First German BB Leak - STOP THIS PAPER "WHAT-IF" UPGRADE IDIOCY!

[KHETTIFER]

Hey OP don't get to upset, the RN will be utter garbage when its eventually implemented, mark my words.

[CommissionerJan]

 

Could be but also the amor values a off by 90mm so not sure what is going on. 

 

But I hate this fantasy upgrade for KAISER. KOENIG will probably be the same story. That sucks big time.

 

I presume some modeler decided, hey we went all out with Myogi right, and then Yolo'd all over the Kaiser.  Although I must admit, it doesn't look half bad. 

 

 

Myogi (also a t4) is essentially a blueprint design, so obviously all her 'upgrades' are completely hypothetical.

But since she has to fight t6 ships sometimes, it's not a bad idea, and I can't really say that what they did with Myogi is unreasonable, if you compare it to what was actually done to refit the Kongos, Fusos (and Ises)

 

Same for Amagi. She was obviously never finished as a battlecruiser, but assuming a modernization along the same lines as the Nagatos does not strike me as unrealistic.

 

And ther are alreaady more than a few ships in the game that go beyond blueprint and straight into 'secret archive napkin drawing'. . .and if we look at WoT, WG is certainly not afraid of blueprints, one-off projects, prototypes and design studies.

[creamgravy]

Huh? Myogi lost it's 4th turret after a collision with Musashi in 1943. A pagoda mast, built entirely of toilet rolls, was installed then. 

During the 2nd Battle of Leyte Gulf Myogi sank Iowa with half a cheese sandwich but the Soviet pacific fleet quickly crushed any IJN resistance. She was taken back to Moscow where the pagoda mast was used to broadcast the David Hasselhoff song "Looking for Freedom" all over the USSR, leading to world peace.

 

It's the most famous ship in the world!

[Admiral_H_Nelson]

Huh? Myogi lost it's 4th turret after a collision with Musashi in 1943. A pagoda mast, built entirely of toilet rolls, was installed then. 

During the 2nd Battle of Leyte Gulf Myogi sank Iowa with half a cheese sandwich but the Soviet pacific fleet quickly crushed any IJN resistance. She was taken back to Moscow where the pagoda mast was used to broadcast the David Hasselhoff song "Looking for Freedom" all over the USSR, leading to world peace.

 

It's the most famous ship in the world!

 

Nice one! That made me laugh!

[1MajorKoenig]

Hey OP don't get to upset, the RN will be utter garbage when its eventually implemented, mark my words.

 

Not sure if that makes me feel better but thank you for trying :-)

[Combat_Hamster]

Huh? Myogi lost it's 4th turret after a collision with Musashi in 1943. A pagoda mast, built entirely of toilet rolls, was installed then. 

During the 2nd Battle of Leyte Gulf Myogi sank Iowa with half a cheese sandwich but the Soviet pacific fleet quickly crushed any IJN resistance. She was taken back to Moscow where the pagoda mast was used to broadcast the David Hasselhoff song "Looking for Freedom" all over the USSR, leading to world peace.

 

It's the most famous ship in the world!

I thought she was sunk by a  series  of 20 ton out of date pork pies  dropped  by 617  sqdn....actually  the upgrade  does look a  bit odd.....looking at  where  the  AA directors  are...seemingly 2  mounted en echelon to the wing  turrets,  I wonder how  their sensitive  equipment  would have worked  the first  time the wing turrets  fired on an  extreme  bearing... I actually think  that if  the KM had  been able to keep  the HSF  they would have scrapped everything before  the Koenigs  before WW2 as not being worth the effort,  perhaps  the Koenigs would  have  been modded a la Andrea  Doria....who knows..

[byronicasian]

I also just noticed the leaked value of the main belt , 265mm is the exact median thickness given the variance of the main belt. You have thicknesses varying from 350mm-180mm. Total variance of 170mm. Half of that is 85mm. 350mm less 85 is 265. Could be a sign of a new port stat display method once armor view comes out, or the Chinese leaker thought median thickness is a more useful stat?

 

http://i.imgur.com/xJZuOZH.jpg.

