Where should I go now?

[VC381]

I'm still relatively new to the game but I feel I've reached a decision point. My favorite ships so far are the Kongo and the Atago, I love the combination of speed and firepower and playing like a battlecruiser, either with the actual battlecruiser (Kongo) or with a very strong heavy cruiser (Atago). Basically I like being quite aggressive but also sneaky. I like ships that can close the range fast and surprise explode someone but also have excellent rudder response and speed to dodge and get back out of trouble when needed.

 

I think though that apart from the Amagi (or I guess Iowa but I don't have the patience to grind to Tier 9) there are no other battleship in the game at the moment that are fast enough to play like that, so I am setting my sights on what other heavy cruisers I want to play. As I said, I probably don't have the patience to grind to Tier 9 so I'm basically trying to decide which ships to aim for in Tiers 7/8. I also currently have a Furutaka and a Karlsruhe but nothing in US tree.

 

Basically I want to try an make a decision that I won't regret, like investing a lot of time and/or free XP grinding a line only to realise it doesn't suit me. So my options are:

 

- Continue grinding the IJN cruisers. Seems like the best option since I like Atago there is no reason I would not like them. But on the other hand, since I have Atago I feel "do I really want to waste time grinding something that plays the same?" and "Would I really play a Myoko or Mogami when the Atago is basically the same ship but makes more XP/money?"

 

- Continue grinding Germans. I kind of want to, I like the look of the ships but I am unsure if I would like their playstyle. Would they suit me? Can they be payed like I described above? Basically I would be aiming for Yorck+Hipper. I know the K-berg is a good ship but like I said I am more interested in heavy cruisers, not light, so I would most likely try to skip to Yorck as fast as I can. Is it worth my free XP to do this?

 

- Start US cruisers from nothing. This would be a big grind especially since, as above, I don't care for light cruisers so I would be trying my best to reach Pensacola+New Orleans ASAP. Is that worth my time? Would I like those two ships?

 

- Save up for Russian cruisers. These are a big unknown, but from what I can see they have a real "heavy" cruiser at only Tier 5 (Kirov). Do we know enough about them to judge their playstyle? What would that playstyle be like?

 

What should I do? What would suit me best?

 

[Slugywug]

As I've not reached anything over t7 feel free to take this with a large pinch of salt

 

• The Fuso and Nagato are less fast than the Kongo, but still vastly more mobile than the typical USN BB, they can actually react to a changed battlefield - you should probably try them.
• If you aren't planning on carrying on with the IJN cruisers then sticking with the Atago makes sense to me.
• Germans - can't comment on higher tiers, but I wouldn't free XP to them - you will really want that xp for module unlocks. The AP damage output of the t5/6 is impressive - but they are not very tough. Which brings us to ...
• The USN - the Cleveland really feels like a heavy cruiser to me - decent armour, good HE,  and AP that will devastate any cruiser that shows a broadside at medium or close range. It's a gem that suits aggressive play and is also handy for fire/airplane shooting missions.

[VC381]

Thanks! Well, I was never planning to give up the IJN BBs, I want to keep the Kongo and in the meantime get the Amagi, I'm sure I will enjoy the Fuso and Nagato in between. I was mainly wondering which cruiser line I should go for. You raise an interesting point with the Cleveland, I overlooked it but it could be interesting and sitting at Tier 6 not that hard to get to. Or maybe I should get it before they split the US line into CL/CA and "upgrade" it to tier 8 or something.

[Shadow9043]

I absolutely love my Hipper. I also just got 15 points on my commander so I get spotted at just over 10km which means I can put an accurate shot at their citadel areas first in most scenarios. Ofc if an IJN cruiser has all concealment percs he will spot me first.

 

Ah well can't win at everything. Hipper AP wrecks!

[VonBroich]

To me Aoba was a step up from the Furutaka and was easier to play. Furutaka has the oddest turret layout of all the cruisers I've played so far. I've just fully upgraded the Myoko and she's pretty much like the Atago to play.

