Can we get a hardcap on BBs already?

[anonym_XGuN6pHmfiJ9]

Personally i'm with OP.  Max 3 BB in each game.

 

And if it end with games with only BB's. I'm fine with that. i don't think BB-captains would have a problem with that. It isn't like having 6 to 10 battleships in a battle is historical correct. 

[Oely001]

Flood of BB becomes a matter of itself. To drive a cruiser has always been challenging. But now you have 2-3 BB fireing at one cruiser, and this makes cruiser gameplay mostly impossible (for many average Players like me), and it becomes pointless because with so many BB around there is no more need for supporting/covering them. This is why I would recommend a BB hardcap, not as the only thing to change but one thing.

[Zerstoeroer]

 

Are you sure though? If its a cruiser I get it but citadelling a DD when it has no citadels? Or do you mean the shots are registered as citadels but shown as overpens? If the shots are registered as citadels but shown as overpens why didn't I 1 shot the Kiev since citadel shots should be highly damaging?

 

A Kiev has 11,200 HP. Bayern's AP shot do a maximum of 10,900. OP always does 0.1 damage, so that's about 1,090. Assuming I hit all shots as overpens, that would only take about 10 shots. 2 salvos is 16 shots so how would it be impossible to overpen a Kiev to death if 10 shots land on target?

 

 

 shhhh don't be so bad to the Kiev. How could he have known that a BB would a) fire at him b) fire AP at him and c) could estimate and give enough lead to land shots at him given that he's going at 42.5 knots?

 

Seriously some BB players should learn how to use their BBs better 

 

Destroyers have no citadels, but Russian destroyers have thicker armor, making them easier to penetrate. That's also  why a BB should always try to shoot at stuff like a Khaba within say 15km range. They wreck your dds, but a BBs AP can penetrate them much easier. And one penetrating shell does 3,33 times the damage of one overpenetrating.

Which means that you only need a couple of penetrations to sink a Kiev.

It most likely was a mix of pens and overpens, the ig display is that bugged.

 

Why do I say it's impossible to land almost every single shell? We both know German dispersion/accuracy in this game. Add to that such a small target at high speed and it's pretty much impossible to pull off such a feat two times in a row. It's much more likely that you had 2-3 penetrations and some overpens.

 

Out of curiosity, did it register 10 hits?

[Scawl_D_Balls]

I just want BB's to actually enter the fight. 

Not tarring everybody with the same brush, but I seem to be so unlucky with the BB's I get matched up with. 

 

In every match, the enemy BB's steam ahead and take us on aggressively. 

We can only sit and watch in envy as our own BB's immediately run to the furthest edge of the map, or in one case screenshot below, instead of the BB's sailing towards cap A and fighting, they immediately turned right and hid behind an island 

 

 

[G01ngToxicCommand0]

DDs never countered BBs as effektive as BBs oneshoot CAs with impunity. Even before all the DD nerfs, BBs could always just oneshoot DDs as well, while DDs sometimes Need more than 8 Torpedohits. The only Thing that keept BB numbers low was the CV class, but all of you cryed for nerfs so that i as a CV can only go for DDs this days.

 

And i suffer from broken economy to, where i get less than 1credit per dmg i do.

 

Anybody remember the Launch of this game? Yes CVs were realy strong, but we had a healthy amount of Crusers because all the scrups, who Play BBs now, were forced to sail them. Never saw that kind of Teamwork again after the 3rd nerf to CVs and i am not even talking about the Times without mirror MM.

 

^This and sorry but I ran out of +1s and I miss picking the Atlanta knowing that its awesome AA would be used to defend the BBs and other less AA heavy CAs but today you are lucky to be in range with its long range AA and shoot down 1 or 2 enemy spotter planes/catapult figters..

[Zathras_Grimm]

A number cap could work but then it has to apply to all classes. To say cap BBs and DDs to make life easier for Cruisers is silly. It shouldn't be easier. However it does need balance.

 

As for the waiting (again already mentioned), when 24 BBs are waiting lump them together in one match. Simple, job done.

 

Wonder what they will complain about then?

