Rock-paper-scissors... Nope.

[Altharius]

 

Today I saw something that makes me stop playing till it is fixed. 

 

This was paper choking scissors.

I was BLIND SHOT by DD. Yes. DD outside smoke could wreck my CA (tier8) while NOT being detected. That is just wrong.

Being torped by DD while being stupid with course/speed: Logical.

Being torped by DD in stealth: Annoying.

Being shot to pieces by a DD and STILL not see him: WTF?

 

This is not the first time I see game-breaking stuff like this.

 

I have played this game since closed alpha, through beta and now I feel it has deteriorated beyond all recognition.

 

CA wreck BB at long range, dodging all shells the BB flings at them, DD wreck the CA's, BB are just the juicy target all can take apart.

CV can work, but with snipe or be sniped a bit boring.

 

At lower tiers this is not visible, but later all too obvious.

 

The rock scissors paper is kinda gone to be honest. This at least is my experience.

 

The devs really need to take a good luck at balancing this back to how is was earlier, because it's ruining a game I love(d) and want to love again.

 

So PLEASE PLEASE bring back the balance 

 

I don't want to tell you how to do your job, you have all the numbers.

 

[MATREKUS]

Today a DD suddenly appeared in front of me from 2km..no smoke no anything....my teammates confirmed they saw the same so its not only me...this game has serious flaws..

[Kazomir]

If a DD shoots you outside its spotting range then its shells are terribly easy to evade. They have even worse arcs than the Cleveland.

[Altharius]

If a DD shoots you outside its spotting range then its shells are terribly easy to evade. They have even worse arcs than the Cleveland.

 

True, but you are helpless to do anything against them. There is no counter. Even though a CA should counter a DD.

[Kazomir]

 

True, but you are helpless to do anything against them. There is no counter. Even though a CA should counter a DD.

 

That is not true. If you avoid its shells sooner or later he will give up, or someone will spot him, or plenty of other scenarios. The game is not a sterile 1v1 environment.

 

And the whole Rock-paper-scissors concept is pure [edited]for me. No class should hard-counter annother just cause, it eliminates the concept of skill in a game.

[D7v]

Ah the invisibility topic again. It's something that adds dimension to the game. Visible DD is a dead one it should be invisible what would you expect ? and you can easily evade dd's in smoke. Just go away. 

 

Plus you have the sonar utility ! If that's what you annoys most, get detection module and the sonar utility. Game offers you different viable options you choose one lose other which is good. 

 

Invisibility is a nice dimension of the game and it should be as it is now to make difference in ships. 

[Altharius]

 

That is not true. If you avoid its shells sooner or later he will give up, or someone will spot him, or plenty of other scenarios. The game is not a sterile 1v1 environment.

 

And the whole Rock-paper-scissors concept is pure [edited]for me. No class should hard-counter annother just cause, it eliminates the concept of skill in a game.

 

The concept might be [edited] for you, it is the concept on wich the balance is built. And not is is all crooked. And in your case of counters, teamplay is never something to take fully into account, especially in WG games.

 

Ectar, on 03 July 2015 - 01:41 PM, said:

 

• World of Warships works on a rock paper scissors system. Basically it means each class has a main counter. - Carriers counter Battleships. Battleships counter Cruisers. Cruisers counter Destroyers. Destroyers can counter anything providing they can get close enough. (Destroyers are probably one of the hardest classes to play as they're fragile). You'll find classes usually engaging each other at the start of battles as it's pretty equal footing and comes down to the skill of landing shots. (Carriers may try to sink each other at the start, Battleships will trade shots with each other, Destroyers will try to hunt each other etc).  In most 1 on 1 situations however with different classes, the counter to the class will usually win. 

[CherryWood]

Well, even some cruisers like Zao can invisifire. It sucks to be the target, but the counter is usually time - dmg done in that way is safe, but also tend to be very low and it thereofore takes very long to kill a dodging ship that way - too long to stop the ship from reaching the map objectives.

[Altharius]

Ah the invisibility topic again. It's something that adds dimension to the game. Visible DD is a dead one it should be invisible what would you expect ? and you can easily evade dd's in smoke. Just go away. 

