Benson (or T8) in T10 games (META)

[The_Great_SCH]

 

That is quite a good tactic. At the start I usually play more passive. As I said, go for targets of oppertunity.

Using torps to distract them is quite smart, but you give a clear tell when you do that. The firing of your guns stop. So if you are going against an USN DD and they stop shooting, you turn around.

With IJN DDs I usually keep my course for a couple of seconds and then suddenly turn around. Because you've been going in a straight line you bait their torps to shoot at your prediction line. And then you reverse course. Then you harmlessly see the torps pass behind you. And because of the insanely high turret traverse you don't even loose that much up-time on your guns.

Just be careful of their support.

SN DDs I don't know. They usually stay at a range where I won't shoot them (their high speed + my slow shells). And since they can't see me, they won't shoot me either. Like a live and let live world.

 

I send th torps when i spotted them, shoot only when the torps are at close range and they just notice.

[The_Great_SCH]

In T10 battles you have less influence then T8/7/6 To be effective and more usefull for your team play safe on start and calculate more your actions Never do blind-rush caps on start Watch radar and fast firing cruisers positioning before you attack/cap

In T10 you will rare get something for free (easy cap on start is almost impossible) Try to avoid situations when 2 or more enemy ships focusing you - just use smoke and escape if its possible Save your HP is most important thing Dont camp too long when you pop up smoke - for sure they will torp your smoke

In close battles use more torps dont be spotted When you in knife fight with enemy DD never sail broadside - try to minimise your ship profile You are most effective in close fight because of high rate and skymoon arcs of your guns Good luck and dont scare - just work harder and calculate more your actions  

 

Thanks for the tips.As i said, i will try the more defensive aproach to the game, even if it is not my style. 

[The_Great_SCH]

So guys thank for the ideas, it is really nice to have people discuss these thing. Played 4 games today, 4 won. Safer play style pays off, not the best of the team but the contribution is ok. Thanks again... we can still exchange ideas. 

[EmilyFara]

Those are good results to me.

 

[passwordistooshort]

The Benson is my second favorite ship just after the Fletcher that is and stays my all time favorite. Other then that I barely play any other ships. I have tried a bit of all, but always ended up being disappointed with the gameplay compared to the USN DDs.

 

That said, the Benson is a very strong DD but you have to play it to it's strengths. I am also one that does not have a 15 point captain on the Benson (I moved the captain over to the Fletcher).

While CE is quite handy for evading detection it is not that mandatory, especially at higher tier. In my experience the biggest thread comes not from ships under 6km but the ones that have RADAR or Hydro.

As for Survivability Expert, I also don't have that. It has been quite rare that I thought "I wish I had 2k more hp about now". My preference is at raising the fire chance by 60% to 8%. Especially with this high rate of fire this increase is quite substantial. But it can still lead to some disappointed results. 

Other then that, the guns are the same as the ones before so don't go for AFT.

 

When it comes to gameplay it all depends on the enemy team composition. If the enemy have a carrier I tend to stick a whole lot closer to the friendly ships and be a scout. Carriers can really ruin your day.

If the enemy has no carrier but does have Russian or US DD's I'll play semi aggressive with a plan of escape. I will aggressively push into caps but I will lie at the edge and slowly creep around. For the rest of the match I'll try to be the forward scout for the BBs. Trying to move in between them and enemy DDs and spotting all the torps going into their direction and eventually flushing out the enemy DD and using the BBs fire support to finish him.

If at any point I get into a 1on1 with a Russian or US DD I will seek a retreat as fast as possible. Even if I am able to sink the enemy DD it will not be without substantial damage to my own ship. And even if I survive the encounter I would be out of the match anyway since I won't have the health for anything significant.

 

If the enemy is unlucky and they only have IJN DDs I tend to play very aggressive, going for all DDs and all caps. The only thing I fear then is German BBs (god these things rape me with their hydro).

 

TL;DR : Stay on the outskirts of your fleet or BB, spot for them / cover them in smoke. Go for targets of oppertunity. Do hit/run tactics on Cruisers / BBs or shoot from outside detection

 

^ This.

My only 2 cents:

-SE is a must especially if you plan to go ranked or in team battles.

-What i generally try to do is spot the enemy dd while slowly moving towards his general location and wait for my fleet to take 10-20% of his hp out.If that doesnt happen i do not engage.

