots but not all of them, and you still have to consider his torpedoes and be vigilant.

I never said that that thing happend every battle and it should definitely not happend every battle.

In this post You are just admitting exploiting thing that you shouldn't have (invisible fire).

Please stop telling nonsense about me spending more time i DD's.
If I will want to I will do it. 

Right now I know enough to deal with DD's.

And again tactics where did you see it in this game ?

Maybe You should decide what you are playing - completely unrealistic arcade game or simulator ?
It looks like you are freely choose to use that argument in one way or another.

And another "best player" please grow up.

Personally I just think that you are an Idiot (with no offence to real idiots)

I didn't insult you in any way before, but you just simply bring that conversation to that level.

[Puzur_Inshushinak]

"Help, vee are sunking!"  "Yesss, what are you sunking?"  Nope, doesn't work I am afraid.  It's gotta be "sinking".

 

that my mistake and I admit it

[Lightbaron]

And that how it supposed to be (but why all DD's does not have the same small window or nothing at all, how on earth someone decide who is getting it and who don't, what are the criteria ?)

With that rudder shift times (it take a realy long time to big ship to respond) you can try to dodge somthing that is capable of firing 5 shells every 3,3 second.
It is obvious that your opponent will correct his fire. 

 

There is nobody who says it is like this for ship 1 and like that for ship 2.

All DDs get the same increase based on their main gun calibers.

4km for 127mm guns (US and IJN), 6km for RU 130mm guns except Gremyashchiy who got saved from the nerf because of her premium status and still has 4km increase only.

The only thing that decides when someone is seen besides that is their detectability range and if they can push their gun range further than their spotting range while shooting.

Because of the 5th module slot that comes with t8 (concealment module) there is a large gap in base detectability compared with t7.

E.g. Sims has 7.3km base and can get it down to ~6.6km. Mahan has 7.7km base and can get it down to ~6.9km with CE. Meanwhile Benson at t8 and Fletcher at t9 can get their detectability down to 5.8km with CE and concealment module. Fubuki can even get it down to 5.4km, same for Kagerou at t9 and Shimakaze at t10 still can get a decent 5.9km detectability.

While shooting that makes it 9.2km for Fubuki and Kagerou, 9.6km for Benson and Fletcher, 10.6km for Sims and 10.9km for Mahan.

The increase for the t8 and t9 DDs is 3.8km instead of 4km because of the concealment module that also comes into play here.

 

Aunt Edith wants to add that shell travel time for USN DDs above 10km roughly equals BB shell travel time above 15km

[Puzur_Inshushinak]

 

There is nobody who says it is like this for ship 1 and like that for ship 2.

All DDs get the same increase based on their main gun calibers.

4km for 127mm guns (US and IJN), 6km for RU 130mm guns except Gremyashchiy who got saved from the nerf because of her premium status and still has 4km increase only.

The only thing that decides when someone is seen besides that is their detectability range and if they can push their gun range further than their spotting range while shooting.

Because of the 5th module slot that comes with t8 (concealment module) there is a large gap in base detectability compared with t7.

E.g. Sims has 7.3km base and can get it down to ~6.6km. Mahan has 7.7km base and can get it down to ~6.9km with CE. Meanwhile Benson at t8 and Fletcher at t9 can get their detectability down to 5.8km with CE and concealment module. Fubuki can even get it down to 5.4km, same for Kagerou at t9 and Shimakaze at t10 still can get a decent 5.9km detectability.

While shooting that makes it 9.2km for Fubuki and Kagerou, 9.6km for Benson and Fletcher, 10.6km for Sims and 10.9km for Mahan.

The increase for the t8 and t9 DDs is 3.8km instead of 4km because of the concealment module that also comes into play here.

 

Aunt Edith wants to add that shell travel time for USN DDs above 10km roughly equals BB shell travel time above 15km

And that how I want to that conversation looks like, without any unnecessary hostility.
Thank you very much that explains alot.
Good luck with all your battles.

[Glig69]

that my mistake and I admit it

 

Don't worry pal - I was just trying to inject a little humour into a fairly bitter debate.  I think I have to agree wit the general sentiment though that there's nothing wrong with the DD meta at the moment.  If you are at the bottom of a deep hole, there's no sense crying out that it's unfair for the universe to contain deep holes ... just don't fall in in the first place. You CAN play against invisible foes, you just have to be map aware and play as a team.  When I play DDs, I always look for separated BBs ... like a lion would when he is hunting.  That's just basic tactics my friend.  Anyway, good luck and try to keep it fun.  

