Different playstyles can ruin the games' fun

[Dr_Knolle]

Hey WG!

 

It is really hard for me, to think about a name for this thread, but this seems to be fitting.

 

But first things first. I have been playing a lot lately and I reallized, most of my teammates prefer to wait 7+ minutes at the start of the match before they do anything. That mainly results in a loss due to other team getting all caps and taking tactically good positions on the map. Of course a match isn`t won in the first minutes, but it is possible to get into a really good position for the later stages of the game if there is a sufficiently strong battlegroup pushing aggressively.

 

I know, waiting at the beginning of the match is a legitimate tactic. But not everyone likes this approach.

 

So, if anyone playing like this reads this: I don't want to insult anyone, I just don't like that playstyle. Feel free to keep playing like this.

 

For those who don't, a more balanced matchmaking concerning playstyles would be great.

 

[edited]

 

I really hope there is a way to make something like this possible.

 

But all the same: The game is at a great state at the moment. Keep up the awesome work!

 

Greetz!

 

[_x_Acheron_x_]

There is only 1 tactic.

 

Lemming train.

[Devantejah]

There is only 1 tactic.

 

Lemming train.

 

We call it "fleet" here.

[KaraMon]

There is only 1 tactic.

 

Lemming train. fleet

 

Fixed

[Pekoe_Darjeeling]

Always push. Never camp. Camping is for people who can't push.

[_GrimLock__]

There is only 1 tactic.

 

Lemming train.

 

With u in the lead?

[AnotherDuck]

When it comes to enjoyable gameplay, lemming trains > camping.

 

Except if it's on Two Brothers, both teams go clockwise, and you're in a battleship, so you're stuck the entire match without targets.

[loppantorkel]

Except if it's on Two Brothers, both teams go clockwise, and you're in a battleship, so you're stuck the entire match without targets.

I've got a nice solution to this

[chaosrealm93]

Hey WG!

 

It is really hard for me, to think about a name for this thread, but this seems to be fitting.

 

But first things first. I have been playing a lot lately and I reallized, most of my teammates prefer to wait 7+ minutes at the start of the match before they do anything. That mainly results in a loss due to other team getting all caps and taking tactically good positions on the map. Of course a match isn`t won in the first minutes, but it is possible to get into a really good position for the later stages of the game if there is a sufficiently strong battlegroup pushing aggressively.

 

I know, waiting at the beginning of the match is a legitimate tactic. But not everyone likes this approach.

 

So, if anyone playing like this reads this: I don't want to insult anyone, I just don't like that playstyle. Feel free to keep playing like this.

 

For those who don't, a more balanced matchmaking concerning playstyles would be great.

 

[edited]

 

I really hope there is a way to make something like this possible.

 

But all the same: The game is at a great state at the moment. Keep up the awesome work!

 

Greetz!

 

 

will you make an exception for my favorite boat; the zao?

 

its most effective when positioned 18km+ away from the action

[The_SDM]

I've got a nice solution to this

 

CVs? 

[loppantorkel]

 

CVs? 

 

No. I know a secret passage

[Deckeru_Maiku]

 

No. I know a secret passage

 

Sooooo... DDs & Cruisers all go clockwise and BBs all go through the middle? Mightn't that get bit tight there?

 

Would be spectacular, though...

[Admiral_noodle]

But pushing usually leads to defeat. So does camping. What's important is map control and knowing how to "press" the enemy.

[Darky_007]

But pushing usually leads to defeat. So does camping. What's important is map control and knowing how to "press" the enemy.

 

well there is difference from camping and inactive

I have no problem with camping, but with inactive players who hide in corners and don't participate in battle until stay alone

 

[AnotherDuck]

I've got a nice solution to this

 

I ignored them, and turned around to delay the enemies. Managed to get a fair amount of damage done. Wasn't enough, but it did help us lose at a slower pace.

 

The ships in my team pushing in front got obliterated by the enemy, far ahead of where I could do anything about, even had I gone with them. It's not like Two Brothers is a map where you can just shoot over the islands...

 

And of course they decided to call me and a Tirpitz retarded (forgot if it was one of the dead guys or not, but someone who got below me on the scoreboard), despite not saying anything when we announced our intentions long before, with no objections.

[EsaTuunanen]

 

Sooooo... DDs & Cruisers all go clockwise and BBs all go through the middle? Mightn't that get bit tight there?

 

Would be spectacular, though...

How about first around half map and then through middle?

[Venatacia]

My last battle was like a load of headless chickens sailing around. They pushed to hard and failed after the afk'ers decided to show up and ships swap sides of the map because you know, peeps like their favorite side. We could of won though but some ships thought it was good to sail off on their own and perish to the songs of the mermaids.

[AgarwaenME]

There is only 1 tactic.

 

Lemming train.

 

Or hang back for 15 minutes then come forward hugging the border only to eat a full spread of torps because it was too hard for you to find Q or E, and then call the person that sank you a hacker  

[AnotherDuck]

Or hang back for 15 minutes then come forward hugging the border only to eat a full spread of torps because it was too hard for you to find Q or E, and then call the person that sank you a hacker  

 

Shh, quiet! Don't spread my Super Secret Strategy^™ to the common rabble!

[loppantorkel]

How about first around half map and then through middle?

Much more interesting than waiting for another obvious victory. ...but they could have smoked the channel and brought some support to improve their chances. Still interesting to see.

[Tungstonid]

Hey WG!

 

It is really hard for me, to think about a name for this thread, but this seems to be fitting.

