Is there a new mod which reveals position in smoke?

[n0tmad]

it happens today and yesterday twice in mino no shooting no radar 1 shoot direkt 4 citadels and sunk out of nothing from a bb 20km away i have many replay where this smoke mod or hack people using and when you ask them how they say i was standing still when i pop smoke and i checked replay i was moving it happens month before with a z52 nose straight in smoke moving big smoke wall bb 1 salve sunk. maybe its luck i thought but now ive seen it many many many many times and many people get mad about. this game is full of cheaters sometimes less online sometimes many. there enough pay sites where you can buy private hacks for wows and 1 guy pm me after same smoke happens and he told me which hack he used, so get used to this game is full of hackers and cheat mod users and wows is doing nothing about they even took out the report , because users which buy expensive hacks for this game spent also much on premium so that why they tolorate the hackers. sorry for my bad english and sentences but it happens again and im mad. yesterday night and right now again so i was checking the forum what people say of it. normaly it should be dozens of threads with smoke hack. i wonder that so less complain.i can upload many replays of this smoke hack mod issue i try to add one example. maybe some pro can tell me what i did wrong in this replay.

20190115_035207_PBSC110-Minotaur_15_NE_north.zip

[ColonelPete]

Show us that replay.

And no, there is no hack for that. It is mostly players who get their ships spotted when deploying smoke. The rest is good guesswork.

[Aotearas]

11 minutes ago, n0tmad said:

it happens today and yesterday twice in mino no shooting no radar 1 shoot direkt 4 citadels and sunk out of nothing from a bb 20km away i have many replay where this smoke mod or hack people using and when you ask them how they say i was standing still when i pop smoke and i checked replay i was moving it happens month before with a z52 nose straight in smoke moving big smoke wall bb 1 salve sunk. maybe its luck i thought but now ive seen it many many many many times and many people get mad about. this game is full of cheaters sometimes less online sometimes many. there enough pay sites where you can buy private hacks for wows and 1 guy pm me after same smoke happens and he told me which hack he used, so get used to this game is full of hackers and cheat mod users and wows is doing nothing about they even took out the report , because users which buy expensive hacks for this game spent also much on premium so that why they tolorate the hackers. sorry for my bad english and sentences but it happens again and im mad. yesterday night and right now again so i was checking the forum what people say of it. normaly it should be dozens of threads with smoke hack. i wonder that so less complain.

 

Shooting Minotaurs in smoke is relatively easy with a spotter plane when you know what you're doing. Even if you haven't been shooting, as long as the player has a rough idea of where you are it's possible to get consistent hits (the addition of the range indicator on your firing line on the minimap, a small circle indicating the spot on the minimap you're aiming at, can be viciously exploited together with last known positions in that regard). Add a bit of RNG blessings and violá: multi-cit salvo.

 

There's no cheat that would allow players to see you in smoke unless you're already spotted, due to how the server only sends the spotting information to the client when the spotting criteria (which are handled serverside) are fulfilled. The client simply doesn't have the data, hence no way a cheat (which can only access informations the client has) could show him.

[Allied_Winter]

No hack. Kein Hack!

 

As you slowed down and were still spotted: Als du langsamer wurdes warst du noch entdeckt

Notice the 2 on your spotted! Siehst du die "2" oberhalb deines entdeckt Zeichens?

 

Shortly before your last puff of smoke came, the enemy must've shot at you from where I painted the white "X". Kurz bevor dein letzter Nebelpuff kommt, hat der Gegner auf dich geschossen. Vermutlich von da wo ich das weiße Kreuz hingemalt habe.

 

Here you can see the shells flying at you, draw a line from your Mino to the shells and you'll know where the enemy is. Since the shell flight time is longer than the 2 or 3 seconds you were unspotted the enemy had a clear shot at you. Da kommen die Geschosse angeflogen. In "ROT" habe ich mal eine Linie gezogen. Von da müssen die Geschosse kommen. Da die Geschosse des Gegners aber mehrere Sekunden brauchen bis sie bei dir sind, schlagen sie ein etwa zu dem Zeitpunkt als du gerade 2 oder 3 Sekunden nicht mehr entdeckt warst.

