Bring back the CV platoons?

[thisheep]

Hello guys!

 

I'm thisheep, huge players of IJN aircrafts carriers and leader of the french clan UFR. I open my first topic in the english speaking forum to translate a debate we had 3 weeks ago on the french forum. 

 

Before categorizing me as a CV fanboy who is asking a buff of his favorite ships, let me try to expose this CV platoon issue. We all know the current situation of the carriers in World of Warships. To my mind they are the more powerfull ships against no brain players and a standard lemming FFA team. On the other hand, as soon as you put some very smart players in the opponents team, a CV can become the more useless ship of the fleet. The clan wars and the past Team Battles proved my point. 

 

I would like to see in the future a new game mode, like a FFA with a ELO system matchmaking. I can not count anymore the number of unbalanced game lost or win in 5 minutes. I hate that kind of battles where a team obliterate the other one. But I fear we will have to wait a while before seeing a matchmaking based of the players skill/level. 

 

I truely think that the return of the carriers platoon could improve the quality of many FFA battles. We all know that carriers are powerfull. They are powerfull because people do not play together and I do not blame them because the current system do not reward any teamplay. We should win credits/xp in putting a smoke on an ally, detect torps, spotting ennemies and destroy aircraft attacking an ally. This is not how the game works today so maybe we should try to force people to play together against the powerfull CV platoon! 

 

These are the conditions of my idea:

 

• A simple try for the beginning with only the tiers 8-9-10.
• 2 CV max in platoon.
• A CV platoon could not face 2 CV who are not in a platoon. 
• Same tiers CV.
• Maybe one US and one IJN in the platoon. 

 

These are the main arguments FOR the return of the CV:

 

• They will be very few battles with CV platoon.
• It could bring back from the dead the CV player population.
• The CV platoon could educate, teach and increase the skill of many carriers who do not play anymore because they fear the big CV players and the insults from their own team when they are losing. 
• The influence of these CV platoon could be huge of course, but same as a 3 DD platoon in a domination mode.
• Last argument: Equality, all other ships can platoon together!

 

These are the argument AGAISNT the CV platoon: 

 

• A platoon of ships with even more firepower and more influence if no coordination in both teams.
• Many DD player will leave the queue as soon they will see carriers (like cowards in ranked!)
• The CV could be nerf or the AA improve to balance this idea. 
• The game will be only a dual between these platoons.

 

Before voting, please remember that it is just an idea. I perfectly understand that we can disagree. 

 

Here the link of the original topic in french: http://forum.worldofwarships.eu/index.php?/topic/57459-pour-des-divisions-en-cv/#topmost

 

The results of the french poll:

 

• 23 yes
• 39 no

 

Thanks for reading and voting! 

[22cm]

No. Just no.  They were allowed for a short time, first when the carriers were introduced,  but coordinated attacks from 2 carriers can sink any ship in 1 wave. Will never happen. 

[thisheep]

No. Just no.  They were allowed for a short time, first when the carriers were introduced,  but coordinated attacks from 2 carriers can sink any ship in 1 wave. Will never happen. 

 

The game is not the same anymore!

Do not forget you will have a CV platoon to protect you as well. Do no think either than a CV platoon can come at the midlle of the fleet and sink you! Look at the current clan wars: Even with 2 very good CV players, their planes cannot reach their target if the fleet stick together! 

[NoirLotus]

thisheep : you are forgetting one argument against CV divisions.

 

Your proposal is to try this in T8+, but WG has changed MM so that at these tiers, you can only have 1 CV per team.

[22cm]

I remember seeing you in randoms, mostly playing in division. A division of good players that includes a carrier that coordinates their strategy is already way too hard to counter,  almost impossible.  Carriers should not be allowed to division at all,  period. 

Also the way MM treats divisions is totally unballanced right now and should be adressed. 

[CLyDeThaMonKeY]

No, just NO.

 

Yesterday, me and some friends was divisioning up for the last battle of the night. After a bunch of high tier games we decided to have fun instead and play T4.