 

Plus you have the sonar utility ! If that's what you annoys most, get detection module and the sonar utility. Game offers you different viable options you choose one lose other which is good. 

 

Invisibility is a nice dimension of the game and it should be as it is now to make difference in ships. 

 

have those. Still invisible.

 

PS: It's not just invisibility in this discussion.

[Kazomir]

 

The concept might be [edited] for you, it is the concept on wich the balance is built. And not is is all crooked. And in your case of counters, teamplay is never something to take fully into account, especially in WG games.

 

 

They counter each-other, but not in the way of "I have a Cruiser, so your destroyer is automatically dead", but more like "I have a cruiser, so it is more likely your destroyer will sink, but it is still not sure, because skill also matters"

Hard counters are not fun in any game.

[Altharius]

 

They counter each-other, but not in the way of "I have a Cruiser, so your destroyer is automatically dead", but more like "I have a cruiser, so it is more likely your destroyer will sink, but it is still not sure, because skill also matters"

Hard counters are not fun in any game.

 

But even this goes overboard from tier 7 and up. DD invisitorping, BB's burning from CA fire, the counter is in essence gone.

The design point for the game is gone. And if hard counter are no longer there, ballance accordingly.

[Panocek]

 

But even this goed overboard from tier 7 and up. DD invisitorping, BB's burning from CA fire, the counter is in essence gone.

The design point for the game is gone. And if hard counter are no longer there, ballance accordingly.

 

its not like fire causes BB health to go down by 50% in one second...

[Mayv]

Today a DD suddenly appeared in front of me from 2km..no smoke no anything....my teammates confirmed they saw the same so its not only me...this game has serious flaws..

 

Got a replay? I really like to see that since so many others claim the same thing but have never given one.

 

None of my DDs can do that or any that I have played against.

[Kazomir]

 

But even this goes overboard from tier 7 and up. DD invisitorping, BB's burning from CA fire, the counter is in essence gone.

The design point for the game is gone. And if hard counter are no longer there, ballance accordingly.

 

I don't think BBs have any problems from CAs, unless a BB is really bad. Being set on fire? Nah no problem I have 100k health, anti-fire ability AND 4 sets of repair heals, Il deal with it. Meanwhile a BB can practically one-shot a cruiser player that lacks awareness of enemy BBs.

 

About DDs. The recent Shimakaze spam is a bit problematic, but it will be corrected in time for sure, and most of it is because high tier cruisers are rarely played in order to give them a scare.

[byronicasian]

Today a DD suddenly appeared in front of me from 2km..no smoke no anything....my teammates confirmed they saw the same so its not only me...this game has serious flaws..

 

Smoke doesn't render when within 4km (i.e. when you're in another DDs smoke). However, the most ships should've been auto spotted by 2.5km (aka absolute vis distance).

[havaduck]

 

remember this scene? Hydrostatics does achieve exactly what in such a situation if the Cleveland gets murdered for 3k every 5,9 seconds BY ONE DD ALONE without being able to retaliate?

 

And there are still battleship drivers who compare being set of fire with instant deletion? With huge health pools, healing and the fire extinguisher? Oh my pls bring the AP changes back. I didnt exploit the week AP was broken, but when I read nonsense like this I really just want do drive up to a BB and unload torps for instant kill while he can use mighty, mighty HE, thats - not forget that - actually doing direct damage in most of the cases because its not as broken like small calibre cruiser HE.

 

So as of now cruisers are opposite of high tier carriers like Essex or Midway. The the carrier gets hard countered by nothing and the only QQ is coming from the lowered rewards for roflstomping 6+ ships; so the only threat is another carrier. The cruiser does hard counter nothing, is at a disadvantage  against every other class and posses only a real threat to other cruisers; if the other classes dont get those pinatas first.

[Deckeru_Maiku]

And I always thought WoWs was more like "Scissors, Paper, Rock, Lizard, Spock" 

 

[Appadang]

Today I saw something that makes me stop playing till it is fixed. 

 

This was paper choking scissors.

I was BLIND SHOT by DD. Yes. DD outside smoke could wreck my CA (tier8) while NOT being detected. That is just wrong.

Being torped by DD while being stupid with course/speed: Logical.

Being torped by DD in stealth: Annoying.