 

Result: No hack, the enemy (Großer Kurfürst) could shot at you without getting spotted himself and since his shells needed to travel for quite some time (I assume 12s or so) it appears as if he'd shoot at you while you being completely in smoke.

Ergebnis: KEIN HACK! Der Gegner (Großer Kurfürst) konnte auf dich schießen als du noch entdeckt warst. Da er hinter den Inseln stand wurde er dabei selbst nicht entdeckt. Ich vermute seine Geschosse waren länger als 10 Sekunden unterwegs bis zu dir, weshalb es bei dir erst ankommt als du schon wieder unentdeckt im Nebel bist.

 

 

Sorry guys, for the German but I assumed it'd be easier for the poster above.

[bushwacker001]

watched the replay.....you were shot at by three different ships in the exact spot you first went invisible...no hack. The BB shells were probably fired before you went invisible and took 5 or 6 seconds to get to you.

 

edit.....See explanation in post above by Allied Winter....spot on. I don't know about other players but I hold off firing at cruisers and dds smoking up to try to fire at the same time they stop and go invisible.

 

On a side note.....hitting the chat button and calling cheat and hacker to your enemy killer will give him nothing but joy and make you look a tad stupid.

[n0tmad]

well i play since beta even if im not a good captain ive got many hours in this game. often im frustrated but never accused other better players of cheating. this is one example and i bet i can post 20 others and you always find an explain. fact is others much closer didnt hit me but kurfürst from much far away is able to make the perfect 40k hit. belive what you want. i have my own thoughts on it.

[Allied_Winter]

Just now, n0tmad said:

well i play since beta even if im not a good captain ive got many hours in this game. often im frustrated but never accused other better players of cheating. this is one example and i bet i can post 20 others and you always find an explain. fact is others much closer didnt hit me but kurfürst from much far away is able to make the perfect 40k hit. belive what you want. i have my own thoughts on it.

You DO know that there's a thing called "Dispersion"? If you shoot at a target, your shells land not where you are pointing your crosshair, but somewhere around that.

 

Anywhere within this black ellipse, your (or the enemie's shells) can land.

 

The enemy GK just got lucky.

 

 

If you want, we can talk in german via PN about that (makes it easier...)

[FishDogFoodShack]

1 minute ago, n0tmad said:

well i play since beta even if im not a good captain ive got many hours in this game. often im frustrated but never accused other better players of cheating. this is one example and i bet i can post 20 others and you always find an explain. fact is others much closer didnt hit me but kurfürst from much far away is able to make the perfect 40k hit. belive what you want. i have my own thoughts on it.

 

Honestly the fact that you lack the basic etiquette skills to not resurrect a two-and-a-half year old thread casts doubt on your ability to discern what actually happened to you.

[n0tmad]

Vor 4 Minuten, n0tmad sagte:

well i play since beta even if im not a good captain ive got many hours in this game. often im frustrated but never accused other better players of cheating. this is one example and i bet i can post 20 others and you always find an explain. fact is others much closer didnt hit me but kurfürst from much far away is able to make the perfect 40k hit. belive what you want. i have my own thoughts on it.

Yes its always 100% luck you dont have to explain me the game mechanics i play long enough. as i said i can upload 20 replays and you will always find some explaination for it. nothing new i remeber a hacker posted his replay and all said he was legit. it just happens to me since some month so there is for sure some smoke mod hack out. for you its luck for me its a mod.

[bushwacker001]

2 minutes ago, n0tmad said:

well i play since beta even if im not a good captain ive got many hours in this game. often im frustrated but never accused other better players of cheating. this is one example and i bet i can post 20 others and you always find an explain. fact is others much closer didnt hit me but kurfürst from much far away is able to make the perfect 40k hit. belive what you want. i have my own thoughts on it.

Well your own thoughts are wrong. You post your complaint in the forum and get the correct explanation for what happened and you do not accept it so why bother. From when the BB fired at you and on the shells landing you had moved probably less than a quarter of your ship length. superb play by the BB and he probably does it a lot....as do I.

[Allied_Winter]

7 minutes ago, n0tmad said:

Yes its always 100% luck you dont have to explain me the game mechanics i play long enough. as i said i can upload 20 replays and you will always find some explaination for it. nothing new i remeber a hacker posted his replay and all said he was legit. it just happens to me since some month so there is for sure some smoke mod hack out. for you its luck for me its a mod.