[Puzur_Inshushinak]

 

Don't worry pal - I was just trying to inject a little humour into a fairly bitter debate.  I think I have to agree wit the general sentiment though that there's nothing wrong with the DD meta at the moment.  If you are at the bottom of a deep hole, there's no sense crying out that it's unfair for the universe to contain deep holes ... just don't fall in in the first place. You CAN play against invisible foes, you just have to be map aware and play as a team.  When I play DDs, I always look for separated BBs ... like a lion would when he is hunting.  That's just basic tactics my friend.  Anyway, good luck and try to keep it fun.  

good luck to you to It's always will be fun

[G3Virus]

It is simple you can't fight things that you can't see.

I omit that part of 5% of fire starting simply because it was an example and irrelevant.
I don't even remember what DD's dat was. 

If you will show me the part how exactly those 5% are counted I will take that for consideration (right now my ship catches fire every second HE salvo it takes).

It feels like it is counted from an amout of shells fired not hitted by.

Take the rudder times and check how long it takes to big ship to resspond to it and try to dodge if you are up against somone "clever enough" to correct his fire. 

He will miss couple of shots but not all of them, and you still have to consider his torpedoes and be vigilant.

I never said that that thing happend every battle and it should definitely not happend every battle.

In this post You are just admitting exploiting thing that you shouldn't have (invisible fire).

Please stop telling nonsense about me spending more time i DD's.
If I will want to I will do it. 

Right now I know enough to deal with DD's.

And again tactics where did you see it in this game ?

Maybe You should decide what you are playing - completely unrealistic arcade game or simulator ?
It looks like you are freely choose to use that argument in one way or another.

And another "best player" please grow up.

Personally I just think that you are an Idiot (with no offence to real idiots)

I didn't insult you in any way before, but you just simply bring that conversation to that level.

 

Search the forum, the formulas for fire chance are written here, I sure could find it so should you.

Simplest explanation is that its 5% per shell but it do not stack so 10 shells are not 50%.

The odds per shell only increases slightly so 5% is abysmal small amount.

Also tier is relevant to the formula.

A higher tier ship will more easily set fire to a lower Tier ships and Vice versa so if a T10DD attacks your Izumo his fire chance will go up.

If you attack a T7 BB with your Izumo and shoot HE your fire chance will go up.

But yea if you read the forums and just do a simple google your would find this information here to.

Research is a key part of being a good player.

 

 

And where did I admit to anything? We all know invis firing is a part of the game, if there's an opportunity sure as hell a DD or even a Crusier would take it.

Crusiers can also Invisi fire if you did not know so you could just as well have been burned down by an Atago or a Zao for that mater and not a DD.

 

Invisi Firing in my view represents a very little amount of damage done by DD's and Crusiers, probably like 1-2% so if you ended up dying to it well then you where in a bad place. Usually one can inflict som "free" damage for a short time invisi firing until the opponent respond usually by getting closer to his team making it impossible to fire without being seen.

 

The fact that you died to it tells me you where no where near close enough to your team, you had NO plan in a case like this. You can force the DD to fallow you and that means you can draw him in to a position where you get the upper hand but you did not do that.

 

Tactics, there are plenty of those. Sure there are people like you that dont read the chat and just go to a cap all alone with no support while everyone keeps telling you to stop going yolo.

 

I play with people from one of the biggest tech site and game community in sweden so most of my matches are in devision.

One should realy learn on what maps one spawns closer to the caps depending on side of the map on spawns that way you know to 90% where the enemy is likely to go and not to go.

You should suggest the optimal caps to your team before the countdown hits 0 and this immensely helps the team stick together.

And dont suggest caps that splits the team if it can be avoided, some people dont consider cap location to both teams and DD's location and type.

Some just random picks cap like A + C or go B and get flanked from two sides.

Also designating targets with F3 or using Voice chat like we do immensely helps focus fire and also relay any tactics and changes to the enemy teams tactics.