 

As Slugwug said, the Cleveland feels very much like a proper heavy cruiser. Though I do find the 6" AP bounces often, when enemy ships angle themselves properly.   The St Loius is a really brawler, a mini battleship in fact. Pheonix and Omaha have paper thin armour, but relatively good range and torps as a handy extra. I'm currently grinding Pensacola. You have to play it more like a light cruiser, as again, the armour is paper thin. Having enjoyed Pheonix and Omaha, I've copied the play style to the Pensacola and it's worked well for me so far

 

As for the German cruisers, Konigsburg has an odd feel to start with, due to having two rear turrets and only one at the front. Torpedoes again are handy. Both Konigsburg and Nurnberg have decent ranges, but big citadels, so zig-zagging and varying speed is a must. The AP has decent penetration  on unangled ships. Sadly HE has a hard job to start fires unlike the US cruisers.  I've only played 11 games in the Yorck so far, so to be honest my opinion won't carry as much weight as more experienced players. Range is good once upgraded, but penetration of AP leaves a lot to be desired. Going by other posts on the forums here, Hipper is a much better ship by far.

 

I've only free XP'd the Myogi as I found her so bad to play, but would suggest not using free XP to miss out ships. I've read the same suggestion on many other posts.  Free XP is best used to fully upgrade a stock ship fast, ias far as I'm concerned.

 

Hopefully this will help in some way

 

[VC381]

The thing that worries me most about the German cruisers is their long rudder shift times (especially Hipper), I think I like the sound of them apart from that.

 

I am also somewhat tempted by the Pensacola despite everyone saying it's a bad ship. Seems to have good damage, turns well. OK it's made of paper but it's not the only thing that's badly armored and I'm trying to work out what makes it so bad. As I said US is one thing I haven't even started but I'm leaning towards that line at the moment based on what people are saying.

[VonBroich]

I use the steering gear mod 2, which reduces the rudder shift time by 20% with both the Yorck and Pensacola and as far as my play style goes, it helps a lot.

 

I've not found the Pensacola as bad as some have. In my best game I managed just over 2.2k base experience on damage of 79k, with premium and it was a 3 x xp weekend, it was just short of 10k xp which i was more than please with.  Playing as a second row ship, keeping your distance and making sure you are never the main target of the opposition is the key to this ship.

 

My best game was with a Nurnberg getting 2.6k base xp with 135k damage.  Again using it at range like the Pensacola.

 

My play style tends to be, get in close with a brawler type ship, such as a St Louis or keep the range with the lighter armoured cruisers.  Close range is far more fun, if no-one has torps.  As Nelson said at Copenhagen 'Engage the enemy more closely.'

[gorichan]

 

The things that make Pepsi a problematic ship to play are:

 

• Visibility - You are spotted 15.7km away and that is your maximum firing range. Most of the time, opposing ships will shoot at you first.
• Armor - It can work against cruisers and at medium ranges, you can bounce even 14'' shells when properly angled however, Pepsi suffers from plunging fire (deck armor is basically non existent). At longer ranges you  have to dodge every shell that some BB fired at you. If you don't, it almost always results in a citadel hit.
• Shell trajectory - This is a very minor flaw, but it will take you some time to get used to US 8'' guns, Japanese have a much flatter trajectory and better HE shells.

 

All in all, it is decent but challenging cruiser to play.

 

[VonBroich]

As Gorichan said and i forgot, visibility is the one big let down with the Pensacola. My mistake there and a big one at that!

 

http://forum.worldofwarships.eu/index.php?/topic/44811-pensacola-should-be-a-tier-6/#topmost  is the current ongoing topic about the Pensacola and seems to be pretty balanced on it's pro's and con's.

 

I've had some great wins and even good losses (if there are such a thing) in the Pensacola and perhaps this could be clouding my judgement overall.