 

[Z_OnkelE]

There are passive players in lower tiers as well, but the economy doesn't affect them, so people can be more aggressive. You are right, sometimes you have to pray to every god in existence so that your team pushes just a little bit and support you, 

 

WG srewed this up, I don't see anybody being effected by their passive play enough. Like mentioned by others, there are still those more concerned about the map border integrity than caps... They must have barely notice this behaviour cuts their income, otherwise I don't understand why they are not concerned about the constant fee.

[The_Great_SCH]

Funny thing. Once you get past the "Oh sh*t i'm in a T10 game with my T8 ship" it all gets better. I am really amazed how many bad players are at T10, and i dont mean stat wise, but bad bad players. Yesterday in a domination match our Shima said he doesn't go to cap because repairs cost too much. You can guess how much xp he got. I ended up capping and strategy torping for my team and ended up beig complimented in chat and with karma. 

One funny thing though : sometimes i get near an island where they cant shoot me, and harass a cruiser with radar, and they end up wasting it, so i got a couple of minutes of doing my thing eg: torping a full health Yamato and farming dmg LOL

[EmilyFara]

Funny thing. Once you get past the "Oh sh*t i'm in a T10 game with my T8 ship" it all gets better. I am really amazed how many bad players are at T10, and i dont mean stat wise, but bad bad players. Yesterday in a domination match our Shima said he doesn't go to cap because repairs cost too much. You can guess how much xp he got. I ended up capping and strategy torping for my team and ended up beig complimented in chat and with karma. 

One funny thing though : sometimes i get near an island where they cant shoot me, and harass a cruiser with radar, and they end up wasting it, so i got a couple of minutes of doing my thing eg: torping a full health Yamato and farming dmg LOL

 

Guess that Shima didn't get the memo. TX have a flat cost now that you get when you hit 'battle'. Damage received is not counted anymore. Only thing that will still make you loose money is the ammo you shoot (and premium consumables). So ironically, the Shima probably had an hefty loss. Since he got that flat fee at the start and shot a lot of VERY expensive torps. (See http://forum.worldofwarships.com/index.php?/topic/99871-0512-economics-before-and-after/ for more information)

 

When it comes to tX with a Benson, it's really fun when you get used to it . 

DDs suffer the least from being bottom tier. Mainly because their concealment is a lot better.

[Slauter]

Basically you can be very aggressive on your own or support the team by smoking/scouting/torping, or do both. You need to know which ships have hydro and radar and their range. B hull with SE for aggressive approach, C hull to have some protection from planes and a bit more conservative gameplay.

[Panocek]

Funny thing. Once you get past the "Oh sh*t i'm in a T10 game with my T8 ship" it all gets better. I am really amazed how many bad players are at T10, and i dont mean stat wise, but bad bad players. Yesterday in a domination match our Shima said he doesn't go to cap because repairs cost too much. You can guess how much xp he got. I ended up capping and strategy torping for my team and ended up beig complimented in chat and with karma. 

One funny thing though : sometimes i get near an island where they cant shoot me, and harass a cruiser with radar, and they end up wasting it, so i got a couple of minutes of doing my thing eg: torping a full health Yamato and farming dmg LOL

 

A lot of people doesn't learn, nor even try to improve their gameplay. And hightiers are punishing mistakes with serious maintenance costs, so losing ship without much damage done is easy way to lose 150k+ in tier 10.

 

And with current fixed fee per battle, even yoloing at some BB and putting few torps into it gives more than hiding in the corner.

[ThePurpleSmurf]

Benson is doing fine in TX matches -> 205k damage, 4 kills, double strike, confederate, high caliber

 

[jonasnee]

destroyers are honestly the class that gets hampered the least fighting up tier, they don't have the survivability problem the same way BBs do, they dont lagg stuff like heals and guns that cruiser do and they don't have the mathematical problem CVs have when they face AA that is much better than their planes with less reserves to back them up.

 

destroyers are all protected from it because their main way of staying alive (smoke and speed) don't really change the higher they go up nor does it really become that much worse, the guns are more or less universally the same after mid tiers and only numbers or soft stats like ROF and traverse really improves, the biggest improvement you get is in terms of torps and honestly by tier 8 2 out of 3 lines can stealth torp which kind of solves the problem for those 2.