[steviln]

On the other hand, there seems to be several thousand more players online on average in the evenings since the german BBs came, so it seems that someone is enjoying having so many BBs. I actually think than when playing anything else than a cruiser, having a lot of cruisers around can be a huge annoyanse. 

[Adwaenyth]

Current BB meta. Tier IX-X. Me in Baltiless + one ex. Zao + 7 BB. I ask on chat how can I fight vs such wall of BB having even 100 k HP each ? They smile: with repair it's closer to 150 K and you have fire .... Yeaa - fire ... when high tier ships have such high immunity to burning and I have slow firing puny HE.

 

Game ended: 50 K DMG done to multiple targets (I just killed 1/3 of single X BB. Wow !) with 2-3 fires worth perhaps 10 K and 2.500.000 DMG tanked. Game was lost but I survived on last HP drop !

 

Such a game should be a dream for the Zao... Games like that smell of 200k+ damage done including a "Witherer" medal.

[pra3y]

 

Destroyers have no citadels, but Russian destroyers have thicker armor, making them easier to penetrate. That's also  why a BB should always try to shoot at stuff like a Khaba within say 15km range. They wreck your dds, but a BBs AP can penetrate them much easier. And one penetrating shell does 3,33 times the damage of one overpenetrating.

Which means that you only need a couple of penetrations to sink a Kiev.

It most likely was a mix of pens and overpens, the ig display is that bugged.

 

Why do I say it's impossible to land almost every single shell? We both know German dispersion/accuracy in this game. Add to that such a small target at high speed and it's pretty much impossible to pull off such a feat two times in a row. It's much more likely that you had 2-3 penetrations and some overpens.

 

Out of curiosity, did it register 10 hits?

 

I can't remember exactly how many hits landed. I only remember landing my first salvo of overpens when the Kiev gave me a broadside, taking about 1/2 health? Then landed the 2nd salvo of overpens and killed it. 

I played the Bayern with and without the accuracy mod (was testing the secondary mod and 7+km secondaries for lols) and it may be a psychological thing but I find myself landing more hits with the accuracy mod (dumb I know, that's what the accuracy mod is for but I think I read somewhere on the forum that the accuracy mod was negligible). Without the mods my shots just go all over the place.

 

Then again against a broadside target if you lead well enough you're bound to hit it, even if its a DD at 16+km (done that a couple of times in the Colorado).

[Odo_Toothless]

 

Such a game should be a dream for the Zao... Games like that smell of 200k+ damage done including a "Witherer" medal.

 

Yea - as I wrote - will survive only smokers or invisi fired ones. BTW. Even such Zao will do a little to win a match, when enemy is hard pushing and his team is not. Most of this damage will be repaired by BB anyway. But Zao will have great stats - of course.

[Odo_Toothless]

 

I can't remember exactly how many hits landed. I only remember landing my first salvo of overpens when the Kiev gave me a broadside, taking about 1/2 health? Then landed the 2nd salvo of overpens and killed it. 

I played the Bayern with and without the accuracy mod (was testing the secondary mod and 7+km secondaries for lols) and it may be a psychological thing but I find myself landing more hits with the accuracy mod (dumb I know, that's what the accuracy mod is for but I think I read somewhere on the forum that the accuracy mod was negligible). Without the mods my shots just go all over the place.

 

Then again against a broadside target if you lead well enough you're bound to hit it, even if its a DD at 16+km (done that a couple of times in the Colorado).

 

Neglible ? I did series of tests: 5 x 100 shells on stationary BB bow on to me, on distance of 16 km in Budionny with and without mod. Every time with mod I had from 12 to 17 % more shells on target.

 

Ex. third try:

- without 101 hits /231 fired - accuracy 43%

- with module 101 hits/183 shell fired - accuracy 55%

[Kittykami]

A hardcap on BBs per battle would be a great start, but I think CAs at high tier still need some help to make them more enjoyable in the current meta (aside from Zao and maybe the Russians too). I was thinking along the lines of a very short duration smoke (say 30s cloud duration but fast cool down and lots of charges) to help them turn or accelerate away without being deleted, heals for all tiers and maybe a RoF buff of some magnitude. 