[Kharazas]

Can't really comment  on the BBs. But you could maybe have a look at the Tirpitz, ingame she seems to be a fast hard-hitting BB.

If you search a fast, agile, stealthy CA then the JPN line is your choice. The US and German line IMHO somehow lack the stealth.

 

 

• The USN - the Cleveland really feels like a heavy cruiser to me - decent armour, good HE,  and AP that will devastate any cruiser that shows a broadside at medium or close range. It's a gem that suits aggressive play and is also handy for fire/airplane shooting missions.

 

The Clevland is basically a tier7/8 ship on tier 6 so it should come as a surprise that she performs well.

[VC381]

Well, I use the steering gear mod on my Atago making my rudder shift ~6s. But even with that mod a Hipper shift would be around 9s (11s base shift upgraded hull), a Pensacola would be something like 5.5s. Maybe I'm worrying about it too much.

 

I think you're right that I probably shouldn't just skip ships with free XP, or at least not until I've worked out that I dislike them. It's just tempting because low tier play doesn't really appeal to me. I like many of the ships but the battles are usually a huge clusterf***, I feel that at higher tiers I can expect some degree of competence and teamwork and more fun/closer battles (wishful thinking!). I also want to play certain ships because I just like those ships (I'm a big naval history geek) so I'm trying to balance that with whether my expectations of them would fit my playstyle given the way they are in game.

 

From that thread though I see good points about the Pensacola turning up. I kind of wish we had a Northampton or Portland, those are really beautiful ships, but that's off-topic I think I'll put my Karlsruhe aside for a bit and next time I'm bored I'll free XP the Chester and see what I can make of the St Lois. At the very least, since the US tree seems easy mode to Tier 6, I won't feel like I'm wasting my time or frying my nerves trying to grind a Pensacola (which is more than I can say for the Furutaka, might skip that one when I feel next like advancing IJN cruisers).

[VC381]

Can't really comment  on the BBs. But you could maybe have a look at the Tirpitz, ingame she seems to be a fast hard-hitting BB.

 

If you can show me where to buy one...

[Amonhep]

You should should continue Japanese battleship line and start also a IJN or USN destroyer line, plus start a IJN or USN carrier line. If you don't have cruisers, i would wait for the incoming Soviet cruisers.

[Kharazas]

 

If you can show me where to buy one...

 

 

yeah forgot that - she's not always available ..

[TheodorosK]

Fuso, Nagato, Amagi are very good ships, Fuso is a diamond.

Cleveland best T6 cruiser imo.

Minekazi is a great DD also.

Isokaze also.

Fubuki and the Shimakaze are the ninja of the game.

Myoko is also a very good CA.

And best cruiser in game for me, the great Zao.

And finally the King of the Seas, the Yamato.

 

[VC381]

Fuso, Nagato, Amagi are very good ships, Fuso is a diamond.

Cleveland best T6 cruiser imo.

Minekazi is a great DD also.

Isokaze also.

Fubuki and the Shimakaze are the ninja of the game.

Myoko is also a very good CA.

And best cruiser in game for me, the great Zao.

And finally the King of the Seas, the Yamato.

 

 

Well, I should say I'm not really interested in playing DD, I know I said I like the ninja thing but the "sneak, torp, hide, die as soon as you're spotted" style sounds too extreme for me. Aside from that I am looking forward to the other things you mentioned (maybe except the Tier 10s, would take me forever to get there).

 

I got the Fuso and used free XP to get it out of stock, but I'm not yet sold on it being so amazing. I get nice damage numbers (about 80k which is quite a lot for me) but at the same time it doesn't feel as satisfying or decisive as the Kongo. It's not fast enough to hunt cruisers or rush a flank and fold the enemy force, so I'm finding myself just trading blows at medium range with other BBs. I angle and weave but so do they and I almost never get citadels, so the fights end up long and slow and I take a lot of damage as well. It's not bad but it will take some getting used to I think.

