Cruisers are becoming more and more pointless

[Fionia_DK]

I do agree its hard to see the role of cruisers.

 

Currently I play the German BB line, but I have Russian and German cruiser lines.

I did love to play cruiser, but now it is hard to play them. There are too many BBs.
 

In T9 and T10 it is next to impossible to have a good game (making damage). Thats why I changed to DDs and BBs. No more fun in cruisers. My Moskva is close to being sold and my Hindenburg is rarely out. The Hindenburg captain, now sails the Kurfürst.

 

A little while ago I made me some statistics. In T10 games the majority of cruisers are T8 cruisers. So I guess there is a lot of T10 cruisers laying in harbour and doing nothing, like mine. I guess if we could get all those CAs out again, WG didnt have to nerf DD's, BB's and CV's.

 

More T10 cruisers also mean, that T8 cruiser could play where they belong, in T8 and not getting forced in T10, just to become BB food.

 

Dear WG, make high tier CA's fun again! Give them Hydro/Radar and Defensive Air (as planned). Make them more agile. Even give them a defensive smoke to escape, not to camp in. Give them better secondaries. Better economy. Just give them what they need, to be fun playing again and the game will be a lot more interesting.

 

Fionia

[Dejiko_san]

If BB numbers per match are capped in order to increase the number of cruisers per match while including a CV this would mean that said CV will have a very hard match with so much AA around, specially with the AA in its current state.

 

If the number of cruisers are to be increased while including CVs in a match the AA should be decreased or at least reworked in order to let CVs do strikes else they will gravitate even more toward DD hunting.

[bloodynicknames]

If BB numbers per match are capped in order to increase the number of cruisers per match while including a CV this would mean that said CV will have a very hard match with so much AA around, specially with the AA in its current state.

 

If the number of cruisers are to be increased while including CVs in a match the AA should be decreased or at least reworked in order to let CVs do strikes else they will gravitate even more toward DD hunting.

 

nobody likes CVs to begin with so who cares.

 

[Spellfire40]

Or you have manned up to take down 3 BBs on your own. Been there, done that with my Furutaka... torps left and right on the two BBs there, and burning the last HP of the 3rd BB whilst turning towards the BB that was about to fire at me in turns. I even managed to decap the Myoko (who finally killed me off), which won us the game in the end (as our DD was capping). My most epic moment in WoWS.

 

I was so pissed when I realized that I didn't save that replay after I had to reinstall the game

 

As for the cruisers becoming pointless: Not at all. The only problem is that the German BBs makes life a lot harder for cruisers... if they get too close. Why not just punish them from distance?

 

That being said, I did love to take on a Bismark 1 vs 1 yesterday in close engagement with my Mogami. He shot me to pieces (only slightly over 100 hp left for me) whilst I slammed in two torpedo salvos into him, barely winning that duel.... I won't ever get into close combat with a Bismark again with my cruisers though

 

​Pleeeese do me a favor do not compare mid tir CA gameplay with end game..... its a totaly diferent game up there.

More often ist something like this :

[Sub_Eleven]

Dear WG, make high tier CA's fun again!

 

I think you have a point there. How many of the high tier silver cruisers (excluding tier 10's) are being played just to have fun? Not because they are grinding a line, but simply because they are a joy to play? I can imagine the premium cruisers get a lot more playtime then their silver cousins simply because they are better equiped to deal with the current state of the game.

 

This is true for myself at least although I only have the Kutuzov, no Atago (yet). The MK has a smoke screen to give it higher surviability and great balistics to rake in the coins. Atago has good stealth and a heal to make it last long enough to do some damage. Sure I can have a fun game in the Baltimore, but it's a whole lot less likely. Why play an UP wreck of a ship when I can play the MK (which doesn't care much at which tier it has to fight anyway) which is actually fun, trains y captains faster and prints me lots of credits? Silver high tier cruisers really feel like an endangered species.

[anonym_i2RxUTEMphjW]

A little idea: to make XP and money for damaging/sinking cruisers very little at the start of the game but rising with less and less time left (and write it somewhere clearly and visible). They still will be targeted as an easier prey but maybe some people would think if it's not better to shell some fat guys first.