 

 

[Admiral_noodle]

Speculation of what will actually be delivered aside a lot of navies are simply going to have *gaps* in the tech trees because of historical reasons. The German BBs might well be such an example. I always thought (when making up my own German BB tree a while ago) that tier IV-VI would be a problem. With Tirpitz at tier 8 I can bet what will come at tier 9-10, the Germans had plenty of daft H class BBs on paper.

 

Similarly Tier 7 wasn't hard for me to fill, and neither was tier III given there were plenty of dreadnoughts to choose from.

 

But tier V... well all the tier V-VI BBs are modernised dreadnoughts. Germany, stripped of her fleet after WW1 simply didn't have them. So what to do? "What if" scenarios are the only thing I was able to think of to fill the gap when I was making fantasy tech trees. Certainly if the ships were to be at all competetive given CVs start to appear at tier IV.

 

My "fantasy RN" BB line has a couple of paper ships/what ifs too, but at higher tier...

 

In the end I don't mind paper ships/what ifs. There is a nice balance of "real" and "what if" to satisfy me anyway.

[Todger_Fairmile]

The only way you can avoid the upgrades you hate so much is to eliminate carriers from the game. Now, since that's not going to happen, deal with it. No one will force you to upgrade to the later hulls capable of fighting off airplanes, or having more hp. You are free to keep the historical hulls. Of course in many battles you will be spending extra time as an artificial reef, but that is your choice.

[Takeda92]

Not sure why AA at that tier is of any importance. Myogi and Wyoming, you have the better AA at tier 4, are performing worse than Arkansas and Nikolai who has the worse AA of them.

[ColonelPete]

Different playerbase.

[JapLance]

Not sure why AA at that tier is of any importance. Myogi and Wyoming, you have the better AA at tier 4, are performing worse than Arkansas and Nikolai who has the worse AA of them.

 

Really? Are you comparing the regular BBs that all potato players can use to a Beta player exclusive ship and one of the most OP ships at its tier of the whole game?

[Admiral_noodle]

 

Really? Are you comparing the regular BBs that all potato players can use to a Beta player exclusive ship and one of the most OP ships at its tier of the whole game?

 

He has a point... BBs don't need much AA at tier IV to be "competetive". The very fact Imperator is OP while having virtually no AA, and with a lot of Langleys around is proof of that.

 

Anyway, will wait and see.

[Takeda92]

 

Really? Are you comparing the regular BBs that all potato players can use to a Beta player exclusive ship and one of the most OP ships at its tier of the whole game?

 

If they can compensate having worse AA, then why not? The reason this ship is OP is because it was overcompensated for the lack of AA. WG just doesn't need to make the same mistake and compensate them accordingly.

 

It doesn't matter who plays Myogi or Wyoming anyway. Your AA guns won't save you from any carrier, your rudder and sticking to your team will.

[BlueMoon51]

I think particularly in the case of upgrades and ships where there was a historical reason for them not being pursued, why not? if the Germans had won WWI or at least not lost it's logical to assume that this ship would have been upgraded. Like in tier 10 without the Manhattan Project and the war dragging on into say the late 1940s there might well have been a need for ships such as the HMS Malta 

[Walther_K_Nehring]

I think at the lowtier-BBs (tier 3 and 4) they should use the historical hulls, perhaps with some additional AA-MGs (0815 or 20mm) or some heavier autocannons (37mm or early 40mm Bofors in singlemounts).

At tier 5 and 6 (we expect König-Klasse and Bayern-Klasse) hullupgrades with overhauled bowsection and conningtower, new heavy AA (new 88mm L/76 twinmount like Königsberg and Nürnberg), more 20mm in single- and twinmounts and a few 37mm for a AA-rating better than Japanese, but worse than US. Perhaps some modern rangefinders and early radar-antennas.

 

But the atlantic-bow for a tier 4 ship and modern ball-rangefinders for heavy AA is to much! Funnelcaps could be OK, because many WW1-BBs had issues with smoke round the mainmast and compromised rangefinding and firingcontroll.

