Someone forgot to adjust 'Situational Awareness' in 0.5.5

[Vogel]

 

There wasn't a change ?

 

Then the patch bugged situational awareness by exactly three seconds from when Situational Awareness disappears and when it should actually disappears.

 

 

[rafparis]

one thing is for me 100% sure: there were never a 3s delay before when you blink in smoke. Just now i had a game in kutuzow when i rected a Benson who was laying smoke and decelerating, the 3 sec get you plenty of time to fire at him when he is targeted.

 

Before 5.5?

He would blink, but for less than 1 second, which would allow only guessing shots, not targeted ones.

[Vogel]

^Agree wholeheartedly. It has certainly not been around since CAT. Might be one of the last couple of patches, but it hasn't always been like this.

[rafparis]

^Agree wholeheartedly. It has certainly not been around since CAT. Might be one of the last couple of patches, but it hasn't always been like this.

 

no, it is since this patch, i'm sure of that. I play all classes, but DDs especially, and i pay attention to what they do and i know the tricks. But the smoke tricks don't work anymore as before. Maybe before AS was on the entire 3 sec time?

[_FTD_]

 

There wasn't a change ?

Do you have a proof for this? Because we are actually trying to figure it out whether it was the like this or not in 0.5.4., what about you?

 

Ignorance is bliss.

 

So, apart from me not being mad and I'm pretty sure this is not the case.

Can't the Devs load up 5.4.0 on the Private Test Server and check if ships go invisible after 20 seconds instead of 23 or +3sec delay after anything which breaks stealth. It shouldn't be hard.

 

Yeah that would make it so much easier... you cannot proof if it was the case like that before or not otherwise, you just cannot even with replays you need both sides with the exact time and camera angle to see whether it was the case or not.

 

I'm going through a lot of replays and it's nearly impossible and THIS is why people are so confused because it has not been like this before and now they are all wondering what is going on. Besides that Strangers123 and I were testing some stuff to confirm the delay is working properly as "intended". The thing is to make something working as intended you need to tell the people something changed which is hard to do when you think it was like this before which I honestly do NOT believe because after 800+ DD games it only took me 2 or 3 games to realize something is different than before.

 

So back to the problem we have to proof now that there is something different which is super hard to do if you aren't the developer that has access to the 5.4.0 files to recreate the EXACT situation in both patch.

[Cirrus4000]

 

There wasn't a change ?

 

But there was. The "blinking" seen on many videos before patch 5.5 show that there was not 3 second delay before you became invisible.

[OVanBruce]

Now that _FTD_ described a thing that - with replays - could prove that there is something "not working as intended" (finally),

 

Are you trying to convince me that after a whole week with this problem hanging around you, WG staff and ST, couldn't reproduce this bug and that magically, at the first try, OMNI could reproduce it 3 (THREE) times in the training room using different scenarios?

[Hanszeehock]

Do you have a proof for this? Because we are actually trying to figure it out whether it was the like this or not, what about you?

 

Ignorance is bliss.

 

I've discussed this with a lot of people. As far as the devs are concerned nothing has been changed. They have said the 3 seconds has been part of the game since CBT. Personally, I think it was like this before 0.5.5 but I have no idea how long it has been around. Unless this could be tested on an earlier version of the game and evidence provided, people are never going to be convinced. As things stand I do not know how this perception something has changed will ever be resolved. So unless new information becomes available I will not comment any further. Thanks.

[OVanBruce]

[edited]

[Hanszeehock]

 

[edited]

 

LOL

[Admiral_noodle]

 

I've discussed this with a lot of people. As far as the devs are concerned nothing has been changed. They have said the 3 seconds has been part of the game since CBT. Personally, I think it was like this before 0.5.5 but I have no idea how long it has been around. Unless this could be tested on an earlier version of the game and evidence provided, people are never going to be convinced. As things stand I do not know how this perception something has changed will ever be resolved. So unless new information becomes available I will not comment any further. Thanks.