 

On another note, I saw the St Louis only does 22 knots and ran a mile. Actually I skipped all the way to Omaha and that IS a fun ship!! I die a lot but I also get good damage, the rudder response and rate of fire are excellent. If Cleveland is more of the same but with more/better guns and firing arcs I'm looking forward to this!

[Panocek]

 

Well, I should say I'm not really interested in playing DD, I know I said I like the ninja thing but the "sneak, torp, hide, die as soon as you're spotted" style sounds too extreme for me. Aside from that I am looking forward to the other things you mentioned (maybe except the Tier 10s, would take me forever to get there).

 

I got the Fuso and used free XP to get it out of stock, but I'm not yet sold on it being so amazing. I get nice damage numbers (about 80k which is quite a lot for me) but at the same time it doesn't feel as satisfying or decisive as the Kongo. It's not fast enough to hunt cruisers or rush a flank and fold the enemy force, so I'm finding myself just trading blows at medium range with other BBs. I angle and weave but so do they and I almost never get citadels, so the fights end up long and slow and I take a lot of damage as well. It's not bad but it will take some getting used to I think.

 

On another note, I saw the St Louis only does 22 knots and ran a mile. Actually I skipped all the way to Omaha and that IS a fun ship!! I die a lot but I also get good damage, the rudder response and rate of fire are excellent. If Cleveland is more of the same but with more/better guns and firing arcs I'm looking forward to this!

 

Cleveland is one very strong ship, with one big flaw - shell velocity. Past 12km only target you can more or less consistently hit are battleships, but if you get her brawling below 10km, it demolishes pretty much everything. On IJN side, Aoba at tier 6 is also very solid performer, with the same guns as on Atago, but with much better reload. Yes, number of guns when broadside is lower (6v10) but going broadside with cruiser is never a good idea. Myoko is pretty good, but suffers terrible turret traverse and have the same wonky turret layout as Atago.

 

Also to nitpick - heavy cruiser refers to armament, not protection ship has.

[VC381]

 

Cleveland is one very strong ship, with one big flaw - shell velocity. Past 12km only target you can more or less consistently hit are battleships, but if you get her brawling below 10km, it demolishes pretty much everything. On IJN side, Aoba at tier 6 is also very solid performer, with the same guns as on Atago, but with much better reload. Yes, number of guns when broadside is lower (6v10) but going broadside with cruiser is never a good idea. Myoko is pretty good, but suffers terrible turret traverse and have the same wonky turret layout as Atago.

 

Also to nitpick - heavy cruiser refers to armament, not protection ship has.

 

I don't find the turret layout particularly wonky, I can't think of a much better way to get 10 guns onto a ship if you're hell-bent on sticking to twin turrets only. I find that the good arcs + fast rudder response allow you to get all guns on target without exposing citadel too much. Mogami's layout is slightly better (don't have that yet), but I still assume the No.2 turret can't fire directly ahead? Actually I'm kind of excited about the Mogami to play her in "flamethrower" setup. I know it got nerfed by the captain skill changes but if I play Myoko and Atago it would just feel too similar to play Mogami with the 8" configuration as well.

[Panocek]

 

I don't find the turret layout particularly wonky, I can't think of a much better way to get 10 guns onto a ship if you're hell-bent on sticking to twin turrets only. I find that the good arcs + fast rudder response allow you to get all guns on target without exposing citadel too much. Mogami's layout is slightly better (don't have that yet), but I still assume the No.2 turret can't fire directly ahead? Actually I'm kind of excited about the Mogami to play her in "flamethrower" setup. I know it got nerfed by the captain skill changes but if I play Myoko and Atago it would just feel too similar to play Mogami with the 8" configuration as well.

 

AFAIK Mogami can't fire from 2nd turret ahead except at long range, with Ibuki having similar issue. And I'm not sure you want to try 155mm "flamethrowers" with 51s turret traverse and 15km range.