[red_eye1980]

Errrm, no. No hard capping please.

 

Ok im back on the game from a 5 month break because of work and I am still trying to find out the updates and the meta. 

I have noticed the lack of CVs and less CAs.

 

But I put it down to the German line BBs. i haven't tried them yet but they seem to have unique characteristics that appeal to people.

 

The British CAs should have brought the numbers up but having no HE does put some traditional CA players off.

 

Having too many BBs should have attracted some casual CV players back in the game. But it hasn't. Why? I think CVs were nerfed too hard before. I think WG stopped working on them too and stopped evolving the class.

 

In the current meta I find myself playing DDs more. Especially because there are hardly any CVs and less CAs. CAs I've been grinding them, but stopped after I reached Pensacola. Still have some faith on the Nurnberg but kinda postpone getting the the next ship up, Yorck.

 

i don't think hard capping is the answer. Nerf BB AA and turning radius, CVs their prime hunters will be back, and let CAs have to provide anti DD and AA role.

 

Until then, Ill be playing DDs and BBs most of the time.

[General_Alexus]

 

But Zao will have great stats - of course.

 

And Zao will be nerfed because it is clearly Overperforming. Same with Khaba: One DD that could fight BBs because it has Range+Speed to crapon BB Campers

 

- worst Thing you can do against a Khaba was sailing away from it, while exectly this Tactik ( sailing away ) makes you immune to EVERY Torpedo armed DD

 

And People were wondering why Khaba was far better than every other DD, Khaba was the only DD that could fight (OP) BBs. And what did WG? Hey lets nerf Khaba to 13km ( with AFT ) Range so that Khaba Needs to get within 11 KM Range of a BB that is sailing away from it to get crapon by BBs and CAs like every other DD in this game.

[Tanaka_15]

No always, you will be visble for 60s you got 1-2 cita and life is getting harder. Problem of high tier curuser is If you are spotted you get citadel. 

[olmedreca]

Maybe just buff the cruisers that have been relegated to trash tier by perfectly balanced premiums like Belfast and Atago?

[Odo_Toothless]

 

Maybe just buff the cruisers that have been relegated to trash tier by perfectly balanced premiums like Belfast and Atago?

 

There are a lot of possibilities to change this. From nerfing of ex. BB HP to making them more susceptible to DMG. Or making cruisers more tanky or stealthy, CV stronger vs BB or simply at least make temporary BB limit until the problem is not resolved and tested.

 

But this game already is balanced .... In tier IV, V - rock, scissor, paper model works like a charm. Texas OP AA and then German BB line started to destroy this balance even there. Average players want stronk ships, played without much problems, so Wargaming made changes to satisfy them. Balance? - It's all about having huge playerbase with money - Sir.

[pra3y]

 

Neglible ? I did series of tests: 5 x 100 shells on stationary BB bow on to me, on distance of 16 km in Budionny with and without mod. Every time with mod I had from 12 to 17 % more shells on target.

 

Ex. third try:

- without 101 hits /231 fired - accuracy 43%

- with module 101 hits/183 shell fired - accuracy 55%

 

http://forum.worldofwarships.eu/index.php?/topic/65144-what-going-on-with-the-gneisenau/

 

Ok they didnt say it was negligeble, just it doesnt seem that effective for the Gneisenau.

 

[ghostbuster_]

Last night in every battle there were min 4-5 DDs per team. Even got a battle with 15 dds in it. (8 at the enemy team 7 at our team).game was only about smokes and torpedos into smokes. So how about DD numbers?

[General_Alexus]

Last night in every battle there were min 4-5 DDs per team. Even got a battle with 15 dds in it. (8 at the enemy team 7 at our team).game was only about smokes and torpedos into smokes. So how about DD numbers?

 

BB and DD numbers are related to each other.

People like me who

- dont like the gameplay of BBs,

-cant Play CVs anymore because of Economy changes and broken gamemechanik,

-dont want to be Free Exp and Dmg Piniata in CAs for the masses of BBs

 

well jeah we Play DDs because F*** Y** WG. And as i said: BBs even Counter DDs nowadays ( how many DDs did you oneshoot in your Fuso with a single AP salvo? i can remember it like 100 times )

[Odo_Toothless]

Last night in every battle there were min 4-5 DDs per team. Even got a battle with 15 dds in it. (8 at the enemy team 7 at our team).game was only about smokes and torpedos into smokes. So how about DD numbers?