Opposite should be with CVs - a lot of treasure at the start, minimal award at the end... tired with seeing everyone leaving the cap or even enemy's base, because oh look shiny CV at the edge of the map - and just got salty in a Strait game where a Myogi left my flank from the start, crossed the map and then hugged opposite edge while i was dancing in front of 5 ships in my bogatyr trying to burn anyone (only a CA down ) - and of course he went higher in XP than me as he had executed the CV when that other flank was empty...

[Smeggo]

 

I think you have a point there. How many of the high tier silver cruisers (excluding tier 10's) are being played just to have fun? Not because they are grinding a line, but simply because they are a joy to play? I can imagine the premium cruisers get a lot more playtime then their silver cousins simply because they are better equiped to deal with the current state of the game.

 

This is true for myself at least although I only have the Kutuzov, no Atago (yet). The MK has a smoke screen to give it higher surviability and great balistics to rake in the coins. Atago has good stealth and a heal to make it last long enough to do some damage. Sure I can have a fun game in the Baltimore, but it's a whole lot less likely. Why play an UP wreck of a ship when I can play the MK (which doesn't care much at which tier it has to fight anyway) which is actually fun, trains y captains faster and prints me lots of credits? Silver high tier cruisers really feel like an endangered species.

 

Sounds like a masterplan, if you want people to buy premiums or up to Tier 10. 

[dasCKD]

 

I think you have a point there. How many of the high tier silver cruisers (excluding tier 10's) are being played just to have fun? Not because they are grinding a line, but simply because they are a joy to play? I can imagine the premium cruisers get a lot more playtime then their silver cousins simply because they are better equiped to deal with the current state of the game.

 

Whilst personally I agree that Premium ships (exception being the Krappy Krim and the Prinz) are noticeably superior to their tech tree counterparts from tier 6 onward, I don't agree that regular ships being weaker than their premium is the reason people don't find them fun. I personally sortie with my ARP Myoko all the time, despite her being for all intents and purposes a Myoko, because I find her enjoyable. I wish I still had my Amagi, so I could go out and terrorize cruisers and other battleships in randoms. The problem, I believe, is a mechanical one. The goal of WoWs, at least discounting the competitive players, are to make it to the gems at the top of the tech trees and in WoWs, a captain is pivotal to the performance of a ship. A ship without a captain is so significantly weaker that in the highly dangerous higher tiers, a well trained captain is obligatory if you would want any level of success. This depends on the ship class of course, as an Amagi without a forth skill will suffer less than a Tashkent without a forth skill. Nevertheless, that captain is forced to move with the ship.

 

The issue is that game mechanics conflict with the desire to maintain an enjoyable ship. If you want to keep a silver ship effective, you either have to retrain a new captain for your silver ship or retrain a new captain for the higher tier ship. Neither is fun because you'll be costing your team more games than you would with a more powerful version of your ship. I think that far more people will play more non-t10 silver ships if WG can find a way to make the captain system so less restrictive. I plan to write a post on it later, but those are my thoughts on this matter.

[Spellfire40]

 

Sounds like a masterplan, if you want people to buy premiums or up to Tier 10. 

 

​Once upon a time there was a Mogami that was fun.....too bad that MK filled the same role and we cant have a compareble silver ship can we?

[S4h3L]

 

​Once upon a time there was a Mogami that was fun.....too bad that MK filled the same role and we cant have a compareble silver ship can we?

 

Chapayew?

[duoinvasion]

 

I think you have a point there. How many of the high tier silver cruisers (excluding tier 10's) are being played just to have fun? Not because they are grinding a line, but simply because they are a joy to play? I can imagine the premium cruisers get a lot more playtime then their silver cousins simply because they are better equiped to deal with the current state of the game.

 

This is true for myself at least although I only have the Kutuzov, no Atago (yet). The MK has a smoke screen to give it higher surviability and great balistics to rake in the coins. Atago has good stealth and a heal to make it last long enough to do some damage. Sure I can have a fun game in the Baltimore, but it's a whole lot less likely. Why play an UP wreck of a ship when I can play the MK (which doesn't care much at which tier it has to fight anyway) which is actually fun, trains y captains faster and prints me lots of credits? Silver high tier cruisers really feel like an endangered species.