[EmilyFara]

destroyers are honestly the class that gets hampered the least fighting up tier, they don't have the survivability problem the same way BBs do, they dont lagg stuff like heals and guns that cruiser do and they don't have the mathematical problem CVs have when they face AA that is much better than their planes with less reserves to back them up.

 

destroyers are all protected from it because their main way of staying alive (smoke and speed) don't really change the higher they go up nor does it really become that much worse, the guns are more or less universally the same after mid tiers and only numbers or soft stats like ROF and traverse really improves, the biggest improvement you get is in terms of torps and honestly by tier 8 2 out of 3 lines can stealth torp which kind of solves the problem for those 2.

 

Yeah, was thinking of that not too long ago. And I completely agree. But there is 1 exception. The gap between tier 7 and 8 is a bit too large for my taste. Between 6 and 7 or 8 and 9 there is a small gap. But at tier 7 you get a 7,5km detection range with the Mahan and from tier 8 you get 6,4 with the Benson. Also the ROF of the Benson is superior.

[The_Great_SCH]

Benson is awesome, managed to get a 60% WR until now, even with the T10 games, in which i usually end up in. Unlocked the Fletcher, hoping it will be as good, or feel as good. 

[EmilyFara]

Benson is awesome, managed to get a 60% WR until now, even with the T10 games, in which i usually end up in. Unlocked the Fletcher, hoping it will be as good, or feel as good. 

 

The Fletcher is awesome and pure sex. I loved the Benson, I absolutely adore the Fletcher. If you have a rank 15 captain you can get concealment to 5.8km. That means you can fire without being detected at 9.8km (same as the Benson). The guns are identical with the same rate of fire. But you can have the gun upgrade that increases your gun range to 15km flat without AFT. While this isn't good versus other DDs, it is great for harassing enemy BBs. And if those BBs start dodging your shells then their aim gets fucked >. It can also use the AA upgrade hull without losing a turret. I don't use speedboost that often and I'd rather have the scatter ability against planes. It is also quite good in taking down scout planes.

 

The 10,5km torps are also quite good. It doesn't differ THAT much from the 9.2km of the Benson. But I feel that it does make a difference.

 

She is a bit slower though... with only 38.3kn with a speed flag versus the 39.9kn with a speed flag. But she does have a faster ruddershift (3s in stead of 4s)

 

TL;DR Fletcher = upgraded Benson.

 

That said, the Gearing that comes after the Fletcher is a disappointment to me. But looking at the setup I was using... I am not surprised 0_o

[_Teob_]

Just some general tips and tricks for all 3 top tier USN DDs

- The Benson torps are quite slow but their detection range is very good. This means that you should generally launch them at ships that do not have hydro. 

- Fletcher has much faster torps and its reload on them is phenomenal. But its gun dmg potential is the same as the Benson's.

- Survival expert is pretty much mandatory on all these boats. Yes you can play without it if you are exceedingly good but I for one don't consider myself good enough to do that. I also run with Vigilence for even more help for my survivability.

- The Gearing is a phenomenal DD and people underestimate it all the time. It has an extra gun and it fires faster (than the Benson or Fletcher) which means that it will kill any other DD it runs into (except a Khaba or a kiting Udaloi). 

- Keep track of radar ships at all times. You can get away from them but any salvo that resets your torpedo cooldown means wasted damage potential and if one of your tubes is destroyed you will have a much worse time.

- Unless you are 100% sure you will hit your torps, fire them in a wall. Layering them is almost never worth it. Of course if you do manage to get to the side of a bow on Yam and you're under 7 km, then by all means, do a murder salvo on it.

- Never fight 2 DDs at the same time regardless of what they are. However, if you do run into two of them, if they are IJN boats, watch and see if they both fire their guns at you. Some IJN captains will never use their guns no matter what.

- Never smoke in a cap unless you really have to. The smoke is torpedo bait and it prevents you from spotting.

- If you are up against a lot of enemy DDs then do drop smoke and move out of it straight away - everyone will fire their torps at your smoke so you're essentially "tanking" for your big ships as torps fired into your smoke are obviously not fired at your allies

- Never sit broadside in smoke. As soon as your smoke is down, move your stern towards the enemy. That way if you see torps you can accelerate to safety.

- In the Fletcher and the Gearing take defensive AA instead of the speed boost.