 

What I don´t understand is the thing with the bealtarmour of the Kaisers- how on god´s earth did they get the 265mm beltarmour? The Kaisers had 350mm mainbelt on 80mm teak! If this is some balancingshit, than use Nassau and/or Helgoland for tier 3 and/or tier 4 premiums (both 300mm belt)! Stop this WG paperdesignfuck in the early tiers, where there were enough real ships with real good balancingparameters!

And 350mm belt on tier 4 doesn´t matter! I shot 10k-15k salvos on New Mexicos (343mm belt) with the Nikolai. Texas and New York (305mm belt) suffer by my Arkansas. So why should this be any balancingissue? It would be better WG would teach their newbies to aim and how to use different shelltypes, than fuckup in history operated BBs!

 

edit:

 

mistakes...

[Historynerd]

I think that the 265 mm value must be either a mistake or a typo... didn't Wg say that one of the pros of the German BB line would be its survivability or something?

 

As for the fictional reconstruction... I think it was inevitable. Had these ships remained in service, would it have been possible that its secondaries and AA armament could be significantly improved without altering their superstructure?

As for myself, I don't find myself that outraged... but that's just how I feel.

[fnord_disc]

I think there should be a what-if upgrade for the Kaisers with Gerät 58 FlaK.

[Historynerd]

I think there should be a what-if upgrade for the Kaisers with Gerät 58 FlaK.

 

Of course... How could we forget about it? 

[Gojuadorai]

What I don´t understand is the thing with the bealtarmour of the Kaisers- how on god´s earth did they get the 265mm beltarmour? 

 

it seems kile they have 350 but the number 256 was given due to been the meadian of sideways armor.

nothing 100% sure so start bit**** when you konw for sure nut upon the numbers of a leak 

 

[edit]

its kinda wiered if infos are correct  the tree start at tier 4 with a tier 3 PREMIUM

 

that would only make sense to me if they give the tier 3 premium pre release to all players 

else i couldnt justify having a valid T3 ship but no Tech tree at T3!

[Masterrix]

100% agree with OP

 

this fictional hull-upgrades are "visually overdone"

 

Kaiser is a T4 ship. why is there a need of such an exessive visual change to her historical hull ?

 

yes, some WW1 ships of T4-6  need some fictional AA and armor upgrades to stay competitive,

but WGN could easily do this without changing the historical look that f*cking much

 

I'm pretty sure, if they have (over)done it with T4 Kaiser, than they have also (over)done it with T5 König and T6 Baden ...

... and now I'm really frightened to see rest of the german BB tree.

 

[Gojuadorai]

 and T6 Baden ...

 

whre you got that from? any source?

[Masterrix]

 

whre you got that from? any source?

 

thats what all ppls are expecting

[TheCinC]

I do prefer historical accuracy and so far, they are not actually doing a bad job.

Some ships were never actually built, but where possible, they appear to have stayed as close to the original plans as possible.

Ships like Khabarovsk, I really can't judge if they are pure fantasy, but I have to admit they play well, although I've stayed away from them mostly.

Can you be more specific about what is wrong with these ships?

 

I for one can't wait for the German BB line to be added, but mostly for the Scharnhorst, Bismarck and hopefully the Deutschland class, the only pre-WW2 ships I am really interested in are Baden and Bayern, one of which will probably be the tier VI ship.

But I understand that Scharnhorst in her real-life configuration would be woefully under powered compared to the existing tier ships, as above tier IV or so, all ships have bigger guns.

So I get why they would choose an upgraded Gneisenau, according to plans that were never fulfilled, over Scharnhorst in the main line.

With Scharnhorst, which was never even in the planning stages for such a conversion, but had a much more interesting career, as a premium, she will not be subject to people complaining that premium ships are OP.

She may be acceptable as a tier VII, but that depends on how she plays.

I think it is a logical choice and an acceptable one.

[Gojuadorai]

 

thats what all ppls are expecting

 

i know that but you told it as if it was known like the leaked stats 

 

But I understand that Scharnhorst in her real-life configuration would be woefully under powered compared to the existing tier ships, as above tier IV or so, all ships have bigger guns.

 

tis is prob. untrue doue to the misconception of cal = penetratio.

 

in the sharnhorst topic someone has posted the pen values of the scharnhorst guns from nav weapons which shows it has nearly same pen as nagato and warspite which have suficient pen .