Reward for failure

[Eternus_Damnatio]

So bit of a follow from my New players and premium ships thread.

 

As some stated in that thread there are plenty of hopeless players that have plenty of games under their belt.

I feel the only solution to this issue is if WG stopped rewarding failure.

They could bring in a system similar to what we currently have in team battles where you only get rewarded for a certain level of performance.

This would push players to improve their game and maybe get those base hugging max range sniping bb's to actually push up and help the team.

[dlbomber]

LOL

 

[cherry2blost]

So bit of a follow from my New players and premium ships thread.

 

As some stated in that thread there are plenty of hopeless players that have plenty of games under their belt.

I feel the only solution to this issue is if WG stopped rewarding failure.

They could bring in a system similar to what we currently have in team battles where you only get rewarded for a certain level of performance.

This would push players to improve their game and maybe get those base hugging max range sniping bb's to actually push up and help the team.

 

 

Ahh man don't tell us SkyBuck has hijacked your forum account bro....  

[EsaTuunanen]

Those Balless Boats (or is it Balless&Braindead) are becoming serious problems.

 

Few days ago met 4k avg damage Kongo player insisting playing right (humping south edge in Solomons) because "enemy was still in range" and then blaming RNG for not hitting a sh*t.

Maybe WG should limit max range of BBs for new players untill they achieve certain average damage to unlock some "Gunnery Training" for full range.

 

Though patch seemed to have gotten rid of them yesterday.

Doing patching must have been above their shoe size IQ.

[Lladdir_]

Those Balless Boats (or is it Balless&Braindead) are becoming serious problems.

 

Few days ago met 4k avg damage Kongo player insisting playing right (humping south edge in Solomons) because "enemy was still in range" and then blaming RNG for not hitting a sh*t.

Maybe WG should limit max range of BBs for new players untill they achieve certain average damage to unlock some "Gunnery Training" for full range.

 

Though patch seemed to have gotten rid of them yesterday.

Doing patching must have been above their shoe size IQ.

 

Give it time, they will return

[Cuddly_Spider]

Lack of ability is no more an "issue" in this game than players of extreme ability to beat up average players without breaking a sweat.

 

I hate to break it to you, but your ability to play this game in no way changes your right to play it, particularly when discussing those who support the game by buying premium content.

[Eternus_Damnatio]

 

 

Ahh man don't tell us SkyBuck has hijacked your forum account bro....  

 

No clue who that is but no anyway lol

Those Balless Boats (or is it Balless&Braindead) are becoming serious problems.

 

Few days ago met 4k avg damage Kongo player insisting playing right (humping south edge in Solomons) because "enemy was still in range" and then blaming RNG for not hitting a sh*t.

Maybe WG should limit max range of BBs for new players untill they achieve certain average damage to unlock some "Gunnery Training" for full range.

 

Though patch seemed to have gotten rid of them yesterday.

Doing patching must have been above their shoe size IQ.

 

Had so many useless players camping their full health bb's too scared to move forward and actually take a hit.

Then they start blaming and insulting the team when they lose and have done nothing the problem is only getting worse.

I do not want to end up in a situation like I did with WoT where I just got so sick of it all that I stopped playing.

 

[Eternus_Damnatio]

Lack of ability is no more an "issue" in this game than players of extreme ability to beat up average players without breaking a sweat.

 

I hate to break it to you, but your ability to play this game in no way changes your right to play it, particularly when discussing those who support the game by buying premium content.

 

Where have I stated anything about the right to play ??? pls enlighten me. Not to mention I also support the game buying premium time and ships.

I want a system that does not reward failure and is that so bad or maybe we should start giving gold medals out to athletes that finish last etc.

The new system used for ranked battles I believe is a good basis for what could be done throughout the game.

Players who perform well and understand concepts like team play should be rewarded those who do nothing to help their team and perform badly should not.

[Cuddly_Spider]

 

Where have I stated anything about the right to play ??? pls enlighten me. Not to mention I also support the game buying premium time and ships.

I want a system that does not reward failure and is that so bad or maybe we should start giving gold medals out to athletes that finish last etc.

The new system used for ranked battles I believe is a good basis for what could be done throughout the game.

Players who perform well and understand concepts like team play should be rewarded those who do nothing to help their team and perform badly should not.