 

There is a reason most people I play with have 50-60% winrate or more, its because we play as a team and we are constantly developing tactics, learning tactics from others and just in general observing how the game develops from reading the forums to patch notices and even rumours at times.

 

If you cant see any "tactics" in the game well then that fault lies with you and not everyone else.

Usually 1-3 people cant fallow team orders in a random battle but most people are actually smart enough to stick with the team and read the chat to know whats going on even if they dont have a plan them self.

 

But there is a fine line between lemming train and a team sticking together, lemming trains are often obvious when there is no team chat in the game and for those association one has to have a plan B.

One should always have a plan B if the team fails, that way my Division can go defend the base if the team is lemming and refuses to read the minimap and see what will happen 5-10 minutes from now.

 

Yes on can predict a game 5-10 minutes ahead with some experience.

 

There are plenty of tactics but if you play solo without divisions and just as a loner BB with no plan then you will get in to trouble thats how the game works.

 

Start playing in a devision and you will soon learn how much more there is to the game.

 

Well the only idiot I see is the troll brick wall you are since everyone else I play with, 30+ people that play in divisions are able to adapt while you dont even want to take good advice from people in this thread.

I know players like you that blames the game and everyone else for there short comings just because you have a self image that you are a "good gamer" and some how when reality strikes and your self image dont live up to it then you must blame everyone else to keep that self image. Blame the game like you are now instead of learning from a failure and adapt. Its realy that simple.

 

And its obvious you dont want to learn or adapt so what the point, you wont get any better then so Im done in this thread since there realy is no point.

 

 

There is nobody who says it is like this for ship 1 and like that for ship 2.

All DDs get the same increase based on their main gun calibers.

4km for 127mm guns (US and IJN), 6km for RU 130mm guns except Gremyashchiy who got saved from the nerf because of her premium status and still has 4km increase only.

The only thing that decides when someone is seen besides that is their detectability range and if they can push their gun range further than their spotting range while shooting.

Because of the 5th module slot that comes with t8 (concealment module) there is a large gap in base detectability compared with t7.

E.g. Sims has 7.3km base and can get it down to ~6.6km. Mahan has 7.7km base and can get it down to ~6.9km with CE. Meanwhile Benson at t8 and Fletcher at t9 can get their detectability down to 5.8km with CE and concealment module. Fubuki can even get it down to 5.4km, same for Kagerou at t9 and Shimakaze at t10 still can get a decent 5.9km detectability.

While shooting that makes it 9.2km for Fubuki and Kagerou, 9.6km for Benson and Fletcher, 10.6km for Sims and 10.9km for Mahan.

The increase for the t8 and t9 DDs is 3.8km instead of 4km because of the concealment module that also comes into play here.

 

Aunt Edith wants to add that shell travel time for USN DDs above 10km roughly equals BB shell travel time above 15km

 

Its actually 5.5km for Fubuki, Kagero has the better with 5.4km so invisi fiering with fubuki is 9.3km.

[Puzur_Inshushinak]

 

Search the forum, the formulas for fire chance are written here, I sure could find it so should you.

Simplest explanation is that its 5% per shell but it do not stack so 10 shells are not 50%.

The odds per shell only increases slightly so 5% is abysmal small amount.

Also tier is relevant to the formula.

A higher tier ship will more easily set fire to a lower Tier ships and Vice versa so if a T10DD attacks your Izumo his fire chance will go up.

If you attack a T7 BB with your Izumo and shoot HE your fire chance will go up.

But yea if you read the forums and just do a simple google your would find this information here to.

Research is a key part of being a good player.

 

 

And where did I admit to anything? We all know invis firing is a part of the game, if there's an opportunity sure as hell a DD or even a Crusier would take it.

Crusiers can also Invisi fire if you did not know so you could just as well have been burned down by an Atago or a Zao for that mater and not a DD.

 

Invisi Firing in my view represents a very little amount of damage done by DD's and Crusiers, probably like 1-2% so if you ended up dying to it well then you where in a bad place. Usually one can inflict som "free" damage for a short time invisi firing until the opponent respond usually by getting closer to his team making it impossible to fire without being seen.

 

The fact that you died to it tells me you where no where near close enough to your team, you had NO plan in a case like this. You can force the DD to fallow you and that means you can draw him in to a position where you get the upper hand but you did not do that.