 

For flame throwing you could wait for RU cruisers, until tier 8 I think they are all light cruisers, relying on quantity over quality of shells, while (at least on paper) have pretty good ballistics combined with outstanding range by cruiser standards.

 

So much for consistency "we nerf Mogami because its wrong when 155mm guns outrange 203mm, but let us introduce new stronk rashian kruzers armed with 152mm Stalin guided shells with 17km range"

 

Though tier 10 Moskva might be something sort of battlecruiser - seemingly new the best cruiser guns - 19.4km range with ballistics surpassing Zao (920m/s vs 985m/s, 155kg vs 176kg, thus shell time to impact will be even shorter and heavier shell means retaining that speed at longer distances and better AP pen), with presumably rudder time being balancing factor - over 17s

[ollonborre]

The Fuso has already been mentioned, and I can't give praise enough to that ship. The sheer firepower is just outstanding.

 

And if you finish your Karlsruhe grind, you get the Königsberg. This is also a great tier 5 ship with the best velocity on tier 5, great AP, good DPM, actually usefull torpedoes and great range.

[VC381]

 

AFAIK Mogami can't fire from 2nd turret ahead except at long range, with Ibuki having similar issue. And I'm not sure you want to try 155mm "flamethrowers" with 51s turret traverse and 15km range.

 

I don't see how 15km range is so bad. The Atago "only" has 15.7km and to be honest I usually don't fire outside of ~12km. All the IJN heavy cruisers do 36 knots and have excellent concealment values, you can close on anything you like without being seen and vanish again if things go wrong. I don't feel the need to use very long range fire.

 

That turret traverse though... WTF. I mean, why?! Are the triple 155mm turrets really heavier than the twin 200mm?

 

And if you finish your Karlsruhe grind, you get the Königsberg. This is also a great tier 5 ship with the best velocity on tier 5, great AP, good DPM, actually usefull torpedoes and great range.

 

I'm actually enjoying the Karlsruhe and am doing surprisingly well in it considering everyone goes on about how crap it is.

[Panocek]

 

I don't see how 15km range is so bad. The Atago "only" has 15.7km and to be honest I usually don't fire outside of ~12km. All the IJN heavy cruisers do 36 knots and have excellent concealment values, you can close on anything you like without being seen and vanish again if things go wrong. I don't feel the need to use very long range fire.

 

That turret traverse though... WTF. I mean, why?! Are the triple 155mm turrets really heavier than the twin 200mm?

 

 

I'm actually enjoying the Karlsruhe and am doing surprisingly well in it considering everyone goes on about how crap it is.

 

Turret traverse on Mogami 155 was nerfed so hard because of effect of old Expert Marksman (2.5 degrees/sec for guns below 155). Now as skill was changed I guess WG forgot and/or don't intend bringing old turret traverse back because stats were proving Mogami was "overperforming", mostly due to AFT/BFT 155 build, which combined with full camo allowed some nasty invisible firing while giving decent DD hunting capabilities and setting world on fire.

 

Also Atago is both tad faster and have better camo than Mogami, not mentioning more hp and healing parties.

[VC381]

Oh yeah, I forget the healing is a special thing. To be honest I struggle to understand how WG can justify spreading all those classes (Myoko, Takao, Mogami, Ibuki) across three whole tiers. I mean, they're great ships I'm glad they're in game, but really there is not a whole lot of difference between them (RL performance wise).

[Panocek]

Oh yeah, I forget the healing is a special thing. To be honest I struggle to understand how WG can justify spreading all those classes (Myoko, Takao, Mogami, Ibuki) across three whole tiers. I mean, they're great ships I'm glad they're in game, but really there is not a whole lot of difference between them (RL performance wise).

 

Same applies to USN cruisers, there is very little difference between Pepsi, Nope Orlean and Baltimore. Des Moines at least have RoF for some dakka time though.

[VC381]

Baltimore in theory should be significantly better than the treaty cruisers, I guess that doesn't translate into the game.