Apparently - despite the time that you're still here from beta - have trouble about the basics of the game. 

 

In the game above, there's a perfect situation on where YOU made the mistake (smoking while being spotted) and the enemy was a tad lucky. So the enemy could shoot at you BEFORE you were in smoke

 

If you'd actually know how this game works, it'd be pretty obvious where luck get's involved.

[ColonelPete]

9 minutes ago, n0tmad said:

well i play since beta even if im not a good captain ive got many hours in this game. often im frustrated but never accused other better players of cheating. this is one example and i bet i can post 20 others and you always find an explain. fact is others much closer didnt hit me but kurfürst from much far away is able to make the perfect 40k hit. belive what you want. i have my own thoughts on it.

That would mean that you mess up very often.

Maybe change that?

 

You have to consider that the enemies closer to you did not have their guns ready when you were slowing down.

Shooting and hitting AFTER you vanish is a A LOT harder.

[RAYvenMP]

many good players will blind fire the smokes if you make mistakes.

some hits to be "successful smoker"

 

- be aware of your surroundings - where radar and sonar ships are and always plan your escape route ahead. In lower tier you can wait till radar ships are spotted, in high tier with much more radar ships, try to mitigate damage you get (islands, etc)

- always make as many smoke puffs as possible, will give you room for maneuvering and will discourage blind shooters

- on a highly contested flank/cap try not to open fire before you are concealed in smoke - decent players will have much easier time to shoot your last known location or estimate your movements

- ALWAYS expect that fast firing ships will blind fire a lot - things like minotaur, haragumo, kitakaze, wooster etc have such rate of fire they can simply spray the smoke over and over and eventually locate your position and you take heavy damage or even die - see hint #2 to mitigate this. If you play RN cruiser - expect ANYTHING to blind fire, especially BBs

- keep moving in the smoke when you are firing, and maintain some angle if in cruiser

- DONT sit in the smoke when enemy torp ships in range havent launched the torps yet, especially in hard to maneuver ship or w/o hydro

 

gl in your smoking career 

[Allied_Winter]

1 minute ago, ColonelPete said:

Shooting and hitting AFTER you vanish is a A LOT harder.

While that is true, in the example above I assume the GK just waited for him to be behind that island, so that the GK can shoot undetected.

[Irishgeezah]

17 minutes ago, n0tmad said:

well i play since beta even if im not a good captain ive got many hours in this game. often im frustrated but never accused other better players of cheating. this is one example and i bet i can post 20 others and you always find an explain. fact is others much closer didnt hit me but kurfürst from much far away is able to make the perfect 40k hit. belive what you want. i have my own thoughts on it.

It's not hard to someone in smoke, even at max range, with a spotter plane you can see exactly where someone is shooting from and with half-decent RNG, you can do serious damage to them. Too many people think they are invulnerable when sitting in smoke!

[Aotearas]

Right then, looks like we got a classic case of "everyone's who's better than me is cheating".

[BLUB__BLUB]

34 minutes ago, Allied_Winter said:

While that is true, in the example above I assume the GK just waited for him to be behind that island, so that the GK can shoot undetected.

I usually do this sort of thing in the RN BBs, as I am likely to have HE loaded:

Watch the DD, and when he smokes up, he will slow down AND YOU SEE SMOKE STARTING.

I will then also know quite reliably WHERE HE IS GONNA STOP.

[Allied_Winter]

Just now, BLUB__BLUB said:

I will then also know quite reliably WHERE HE IS GONNA STOP.

Not only that. For a very short time (iirc 1s or so) the "lock on" is still active after a ship disappears. 

 

Especially noticeable when a ship disappears behind an island and it takes just that half a second for me to allign my guns. Still OVER the island. And mostly on to the target as well.

[BLUB__BLUB]

1 minute ago, Allied_Winter said:

Not only that. For a very short time (iirc 1s or so) the "lock on" is still active after a ship disappears. 

 

Especially noticeable when a ship disappears behind an island and it takes just that half a second for me to allign my guns. Still OVER the island. And mostly on to the target as well.