- Don't torp the first ship in a column - they will probably come under fire first so they will manoeuvre. Go for the 2nd or 3rd ship as people tend to tunnelvision on aiming while they are not being shot at. 

 

Lastly, to answer your question, yes, the Benson is fine in tier X matches if you chose your torp targets well. Ships at tier x tend to be quite fast and the 55 kn torps aren't particularly well suited for that. Targets that are usually good to go for are Tirptiz (a lot of clueless players), bow on Yamatos and cruisers that are not being shot at (they tend to not expect torps). In general always keep an eye on your minimap and make a note of players who spend a lot of time sailing in straight lines.

[The_Great_SCH]

 

The Fletcher is awesome and pure sex. I loved the Benson, I absolutely adore the Fletcher. If you have a rank 15 captain you can get concealment to 5.8km. That means you can fire without being detected at 9.8km (same as the Benson). The guns are identical with the same rate of fire. But you can have the gun upgrade that increases your gun range to 15km flat without AFT. While this isn't good versus other DDs, it is great for harassing enemy BBs. And if those BBs start dodging your shells then their aim gets fucked >. It can also use the AA upgrade hull without losing a turret. I don't use speedboost that often and I'd rather have the scatter ability against planes. It is also quite good in taking down scout planes.

 

The 10,5km torps are also quite good. It doesn't differ THAT much from the 9.2km of the Benson. But I feel that it does make a difference.

 

She is a bit slower though... with only 38.3kn with a speed flag versus the 39.9kn with a speed flag. But she does have a faster ruddershift (3s in stead of 4s)

 

TL;DR Fletcher = upgraded Benson.

 

That said, the Gearing that comes after the Fletcher is a disappointment to me. But looking at the setup I was using... I am not surprised 0_o

 

Tried her in Coop until i have enough xp/free xp tu upgrade the hull and the guns, torps last. Seems really nice, i bet with SE and CE she will do a good job in a T10 game, given the same gun, better torps and higher HP pool. 

[The_Great_SCH]

Just some general tips and tricks for all 3 top tier USN DDs

- The Benson torps are quite slow but their detection range is very good. This means that you should generally launch them at ships that do not have hydro. 

- Fletcher has much faster torps and its reload on them is phenomenal. But its gun dmg potential is the same as the Benson's.

- Survival expert is pretty much mandatory on all these boats. Yes you can play without it if you are exceedingly good but I for one don't consider myself good enough to do that. I also run with Vigilence for even more help for my survivability.

- The Gearing is a phenomenal DD and people underestimate it all the time. It has an extra gun and it fires faster (than the Benson or Fletcher) which means that it will kill any other DD it runs into (except a Khaba or a kiting Udaloi). 

- Keep track of radar ships at all times. You can get away from them but any salvo that resets your torpedo cooldown means wasted damage potential and if one of your tubes is destroyed you will have a much worse time.

- Unless you are 100% sure you will hit your torps, fire them in a wall. Layering them is almost never worth it. Of course if you do manage to get to the side of a bow on Yam and you're under 7 km, then by all means, do a murder salvo on it.

- Never fight 2 DDs at the same time regardless of what they are. However, if you do run into two of them, if they are IJN boats, watch and see if they both fire their guns at you. Some IJN captains will never use their guns no matter what.

- Never smoke in a cap unless you really have to. The smoke is torpedo bait and it prevents you from spotting.

- If you are up against a lot of enemy DDs then do drop smoke and move out of it straight away - everyone will fire their torps at your smoke so you're essentially "tanking" for your big ships as torps fired into your smoke are obviously not fired at your allies

- Never sit broadside in smoke. As soon as your smoke is down, move your stern towards the enemy. That way if you see torps you can accelerate to safety.

- In the Fletcher and the Gearing take defensive AA instead of the speed boost.

- Don't torp the first ship in a column - they will probably come under fire first so they will manoeuvre. Go for the 2nd or 3rd ship as people tend to tunnelvision on aiming while they are not being shot at. 

 

Lastly, to answer your question, yes, the Benson is fine in tier X matches if you chose your torp targets well. Ships at tier x tend to be quite fast and the 55 kn torps aren't particularly well suited for that. Targets that are usually good to go for are Tirptiz (a lot of clueless players), bow on Yamatos and cruisers that are not being shot at (they tend to not expect torps). In general always keep an eye on your minimap and make a note of players who spend a lot of time sailing in straight lines.