Another tried to get into the same battle as us also but when we got into the battle we quickly realised me and one of my friends was both in CVs, and both on the same team.

The enemy carriers had no chance in hell dropping any strikes and we dominated both air and sea.

Me in my Langley and my friend in his Hosho wiped out all of the enemy CVs planes and our division buddy in a DD wiped the carriers themselfes out.

Our CVs had a little over 200k damage combined. 1 kills each I think while the limping ships was taken out by our friend in his Yubari.

 

Too sum it all up. 2 CVs on comms together is deadly as (Sensured) and should never ever be a thing in WoWs.

[_Alie_]

 The CV could be nerf or the AA improve to balance this idea. 

 

[JymmBlack]

Imho, while i would fear such divisions, it would be fair to give it a try. I see no reason why CV players should be punished just because other players in other ships are unable to coordinate and bring a steel/fire wall to break their assault. But if doing so, WG should also give a better reward to planes kill made by ships, would be nice to reward players who manage to improve their AA and protect their team.

[XbodzioXplX]

I adored playing CV. But since 2 last patches I find them unplayable. I'm talking about economy (credits, XP). Ok, I tried mostly the US ones.

CVs are hard to play - you need to see whole map. You need to be where your team need you most. You have a lot of squadrons to control so it is not just "pew pew" playing. It is more like RTS then FPP (yes, it is not a discovery).

 

What I like about CV divisions:

- coordinating the moves

- one could go "fighter setup", the other "strike setup" - so more tactics there

 

What I dislike:

- CV snipe - it would be a normal scenario

- take a unicum in BB and in CV; BB could have 60-65% win ratio, while CV 60-65% - CV can go everywhere so if your team sucks CV division could still recap or kill enemies on the other side of map

- random games are mostly about "Me, Myself and I" - ships go like a chickens without head and they are easy prey for CV

- CVs destroy the Domination Battles - DDs and CA are afraid to go for a cap and since planes can just "fly aside" just for spot that mode would be even harder (more camping)

 

My conclusion - yes to CV division but only in Team Battles, not in Randoms.

[xXx_Blogis_xXx]

Sorry but NO , in alpha we was can do 3x cv div , even 2x cv div can do way to much , so game would be way not balanced , so this not gona happen

[Takru]

On the other hand, as soon as you put some very smart players in the opponents team, a CV can become the more useless ship of the fleet.

 

Point being that you require ONE good CV player on your team vs A WHOLE LOT OF good anything-but-CV players on the other team.

[Azalgor]

 You ask for CV divisions, but they try to remove CV instead, over 20 min in cap for a single game on a TX CV (any time) thanks to that they limited them to 1 vs 1 on tiers 8+... just because... Strange that where the AA is somewhat dull (t3-t7) they go 2 v 2, and where it is strong they say 2 CV is OP. Logic is strong in them...At the moment there is no point in even grinding CV past tier 7 in order to play them without 20 min game search.

 Id want the chance of no CV vs 1-2 like it once was back in CBT back, atleast makes a challenge and pushes people to play together...But what am i saying, todays comunity doesnt need CVs to bother them while they are camping from a corner...

[Marlekin]

God no.

The team with divisioned CV's working together always seemed to win against the team with some randomed CV's. I've seen enough fighter CV + bomber CV cleaning house, thank you very much. 

 

This could be a thing in clan wars/team battles tho, when those game modes arrive. 

[VC381]

Which part of CV division will only fight other CV division are you guys not reading? This is a great idea!

 

Unfortunately it would force everyone else to group around their CVs and share protection until one CV division won the airspace, then that team would go on to win the game. Oh wait, that would be realistic!

 

And to be honest I would like that. Not every game, but from time to time it would be cool. Some games no CVs, BBs go nuts and slug it out. Other games CV 2v2 divisions everyone else escorts. It would actually bring a lot of variety to the game!