 

Its probable that the "flickering" in and out of detection was masking the 2-3seconds anyway. No one could fire at a flickering target with ease so it would be thought of as blind firing. This is probably why people didn't think it worked the way it did. Now the flickering is fixed the 3s delay is there for all to see and being noticed. 

 

I can tell you that as an experienced IT developer rolling back the code on a test server to test something which isn't actually broken won't be happening! 

 

I would appreciate if the 3s delay is explained in a guide somewhere so people aren't misled into thinking they are invisible when they aren't. 

 

I used radar today and sailed into range of a DD in smoke. The ship appeared on the minimap exactly 3 seconds before rendering. It was like "get ready". So long as the "!" Going off is understood to mean "you'll disappear in 3 seconds" and always works like that then fine. 

[Ictogan]

 

I've discussed this with a lot of people. As far as the devs are concerned nothing has been changed. They have said the 3 seconds has been part of the game since CBT. Personally, I think it was like this before 0.5.5 but I have no idea how long it has been around. Unless this could be tested on an earlier version of the game and evidence provided, people are never going to be convinced. As things stand I do not know how this perception something has changed will ever be resolved. So unless new information becomes available I will not comment any further. Thanks.

But people have provided evidence that this delay DIDN'T exist before. Are you just going to ignore that?

[_FTD_]

 

Its probable that the "flickering" in and out of detection was masking the 2-3seconds anyway. No one could fire at a flickering target with ease so it would be thought of as blind firing. This is probably why people didn't think it worked the way it did. Now the flickering is fixed the 3s delay is there for all to see and being noticed. 

 

I can tell you that as an experienced IT developer rolling back the code on a test server to test something which isn't actually broken won't be happening! 

 

I would appreciate if the 3s delay is explained in a guide somewhere so people aren't misled into thinking they are invisible when they aren't. 

 

I used radar today and sailed into range of a DD in smoke. The ship appeared on the minimap exactly 3 seconds before rendering. It was like "get ready". So long as the "!" Going off is understood to mean "you'll disappear in 3 seconds" and always works like that then fine. 

The flickering was only an issue while the DD was in / on the edge of a smoke, it has never been a problem in open waters. Now you have the 3 sec delay in the smoke AND open waters.

[Zgicc]

 

Its probable that the "flickering" in and out of detection was masking the 2-3seconds anyway. No one could fire at a flickering target with ease so it would be thought of as blind firing. This is probably why people didn't think it worked the way it did. Now the flickering is fixed the 3s delay is there for all to see and being noticed. 

 

I can tell you that as an experienced IT developer rolling back the code on a test server to test something which isn't actually broken won't be happening! 

 

I would appreciate if the 3s delay is explained in a guide somewhere so people aren't misled into thinking they are invisible when they aren't. 

 

I used radar today and sailed into range of a DD in smoke. The ship appeared on the minimap exactly 3 seconds before rendering. It was like "get ready". So long as the "!" Going off is understood to mean "you'll disappear in 3 seconds" and always works like that then fine. 

 

What's the point of having Sit Awareness active for a whole 20 seconds for it to just not show you the last 3 seconds? Even if it is working as intended now (which to my knowledge wasn't working "as intended" pre-5.4.0) why such an arbitrary pointless number.

 

But anyway, this is a core mechanic change so it is important to see what is what.

 

And why couldn't they rollback a test server? Isn't that the point of a developer. To figure stuff in their game out?

[Vogel]

One possible explanation is that the change of file structure meant that models load much faster -> 3 second rule became noticable. But this is under the assumption that the game loads models from harddrive only when they are detected, and not when they aren't. 

[Pajosaurus]

And again. This is already the third time this happens to me (that I noticed). Just got citadeled in Svietlana by a Kongo with no SA going off. I was completely out of combat, haven't fired my guns for couple of minutes though I was briefly detected by an airplane some 15 seconds earlier.