 

Tactics, there are plenty of those. Sure there are people like you that dont read the chat and just go to a cap all alone with no support while everyone keeps telling you to stop going yolo.

 

I play with people from one of the biggest tech site and game community in sweden so most of my matches are in devision.

One should realy learn on what maps one spawns closer to the caps depending on side of the map on spawns that way you know to 90% where the enemy is likely to go and not to go.

You should suggest the optimal caps to your team before the countdown hits 0 and this immensely helps the team stick together.

And dont suggest caps that splits the team if it can be avoided, some people dont consider cap location to both teams and DD's location and type.

Some just random picks cap like A + C or go B and get flanked from two sides.

Also designating targets with F3 or using Voice chat like we do immensely helps focus fire and also relay any tactics and changes to the enemy teams tactics.

 

There is a reason most people I play with have 50-60% winrate or more, its because we play as a team and we are constantly developing tactics, learning tactics from others and just in general observing how the game develops from reading the forums to patch notices and even rumours at times.

 

If you cant see any "tactics" in the game well then that fault lies with you and not everyone else.

Usually 1-3 people cant fallow team orders in a random battle but most people are actually smart enough to stick with the team and read the chat to know whats going on even if they dont have a plan them self.

 

But there is a fine line between lemming train and a team sticking together, lemming trains are often obvious when there is no team chat in the game and for those association one has to have a plan B.

One should always have a plan B if the team fails, that way my Division can go defend the base if the team is lemming and refuses to read the minimap and see what will happen 5-10 minutes from now.

 

Yes on can predict a game 5-10 minutes ahead with some experience.

 

There are plenty of tactics but if you play solo without divisions and just as a loner BB with no plan then you will get in to trouble thats how the game works.

 

Start playing in a devision and you will soon learn how much more there is to the game.

 

Well the only idiot I see is the troll brick wall you are since everyone else I play with, 30+ people that play in divisions are able to adapt while you dont even want to take good advice from people in this thread.

I know players like you that blames the game and everyone else for there short comings just because you have a self image that you are a "good gamer" and some how when reality strikes and your self image dont live up to it then you must blame everyone else to keep that self image. Blame the game like you are now instead of learning from a failure and adapt. Its realy that simple.

 

And its obvious you dont want to learn or adapt so what the point, you wont get any better then so Im done in this thread since there realy is no point.

 

 

Its actually 5.5km for Fubuki, Kagero has the better with 5.4km so invisi fiering with fubuki is 9.3km.

So how you will explain that exactly Fletcher set me on fire with the first salvo he took (I'm sprinkling my deck with gasoline)?

About higher tier argument - it's obvious what for will be any tier hierarchy It has to mean somthing.

I do know about invisible fire from cruiser I have seen it many times, and I do not have that problem with them.

I really can't understand why you assuming that I do so many things without a slightest possibility of knowing that or even be close to the true about met?

Every one makes wrong judgment about situation on the map there is no people that are always 100% right.

I have never told any thing about overall invisible firing damage is wery high if it was it definitely will be the problem.

Of course I have to agrre with you on, 
"One should realy learn on what maps one spawns closer to the caps depending on side of the map on spawns that way you know to 90% where the enemy is likely to go and not to go.
You should suggest the optimal caps to your team before the countdown hits 0 and this immensely helps the team stick together.
And dont suggest caps that splits the team if it can be avoided, some people dont consider cap location to both teams and DD's location and type.
Some just random picks cap like A + C or go B and get flanked from two sides.
Also designating targets with F3 or using Voice chat like we do immensely helps focus fire and also relay any tactics and changes to the enemy teams tactics.",

It is true and that is it.

I would not call team play a tactics per se - but It is not the point and that's my opinion Your is different let's not argue on it anymore please.

Why you constantly assume thing about me do you know any thing about me "Sherlock".
I did not use, (as a first one), any epithets against you and you are not happy about it (I wasn't happy about it to),  stop use it:
"Who lives by the sword dies by the sword". 
I just give you a taste of your own medicine.

Who on earth teach you mathematics ?

 

[El2aZeR]

So how you will explain that exactly Fletcher set me on fire with the first salvo he took (I'm sprinkling my deck with gasoline)?

 

Simply luck. The odds are 5% per shell which as others have explained above is very low, but just because the chance of it happening is low doesn't mean it can't happen.