 

1. "Stop allowing players to purchase high tier premium ships when they have no clue what they are doing."

 

So yes, you have stated something about the "right to play", consider yourself enlightened.

 

2. The system does not reward failure, it simply allows people to play. The economy is finely balanced as it is to not be punishingly difficult yet encourage the purchase of premium content.

 

3. If you're happy with the system for ranked battles stick to them. Randoms are fine, and the wide dispersion of skill levels actually adds something to the game - unpredictablilty. You never know what you will be faced with next. There are already options for those who like it to be competitive.

 

4. This already happens. Players who play well get more silver, more xp, and get to advance faster and play longer on higher tiers without having to farm.

[Kenliero]

"Amount of xp gained from shell hit should be divided with a distance it was fired from ".... hmm?

[Panocek]

"Amount of xp gained from shell hit should be divided with a distance it was fired from ".... hmm?

 

%range should do the trick as well.

[Nergy_BB]

So playing games is only about Success and Failure?

[EsaTuunanen]

So playing games is only about Success and Failure?

How about demanding everyone to at least try to help the team?

 

Basically these Balless Boats are just sabotaging team's efforts as effectively as deliberate team killers.

Even if they couldn't do proper damage even from closer range (bad aim/target choise/wrong shell) at least they would draw some fire away from other ships allowing them to survive longer and do more damage.

 

Or do you think others would tolerate someone purposely sabotaging team's effort in real life?

[Eternus_Damnatio]

 

1. "Stop allowing players to purchase high tier premium ships when they have no clue what they are doing."

 

So yes, you have stated something about the "right to play", consider yourself enlightened.

 

2. The system does not reward failure, it simply allows people to play. The economy is finely balanced as it is to not be punishingly difficult yet encourage the purchase of premium content.

 

3. If you're happy with the system for ranked battles stick to them. Randoms are fine, and the wide dispersion of skill levels actually adds something to the game - unpredictablilty. You never know what you will be faced with next. There are already options for those who like it to be competitive.

 

4. This already happens. Players who play well get more silver, more xp, and get to advance faster and play longer on higher tiers without having to farm.

 

Ok slightly misleading rage induced thread title but as usual people fail to actually do any reading.

From my thread post number 42. 

"Just wish they would address the issue of new players in high tier premiums.

Personally I think that if they have under x amount of games they go into a different pot for mm.

Seems the best way to go WG can still sell them their product that way."

As for your other points just no it is still way too easy for people to fail there way to T10.

And the team battle comment obviously from someone who has not played a lot of them.

Sit in queue for 10mins then play a team ranked so far below yours it is not even funny not to mention the lack of incentives.

[Eternus_Damnatio]

So playing games is only about Success and Failure?

 

I am not some bleeding heart liberal that thinks coming last should be rewarded I play to win what is the point of playing a competitive game if not to win.

That does not mean I only enjoy my wins I have had some dam good games that were losses.

But those losses were fights to the bitter end good close games where everyone involved played a part.

Some players are just not as good as others I have no issue with that we all have different skill levels.

But reward for poor performance and team play should not happen.

 

[Nergy_BB]

How about demanding everyone to at least try to help the team?

 

Basically these Balless Boats are just sabotaging team's efforts as effectively as deliberate team killers.

Even if they couldn't do proper damage even from closer range (bad aim/target choise/wrong shell) at least they would draw some fire away from other ships allowing them to survive longer and do more damage.

 

Or do you think others would tolerate someone purposely sabotaging team's effort in real life?

 

You have never played a game just for fun? I really feel sorry for you. I really do.

[Sake78]

You know what else can work? All you so concerned citizens to dismount that high horse of yours and educate players, on a neutral tone, either via Forums, or ingame through Training Rooms. Furthermore, what you COULD do is get together and make nice and informative guides, for WG to introduce into their game, so not everybody hunts for links - the 1% that reads Forums, anyway. So, instead of thinking of new and improved ways of shafting players, maybe you could do something constructive for a change. Make "The OMNI School" and educate peeps and/or train peeps, talk with WG to advert said school ingame, if you are so concerned.

 

Oh, btw - if I play poorly I get poor cash and xp - that should suffice.