 

Answer is simple: In full BB meta it's normal to see plenty of DD. There is often nobody left to counter them properly. (forgot that buffed BB AP shells, secondaries and hydro on German line ....) Give some space to cruisers, then the problem will vanish. Action and reaction.

[ghostbuster_]

 

BB and DD numbers are related to each other.

People like me who

- dont like the gameplay of BBs,

-cant Play CVs anymore because of Economy changes and broken gamemechanik,

-dont want to be Free Exp and Dmg Piniata in CAs for the masses of BBs

 

well jeah we Play DDs because F*** Y** WG. And as i said: BBs even Counter DDs nowadays ( how many DDs did you oneshoot in your Fuso with a single AP salvo? i can remember it like 100 times )

BBs counter the DDs? you cant be serious. of course many times i oneshoot DDs with my BBs but those were plebs who were trying to rush me with their DDs. Have fun while trying to counter gearings or shimas in your tier X BB. you cant counter them and you shouldnt be able to counter them.  

And about CAs. they are not free EXP and damage. many player do many ridiculous mistakes and get punished. then they come on forums and start "there is no point playing CAs anymore" threads. CAs are just fine.

[G01ngToxicCommand0]

BBs counter the DDs? you cant be serious. of course many times i oneshoot DDs with my BBs but those were plebs who were trying to rush me with their DDs. Have fun while trying to counter gearings or shimas in your tier X BB. you cant counter them and you shouldnt be able to counter them.  

And about CAs. they are not free EXP and damage. many player do many ridiculous mistakes and get punished. then they come on forums and start "there is no point playing CAs anymore" threads. CAs are just fine.

 

I am afraid that your perception is skewed form the fact that you have only played 35% of your battles solo with the rest in division and as we know when in division damage, kills, survival and winrate are much higher than which is possible when playing solo because a divsion that communicates and coordinates their actions are much more effective than the same number of solo players ever will be as can be seen from your solo vs. division stats. You simply don't experience the game the same way players like me that primarily play the game solo do thus you don't experience the weaknesses and plight of cruisers in a BB heavy game meta which is the current situation.

I'm not saying your argument doesn't have valid points because the cruisers are ok when performing in games where there are a low number of BBs on each team but they simply can't perform their intended role as a counter to destroyers in battles with 5-6 battleships which are game designwise the counter to cruisers by a factor of at least two to one with regards to hitpoints and firepower.

 

Cruiserplay in a good division is simply not the same experience as when playing cruisers solo thus the experiences from division can not be transferred to the experience that solo players have.

[ghostbuster_]

 

I am afraid that your perception is skewed form the fact that you have only played 35% of your battles solo with the rest in division and as we know when in division damage, kills, survival and winrate are much higher than which is possible when playing solo because a divsion that communicates and coordinates their actions are much more effective than the same number of solo players ever will be as can be seen from your solo vs. division stats. You simply don't experience the game the same way players like me that primarily play the game solo do thus you don't experience the weaknesses and plight of cruisers in a BB heavy game meta which is the current situation.

I'm not saying your argument doesn't have valid points because the cruisers are ok when performing in games where there are a low number of BBs on each team but they simply can't perform their intended role as a counter to destroyers in battles with 5-6 battleships which are game designwise the counter to cruisers by a factor of at least two to one with regards to hitpoints and firepower.

 

Cruiserplay in a good division is simply not the same experience as when playing cruisers solo thus the experiences from division can not be transferred to the experience that solo players have.

People are complaining about getting oneshotted by BBs. exept detonations i got oneshotted maybe 3 or 4 times in 2k+ battles. so tell me, does playing in a div protect me from getting oneshotted? maybe i use wasd keys and dodge the BB shells? 

[Kutfroat]

either hard cao at 3 max. or a severe Long range accuracy nerf, or severe agilioty nerf, but something must be done to make cruisers playable again.