Royal BB line

[SeaMonsterUK]

In other words no good reason. Someone just felt like it.

 

Someone who is qualified at designing a Super Dreadnought.

[SmartassNoob]

After more than 3 thousand battles played and only 3 ships short of "chief naval architect", I'm pretty sure I'm over-qualified to competently criticize a WW1 BB. Also, I'll have you know, I've constructed a number fine plastic models of warships and a couple of wooden models of multi-masted sailing ships to top that.

 

[SeaMonsterUK]

After more than 3 thousand battles played and only 3 ships short of "chief naval architect", I'm pretty sure I'm over-qualified to competently criticize a WW1 BB. Also, I'll have you know, I've constructed a number fine plastic models of warships and a couple of wooden models of multi-masted sailing ships to top that.

 

So we can expect you to be building Battleships for the Royal Navy very soon then right?

[mr3awsome]

Someone who is qualified at designing a Super Dreadnought.

In this case, George Thurston, who also contributed to the design of Kongou. 

 

Also I believe the structure in question is the secondary conning position. 

[piritskenyer]

@SmartassNoob

 

They couldn't have brought the turret all the way around because of the internal arrangement of the turrets. 

[SmartassNoob]

 

So we can expect you to be building Battleships for the Royal Navy very soon then right?

 

Well, yeah. I've already mailed my CV to them by courier pigeon, so I'd expect a response soon. Then again, these are modern times, so maybe I should have used telegraph instead.

 

@piritskenyer Couldn't have, or didn't want to? Inside the turrets are just straight round columns that need to connect to the ammunition rooms at some point.

[piritskenyer]

@SN as far as I'm aware, they wouldn't have been able to, due to the rotating structure interfering with the fiixed structure at some point. I know that the 15" Mk I turrets would have been absolutely incapable od doing a 360, and i also assume it would be the case for the 13.5" guns' turrets. 

[SmartassNoob]

Fine, I'll design a better turret for them too then. 

 

Quote Jeremy Clarkson: "How hard could it be?"

[El2aZeR]

Well, yeah. I've already mailed my CV to them by courier pigeon, so I'd expect a response soon.

 

Did you design it to be made out of ice? 

[SeaMonsterUK]

I once sent a design to the RN. NEVER AGAIN! Apparently a 2D Paint drawing wasn't good enough!

[mr3awsome]

Also, WG takes it as 40lb = 1" of armour (going by Warspite), so KGV should have a full 14" belt, 5" deck, etc. 

[Webley_Mark]

I once sent a design to the RN. NEVER AGAIN! Apparently a 2D Paint drawing wasn't good enough!

 

And now, I want to see this famous 2D Paint drawing.

[SeaMonsterUK]

Also, WG takes it as 40lb = 1" of armour (going by Warspite), so KGV should have a full 14" belt, 5" deck, etc. 

 

So in game it will have the same Belt armour of the Scharnhorst and Gneisenau.

[SmartassNoob]

Thickness is one thing, layers and angles are another thing entirely.

[SeaMonsterUK]

Thickness is one thing, layers and angles are another thing entirely.

 

KGV armour isn't angled except for the tops of the belt.

[SmartassNoob]

For turrets, yes, but ship armor is always in many internal layers. The external walls represent only some of the armor. Or is it that english ships really were just steel boxes with normal wooden house interior walls?

[SeaMonsterUK]

For turrets, yes, but ship armor is always in many internal layers. The external walls represent only some of the armor. Or is it that english ships really were just steel boxes with normal wooden house interior walls?

 

[SmartassNoob]

 

 Aha! Notice the vertical internal armored wall, marked as "1 3/4 in." In fact there's another one around the magazines. 

 

[SeaMonsterUK]

 Aha! Notice the internal armored wall, marked as "1 3/4 in." 

 

As is normal for most ships, but wouldn't stop anything from tier 7 to 8 from penetrating it at medium range.

[El2aZeR]

Pretty sure WG doesn't model internal compartmentalization. No ships would have "citadel belt armor" otherwise.

[Philipp_ab_exterminatore]

Think its about time we at least had a confirmed line order from WG. Ive had enough talking about them im ready to sail them

[mr3awsome]

Which of these three do you like best?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Webley_Mark]

Which of these three do you like best?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

K3. Cause, you have gun on the rear.

[SeaMonsterUK]

K3 is my favourite, but I3 is likely to have a better spread of shells due to the close proximity of all 3 turrets, at least in theory anyway.

[Mucker]

 

I have pondered over the secondary issue on British Battleships for a while now so I decided to compile a spreadsheet with the secondary performance of each BB in the game, an then put the expected performance of the RN Battleships in comparison to the competition.

 

Before we start, here are a few things to consider:

 

- Only HE secondaries are taken into account. As the consensus is that AP secondaries are very ineffective, the overall differences in potential damage should negligible.

 

- Only raw potential damage is considered.

 

- Numbers are calculated upon in game numbers. Guns not yet in game are either educated guesses or based upon close relatives already in game. When the numbers come from external sources (like navweaps) and a range is given (like RoF) I used the upper end, taking Warspite as guideline.

 

- The Numbers represent the heaviest broadside possible, i.e. 1/2 of the potential damage (which would occur with manual secondaries anyway). For each ship the heaviest secondary layout is listed, some ships (USN) lose secondaries in favor for more AA with the upgrade hulls.

 

- If you find errors or have alternative suggestions, feel free to point them out.

 

- damage calculation is pretty simple: # of barrels x RoF per barrel x shell damage.

