Fan made Italian tech tree

[Trainspite]

 

 

Right.

No disrespect intended, but the Dante would shred the South Carolina, the Kawachi, the Nassau, the Bellerophon and even the Courbet.

She's got pretty thin armour, but she's a bit fast, and she can bring twelve guns to bear. It wouldn't be fair.

She might well be a Tier IV premium.

 

Very true. I am concerned about the direction of tier 3 BBs though, looking at Konig Albert, which is roflstomping the other tier 3s on NA at the moment. I just hope that WG don't repeat that mistake.  

[Historynerd]

 

Very true. I am concerned about the direction of tier 3 BBs though, looking at Konig Albert, which is roflstomping the other tier 3s on NA at the moment. I just hope that WG don't repeat that mistake.  

 

Hmmm... you are right...

 

 

 

XD

 

[Trainspite]

 

Hmmm... you are right...

 

 

 

XD

 

 

It's almost like they want us to club seals with stock tier 4 Battleships... 

[Snowyskies]

I'm concerned about the viability of the tier VII and especially your tier VIII destroyers as I don't see them as being very competitive with the rest. With only 1x3 or 1x4 torpedoes you are more or less forced to be a gunboat. Granted that the 120 mm guns have slightly better trajectory than the IJN 120 mm guns but can you claim that Maestrale II would be a far superior gunboat compare to Fubuki (soon to maybe be Akatsuki)? Already at tier VII Błyskawica is superior to Maestrale II in my opinion with better guns, more of them and also 2x3 torpedoes. To be fair though Blysckawica might be a bit OP for its tier.

 

Right.

No disrespect intended, but the Dante would shred the South Carolina, the Kawachi, the Nassau, the Bellerophon and even the Courbet.

She's got pretty thin armour, but she's a bit fast, and she can bring twelve guns to bear. It wouldn't be fair.

She might well be a Tier IV premium.

 

I don't see how Dante is very much superior to the Courbet class, 2 guns less on the broadside sure and somewhat slower but superior firepower forward and aft, better secondaries etc. On balance they seem to be quite equal to each other although obviously a step above the other you mentioned. Still with the magic of soft stats it isn't impossible to place it at tier III but it would probably be doing it a disservice.

[Waroch]

True. I suggest they stop the power creep with the Courbet. Sounds about right to me :3

 

PS: Fiat G55 exist as a land based torpedo fighter... Why not carrier based?

 

well in a game you can do about whatever you like.

From a historical/technical perspective, it's not a likely conversion. It's already quite a challenge to successfully adapt a land based fighter as a carrier based one, a cheap conversion like the Seafire usually doesn't do great.

I would say it would take an in-depth revision of the G55 to have only a carrier based fighter, given it's a fast and relatively highly loaded aircraft, with a narrow canopy and not such a good visibility, plus the rather strange counter-torque solution on Fiat fighters which doesn't help slow speed behaviour... For that only you need a new and longer wing, more flaps, strenghtened fuselage, new gear, additional equipment and probably new canopy as well.

Now if you want to stick a ~700kg torp on it and still take off from a deck barely 200m long... You pretty much have to stick a bomber wing on it as well, which of course means you can forget the fighter role and you won't have the bombing capacity of a dedicated bomber either. Better start a new design.

 

Anyway, like said above it's only if there's a CV line to go along. The Royal Navy will most certainly have one, the Marine Nationale might have one as there were a couple of ships in service, plus a good number of aircraft designs -including one which is already in WoWP. The German, Italian and Russian navies have objectively much less to offer; the devs stated that they don't plan a German CV line in the foreseeable future, so it's safe to assume none of these is on their agenda.

[Historynerd]

I'm concerned about the viability of the tier VII and especially your tier VIII destroyers as I don't see it as being very competitive with the rest. With only 1x3 or 1x4 torpedoes you are more or less forced to be a gunboat are almost exclusively a gunboat. Granted that the 120 mm guns have slightly better trajectory than the IJN 120 mm guns but can you claim that Maestrale II would be a far superior gunboat compare to Fubuki (soon to maybe be Akatsuki)? Already at tier VII Błyskawica is superior to Maestrale II in my opinion with better guns, more of them and also 2x3 torpedoes. To be fair though Blysckawica might be a bit OP for its tier.

 

The Tier VII (the Soldati) will probably switch between hull forms, with the former keeping two torpedo mounts, and the latter switching one for added AA.

The Tier VIII (Maestrale potenziato) is, as you say, going to be more of a pure gunboat, but I don't feel that it would suffer, as it has six guns (the same as the Błyskawica); besides, the latter is pretty much one of a kind in itself.

 

We know the issue we have is that several destroyer classes turn up with the same 120 mm gun, but that's how it is. I have little doubt that WG, helped by the fact that little details are available for these ships, can fix things by tweaking the soft stats.

 

 I don't see how Dante is very much superior to the Courbet class, 2 guns less on the broadside sure and somewhat slower but superior firepower forward and aft, better secondaries etc. On balance they seem to be quite equal to each other although obviously a step above the other you mentioned. Still with the magic of soft stats it isn't impossible to place it at tier III but it would probably be doing it a disservice.