[Eternus_Damnatio]

You know what else can work? All you so concerned citizens to dismount that high horse of yours and educate players, on a neutral tone, either via Forums, or ingame through Training Rooms. Furthermore, what you COULD do is get together and make nice and informative guides, for WG to introduce into their game, so not everybody hunts for links - the 1% that reads Forums, anyway. So, instead of thinking of new and improved ways of shafting players, maybe you could do something constructive for a change. Make "The OMNI School" and educate peeps and/or train peeps, talk with WG to advert said school ingame, if you are so concerned.

 

Oh, btw - if I play poorly I get poor cash and xp - that should suffice.

 

I have tried advising people so many times and maybe 1/10 will listen the rest just gob off and start with insults so I gave up bothering.

Not my job to train and educate these people at T8+ anyway they should have at least a basic understanding by then.

Fact is a lot of these guys fail there way up the tiers and have no understanding of things like game mechanics and team play.

Video from Ichase shows exactly the sort of thing I mean.

[Sake78]

True that is not your job to educate people, but that`s one of the very few ways of achieving your goal - skilled high tier gameplay, or at least decent. 

 

The other is what you said in your OP, and I think that it is wrong - punishing people. They are punished enough by having worse results per battle, with all that entails already - slower progress overall. The only answer, I think, is to teach them - and here you and good players can sit down and talk with WG how it can be done via ingame interface and / or tutorials, or anything and everything that you can come up with, to make a player better, at any and all tiers. 

[Eternus_Damnatio]

True that is not your job to educate people, but that`s one of the very few ways of achieving your goal - skilled high tier gameplay, or at least decent. 

 

The other is what you said in your OP, and I think that it is wrong - punishing people. They are punished enough by having worse results per battle, with all that entails already - slower progress overall. The only answer, I think, is to teach them - and here you and good players can sit down and talk with WG how it can be done via ingame interface and / or tutorials. 

 

Not needed there are so many streamers and youtube videos out there that can help educate people if they take the time to just look.

And as for a system that stops rewarding failure as I have said I would be looking for something like ranked currently has.

Where the bottom 3 players of each team unless they score above a certain mark do not get rewarded.

People here like to jump the gun and come to their own conclusions about what I am saying without truly reading or understanding.

Anyone that has played ranked under the newer system will have known what I was talking about.

And those that do not know jump to conclusions instead of asking a simple question like how does that work exactly.

[Cuddly_Spider]

 

Ok slightly misleading rage induced thread title but as usual people fail to actually do any reading.

From my thread post number 42. 

"Just wish they would address the issue of new players in high tier premiums.

Personally I think that if they have under x amount of games they go into a different pot for mm.

Seems the best way to go WG can still sell them their product that way."

As for your other points just no it is still way too easy for people to fail there way to T10.

And the team battle comment obviously from someone who has not played a lot of them.

Sit in queue for 10mins then play a team ranked so far below yours it is not even funny not to mention the lack of incentives.

 

I read it. There is absolutely nothing ambiguous about:

 

"Stop allowing players to purchase high tier premium ships when they have no clue what they are doing."

 

There is no mistaking that. You, as an exceptionally good player, have decided to crown yourself king of World of Warships and think that gives you the right to judge whether others are worthy to play on higher tiers. That is what both this thread and the thread I linked are really about. That sort of elitist crap infested the World of Tanks community for a long time and it was pretty toxic as I recall.

 

Also you keep on using the word "issue" to describe players of lower skill than yourself, yet you offer up very little in the way of explanation as to why this is an "issue". This begs the question - why isn't your own higher skill the real "issue" that needs to be addressed? Average players are, by definition, far more numerous than the elite. Why not cater to the masses rather than the gifted few? Why not stop you from buying premiums but give it to poorer players (who need them to farm silver) at a discount? And what about when the average players are out there, just trading broadsides with another average player, and some superskilled captain comes and destroys their citadel in two volleys? Doesn't that need "addressing"? Should your dispersion be increased or the hitboxes of enemy citadels be reduced for you in particular? Of course not, but your logic applied in reverse would make this so.

 

Furthermore I really wish you'd read your own post here and think more carefully about the rammifications of what you're demanding. Let me point this out, and together we're going to do some applied mathematics:

 

"Sit in queue for 10mins then play a team ranked so far below yours it is not even funny not to mention the lack of incentives."