So yeah, you can start a fire on your first salvo in a Fletcher, but on the other hand you can also go over 100 hits without setting your target ablaze even once.

[G3Virus]

The fact that you create at thread about getting killed by a DD once from invisi firing upsets you so much and blaming the game for it sees it all realy.

If you consider it just "one" mistake by you then you would not be so upset about it and make a dam thread about stuff everyone else learns to deal with.

Also no one have sad that people dont make mistakes,  but most people admit it was there fault being out of position or doing the wrong move and learn from it and move on.

You refuse to learn from it and thats on you.

 

So yea I can assume since it annoys you, you also constantly admits there are no "tactics" in the game witch is wrong and stated by people the past 3 pages but I guess everyone else is wrong and you are right..... only you can see the logic in that.

 

I could give a ton of tactical advice but the point is pretty mute when you dont even want to admit there are tactics and people use them all the time.

 

Team play makes tactical decisions quick and effective and you can employ tactics that is hard to impossible to use otherwise due to the complexity and time criticality of them.

Playing with people you know means they know your tactics and you know there's so there are fewer mistakes made and all efforts can be focused on winning and tactics can be changed as the game develops.

Plus any game predictions can quickly be interpreted and evaluated buy the division using voice chat and adapt the tactics as needed. It has a DISTINCT advantage.

 

Its not uncomment to increase the winrate with 10-20% playing with people you spent hundreds or thousands of games playing with,  there are web pages for such stats that sort them solo, 2 div and 3 man div so the advantages are huge.

And it all boils down to effectively communicating the tactical decision needed to be made to win.

 

But realy its your loss not comprehending this.

 

A 3 man div can take action defending the base when the team lemmings and increase the odds immensely in defending the base, coordinated focus fire is much easier to.

A push can be lead much easier, ships positioned properly to secure caps, the list goes on.

 

Well I did not give a mathematical example, only thing I sad is that the odds of a fire is per shell and its not an additive effect like some assumes so two shells with 5% chance is NOT 10% if both hits.

 

And your surprise of burning at the first hit tells more about your understanding of chance then my mathematical skills.

So how you will explain that exactly Fletcher set me on fire with the first salvo he took (I'm sprinkling my deck with gasoline)?

 

Well 5% chance still means you can be set on fire the first time, it also means you can be set on fire multiple times in a row but it also means you might not be set on fire for a 100 rounds.

All it realy sees is that the chance fore on shell is 5% assuming equal tiers and no fire prevention.

 

The accumulative effect of multiple shell hits can be calculated and here is a link that explains how to calculate it.

http://forum.worldofwarships.com/index.php?/topic/60529-setting-fires-what-are-the-percentages/page__pid__1480914#entry1480914

 

Random events are not spaced apart evenly but often happens in clusters so yea getting multiple fires and then nothing for a long time is not odd at all and perfectly random.

But most people associate random with evenly spaced events rather then then a cluster of them.

But maybe they did not teach you that did they?

 

Maybe you should understand random events and chance before insulting other peoples mathematical skills.

Random is what it is and if you dont like it well then your in the wrong universe.

 

Use google and you will fins answers to the fire chance system and the fire prevention system and how it works in the game and how to calculate the chance instead.

[Puzur_Inshushinak]

 

Guys really that supposed to be a joke. - (I'm sprinkling my deck with gasoline)?

I know exactly how to calculate percentage there is nothing special about it.

I did not try to insult your mathematical skills it's simply unimaginable that some one will wont to calculate it that way - I just want to meet person who want to do it this way - It will be fun.

This conversation went beyond point I want it to go.

Like you said I got upset but not by the fires or even being sunk - I only got upset about being invisible from quite close range.

I don't deny existence of coordinated efforts in the battle in your devision especially with comunication and knowlege of each other that you have.

Like I said before lets not  argue about "tactics", based on what I have seen so far it is mostly chaos, I only play random battles I simply like it this way.

You should know that in computer science true randomnes do not exist only an algorithm for generating a sequence of numbers whose properties approximate the properties of sequences of random numbers.

And I'm pretty sure that I'm in the right universe - maybe in parallel reality I got better stats than you. (joke)

You definitely assume too many things about me that you really have no chance of knowing so please stop. You never will be even close to the true.