 

True. I suggest they stop the power creep with the Courbet. Sounds about right to me :3

 

The Dante is optimized for broadside firing, and had less conspicuous superstructure; it's far less visible, so it will probably have high concealment. Its structure and armor protection doesn't have the complication its French counterparts has because of the wing turrets concept.

I'm not that into head-on fire, but I guess the Courbet has the advantage here. However, it looks to me that I can angle the Dante rather well to unmask all of her guns, so I'm not that worried.

IRL, some of the Courbet's secondary guns were plated over, as they were useless, while some of the Dante's secondary guns were in powered turrets; besides, they don't matter much in a BB vs BB match, DDs are the one who need worry the most. Also, during WWI, the Dante would have comfortably outranged the Courbet by some 10'500 m (but we all know what WG does to range...).

The Dante's guns fire a slightly heavier shell at a higher muzzle velocity (840 m/s instead of 783). So they'd do a bit more damage, with a flatter trajectory.

 

So overall, yes, I think the Dante has an advantage (although saying "shred" was maybe too much).

[Snowyskies]

The Tier VII (the Soldati) will probably switch between hull forms, with the former keeping two torpedo mounts, and the latter switching one for added AA.

 

The Tier VIII (Maestrale potenziato) is, as you say, going to be more of a pure gunboat, but I don't feel that it would suffer, as it has six guns (the same as the Błyskawica); besides, the latter is pretty much one of a kind in itself.

 

 

 

We know the issue we have is that several destroyer classes turn up with the same 120 mm gun, but that's how it is. I have little doubt that WG, helped by the fact that little details are available for these ships, can fix things by tweaking the soft stats.

 

It will be interesting to see how the IJN rebalancing ultimately looks like as that might show what WG wants for the future so I won't argue too much about it. Still Blysckawica has 7 guns and not 6, right? So one more gun, higher RoF, superior trajectory (NavWeap stats) and all on a ship that is sitting one tier lower than where you'd put Maestrale potenziato. Fair enough that tech tree ships are probably the more suitable comparison, but I thought Blysckawica is an interesting case as it has the 120 mm/50 guns in single purpose mounts - just like the Italians.

 

Okay, yes, soft stats can easily help you but it's still nice to have ships that fit without having to resort to too soft stat "buffing" (or nerfing for that matter).

 

The Dante is optimized for broadside firing, and had less conspicuous superstructure; it's far less visible, so it will probably have high concealment. Its structure and armor protection doesn't have the complication its French counterparts has because of the wing turrets concept.

I'm not that into head-on fire, but I guess the Courbet has the advantage here. However, it looks to me that I can angle the Dante rather well to unmask all of her guns, so I'm not that worried.

IRL, some of the Courbet's secondary guns were plated over, as they were useless, while some of the Dante's secondary guns were in powered turrets; besides, they don't matter much in a BB vs BB match, DDs are the one who need worry the most. Also, during WWI, the Dante would have comfortably outranged the Courbet by some 10'500 m (but we all know what WG does to range...).

The Dante's guns fire a slightly heavier shell at a higher muzzle velocity (840 m/s instead of 783). So they'd do a bit more damage, with a flatter trajectory.

 

So overall, yes, I think the Dante has an advantage (although saying "shred" was maybe too much).

 

I'm inclined to agree that Dante might have a advantage, but yeah, "shred" was a bit too much

[Historynerd]

It will be interesting to see how the IJN rebalancing ultimately looks like as that might show what WG wants for the future so I won't argue too much about it. Still Blysckawica has 7 guns and not 6, right? So one more gun, higher RoF, superior trajectory (NavWeap stats) and all on a ship that is sitting one tier lower than where you'd put Maestrale potenziato. Fair enough that tech tree ships are probably the more suitable comparison, but I thought Blysckawica is an interesting case as it has the 120 mm/50 guns in single purpose mounts - just like the Italians.

 

Okay, yes, soft stats can easily help you but it's still nice to have ships that fit without having to resort to too soft stat "buffing" (or nerfing for that matter).

 

Check it, and you'll find out that the Błyskawica has three twin mounts of its 120 mm Bofors, which make a total of six.

 

What you said make me think of something; maybe WG could consider to give the Maestrale potenziato's mounts some degree of AA value. That would give her some edge.

 

 I'm inclined to agree that Dante might have a advantage, but yeah, "shred" was a bit too much 

 

Alright.

[Deamon93]

Bly has seven(three twins and a single). Anyway the DD line is the older and haven't bothered thinkingvon pptential fixes after the Russian DDs showed up, can't be asked. For this reason I have doubts on the line, it's no secret

[Historynerd]

Still Blysckawica has 7 guns and not 6, right? 

 

Bly has seven(three twins and a single). Anyway the DD line is the older and haven't bothered thinkingvon pptential fixes after the Russian DDs showed up, can't be asked. For this reason I have doubts on the line, it's no secret

 

Whoops. Missed that seventh gun somehow. Sorry, my bad. 