 

This is because you are so far above average that the matchmaker is struggling to find comparable players. If you were average, between 48-52% winrate with average damage etc then the matchmaker wouldn't struggle at all, because the population at large sits about that level. Now if you applied your own standards to the game and shunted the average player off the higher tiers you'd be back here complaining about waiting 10 minutes to get into a tier 9 match!

 

 

Not needed there are so many streamers and youtube videos out there that can help educate people if they take the time to just look.

 

A lot of people have busy lives. Work, family, etc. When they sit down to have a game of something they're going to want to play, not learn to play and certainly not treat it as a second job and study the thing. This is also the demographic who is most likely to spend on the game, as work gives disposable income and the handicap of less time to play can be overcome with a premium account.

[EsaTuunanen]

You know what else can work? All you so concerned citizens to dismount that high horse of yours and educate players, on a neutral tone

Doesn't work to those who choose stupidity and screwing their team.

Getting anything into their heads would need using fine adjustment tool.

 

and here you and good players can sit down and talk with WG how it can be done...

I think fine adjuster wouldn't be enough for that.

[Aotearas]

 

Let me point this out, and together we're going to do some applied mathematics:

 

"Sit in queue for 10mins then play a team ranked so far below yours it is not even funny not to mention the lack of incentives."

 

This is because you are so far above average that the matchmaker is struggling to find comparable players. If you were average, between 48-52% winrate with average damage etc then the matchmaker wouldn't struggle at all, because the population at large sits about that level. Now if you applied your own standards to the game and shunted the average player off the higher tiers you'd be back here complaining about waiting 10 minutes to get into a tier 9 match!

 

That would be a point, if only it weren't for the fact that matchmaking isn't skillbased.

[Eternus_Damnatio]

 

I read it. There is absolutely nothing ambiguous about:

 

"Stop allowing players to purchase high tier premium ships when they have no clue what they are doing."

 

There is no mistaking that. You, as an exceptionally good player, have decided to crown yourself king of World of Warships and think that gives you the right to judge whether others are worthy to play on higher tiers. That is what both this thread and the thread I linked are really about. That sort of elitist crap infested the World of Tanks community for a long time and it was pretty toxic as I recall.

 

Also you keep on using the word "issue" to describe players of lower skill than yourself, yet you offer up very little in the way of explanation as to why this is an "issue". This begs the question - why isn't your own higher skill the real "issue" that needs to be addressed? Average players are, by definition, far more numerous than the elite. Why not cater to the masses rather than the gifted few? Why not stop you from buying premiums but give it to poorer players (who need them to farm silver) at a discount? And what about when the average players are out there, just trading broadsides with another average player, and some superskilled captain comes and destroys their citadel in two volleys? Doesn't that need "addressing"? Should your dispersion be increased or the hitboxes of enemy citadels be reduced for you in particular? Of course not, but your logic applied in reverse would make this so.

 

Furthermore I really wish you'd read your own post here and think more carefully about the rammifications of what you're demanding. Let me point this out, and together we're going to do some applied mathematics:

 

"Sit in queue for 10mins then play a team ranked so far below yours it is not even funny not to mention the lack of incentives."

 

This is because you are so far above average that the matchmaker is struggling to find comparable players. If you were average, between 48-52% winrate with average damage etc then the matchmaker wouldn't struggle at all, because the population at large sits about that level. Now if you applied your own standards to the game and shunted the average player off the higher tiers you'd be back here complaining about waiting 10 minutes to get into a tier 9 match!

 

 

A lot of people have busy lives. Work, family, etc. When they sit down to have a game of something they're going to want to play, not learn to play and certainly not treat it as a second job and study the thing. This is also the demographic who is most likely to spend on the game, as work gives disposable income and the handicap of less time to play can be overcome with a premium account.

 

Was going to actually explain things to you but you don't have a clue what you are talking about nor understand what I am saying and you seem to like making assumptions about people. 

I work full time have other obligations and they have nothing to do with how and when I play nor does the money I spend on this game each and every month.

[Eternus_Damnatio]

 

That would be a point, if only it weren't for the fact that matchmaking isn't skillbased.

 

It is based on team score as far as I know and actually has nothing to do with this thread anyway just a reply to something that was said.