 

the zao is an immense joy to play imo, you just HE everything to death with impunity. That's why I see so many of them when I play mine.

Zao just doesn't care about anything, it just spams HE and print damage left and right

[IceyJones]

well...yesterday i decided to play the dmitry again to proceed a bit towards moskva.

only 2 cruisers per team + 6 BBs + 4DDs

lived until minute 17 into the battle. 170k damage, 4 kills

2 DDs, 1 cruiser, 1 BB

 

unfortunately team throwed the victory but.....cruisers are NOT pointless, even in such a setup......baby BBs are! that camp in a cap with full health (our montana in this battle for example), not charging into the remaining hipper and iowa. specially the hipper was a oneshot for the montana as only 5k HP left. we lost by points, even we were in front 5 minutes to battle end

 

 

[Sub_Eleven]

 

the zao is an immense joy to play imo, you just HE everything to death with impunity. That's why I see so many of them when I play mine.

Zao just doesn't care about anything, it just spams HE and print damage left and right

 

Hence I excluded tier 10's. Cruisers get a last powercreep at tier 10, so they fare better then the lower high tier ships. Always being top tier in a match also helps a lot. The main problem lies with tiers 7 to 9 in combination with the current meta.

 

well...yesterday i decided to play the dmitry again to proceed a bit towards moskva.

only 2 cruisers per team + 6 BBs + 4DDs

lived until minute 17 into the battle. 170k damage, 4 kills

2 DDs, 1 cruiser, 1 BB

 

unfortunately team throwed the victory but.....cruisers are NOT pointless, even in such a setup......baby BBs are! that camp in a cap with full health (our montana in this battle for example), not charging into the remaining hipper and iowa. specially the hipper was a oneshot for the montana as only 5k HP left. we lost by points, even we were in front 5 minutes to battle end

 

 

 

Well if you had a fun game, good for you I guess. The majority however finds it very hard to have fun right now in high tier cruisers. Especially the USN ones are UP and they are fighting an uphill battle with the battleboat heavy matchmaking. I agree with you cruisers are not entirely useless, but they are under par by a large margin. If nothing is done, we end up with 2 ship classes (or 1 when destroyers get their final nail in their coffin). That's not an exciting prospect to me.

[Exocet6951]

well...yesterday i decided to play the dmitry again to proceed a bit towards moskva.

only 2 cruisers per team + 6 BBs + 4DDs

lived until minute 17 into the battle. 170k damage, 4 kills

2 DDs, 1 cruiser, 1 BB

 

unfortunately team throwed the victory but.....cruisers are NOT pointless, even in such a setup......baby BBs are! that camp in a cap with full health (our montana in this battle for example), not charging into the remaining hipper and iowa. specially the hipper was a oneshot for the montana as only 5k HP left. we lost by points, even we were in front 5 minutes to battle end

 

 

 

You used the most flexible (and easily arguably the best) tier9 cruiser with a great radar, the best range and accuracy to try to prove that point.

I could just as easily used a recent game in a Hipper where a BB 20km away shot over mountains to remove half my hp in a single salvo to prove the contrary.

 

In the end, I did my best and ended up doing a respectable 50k damage thanks to a suicidal Bismark thinking torpedoes were not a thing, but the fact is that I could have just used a Bismark, and have been almost as fast and more decisive in the battle, all while keeping my hydro search.

 

[StringWitch]

T7+ cruisers are painful, at least at this time when most things shooting you will be (German) BBs, and at that tier they'll wipe your health away unless you're constantly doing loops all the time to avoid shells (and sometimes even if you are), but why go to that effort when the other classes are far easier and safer to play, and have more control over engagements? I personally feel the problem with this game is AP damage increasing exponentially with increased gun calibre. If BBs were more accurate/consistent but did lower damage per salvo (with more % dmg from overpens and pens but less max dmg from citadels, compared to how it is currently), I'd be a lot happier with the situation.