 

Thanks for the tips. I am sure this will help me and other USN DD players just like myself. 

I always try and make a team with other dd's and cap/spot together, there is not much chance being the only DD in the game so that works. Firing torp in the Benson works as area control, usually spread as a wall, and if my target is under 7 km i send killer fishes. 

[Eviscerador]

The Benson is a Beast, no matter the tier.

 

Just play it as you would play any other US DD. Be aggresive, contest caps, move wildly, saturate with your torpedoes, support allies.

 

Don't be afraid to get close to other BB and cruisers before start firing. Switch to AP when the opportunity arises. Cruisers and BB will never expect you doing 2k damage every 3 seconds to their broadside (not counting citadels) British cruisers are specially vulnerable to this.

 

Manage your health, and always use smoke to escape, never to engage.

 

The only ships you have to be afraid of are the Radar cruisers, German BB (secondaries galore!) and other US DD. Russians will never contest cap zones (not with their crap detection range) and japanese are just snacks for you (just watch out torpedoes).

 

Also remember to relocate. It is incredible how can you surprise an unexpecting enemy with your speed boost and 41 knts top speed while boosted.

[_Teob_]

...and always use smoke to escape, never to engage.

 

I can't even begin to express how much I disagree with this. You should use your smoke aggressively. Using it defensively will severely limit your damage potential.

[The_Great_SCH]

 

I can't even begin to express how much I disagree with this. You should use your smoke aggressively. Using it defensively will severely limit your damage potential.

 

I guess it is situational isn't it?

 

I mean there are 3 different occasions : 

- when you have to get away from enemy cruisers/more DD's you could handle

- when you want to help your fleet and smoke them up, while you spot for them and help them do the damage

- when there are other DD's spotting for you and you can spam enemy BB's/CA/CL's from safety (but have to keep in mind those enemy DD's which might torp the smoke).

 

Unfortunately I couldn't manage to do more than 110k-120k damage in a game (average being 46k), but then again I am more of a team-oriented player, cap/kill enemy DD's and harass other ships, while trying to stay alive as much as i can. 

 

[EmilyFara]

I agree with @Rethyl 

The defensive 'panic fart' is one to avoid. It is a lot more useful to hide your friendly BBs in either attacking or retreating or by being the invisible HE spamming [edited].

[_Teob_]

I guess it is situational isn't it?

 

Yes of course. But what I obviously meant is if you use your smoke only as a defensive tool as Eviscerador suggested you are being less effective in my opinion.

 

2 of the situations you mentioned are aggressive uses for smoke (smoking your team or yourself to do dmg).

 

[Eviscerador]

I suppose it is all up to your play style.

 

Most of the time if you use your smoke offensively (for spamming, staying in the smoke etc...) you depend on your team to spot for you, and in case the enemy DD or CA know their crap, you will be in trouble when your smoke dissipates. I know because I have a long list of enemy DD killed when they got out their smoke.

 

My playstyle on the other way, revolves around supporting allies and hitting enemy ships where they don't expect it. I usually get as close as detection range allows me in order to use my full DPM on the enemy ships (and also get very nice AP shots) so my smoke is my way of retreating. If the enemy stop firing at other ships and focus on me, I just turn away and use smoke. Take in mind that I don't use the smoke to stay inside, just as a cover to break contact, and I will use that trick several times until the smoke disipates, but never staying INSIDE the smoke (which is a torpedo magnet by itself, and also a GPS marker of your position)

 

Of course, that doesn't meant I can't use it that way if I know there are other ships spotting (usually I'm the one spotting) OR if my team needs a smoke screen. The best I can do for that poor CA that was courageous enough to support me inside the cap circle, is to cover him and spot for him.

 

But in the end, you will survive MORE and you will help your team more if you reserve your smoke charges for defensive pourposes instead of for offensive pourposes. Because if you used your charge offensively and suddenly you are in trouble... well... you are out of aces in your sleeve.

[The_Great_SCH]

Yeah, I wish I would be a better player and make damage+survive the games. Usually doesn't work that way for me. If i make damage i do not survive, and if i survive i do not make a lot of damage. XP wise i am always top 3 of my team, but i do what i have to do to get the job done/win.