 I always have bad luck on that, I shoot 'last moment' and then usually the 'mountain' icon suddenly appears and I roast some scenery. 

[GarrusBrutus]

1 hour ago, n0tmad said:

it happens today and yesterday twice in mino no shooting no radar 1 shoot direkt 4 citadels and sunk out of nothing from a bb 20km away i have many replay where this smoke mod or hack people using and when you ask them how they say i was standing still when i pop smoke and i checked replay i was moving it happens month before with a z52 nose straight in smoke moving big smoke wall bb 1 salve sunk. maybe its luck i thought but now ive seen it many many many many times and many people get mad about. this game is full of cheaters sometimes less online sometimes many. there enough pay sites where you can buy private hacks for wows and 1 guy pm me after same smoke happens and he told me which hack he used, so get used to this game is full of hackers and cheat mod users and wows is doing nothing about they even took out the report , because users which buy expensive hacks for this game spent also much on premium so that why they tolorate the hackers. sorry for my bad english and sentences but it happens again and im mad. yesterday night and right now again so i was checking the forum what people say of it. normaly it should be dozens of threads with smoke hack. i wonder that so less complain.i can upload many replays of this smoke hack mod issue i try to add one example. maybe some pro can tell me what i did wrong in this replay.

20190115_035207_PBSC110-Minotaur_15_NE_north.zip

*hidden stats*, check.

Calls hacks because something "unexplainable" happens to him, check.

 

[Lord_Holland_of_Wessex]

1 hour ago, n0tmad said:

well i play since beta even if im not a good captain ive got many hours in this game. often im frustrated but never accused other better players of cheating. this is one example and i bet i can post 20 others and you always find an explain. fact is others much closer didnt hit me but kurfürst from much far away is able to make the perfect 40k hit. belive what you want. i have my own thoughts on it.

Wait so you mean I've been wrong all this time, I knew it, everyone who killed me in smoke is a hacker! 

 

Thank you.  

[wilkatis_LV]

@n0tmad spotting's overrated anyway

 

Spoiler

 

 

[lup3s]

 

Shooting (and hitting) ships in smoke is not that difficult though :

- ship is spotted when smoking -> easiest shot of all

- ship got briefly spotted but not shooting, smokescreen doesn't "continue" -> shoot last known position on the map using the range indicator

- ship is shooting from smoke, no allies are shooting him, you have spotter plane ready -> use spotter plane, aim just below origin of shell tracers, full salvo

- ship is shooting from smoke, no allies are shooting him, no spotter plane ready -> sequential fire until you hit something, look where you hit, fire at same spot

- allies are shooting the ship in the smoke -> wait a short time to see if allies get hits, if they do : full salvo; if they don't : make some guesses and sequential fire at those spots (you know where the ship isn't)

 

And probably there are more "tricks" to have a higher chance of hitting ships in smoke ...

[eliastion]

8 hours ago, n0tmad said:

Yes its always 100% luck you dont have to explain me the game mechanics i play long enough. as i said i can upload 20 replays and you will always find some explaination for it.

That is one of the funniest quotes I've seen in quite some time. Have you spared a thought that PERHAPS if each of your "proofs" of cheating can be easily explained away WITHOUT the involvement of (technically nigh-impossible since it would require hacking not the game client but rather hacking into the server) cheats, it might just mean that you're wrong about that whole cheating thing?

 

You're like that bad student angry at someone who aced the test in middle school - the guy must've stolen the answer sheet from the teacher! It's clearly impossible for someone to study all the required material and answer all the questions without cheating!

[eliastion]

7 hours ago, GarrusBrutus said:

*hidden stats*, check.

Calls hacks because something "unexplainable" happens to him, check.

 

The funny part is that the unexplainable got explained to him - and that got him angry. He said that he could give 20 more examples but they would certainly get explained too, so he won't bother, because he's smart and he knows what's really going on! Look:

8 hours ago, n0tmad said:

well i play since beta even if im not a good captain ive got many hours in this game. often im frustrated but never accused other better players of cheating. this is one example and i bet i can post 20 others and you always find an explain. fact is others much closer didnt hit me but kurfürst from much far away is able to make the perfect 40k hit. belive what you want. i have my own thoughts on it.