 

But first things first. I have been playing a lot lately and I reallized, most of my teammates prefer to wait 7+ minutes at the start of the match before they do anything. That mainly results in a loss due to other team getting all caps and taking tactically good positions on the map. Of course a match isn`t won in the first minutes, but it is possible to get into a really good position for the later stages of the game if there is a sufficiently strong battlegroup pushing aggressively.

 

I know, waiting at the beginning of the match is a legitimate tactic. But not everyone likes this approach.

 

So, if anyone playing like this reads this: I don't want to insult anyone, I just don't like that playstyle. Feel free to keep playing like this.

 

For those who don't, a more balanced matchmaking concerning playstyles would be great.

 

[edited]

 

I really hope there is a way to make something like this possible.

 

But all the same: The game is at a great state at the moment. Keep up the awesome work!

 

Greetz!

 

 

So your solution to the "problem" is that WG tracks the movement of every single player during the game (or the beginning of the game) and use a certain sample size of every player to sort them into groups like "camper", "not so camper-ish", "pushy" and "suicide"?

I think even if it would be a thing the setup for such an algorithm and the evaluation is not as easy as you think just because the behaviour of players is not consistent. They are also influenced by e.g. the mm (bottom/mid/top tier, lots of DDs, ...) and fellow and captains (camping top tiers, pushing divisions, ...) as well as the enemy (lemming fleet yes/no, ...). And what about the players who are smart enough not to drive into the entire enemy fleet in the beginning of a game but rather turn around which might be detected as camping as well? So a "camper" in one match can as well be the suicide pusher in the next, to exaggerate a bit. In the end I guess every player will land somewhere around "pushy" and "not so camper-ish" so there might be little to no use at all for such a system.

If such a system is implemented what do you think should be done concerning the mm? Only campers vs campers or more like distributing the different kinds of playstyles more evenly so players might change for the better or worse?

And what about divisions which will make such a system even more complicated? Use the best/worst attribute just like it is done with tiers? Not allowing divisions of players with different attributes? Pay attention to the attributes of division players to create  an evenly match up? The least thing you get is an increased queue time for divisions.

 

As stated above I don't think such a system is both easy to implement and useful. Just because you can't detect all the necessary factors and even if you did that the system would need too many ressources to run for that little bit of "comfort" it brings to a small part of the playerbase.

[philjd]

How about first around half map and then through middle?

 

Wow, Surigao Straits anyone..... I doubt those guys will try that tactic again....

[_GrimLock__]

 

Wow, Surigao Straits anyone..... I doubt those guys will try that tactic again....

 

One does not simply enters the vag*** of doom!

[Dr_Knolle]

But pushing usually leads to defeat. So does camping. What's important is map control and knowing how to "press" the enemy.

 

Yeah, that's what I meant. I just don't think that either camping somewhere or the lemming train are the only viable playstyles. Normally the starting-locations create kinda good battlegroups. If a whole group pushes, let's say, 2BB, 1DD and a cruiser starts to push one side of the map, or one cap, they can survive long enough to defend and if they cap uncontested, they can turn and support other battlegroups.

 

Of course, success depends on each players' skill, but playing like this, is really fun if the battlegroup is as described and working together well.

 

I had the pleasure to play several games on the weekend, in which I got those teammates. For me it was some of the most enjoyable playtime in a while.

 

[Dr_Knolle]

 

So your solution to the "problem" is that WG tracks the movement of every single player during the game (or the beginning of the game) and use a certain sample size of every player to sort them into groups like "camper", "not so camper-ish", "pushy" and "suicide"?

I think even if it would be a thing the setup for such an algorithm and the evaluation is not as easy as you think just because the behaviour of players is not consistent. They are also influenced by e.g. the mm (bottom/mid/top tier, lots of DDs, ...) and fellow and captains (camping top tiers, pushing divisions, ...) as well as the enemy (lemming fleet yes/no, ...). And what about the players who are smart enough not to drive into the entire enemy fleet in the beginning of a game but rather turn around which might be detected as camping as well? So a "camper" in one match can as well be the suicide pusher in the next, to exaggerate a bit. In the end I guess every player will land somewhere around "pushy" and "not so camper-ish" so there might be little to no use at all for such a system.

If such a system is implemented what do you think should be done concerning the mm? Only campers vs campers or more like distributing the different kinds of playstyles more evenly so players might change for the better or worse?

And what about divisions which will make such a system even more complicated? Use the best/worst attribute just like it is done with tiers? Not allowing divisions of players with different attributes? Pay attention to the attributes of division players to create  an evenly match up? The least thing you get is an increased queue time for divisions.

 

As stated above I don't think such a system is both easy to implement and useful. Just because you can't detect all the necessary factors and even if you did that the system would need too many ressources to run for that little bit of "comfort" it brings to a small part of the playerbase.

 

Thank you for that detailled answer about your concerns.

 

About the divisions: If you give every division a certain score based on several values, and give a range in which those divisions can be matched in the same game, in don't think it would be all to complicated to implement.

 

About that algorithm: Of course that would not be easy. But as every other MM tool in use in WOWS or other multiplayer-games, after some time the data collected would lead to a normal behaviour of the matchmaker, I think. Playstyles differ from game to game, I know, but overall, after let's say 150 matches, an indication about how the specific player is playing, can be seen.

 

Matchmaking should put every playstyle against each other. As I said in the first post, this is not about telling anyone, his playstyle sucks or anything, I am just not as happy as I could be about MM at the moment. These are just my thoughts about ways how to maybe make it more enjoyable for players like me. Interestingly, most answers so far are about the lemming-fleet. And that's the type of playstyle I was talking about, I don't enjoy.