 

At T2-5 cruisers can generally expect to survive the first few salvoes of a BB encounter and have a chance to achieve something. Yesterday I had an awful game in Mogami (and my last before unlocking Ibuki, whose damage repair might make me less salty, we'll see) where I died in 3 BB salvoes trying to do anything besides wander around shooting 1 salvo every 30 seconds at max range to avoid their ire. Then I enjoyed an equally bad game in Marblehead, but one where I actually did a few useful things thanks to T5 BB dispersion being out on a quest to literally expand its horizons.

[anonym_u6sYtyvyHdEJ]

A DD gets 5 and more BB hits (no matter AP or HE) and over 90% of them cruises still at 40knots til the end and DD's have Klingon cloaking devices - still invisible at 2km range - PURE UNREAL NONSENSE. With more & more BB's in the battles playing Cruisers is sometimes frustrating. BTW, I still love my Aoba.

[anonym_u6sYtyvyHdEJ]

DD's can see thru their own smoke screen that is around them - that makes WoW a childs game. 

[AgarwaenME]

A DD gets 5 and more BB hits (no matter AP or HE) and over 90% of them cruises still at 40knots til the end and DD's have Klingon cloaking devices - still invisible at 2km range - PURE UNREAL NONSENSE. With more & more BB's in the battles playing Cruisers is sometimes frustrating. BTW, I still love my Aoba.

 

DDs aren't invisible at 2km ranges. You're just a mix of blind and unattentive.

[AgarwaenME]

DD's can see thru their own smoke screen that is around them - that makes WoW a childs game. 

 

Actually they can't. And being so clueless makes you either 8 years old, or senile.

[Damanta]

DD's can see thru their own smoke screen that is around them - that makes WoW a childs game. 

 

False.

If they are fully in their smoke they need others to spot for them.

[Aotearas]

 

A DD gets 5 and more BB hits (no matter AP or HE) and over 90% of them cruises still at 40knots til the end and DD's have Klingon cloaking devices - still invisible at 2km range - PURE UNREAL NONSENSE. With more & more BB's in the battles playing Cruisers is sometimes frustrating. BTW, I still love my Aoba.

 

DD's can see thru their own smoke screen that is around them - that makes WoW a childs game.

 

No they can't.

 

Read up on the spotting mechanics. I assume calling this a child's game means that you feel mature enough to differentiate yourself from such, I hope that comes backed up with sufficient language and reading comprehension skills so you ought have little difficulty in learning how the game works and how it doesn't.

[len_marksman]

cruisers are great at lower tear levels but at high tear they are easy prey for these new german bbs  and why do they insist on this 5 bb crap it makes me wonder do they realy want us to play cruisers because the way its going will just be the odd cv dds and the mighty battleships how boring will that be

[Runner357]

After getting the Zao a few days ago I'll have to admit that the poster who told me it was the best T10 cruiser was absolute right. It's sooooooo good it's ridiculous

[Ph3lan]

I have always been a BB and cruiser player in WoWS and while I mostly play BBs my stats are considerably better in cruisers. It is true that lately I have seen a lot more BBs and a lot less cruisers than usual, but I guess this is due to the recent introduction of the German BBs. I expect the numbers to change considerable as soon as the RN cruisers come out. I agree that cruisers in general are harder to play than BBs, but this has always been the case. Cruiser simply have a very high skill ceiling. They can do extremely well when played properly and fail miserably when not used as intended. The slightest mistake is punished instantly and in the case of the lower tier ones irreversibly, while BBs can get away with a lot more thanks to their armor and HP regen/HP pool. However, cruisers are way more versatile than BBs, can react to changes of the battlefield much easier and faster and if you manage to stay alive, the damage output is awesome.

That being said, this is just my personal opinion and this doesn't mean that I am right We will make sure to include this feedback in our weekly report. 

[len_marksman]

cruisers are great at lower tear levels but at high tear they are easy prey for these new german bbs  and why do they insist on this 5 bb crap it makes me wonder do they realy want us to play cruisers because the way its going will just be the odd cv dds and the mighty battleships how boring will that be