 

Anyhow, how about my idea? After all, even if super-late the idea of 120 mm DP guns was slowly gaining ground within the Regia Marina.

Give them some DP value, and it might balance things satisfactorily enough.

[Deamon93]

 

 

Whoops. Missed that seventh gun somehow. Sorry, my bad. 

 

Anyhow, how about my idea? After all, even if super-late the idea of 120 mm DP guns was slowly gaining ground within the Regia Marina.

Give them some DP value, and it might balance things satisfactorily enough.

 

It's not a problem.

 

Anyway even with DP values they risk to be a subpar variant of the Russians due to inferior torpedo armament(in terms of number of tubes and, potentially, in alpha damage) and somewhat inferior primary armament. They would need something which gives them a hand in most conditions(since CVs might not be present making the DP advantage useless)

[Devi1]

Sub_Octavian on a Q&A on reddit: "There will be SOME Italian ships - this is logical and expected. But...no leaks on that from me. Sorry."

 

Start the speculation engine!

[Deamon93]

Sub_Octavian on a Q&A on reddit: "There will be SOME Italian ships - this is logical and expected. But...no leaks on that from me. Sorry."

 

Start the speculation engine!

 

Could you link please? Not that I don't trust the source, just to see what the question was(and the rest of the Q&A)

[Historynerd]

Could you link please? Not that I don't trust the source, just to see what the question was(and the rest of the Q&A)

 

Here.

 

 Question: What is the situation with the Italian ships? Can we hope in at least a premium ship soon?

 

Reply: There will be SOME Italian ships - this is logical and expected. But...no leaks on that from me. Sorry.

 

It was some thirty minutes ago.

 

Really hope he means some Italian ships in the near future (i.e. a few premiums), to be followed by the tech tree, btw... 

And I wish they'd start pounding at the doors of the archives and get through the red tape (I know it's an issue, but this is yet another reason to start doing the grunt work).

[Deamon93]

Well the answer is vague, both in quantity of ships and timing. Regardless I hope they are already researching, although hard to know.

[Historynerd]

Well the answer is vague, both in quantity of ships and timing. Regardless I hope they are already researching, although hard to know.

 

Did you expect something more definite? It's clear they are still far away from doing work. I'd bet no WG researcher has looked at a detailed plan for an Italian ship, yet.

I repeat, I know the difficulty in accessing such archives is not helping, but they still ought to get a move on, if they want to release a RM premium before the very end of 2017.

[Deamon93]

 

Did you expect something more definite? It's clear they are still far away from doing work. I'd bet no WG researcher has looked at a detailed plan for an Italian ship, yet.

I repeat, I know the difficulty in accessing such archives is not helping, but they still ought to get a move on, if they want to release a RM premium before the very end of 2017.

 

Not at all, on the contrary: a vague answer is better than no answer. Regarding a look at the archives I think WG will ask support of an Italian third party to bypass at least part of the red tape, then again all depends on how much they would save(in time and money) doing this way compared to doing it all inhouse

[SparvieroVV]

Errors based on book diagrams where found with Nagato and Montana as well as a couple of others iirc. I'm not sure how much archive access should stop a well known ship from being a premium. As stated it probably depends on how willing one of the noted authorities on the RM is willing to work with WG. So they have access to pictures in good detail, etc. 

[Deamon93]

Errors based on book diagrams where found with Nagato and Montana as well as a couple of others iirc. I'm not sure how much archive access should stop a well known ship from being a premium. As stated it probably depends on how willing one of the noted authorities on the RM is willing to work with WG. So they have access to pictures in good detail, etc. 

 

Well I just checked the USMM(not directly of course but via their rules and regulations online), I don't know how other archives act.

 

Speaking of material I wonder if the USMM would just tell what they have without having to go there since the whole archive material is listed and briefly described to facilitated the fruition of said material.

[SparvieroVV]

Sub_Octavian on a Q&A on reddit: "There will be SOME Italian ships - this is logical and expected. But...no leaks on that from me. Sorry."

 

Start the speculation engine!

 

some Italian ships next year or some Italian ships? Because the latter is disturbing as we should have at least three trees not some ships. 

[Historynerd]

some Italian ships next year or some Italian ships? Because the latter is disturbing as we should have at least three trees not some ships. 

 

I choose to believe he meant what you said first.

Because otherwise...

 

 

 

[SparvieroVV]

 

I choose to believe he meant what you said first.

Because otherwise...

 

 

 

[Deamon93]

 

some Italian ships next year or some Italian ships? Because the latter is disturbing as we should have at least three trees not some ships. 

 

Well the answer is most likely vague by choice so he won't reveal plans in place(because they planned up to 2020). With this said if they follow the usual procedure they'll implement at least a premium some time before the tree itself, then again it's impossible to confirm or deny this assumption without an input from them.

 

 

[SparvieroVV]

I have a lot of dragon flags waiting for the first premium. 

 

[Historynerd]

Well, Romics came and went, and nothing was said about anything about the Italian ships.