 

- Of course, the damage in game will be vastly lower due to 1/3 damage rule, non penetrations for 0 damage, and generally poor hit ratio of the secondaries. Also different builds and captain skills have a huge influence.

 

 

Tier 3:

Here I assume Bellerophon as the tech tree ship. Secondaries are 16 x 4" (102 mm), thus 8 per broadside. Gun performance is estimated at 8 RPM with 1500 dmg per shell:

 

Bellerophon: DPM: 96000, Shells/min: 64

Kawachi: DPM: 132200, Shells/min: 72

Nassau: DPM: 132000, Shells/min: 120

Albert: DPM: 110000, Shells/min: 100

South Carolina: DPM: 121000, Shells/min: 110

 

At first glance, Bellerophon is expected to be the weakest ship of her tier, however she is not that far off Albert, which does fine with her setup. So a RoF buff must not be expected.

 

Tier 4

I took Colossus as the next ship in the tech tree. Same gun and setup as Bellerophon.

 

Colossus: DPM: 96000, Shells/min: 64

Myogi: DPM: 60000, Shells/min: 30

Ishizuchi: DPM: 66300, Shells/min: 51

Kaiser: DPM: 66000, Shells/min: 60

Wyoming: DPM: 123840, Shells/min: 69

Nikolai: DPM: 95000, Shells/min: 50

 

At Tier 4, the picture has changed significantly. With the same setup, Colossus is the second best among the bunch, German and Japanese BBs really suffered in the transition from Tier 3 to 4. With these numbers Colossus is perfectly fine.

 

Tier 5

Now it's the Dukes turn. Secondary setup is 2 x 3" (76,2 mm) and 12 x 6" (152 mm). I'm assuming that the 3" guns can cover large angles on both sides as a pair, so I count 2, with 6 x 6" completing the broadside. 3" gun performance is based on the 3" on Ishizuchi thus 17 RPM @ 1300 dm. The 6" are based on Warspite, thus 7,3 RPM @ 2200 dmg.

 

Iron Duke: DPM: 140560, Shells/min: 78

Kongo: DPM: 100800, Shells/min: 48

König: DPM: 91728, Shells/min: 71

New York: DPM: 123840, Shells/min: 69

Texas: DPM: 51408, Shells/min: 29

 

Iron Duke takes the lead at this tier, both in raw damage and shells fired. 

 

 

Tier 6

At Tier 6 we already have the well known Warspite with 4 x 4" DP (21,4 RPM @ 1500 dmg) and 4 x 6" (7,3 RPM @ 2200 dmg). I expect the tech tree QE to be based on Queen Elisabeth with her refit as top hull. This gives her 10 x 4,5" (114 mm) per broadside, with no 6" guns left. Gun performance is estimated at 12 RPM @ 1600 dmg.

 

Warspite: DPM: 192640, Shells/min: 115

QE: DPM: 192000, Shells/min: 120

Bayern: DPM: 137590, Shells/min: 106

New Mexico: DPM: 188856, Shells/min: 105

Arizona: DPM: 173376, Shells/min: 96

Fuso & Mutsu: DPM: 100800, Shells/min: 48

Dunkerque: DPM: 237500, Shells/min: 125

 

Tier 6 is tightly packed with Dunkerque edging out the top spot with a healthy margin. The RN vessels are certainly very competitive. No buffs are due at all.

 

Tier 7

At Tier 7 we have 2 possible RN entries, Nelson and Hood. Hood boast 8 x 4" DP per broadside (21,4 RPM @ 1500 dmg), Nelson gets 3 x 4,7" and 6 x 6" per broadside.

The 4,7 is estimated at 12 RPM @ 1700 dmg, the 6" are yet again based on Warspite.

 

Hood: DPM: 256800, Shells/min: 171

Nelson: DPM: 157560, Shells/min: 80

Scharnhorst: DPM: 281500, Shells/min: 201

Gneisenau (128 mm): DPM: 225000, Shells/min: 150

Colorado: DPM: 173376, Shells/min: 96

Nagato: DPM: 100800, Shells/min: 48

 

Scharnhorst and Hood clearly take the top spots here, Nelson trails Colorado by a bit. Nagato is the clear loser at this tier The Difference between Hood and Nelson is quite staggering, which is a nice selling point for possible (read: no brainer) premium ship.

 

Tier 8

At Tier 8 we also have 2 possible RN entries, KGV and Vanguard. Both have 16 x 5,25" (133 mm) DP secondaries, thus 8 per broadside. Performance is estimated at 8 RPM @ 1900 dmg for KGV, and 9 RPM at 1900 dmg for Vanguard (navweaps).

 

KGV: DPM: 121600, Shells/min: 64

Vanguard: DPM: 136800, Shells/min: 72

Tirpitz & Bismarck: DPM: 256056, Shells/min: 189

North Carolina: DPM: 180000, Shells/min: 100

Amagi: DPM: 201600, Shells/min: 96

 

At Tier 8, Both RN vessels suffer a lot, so one could think that a nice RPM buff is due to make them more competitive. OTOH Nagato is left to trail the the best ship in tier seven with almost 1/3 of the secondary HE power, but I'm aware that Nagato has a  AP component as well. Since both KGV and Vanguard do not have that. I'm really expecting some sort of RoF buff in both cases.

 

For Tier 9 and 10, I don't have knowledge on the blueprint layouts, so I leave them out for now. If you can provide me with them, i'll finish the list accordingly.

 

TL DR: Most of the RN Battleships should be fine secondary wise, just don't expect a Warspite at each and every tier, but Hood should be pretty awesome. Some adjustments at the high tiers may be necessary though.