Being shot to pieces by a DD and STILL not see him: WTF?

 

This is not the first time I see game-breaking stuff like this.

 

I have played this game since closed alpha, through beta and now I feel it has deteriorated beyond all recognition.

 

CA wreck BB at long range, dodging all shells the BB flings at them, DD wreck the CA's, BB are just the juicy target all can take apart.

CV can work, but with snipe or be sniped a bit boring.

 

At lower tiers this is not visible, but later all too obvious.

 

The rock scissors paper is kinda gone to be honest. This at least is my experience.

 

The devs really need to take a good luck at balancing this back to how is was earlier, because it's ruining a game I love(d) and want to love again.

 

So PLEASE PLEASE bring back the balance 

 

I don't want to tell you how to do your job, you have all the numbers.

 

Confirmed - also - told you so didn't I? 

 

You know what the problem is? Well - I'll quote someone who replied to my ticket (I wont put names because I'm not a total reject): Your problem is: Your pc is overclocked and you need to defrag your SSD & HDD - Also you need to go to your appdata/roaming/wargaming.net and find the world of warships cache folder (WHICH DOES NOT EXIST BY THE WAY because stronk coding and desisions) and delete a few files.

 

(You know what I'm talking about lol.....oooh how I miss navy field EU)

[ColonelPete]

@Altharius

 

Where were you the last months? Invisible shooting can be done since open beta, nothing new.

As other people said there is enough that can be done. Work with your team.

[Altharius]

@Altharius

 

Where were you the last months? Invisible shooting can be done since open beta, nothing new.

As other people said there is enough that can be done. Work with your team.

Go play tier 8 and above... And then come back to me on that.

[Tyrendian89]

Go play tier 8 and above... And then come back to me on that.

 

umm... what's your point? He's just plain right in what he says...

[t3h3th32]

It's always the same. As I'm always spamming each topic with it, here we go again: give IJN and USN the same Hydro that Germans have, then, while escorting BBs or at least scouting ahead of the convoy, you can have a certain impact on the game, not with some 3 km range Hydro, while there are 20 km ranged torps, lol.

 

Cheers,

~t3h'Pâr4d0x

[ShockPirat]

@Altharius

 

Which CA? Which DD?

 

With concealment module, tier 8 CA can get their detection range down to 10.5 (Mogami) to 12.3 (Hipper). Not exactly sure about the numbers, but it's close to that.

 

Without concealment expert (the tier 5 skill), Tashkent can't invisifire, and it's really the only one you should worry about at long range. Benson can invisfire from about 10.5 km, but it has horrible arc and can easily be dodged. Fubuki can do the same, but his time would probably better be spent trying to torp someone.

Since someone mentioned Blyskawica above. It invisifires from 11.7 if I remember right.

 

So, when a DD is invisishooting you, what should you do? STOP SHOOTING. Shooting adds 6 km to your detection range for 20 seconds. Let your concealment go to its base value, you will probably go invisible for the DD, forcing him to get closer and get spotted if he keeps shooting or to disengage.

Above, of course, assumes 1v1 situation. If one DD is keeping you lit and another one is shooting you, well you shouldn't have gotten yourself into that situation. Run back to your team.

 

You didn't install the concealment module? You got only yourself to blame.

 

 

There are some CA that can't do anything vs invisifiring DDs (first one that springs to mind is Pensacola with its horrible spotting range), but none of tier 8 CAs are one of them.

 

 

Tldr; learn how spotting mechanics work, abuse them against people who don't know, win.

[AgarwaenME]

 

But even this goes overboard from tier 7 and up. DD invisitorping, BB's burning from CA fire, the counter is in essence gone.

The design point for the game is gone. And if hard counter are no longer there, ballance accordingly.

 

So what you're saying, is that a massive buff to CVs is needed.

[Spellfire40]

Today a DD suddenly appeared in front of me from 2km..no smoke no anything....my teammates confirmed they saw the same so its not only me...this game has serious flaws..

 

Replay? Every 2ed day we hear that up to date nobody could produce a replay to confirm this. 2km sounds like you were inside a smoke screen wich wasnt rendered and proximity spoted him when you came in 2km range wich coencedently is the autospot range even behind islands.