[Ictogan]

I actually found a way to exploit the 3s delay: If I'm in an IJN DD can see an enemy DD without him seeing me and smoke while at full speed, I can still see him for 3s while the smoke blocks the line of sight. If I shoot while I'm still in a smoke puff, he won't detect me and the 20s delay doesn't apply. I will of course immediately move out of the smoke due to moving at full speed, which is where I will detect him again. From each time I exit a smoke puff I have an extra 3s that I can see him while he can't detect me. This is kinda limited by the rate of fire of IJN DDs and I have to guess correctly when the smoke puffs will appear, but I can get 2 salvos out while my smoke consumable is active without him seeing me - he will only see me after I fire my third salvo. Having fired three salvos and not being hit by one, I can get an advantage in a gunfight against gunboats. Basically a short-time offensive smoke that doesn't need someone else for spotting.

 

This tactic also works with any other DD that has a lower spotting range than your opponents, but obviously it will work best for IJN DDs as they have the best spotting ranges.

[Kartoffelmos]

Working as intended™.

 

[WhiskeyWolf]

[edited]

[Eternus_Damnatio]

As far as I am concerned the point of SA is to tell you when detected.

There should be no delays if you are spotted SA up if you are not SA down simple.

The skill description does not say alerts you when detected most of the time.

 

 

[LetsRockAndRoll]

As far as I am concerned the point of SA is to tell you when detected.

There should be no delays if you are spotted SA up if you are not SA down simple.

The skill description does not say alerts you when detected most of the time.

 

 

Or that you will be detected well before the warning appears and the first salvo is already on the way so good luck dodging it.

 

 

[SinkTheOthersNotMe]

And my issue is SA and smoke:

Played 20 games yesterday among which 10 with my Russian DD and my rating went from 1500+ -> 800.

Why?

 

Because I systematically got focused fired at while in the smoke and no SA indicator.

 

10 games, focused fired by several ships = Not a lucky shot or good guess and to have my rating going from 1500 down to 800 over 10 games is no accident either.

 

And I tried different tricks, slowing down while not firing then launching smoke then stay within the smoke boundaries -> did not work.

Tried the same but without being spotted by anything -> did not work and so on.....

 

WG is saying 'working as intended' and this was why I left WOT...so really wondering if they will do something like a 'sneak emergency patch' whil still denying anything is wrong.

 

Sidenote: Will continue playing my Russian DD but from 14km away and so will never cap or do something like that as smoke is now useless for me.

 

[WhiskeyWolf]

Okay guys, I'm not too good at this replay analyzing, but tell me what happens with 13:30 minutes to the end and at grid H3.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/y9vx0zut27vqgix/20160506_180036_PJSD026-Camo-Kamikaze_41_Conquest.wowsreplay

 

PS: wolf sends his regards

 

 

Looks like that CV got spotted for a second there. Shouldn't have been since nothing is near it or in line of sight. Weird as hell.

In my opinion and looking at some things happen the last few days I'm now 100% sure the spotting system is bugged.

And WG is in denial about it.

 

I also like how people who said spotting "works as intended" somehow aren't able to explain how the carrier in this replay got spotted.... or rather they ignored the replay altogether.

[von_chom]

 

 

 

 

Hanszeehock, on 09 May 2016 - 07:59 PM, said:

 

As far as the devs are concerned nothing has been changed.

Well, WG is known very well for screwing thing B while fixing/working on A ....

 

[Admiral_noodle]

 

 

 

 

 

As far as the devs are concerned nothing has been changed.

Well, WG is known very well for screwing thing B while fixing/working on A ....

 

 

To be fair that's true of IT releases in general...

 

the working as intended 2-3s... Ok... I swear it's new to me but ok... Put up notes in SA guide etc and make this known. 

 

We we should probably concentrate on finding hard evidence for spotting problems much longer than 3s.