 

But the negativity so far essentially proves it won't happen anyway.

[xXx_Blogis_xXx]

God no.

The team with divisioned CV's working together always seemed to win against the team with some randomed CV's. I've seen enough fighter CV + bomber CV cleaning house, thank you very much. 

 

This could be a thing in clan wars/team battles tho, when those game modes arrive. 

 

still no , 2 good cv players lets say can do 400k dmg or more diff by game , and lets say ca players ? 50k+ dmg and bb hmm if good 100k ? still good cv player can do like 2-3 players

[Marlekin]

Unfortunately it would force everyone else to group around their CVs and share protection until one CV division won the airspace, then that team would go on to win the game. Oh wait, that would be realistic!

 

This sounds incredibly dull if you ask me. 

[The_SDM]

Nope, two CVs who play together are to much. 

[lord_darth_vader_bg]

Yes.

One tier difference between ships in division would be fine. And without restrictions ... if you wish 2 US or 2 IJN or combine 1 US + 1 IJN carrier.

[ToreDL87]

What about 2 CV Platoon of only lower tier put in higher tier match then?

We`d have matches with 2x Hiryu`s vs 1xMidway or 2x Ryujo`s vs 1x Enterprise for example.

Or 2x Hiryu`s vs 2x Ranger`s in a Tier X match, they`ll have to contend with each other as well as the Tier X Battleships and Cruisers.

Lower tier carriers and planes take less damage before they go down, with the reward of more coordinated effort.

Balances it out I should think?

 

We`re several CV players who just want to cooperate, to many of us it don`t much matter what we are facing, and of course we want it to be fair to others.

[22cm]

 

This sounds incredibly dull if you ask me. 

 

Yes, that s funny only for the CV players, but they re also dull enough to understand this.

[Psychocouac]

No. Never ever ever ever.

[ToreDL87]

Tier X BB`s can go Division (which is fun), and the stats are generally something like firepower worth 30k+ damage per salvo (per ship) anywhere inside a 23km+ (per ship, some up to 30km range) circle every 25-30 seconds, 10km secondary range (per ship), 200% increased anti air capabilities (per ship).
^those numbers>x3
But you`re afraid of the 8 (max) paper plane B5N Kate`s who get through the AA, outputting a combined 15000HP MAX TOTAL (because of suppression) at a rate of once every 5 minutes around 2-3 times per match (because CV`s have limited planes) because one match lasts 20 mins max, 5 mins to launch, prep and coordinate strike, and thats IF, IF the torps hit, IF the CV`s face no American fighter CV (check what I suggested earlier), IF they manage stay out of main gun range (which as I mentioned, is up to 30km) IF they get through AA Cruiser picket lines etc.

Of course a lone BB is gna have a bit of a problem with that, but all the more reason to stay and move with the team isnt it?
For those unknowing to the fact, T7 CV`s has, because of the nature of how an aircraft works as a weapon, far less dmg output per round than one Tier X DD, and we can usually see the planes coming from a long ways off.

I see solid enough K/D rates with anything EXCEPT carriers on the stats of most of those that say naye.
So I can see why some subscribers of this game wouldnt even want CV`s in the game what so ever.
The problem is though, it`s not just a game for captains of DD`s, BB`s and CA`s.

[Tigdam]

I would like to see it happen again, always was fun to be a part of and if they are going to adjust divisions, I want the level difference to be changed. Would love to bring the Mikas into a tier 5/6 game again =3

[YouBetterLeave]

yes, i wanted to have CV platoons since i started playing them. its just so unpleasing when you get a second CV in your team who doesnt understand how to play and just rushes his fighter groups into the enemys and looses them all, then i cant do anything because the enemys group their fighters, shoot down all my bombers when i try to engage anything and i cant destroy their fighters because they outnumber me 3-1...

[tsachev]

I agree to have CV platoons in one condition - every ship in the game to have defensive air fire for 2 minutes with 6 times increase of damage per second. This will be fair.